Do you have questions about Catholic beliefs & Practices

[blanchardman]

Any other position that immediately following the Particular Judgment would be meaningless

From our Catholic Catechism.

1022 Each man receives his eternal retribution in his immortal soul at the very moment of his death, in a particular judgment that refers his life to Christ: either entrance into the blessedness of heaven-through a purification or immediately, – or immediate and everlasting damnation.

At the evening of life, we shall be judged on our love {Divine Justice is LOVE}]

1051 Every man receives his eternal recompense in his immortal soul from the moment of his death in a particular judgment by Christ, the judge of the living and the dead.

1781 Conscience enables one to assume responsibility for the acts performed. If man commits evil, the just judgment of conscience can remain within him as the witness to the universal truth of the good, at the same time as the evil of his particular choice. The verdict of the judgment of conscience remains a pledge of hope and mercy. In attesting to the fault committed, it calls to mind the forgiveness that must be asked, the good that must still be practiced, and the virtue that must be constantly cultivated with the grace of God:

We shall . . . reassure our hearts before him whenever our hearts condemn us; for God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.

If in the final judgment one were NOT to go through Purgatory; that Soul would either be in HELL or Heaven.

Matthew 5:48
Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect.

Luke 6:40
The disciple is not above his master: but every one shall be perfect, if he be as his master.

Matt.5: [26] truly, I say to you, you will never get out till you have paid the last penny.

ONLY Souls that are like God" {made} perfect; can enter into the Beatific Vision. Amen:thumbsup:

“Immortal soul” in1Cor 15:53-54 it states that the dead(in Christ) will be raised incorruptible. It then says that those (believers) who are alive must put on incorruption (the body) and the mortal must put on immortality (the soul).
Clearly the dead are judged worthy of imortality some time between death and resurrection but that the living are mortal body and soul. Imortality is a gift to those who believe in Jesus. For those who do not there is only (the second) death.

 

[jane_doe]

Well, the term “boss” is more appropriate with a business. The Church is a body, with leadership and offices. The Pope is a father to the people, in a sense. He is a steward of Jesus, the King. He is a pastor to the whole flock of Christ. He can use the keys given to Simon Peter in distinction to the rest of the College of Bishops. His office constitutes divine Confirmation of Apostolic Teaching.

So “being in full communion with Rome” = “accepting Francis as the pastor and heir of Saint Peter”?

Nothing about other doctrines or beliefs?

 

[rcwitness]

So “being in full communion with Rome” = “accepting Francis as the pastor and heir of Saint Peter”?

Nothing about other doctrines or beliefs?

If you accept Francis as Pastor and successor of St Peter, you would consequently accept the Teachings (Doctrines) which he preaches and Confirms.

One is Catholic through Catholic Baptism and Confirmation. One is in Communion by assenting, in faith, to the Teachings and participating in Holy Communion.

One does so “worthily” by confessing sins committed after Baptism in the Sacrament of Reconciliation, in order to receive Communion in a state of grace.

 

[rcwitness]

“Immortal soul” in1Cor 15:53-54 it states that the dead(in Christ) will be raised incorruptible. It then says that those (believers) who are alive must put on incorruption (the body) and the mortal must put on immortality (the soul).
Clearly the dead are judged worthy of imortality some time between death and resurrection but that the living are mortal body and soul. Imortality is a gift to those who believe in Jesus. For those who do not there is only (the second) death.

All will be resurrected… those to everlasting life and those to everlasting damnation. Nobody ceases to exist.

 

[jane_doe]

If you accept Francis as Pastor and successor of St Peter, you would consequently accept the Teachings (Doctrines) which he preaches and Confirms.

One is Catholic through Catholic Baptism and Confirmation. One is in Communion by assenting, in faith, to the Teachings and participating in Holy Communion.

One does so “worthily” by confessing sins committed after Baptism in the Sacrament of Reconciliation, in order to receive Communion in a state of grace.

But many people whom attend Catholic churches disagree with teachings (things like abortion & homosexuality). Are those people in full communion with Rome?

(I’m a asking to understand the Catholic perspective here, not to argue).

 

[rcwitness]

But many people whom attend Catholic churches disagree with teachings (things like abortion & homosexuality). Are those people in full communion with Rome?

(I’m a asking to understand the Catholic perspective here, not to argue).

No problem

It’s not an easy answer. It gets into areas of personal culpability. It depends on the personal awareness of what they are accepting/rejecting because there is Invincible Ignorance which may apply.

There is heresy, which does put one outside full communion with the Catholic Church. And there is Mortal sin, which puts one in a state of separation with Communion of the Catholic Church.

 

[Abu]

jane_doe #695
But many people whom attend Catholic churches disagree with teachings (things like abortion & homosexuality). Are those people in full communion with Rome?

(I’m a asking to understand the Catholic perspective here, not to argue).

The Church’s Canon Law answers your question – how could dissenters be in “full communion”?
**Can. 205. **Those baptized are fully in the communion of the Catholic Church on this earth who are joined with Christ in its visible structure by the bonds of the profession of faith, the sacraments, and ecclesiastical governance.

Can. 212 §1. Conscious of their own responsibility, the Christian faithful are bound to follow with Christian obedience those things which the sacred pastors, inasmuch as they represent Christ, declare as teachers of the faith or establish as rulers of the Church.

Those who are “Catholics” but disagree with Catholic dogma or doctrine are described by Christ: ““if he refuses to hear even the Church let him be like the heathen and a publican.” (Mt 18:17).

Jesus of Nazareth proclaimed:
You are Peter and on this rock I will build MY Church." (Mt 16:18)
“The gates of hell will not prevail against it.”(Mt 16:18)
I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of heaven." ( Mt 16:19)
“Whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven.” (Mt 16:19) [Later, also to the Twelve]. [My emphasis]

 

[blanchardman]

All will be resurrected… those to everlasting life and those to everlasting damnation. Nobody ceases to exist.

Matthew 7:13 …"broad is the way that leadeth to destruction( not damnation)

John 3:16…"that whosoever believeth in him should not perish(die,be destroyed)(again not damned), but have everlasting life.
Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Zechariah13:8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.
Revelation 208 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured(once more no damnation,total destruction) them.

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Verses 11,12,13 is 1Corinthians 3:11-15 as is Zechariah 13:8&9

 

[rcwitness]

Matthew 7:13 …"broad is the way that leadeth to destruction( not damnation)

John 3:16…"that whosoever believeth in him should not perish(die,be destroyed)(again not damned), but have everlasting life.
Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Zechariah13:8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.
Revelation 208 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured(once more no damnation,total destruction) them.

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Verses 11,12,13 is 1Corinthians 3:11-15 as is Zechariah 13:8&9

Hey blanchardman.
I’m not sure what points you were trying to make. It helps when you explain, when posting scriptures.

As for damnation, I used it as a term meaning;

damnation

noun**dam·na·tion*\dam-ˈnā-shən\

Simple Definition of*damnation

:*the state of being in hell as punishment after death

I’m not disagreeing with the Scriptural terms “death/destruction”. It’s merely the English term for being sent to hell. No need to find something to dispute there.

 

[blanchardman]

Hey blanchardman.
I’m not sure what points you were trying to make. It helps when you explain, when posting scriptures.

As for damnation, I used it as a term meaning;

damnation

noun**dam·na·tion*\dam-ˈnā-shən\

Simple Definition of*damnation

:*the state of being in hell as punishment after death

I’m not disagreeing with the Scriptural terms “death/destruction”. It’s merely the English term for being sent to hell. No need to find something to dispute there.

Sorry! I started on one thought and drifted into another. I started to show that the eternal life is a gift to those who believe in Jesus. If you do not have eternal life how can you have eternal suffering?

The rest should have been erased.

 

[rcwitness]

Sorry! I started on one thought and drifted into another. I started to show that the eternal life is a gift to those who believe in Jesus. If you do not have eternal life how can you have eternal suffering?

The rest should have been erased.

Ok. I believe Scripture uses life and death to express whether we receive and trust on the giver of life, or remain unreconciled to Him.

Death is not complete annihilation, as in "to cause to cease to exist. " The soul and body are perpetuated because we have been created in the image of God. Man, body and soul, are perpetuated by God, by either the wrath of Him or the Love of Him. The latter being life and the former, death.

 

[blanchardman]

Ok. I believe Scripture uses life and death to express whether we receive and trust on the giver of life, or remain unreconciled to Him.

Death is not complete annihilation, as in "to cause to cease to exist. " The soul and body are perpetuated because we have been created in the image of God. Man, body and soul, are perpetuated by God, by either the wrath of Him or the Love of Him. The latter being life and the former, death.

If men are “immortal” by nature then why would they have to put on immortality? (1 Corinthians 15:53&64)

 

[rcwitness]

If men are “immortal” by nature then why would they have to put on immortality? (1 Corinthians 15:53&64)

This is in regards to life, not about mere existence.

Matthew 25

41*Then he will say to those at his left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels

Revelations 14

"And another angel, a third, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If any one worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand,*he also shall drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured unmixed into the cup of his anger, and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.*And the smoke of their torment goes up for ever and ever; and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”​

 

[rcwitness]

…

blanchardman, if you don’t mind me asking, are you a Christian? You seem to care about these issues very much, and have strong convictions. Do you Commune somewhere?

 

[blanchardman]

blanchardman, if you don’t mind me asking, are you a Christian? You seem to care about these issues very much, and have strong convictions. Do you Commune somewhere?

Thank you for asking.
I believe in Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. I do not belong to any religion.

 

[rcwitness]

Thank you for asking.
I believe in Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. I do not belong to any religion.

Thank you. Thats good you believe. I didn’t ask a religion, if you take issue with the term. I asked about Communion. Where do you come together to give thanks, worship, and receive the Lord’s Supper?

 

[blanchardman]

This is in regards to life, not about mere existence.

Matthew 25

41*Then he will say to those at his left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels

Revelations 14

"And another angel, a third, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If any one worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand,*he also shall drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured unmixed into the cup of his anger, and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.*And the smoke of their torment goes up for ever and ever; and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
​

I will gladly respond to this once you have answered my question in post 702 or at least explain how this post answers the question.​

 

[rcwitness]

If men are “immortal” by nature then why would they have to put on immortality? (1 Corinthians 15:53&64)

I will gladly respond to this once you have answered my question in post 702 or at least explain how this post answers the question.

Gladly! Paul is talking about everlasting life after death in this life. The next life is everlasting unto life or death.

I gave you two scriptures which confirm the permanence of hell. This is not fun to discuss, either. It’s quite fearful.

 

[blanchardman]

Gladly! Paul is talking about everlasting life after death in this life. The next life is everlasting unto life or death.

I gave you two scriptures which confirm the permanence of hell. This is not fun to discuss, either. It’s quite fearful.

Another verse: Matthew 10:28. And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell
Implied here the soul can be killed.
Stated here it will be DESTROYED in hell.

In Revelation Jesus is depicted with a twosided sword coming out of his mouth (Rev 1:16 & 19:15&21). What is the meaning of this?
In verse 19:21 he slays those mentioned in your earlier post.

 

[rcwitness]

Another verse: Matthew 10:28. And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell
Implied here the soul can be killed.
Stated here it will be DESTROYED in hell.

In Revelation Jesus is depicted with a twosided sword coming out of his mouth (Rev 1:16 & 19:15&21). What is the meaning of this?
In verse 19:21 he slays those mentioned in your earlier post.

Killed, yes. Die, yes. Destroyed, yes. Cause to cease to exist? No.

Anyway. I think you and I should move on from this. I believe hell is eternal death. This is what we believe, and I don’t find Scripture revealing otherwise. I showed two Scriptures confirming the permanence of hell.

Matthew 25

Then he will say to those at his left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels

Revelations 14
"And another angel, a third, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If any one worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also shall drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured unmixed into the cup of his anger, and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up for ever and ever; and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”