Do you like or dislike Father Corapi?

[Roy5]

ANAMCHARA and ALEGREFE

 **Anamchara**. Good posting. If you spoke for all of Catholicism, right on. We need to have room for people who have doubts. Frankly - no offense - but most intelligent people do in this modern age. They aren't content anymore to let Popes, priests and scholars do their thinking for them.

  One example. I was once quite taken with Thomas Aquinas. Then, in reading him one day, I stumbled on how, in his view, the Church should handle heretics. Turn them over to the civil authorities to be executed! I still admired Aquinas as a prolific scholar but no longer took what he said as 'gospel truth'. Obviously some of what he wrote was nonsense - also true of many the church Fathers who wrote long before the microscope, when most people believed in Adam and Eve, the earth was flat, and demons caused mental illness. We can forgive them but we certainly don't have to look to them as sources of special insight for the modern age.

   By the way, I read Commonweal, America, US Catholic and our diocesan monthly. I wonder if Fr, Corapi reads these fine magazines. Somehow I doubt it.

 **AlegreFe** You may be right. Perhaps I have come to the point where I don't belong in the Catholic Church. I have developed a strong commitment to ecumenism, and not just among Christians, but among people of faith around the world. I have spent time in Korea, China, India, Egypt, Israel and other countries where non-Christians are the majority, and the notion that these fine Buddhists, Hindus, Muslims, Jews etc may not be able to get into heaven because they're not Christian alienates me completely. Wouldn't it be great if people of faith around the world worked in unison for peace, understanding and goodwill? Too often religion has been a source of sinful division and pride, even wars and persecutions - "my religion is right, yours is evil!" I wonder sometimes if God cares a hoot about our church label, but looks only at our heart. When the lawyer wanted to know how to inherit eternal life he said nothing about church or creed but about loving God and loving one another. Then he gave the parable of the Good Samaritan where a hated Samaritan was the hero. 

   Now, you seem to be suggesting self-censorship, that Catholics who have doubts should keep them hidden, that to express them honestly is somehow wrong.  I had thought that these postings were for just such open and honest discussion rather than simply reenforcing one another's lock-step agreement with absolutists within the Church. If this is a club restricted to those who have the same opinions - parroted opinions when it comes to doctrine and practices - obviously I don't belong here. Interestingly, my mass-attending friends seem to agree more with me than with the "believe it all or get out" attitude. Most of them question such 'miracles' as Fatima and Lourdes, and most of them favor the right of clergy to marry and some strongly support the ordination of even women.

  I should be through with this thread. I've said my piece, and we seem to have drifted off topic. On the other hand, my trouble with Fr. Corapi stems from concern that the Church often is too harsh and shows too little compassion for those inside and outside the Church who simply can't endorse everything the Church teaches. I presume this is "evil heresy" and I should feel guilty, as you seem to suggest. But, alas, I don't! And I believe God smiles on those of us who, in his blessed Name, work for a more loving Catholicism and pray for peace, justice, and understanding among those of all faiths who believe in Him, Catholic and non-Catholic alike..

 

[Julianna]

Really? Can you not sense a heart that is reaching out? He need not directly express “sorrow”, but has opened the door to dialogue (albeit he appears quite skeptical that much will come of it; hmm, I wonder why? ) A good number of people come to the Church following Roy’s path. Your approach would have us turn them all away as modern day tax collectors.

Well, don’t you just prove Roy’s point in spades there.

**No kidding… **

I understand your admonition to not spread falsehoods about the Church but asking questions is not the same thing. I, for one, invite Roy to stay in the Church but I would urge him to seek his answers in more reputable locations than this board, EWTN, and the like. The entirety of the Church goes far beyond that narrow scope (though you wouldn’t think so if you hang around here too much). Nearly all people of faith have suffered a crises of faith at some time or another, from the pews to the saints themselves. I would say it is incumbent upon the rest of us to be charitable toward folks undergoing such struggles.

And how, then, would he learn of the fullness the Church has to offer? No. Rather what he needs to do to expose himself to that fullness, a fullness that reaches far beyond the all-too-confining bounds of this board which is held in disregard by the vast majority of the faithful I’ve encountered–laity and clergy alike.

Well then you must neither approve of the terms “Conservative American” nor “Liberal American” for we are all just Americans who hold to American values? Well, yes and no. Both liberals and conservatives are Americans; both liberals and conservatives are Catholics. Religion, like politics, is at heart an intellectual construct for our human minds to deal with the larger reality around us. How we exercise and express our intellectual findings may follow a either a strict, unbending, “conservative” bent or a freer, open-minded, “liberal” track. Or, most common, somewhere in between.

Finally, I find it…odd, that after pontificating on the inappropriateness of labelling Catholics either conservative or liberal but you only find “liberal Catholic” to be an oxymoron./QUOTE]

yeah, I thought that was odd as well. Great post Strummer. We have to remember that priests do not walk on water…they walk the same pavement as we do. The Church is people, human kind if you will. We ask questions…we may not like the answer…but it is always worth it to “ask”…how else can we “seek” if we don’t ask?

 

[Shoshana]

This is illogical inconsistency.

Thank you.

Our faith is internal.

Our faith is internal and external. Our faith will be expressed in our behaviour, in our words, and in our actions. What is one without the other.

The world is external. Our faith guides us in how to respond to the world. However, as the world is ignorant of our faith, our faith does not tell the world how to respond to us. The world, quite simply, is merely the world. I find it self-righteous hubris to try to claim the mantle of victimhood for the “oppression of the world” in a vain, self-congratulatory attempt to prove one’s sanctity.

You got all that from one statement? :hypno: Wow@ Maybe you should read Bishop Sheen’s books. He says the one proof that we are following Jesus is that we will be hated by the world.

If you let the world turn you hard, you’ve lost a precious part of the peace that passes all understanding.

I am far from being hard. You do not even know me. Why are you coming down so hard? I recieve direction once a month. I believe that our Faith is a great gift from God. We are at all different levels. Just as in marriage, warm and fuzzy is good during the honeymoon, and likewise, God woos us during a period of time. But one does need grow up if one is to grow in the faith.

I admit I am impressed you got all of that information on little ol’ me in one statement of mine. If we are to follow the Lord, we will be persecuted and hated…the Bible tells me so@

 

[Strummer]

Originally Posted by Strummer
This is illogical inconsistency.

Thank you.

I’m sorry but this seems like a nonsensical response and I do not know what to make of it. The best I can come up with is that it is meant as an insult via sarcasm. However, it is probably more likely not that and I am misinterpreting. I bring this up only to highlight how easy it is to be misunderstood with short, pithy responses.

Our faith is internal.

Our faith is internal and external. Our faith will be expressed in our behaviour, in our words, and in our actions. What is one without the other.

Erm, we’re both right but we’re missing each other. What I was trying to say is that we experience our faith internally and the world cannot touch us there unless we allow it. Yes, we express our faith externally…by definition.

The world is external. Our faith guides us in how to respond to the world. However, as the world is ignorant of our faith, our faith does not tell the world how to respond to us. The world, quite simply, is merely the world. I find it self-righteous hubris to try to claim the mantle of victimhood for the “oppression of the world” in a vain, self-congratulatory attempt to prove one’s sanctity.

You got all that from one statement? Wow@

No, not from one statement but from a whole host of similar claims from innumerable sources. In short, I was not speaking of you specifically and apologize for creating that impression. If, however, you wish to take up that mantle, I leave that choice to you…

Maybe you should read Bishop Sheen’s books. He says the one proof that we are following Jesus is that we will be hated by the world.

Ah, but engendering hatred of the world is not proof that we are following Jesus. The world can have all sorts of reasons to hate us. Secondly, there are those who, to my thinking, are somewhat weak or insecure in their faith and seek whatever validation they can find to assure themselves. It is a sad human weakness that, in such a situation, would then (mis)perceive “persecution” in order to prove their own sanctity to themselves and to others.

If you let the world turn you hard, you’ve lost a precious part of the peace that passes all understanding.

I am far from being hard. You do not even know me. Why are you coming down so hard? I recieve direction once a month. I believe that our Faith is a great gift from God. We are at all different levels. Just as in marriage, warm and fuzzy is good during the honeymoon, and likewise, God woos us during a period of time. But one does need grow up if one is to grow in the faith.

I admit I am impressed you got all of that information on little ol’ me in one statement of mine. If we are to follow the Lord, we will be persecuted and hated…the Bible tells me so@

I know it’s only two letters but it is a very important word in the sentence you quoted from me: “IF”. I did not accuse you of being hard but offered a warning meant for all. You seem to be bent on making this personal and I urge you to stop before I respond in kind. That is not a threat but a plea for I am trying to curb my tendency to lash out with unnecessary harshness.

 

[Shoshana]

I’m sorry but this seems like a nonsensical response and I do not know what to make of it. The best I can come up with is that it is meant as an insult via sarcasm. However, it is probably more likely not that and I am misinterpreting. I bring this up only to highlight how easy it is to be misunderstood with short, pithy responses.

Erm, we’re both right but we’re missing each other. What I was trying to say is that we experience our faith internally and the world cannot touch us there unless we allow it. Yes, we express our faith externally…by definition.

No, not from one statement but from a whole host of similar claims from innumerable sources. In short, I was not speaking of you specifically and apologize for creating that impression. If, however, you wish to take up that mantle, I leave that choice to you…

Since you were responding to my posts, I assumed you were talking to me.

Ah, but engendering hatred of the world is not proof that we are following Jesus. The world can have all sorts of reasons to hate us. Secondly, there are those who, to my thinking, are somewhat weak or insecure in their faith and seek whatever validation they can find to assure themselves. It is a sad human weakness that, in such a situation, would then (mis)perceive “persecution” in order to prove their own sanctity to themselves and to others.

I know it’s only two letters but it is a very important word in the sentence you quoted from me: “IF”. I did not accuse you of being hard but offered a warning meant for all. You seem to be bent on making this personal and I urge you to stop before I respond in kind. That is not a threat but a plea for I am trying to curb my tendency to lash out with unnecessary harshness.

It was hard not to take it personal because you responded to my posts. There is no need to lash out. I will let this go…I hope this is not done to may other posters. Peace!

 

[Strummer]

Since you were responding to my posts, I assumed you were talking to me.

Responding to you? Yes. Talking to you? In part and to the thread in general. Taking about you? No, not in the post in question.

It was hard not to take it personal because you responded to my posts.

There is a vast and important distinction to be made between talking ***to ***you and talking ***about ***you. While I may have been doing the former, I was not doing the latter.

There is no need to lash out. I will let this go.

As will I.

 

[mom4truth]

I, personally, think we’ve beaten a dead horse (as earlier stated by another poster). We’ve totally gotten off the topic of Fr. Corapi and instead veered to debating what Catholicism is/means. This is not the thread for that. I agree that posters should not degrade the Faith in this thread. If you don’t like the Catholic church, find another thread and talk about it there. Leave those of us who love our Faith and Fr. Corapi alone. We enjoy discussing Fr. Corapi, not debating those who have the “smarts” to find Catholicism too cumbersome!

I say: kill the thread.

 

[anamchara]

I, personally, think we’ve beaten a dead horse (as earlier stated by another poster). We’ve totally gotten off the topic of Fr. Corapi and instead veered to debating what Catholicism is/means. This is not the thread for that. I agree that posters should not degrade the Faith in this thread. If you don’t like the Catholic church, find another thread and talk about it there. Leave those of us who love our Faith and Fr. Corapi alone. We enjoy discussing Fr. Corapi, not debating those who have the “smarts” to find Catholicism too cumbersome!

I say: kill the thread.

Yes, a dead horse. I would be the poster who wrote that. The thing is, the thread is asking a question. Do you like or dislike Fr. Corapi? So obviously, people will come who don’t like him and give reasons. This creates debate because a few posters who don’t like him will be asked for reasons, once those reasons are given, those who like him take offense. The topic of Fr. Corapi is divisive as this thread proves that. We are all Catholic and passionate about our Church. We all want is best for our Church. We don’t always agree on what is best. There is nothing wrong with not liking Fr. Corapi’s style and even his content. This does not make the person a bad Catholic. It also does not make a person a bad Catholic if they are questioning their faith. Mother Teresa had a crisis of faith. I wonder if she had come into this thread saying she had issues with Fr. Corapi and various aspects of the Church, would certain posters be so quick to tell her to leave? Just a thought.

 

[Shoshana]

Yes, a dead horse. I would be the poster who wrote that. The thing is, the thread is asking a question. Do you like or dislike Fr. Corapi? So obviously, people will come who don’t like him and give reasons. This creates debate because a few posters who don’t like him will be asked for reasons, once those reasons are given, those who like him take offense. The topic of Fr. Corapi is divisive as this thread proves that. We are all Catholic and passionate about our Church. We all want is best for our Church. We don’t always agree on what is best. There is nothing wrong with not liking Fr. Corapi’s style and even his content. This does not make the person a bad Catholic. It also does not make a person a bad Catholic if they are questioning their faith. Mother Teresa had a crisis of faith. I wonder if she had come into this thread saying she had issues with Fr. Corapi and various aspects of the Church, would certain posters be so quick to tell her to leave? Just a thought.

Mother Theresa had a very good relationship with Fr corapi…she was at his ordination. He also had a good relationship with Mother Angelica…

Just trivia…have a blessed day!

 

[anamchara]

You ask: don’t the other churches require the acceptance of special doctrines? Not in the way that Fr, Corapi teaches. He says, in effect, that if we doubt anything the church teaches we are ipso faco wrong and in danger of heresy!

 

[mom4truth]

If you read Mother Teresa’s biography, I wouldn’t say she had a crisis of faith. She endured the Dark Night of the Soul for 40 years. That means she did not “feel” God’s presence. That isn’t to say she didn’t believe in God. If she didn’t, how could she have been able to accomplish all that she did with such a loving heart? The Holy Spirit is at work in a person’s heart even when the individual does not “feel” God/Holy Spirit at all. That is when the individual is EXTREMELY close to the Lord. So - a crisis in faith - that’s not what I’d call what Mother Teresa had. Read the biography. It’s quite interesting and inspiring. And, oh year, Fr. Corapi DID have a good relationship with Mother Teresa! I think they were on the same page…

Looks like no one wants to kill this thread, huh?

 

[Shoshana]

This would be one of the reasons I don’t like him. I don’t know if you are taking it out context. We can doubt, that is ridiculous. There is a big difference between doubt and out right heresy. My goodness, there is a middle ground.

Accrding to the Fr Corapi, the devil loves the color ‘grey’…because if we believe in the grey, we basically don’t have to agree with what the CC teaches. And if we do not agree with All what the Church teaches, then, we are on dangerous territory. The Church in Her wisdom does know best. Fr Corapi does not teach anything outside of Her wisdom.

 

[kaygee]

Coming into this rather late.

Prayers were requested for Fr. Corapi at a recent daily Mass on EWTN. At the time, I was struck by the idea of asking St. John the Baptist to pray for him. The two Johns are rather alike as voices crying in the wilderness. . . .

Fr. John Corapi is no more likeable than John the Baptist was in his time, probably because the spirit and the message are the same. . . :twocents:

 

[Shoshana]

Coming into this rather late.

Prayers were requested for Fr. Corapi at a recent daily Mass on EWTN. At the time, I was struck by the idea of asking St. John the Baptist to pray for him. The two Johns are rather alike as voices crying in the wilderness. . . .

Fr. John Corapi is no more likeable than John the Baptist was in his time, probably because the spirit and the message are the same. . . :twocents:

:clapping: I also compare him to St Paul. He has a very rare charism which uplifts my soul to love Jesus more. God bless Fr John Corapi and may he continue his ministry that is much needed these days.

 

[Julianna]

anamchara;3696866:

[/CODE[COLOR="Navy"]**]anamchara: This would be one of the reasons I don't like him. I don't know if you are taking it out context. We can doubt, that is ridiculous. There is a big difference between doubt and out right heresy. My goodness, there is a middle ground.  **

Shoshana:Accrding to the Fr Corapi, the devil loves the color ‘grey’…because if we believe in the grey, we basically don’t have to agree with what the CC teaches. And if we do not agree with All what the Church teaches, then, we are on dangerous territory. The Church in Her wisdom does know best. Fr Corapi does not teach anything outside of Her wisdom.

Not only is it amazing that human beings know what God thinks…but there are some who know what the devil is thinking…Amazing…purely amazing. I must have missed the memo on that. I am waiting on the “should I boycott Sherwin Williams because they sell grey paint” thread. I understand what anamchara is saying…she is not talking lukewarm or wishy washy. It seems you missed her point.

**anamchara: My experience growing up in that was very positive so much so that I find it incredibly distasteful when I read comments like “well, they are 30,000+ now” or any other belittling comments. Our service on Sundays was not that much different from a Catholic Mass. **

****Shoshana: There is ONE big difference and this is the Holy Eucharist. The reception of the Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ given to us by an ordained priest through apostolic lineage. ****

That one is a given.

**anamchara:The readings were pretty much the same. Something I never find Catholics on here acknowledge. You are right in that there is a great deal of acceptance, non-judgmental approach in the higher Churches. **

My mother is Baptist. Yes the readings are the same and they touch people in different ways.

Shoshana: There has been much judgment from other denominations (especially from the fundamentalist) and they become surprised that we do have readings from the Bible. As for me, well, any of the other denominations, although they contain partial truth, I see them as a big prayer group. I belong to a prayer group myself.

So how different are you in your judgement of them? I see alot of parallels here with Fr. Corapi and the fundamentalist style of teaching. Partial truth? they don’t think so.

**anamchara: It’s important we understand our seperate brethen. There are differences but we need to be very clear on what they are. The reason I converted was because they brought me closer to Christ so close that I needed more. I’m afraid you would find your hearts content in a liberal high Church model but over time you might crave more. The real presence and the mystical side of Catholicism is what brought me into the Catholic faith. When it all comes down to it. I think you would miss that. But I can’t say for sure. I don’t know what is in your heart. It sounds like you are going on a spiritual journey. I grew up in that and although I have a great deal of love and respect for my past ( I honestly miss it greatly at times) I can’t give up Christ in the Eucharist. **

For me, it’s Mary…a true example of a woman.

**anamchara: As Fr. Greeley so beautifuly points out. As Catholics we can experience God with all our senses as Catholics. Smell (incense) touch (holy water) hear (music) taste (Body of Christ) etc…you get the idea. **

My DRE said the same thing at a catechists retreat. The senses help us to focus, to stay in touch. That is a good thing.

**Shoshana: You were concerned that roy may be content in ahighly liberal church…well, Fr Greeley fits the bill. I repeat, this is a priest who is not orthodox in his teachings. **

I enjoyed reading Fr. Greeley back in the day. To each his own opinon.

 

[anamchara]

 

[Shoshana]

Shoshana, a couple of things. Your posts are hard to quote because you are using the quoting feature incorrectly.

Sorry about that. I really do not kno whow to use the multiple quotes.

 

[anamchara]

**

Not only is it amazing that human beings know what God thinks…but there are some who know what the devil is thinking…Amazing…purely amazing. I must have missed the memo on that. I am waiting on the “should I boycott Sherwin Williams because they sell grey paint” thread. I understand what anamchara is saying…she is not talking lukewarm or wishy washy. It seems you missed her point.

**

**She did miss my point several times. No, not luke warm at all and thank you for acknowledging that Julianna. That’s the part I find so frustrating. **

**If you don’t like Fr. Corapi it must mean you don’t want to hear the truth sheesh. **

**

That one is a given.

**

**I made it very clear in my post about the real presences. I don’t know why that was brought up. **

My mother is Baptist. Yes the readings are the same and they touch people in different ways.

It goes a bit further than that. Many mainline Churches use the same lectionary as Catholics do. So what my Methodist mothers hears preached on Sunday, I do as well. We often compare what was said. It’s normally about the same.

So how different are you in your judgement of them? I see alot of parallels here with Fr. Corapi and the fundamentalist style of teaching. Partial truth? they don’t think so.

Amen. This is the part they don’t see.

Judgment from other denominations as the poster points out (normally the evangelicals/far right) comes from ignorance and I see that from many Catholics as well. The remarks that I’ve heard in my bible study amaze me. I finding myself correcting what people think about Protestants. They seem to be under some odd impressions.

For me, it’s Mary…a true example of a woman.

I think many cradles feel that way. Very cool.

My DRE said the same thing at a catechists retreat. The senses help us to focus, to stay in touch. That is a good thing.

Exactly, Fr. Greeley has written a great deal on the beauty of our faith. I think many on here don’t like him because he says it like it is and speaks the truth Hows that for turn around?

 

[Shoshana]

Juliana says:

Not only is it amazing that human beings know what God thinks…but there are some who know what the devil is thinking…Amazing…purely amazing. I must have missed the memo on that. I am waiting on the “should I boycott Sherwin Williams because they sell grey paint” thread. I understand what anamchara is saying…she is not talking lukewarm or wishy washy. It seems you missed her point.

Yes, Father Corapi knows what he is talking about. This is a man who is ordained and inspired by the Holy Spirit to KNOW what the devil thinks. I would never put myself at his level. He prays 100 hours for each of his talks. Even my priests speaks like Fr Corapi at times…he is an ordained priest and prays before the Blessed Sacrament an hour each day. They hear confessions and hear the tromented souls at time that the devil had a grip on.

And because our priest talks about the devil, our church has been attacked, ore than once, by satanic groups that exist around here. They hate our pastor. For good reason.

Juliana says;

So how different are you in your judgement of them? I see alot of parallels here with Fr. Corapi and the fundamentalist style of teaching. Partial truth? they don’t think so.

The only thing I said is that the other deminations are a big prayer group because of the lack of the Eucharist. That is all. And I said that they have the partial truth…because we have the fullness of the truth. Read the document and encyclycals…that is exactly what it says.

And yes, Fr Corapi does not tip toe through the tulips when he preaches the Truth. He doe snot confuse at all. His point is well made. So, I guess I would say that he is a fundamentalist…but a fundamentalist that gives us the Eucharist.

Juliana says:

enjoyed reading Fr. Greeley back in the day. To each his own opinon.

I said what I had to say about Fr Gereely…I would take care in his readings.

 

[Shoshana]

**She did miss my point several times. No, not luke warm at all and thank you for acknowledging that Julianna. That’s the part I find so frustrating. **

Not only I but many others.

**If you don’t like Fr. Corapi it must mean you don’t want to hear the truth sheesh. **

That is something that needs to be answered by those who listen to him whether it is his style and just makes one uncomfrotable in preaching the Truth.

As far as senses go, one would be good to go to St Ignatius to understand the ‘senses’ part of our journey to Christ.

**I made it very clear in my post about the real presences. I don’t know why that was brought up. **

It goes a bit further than that. Many mainline Churches use the same lectionary as Catholics do. So what my Methodist mothers hears preached on Sunday, I do as well. We often compare what was said. It’s normally about the same.

Amen. This is the part they don’t see.

Judgment from other denominations as the poster points out (normally the evangelicals/far right) comes from ignorance and I see that from many Catholics as well. The remarks that I’ve heard in my bible study amaze me. I finding myself correcting what people think about Protestants. They seem to be under some odd impressions.

I think many cradles feel that way. Very cool.

Exactly, Fr. Greeley has written a great deal on the beauty of our faith. I think many on here don’t like him because he says it like it is and speaks the truth Hows that for turn around?