Do you think priests should be allowed to marry?

[impalass]

He says that the current discipline of the Church is that priests and Bishops come from the ranks of unmarried, celibate men, and that they will have made a solemn vow to remain celibate for their whole lives.

How things were more than 1500 years ago is not really a concern of today. The discipline of celibacy is a witness and a sign to today’s world about the meaning of holiness, and what it is, to make a sacrifice for Jesus Christ.

You say “How things were more then 1500 years ago is not really a concern today”. With an answer like that then what happened 2000 years ago isn’t a concern today. Thats not a relevant answer. Times change and the church needs to be brought up to date, or before long there will be a split in the church. By the most part USA catholics are way too liberal for the vaticans liking, thats why a US Cardinal will never become a pope with the current regime.

Recent polls state over 50% of CURRENT roman catholic priests in the USA favour abolishing celibacy. Thats over 24,000 priests in the USA.. Over 65% of catholic laity polled believe celibacy should be relaxed/abolished.  Over 80% of catholics have used or practice a form of birth control the church says is a sin.   Most catholics don't go to mass regularily or at all. Thats a lot of discention in the catholic church would you not agree, when over half of your believers do not support the vatican in many of their teachings.   In business that would be a dismal failure.

So the real question, is why?   Why the division of catholic priests/laity regarding celibacy, pre-marital sex,  birth control, attending mass, even abortion.  Recent polls done by CNN when the pope visited that catholics favour pro choice (abortion) nearly as much as the general population.  Over 49% of catholics are pro choice.   I am pro life but has nothing to do with being catholic thats my personal choice

Western/Eastern European countries  catholic church mass attendance in some countrie is below 10%.   

 I know when I attended grade school in the 50s/early 60s that these  topics were not even issues.   Quick  changes among the laity and church stewards (priests) are occuring.   Why?

 

[allhers]

You say “How things were more then 1500 years ago is not really a concern today”. With an answer like that then what happened 2000 years ago isn’t a concern today. Thats not a relevant answer. Times change and the church needs to be brought up to date, or before long there will be a split in the church. By the most part USA catholics are way too liberal for the vaticans liking, thats why a US Cardinal will never become a pope with the current regime.

Recent polls state over 50% of CURRENT roman catholic priests in the USA favour abolishing celibacy. Thats over 24,000 priests in the USA.. Over 65% of catholic laity polled believe celibacy should be relaxed/abolished.  Over 80% of catholics have used or practice a form of birth control the church says is a sin.   Most catholics don't go to mass regularily or at all. Thats a lot of discention in the catholic church would you not agree, when over half of your believers do not support the vatican in many of their teachings.   In business that would be a dismal failure.

So the real question, is why?   Why the division of catholic priests/laity regarding celibacy, pre-marital sex,  birth control, attending mass, even abortion.  Recent polls done by CNN when the pope visited that catholics favour pro choice (abortion) nearly as much as the general population.  Over 49% of catholics are pro choice.   I am pro life but has nothing to do with being catholic thats my personal choice

Western/Eastern European countries  catholic church mass attendance in some countrie is below 10%.   

 I know when I attended grade school in the 50s/early 60s that these  topics were not even issues.   Quick  changes among the laity and church stewards (priests) are occuring.   Why?

A lot of what you say has nothing to do with being Catholic, so just because you keep saying the same thing over and over doesn’t mean anything is going to change. In order for a change to take place when saying the same thing over and over it has to be TRUTH.
Sorry, you just aren’t convincing anyone.

 

[impalass]

“Father” John Shuster is a priest who no longer has faculties. He left the priesthood. He makes historical mis-statements in his case in the first paragraph. He is hardly a credible witness.

Currently over 50% 24,000 United States roman catholic priests recent poll favoured abolishing celibacy. A real split in the church. I am sure there are many priests in your diocese who also favour this.

The real question is why? We know that starting in the 70s there was a real stampede out the front door by priests. Same with nuns. I know a few ex-nuns. Did they tell me stories! Marriage seemed to be the reason in most cases. Current age of a US priest is 59 and increasing all the time.

During the past 5 years there has been a large consolidation of parishes. Many have run their course and closed up and a few new ones opened where needed. With so many priests favouring abolishing celebacy its obvious there are many priests struggling with their vocation. I do feel sympathy for them. Many got themselves into something they maybe shouldn’t have.

 

[impalass]

A lot of what you say has nothing to do with being Catholic, so just because you keep saying the same thing over and over doesn’t mean anything is going to change. In order for a change to take place when saying the same thing over and over it has to be TRUTH.
Sorry, you just aren’t convincing anyone.

The question on this forum is Do you think priests should be allowed to marry?..I answered the question and gave out some statistics as this forum requests but its obvious I am not giving you the answer you want to here. My opinion on this forum is as valid as yours.

If you want people to agree with only what you have to say maybe you should start your own forum. “People who agree with me” forum.

I don’t care if things change. I sit on the sidelines and I watch as half the catholics line up on one side and the other half line up across from them. Its almost a 50/50 split and soon it will be 60/40, then 70/30 etc. It doesn’t matter to me. I like drama! But I use my OWN conscience about my current beliefs.

 

[BSHoop96]

Again, Jesus was/is God… Men are not… they are (so very) human… Jesus never said (that anyone is aware of) that marriage is inferior to not being married… St. Paul implied such a thing, but Jesus did not… He only said that we are to love Him more than our brothers, sisters, mothers, fathers, children and our very SELVES (so many of us forget that last one!! )…

And now that i think about it, it is easier to “hate” (yes, He uses that word) all those aforementioned “loved ones” if we are intimately involved with them… than when we are not…

The Church is not saying that marriage is inferior, on the contrary, it is a sacrament. Just a different one than ordination. Different is not better or worse. The Church has spoken on this. You can argue all you want. In the Latin rite priests are not married with the exception of a very small few who were married before they became Catholic, such as some episcopal and lutheran ministers. If one does not agree they are free to worship elsewhere.

 

[mercygate]

So what does the pope say about 39 popes and catholic priests that were married that came before him?

I believe several of the 12 apostles were married. Again I say when over 50% of United States Catholic priests polled recently by the New York Times/CBS that favour relaxing celibacy then 1 out of every 2 parishes in the united states (maybe your parish) I am sure your diocese has a priest(s) that disagrees strongly with your view on this matter. Maybe you should talk to your bishop to find out who they are.

The discipline of celibacy came about consistently over time and was definitely in place as normative WELL before the eleventh century. Before that, continence was expected of presbyters who were married.

The question posed by this thread was "Do you think priests should be allowed to marry?’

You have given your highly charged opinion with unambiguous clarity.

 

[estesbob]

I don’t care if things change. I sit on the sidelines and I watch as half the catholics line up on one side and the other half line up across from them. Its almost a 50/50 split and soon it will be 60/40, then 70/30 etc. It doesn’t matter to me. I like drama! But I use my OWN conscience about my current beliefs.

But those statiscis are only for the United States. Often in these discussions we forget that we are just a part of the 1.2 billion catholics in the world. We see the same thing on the “should women be ordained threads,.” People claiming that there is widesprerad support for it IN THE UNITED STATES. Other than a few Western countries there is very little push for either of these.

I personally would like to see Priest be allowed to marry but I also beleive the Pope knows a lot more about this than i ever could As always i will derfer to his judgement.

 

[BSHoop96]

39 previous popes were married, including priests of the time. Pope Adrian II was the last married pope…please check it out. I can’t change history.

Bash me all you want, I don’t make this stuff up. . The majority of catholics in all recent polls suggest celibacy should be abolished. 50% of roman catholic priests, thats right 1 out of every 2 parishes in the USA have priests that want change. Are they all wrong? Change is good! I know the catholic church hierarchy isn’t a democracy, but its time it should be.

The problem with you is that you don’t want the Catholic church to be the Catholic church anymore.

 

[impalass]

A lot of what you say has nothing to do with being Catholic, so just because you keep saying the same thing over and over doesn’t mean anything is going to change. In order for a change to take place when saying the same thing over and over it has to be TRUTH.
Sorry, you just aren’t convincing anyone.

If you don’t like my answers then why do you continue to reply? Eh!

Off topic: I was raised a catholic like you. Like most catholics we all have different views. I don’t fear what the pope says, I always use my own conscience to make logical decisions. Maybe your not a strong individual and need that crutch of the church to guide your life. I am not afraid to make negative comments about the church, nor am I afraid to criticize the government or George Bush etc. I broke away from this catholic fear/guilt syndrom the church bestowes on people, and I have been better for it. You should try it! It works.

 

[BSHoop96]

Let me ask you. Would you live a life of celibacy?

Irrelevant what someone else would do. It only matters if you plan on becoming a priest.

 

[bilop]

The question on this forum is Do you think priests should be allowed to marry?..I answered the question and gave out some statistics as this forum requests but its obvious I am not giving you the answer you want to here. My opinion on this forum is as valid as yours.

I’m sorry, but could you please state the issue correctly.

The issue is should the Church ordain married men in the Latin Church as a general rule.

There is NO POSSIBILITY of priest being able to marry and maintain their active priesthood.

Holy Orders is a permanent impediment to marriage.

The Church will NEVER allow priests to marry.

She may very well ordain more married men in the Latin Church.

God Bless

 

[impalass]

The problem with you is that you don’t want the Catholic church to be the Catholic church anymore.

All I am doing is passing on factual information.  You don't like factual information ?   I could see you being upset if I was making things up.  

Please check out what I say.  I like statistics and the information I state in these forums is very easily attainable by extremely reliable sources.  Please google married popes and read the hundreds of threads regarding them.  Please google married priests.....read all about them.  Google priest caught....and read about a lot of bad characters in the priesthood.  Google priest celibacy.....its all there.  If you don't want to believe this stuff, climb back into your bubble.

If most catholics do not follow the churches teachings, thats not my fault.  Take it up with them.   Your trying to bash me because you don't want to hear the truth.  Again please check out this information available.

I am the bearer of truthful information many don’t want to believe.

 

[BSHoop96]

If you don’t like my answers then why do you continue to reply? Eh!

Off topic: I was raised a catholic like you. Like most catholics we all have different views. I don’t fear what the pope says, I always use my own conscience to make logical decisions. Maybe your not a strong individual and need that crutch of the church to guide your life. I am not afraid to make negative comments about the church, nor am I afraid to criticize the government or George Bush etc. I broke away from this catholic fear/guilt syndrom the church bestowes on people, and I have been better for it. You should try it! It works.

If you were in a fear/guilt syndrome from the Church then you never “got it”. Maybe you should go back and try again.

 

[BSHoop96]

All I am doing is passing on factual information. You don’t like factual information ? I could see you being upset if I was making things up.

Please check out what I say.  I like statistics and the information I state in these forums is very easily attainable by extremely reliable sources.  Please google married popes and read the hundreds of threads regarding them.  Please google married priests.....read all about them.  Google priest caught....and read about a lot of bad characters in the priesthood.  Google priest celibacy.....its all there.  If you don't want to believe this stuff, climb back into your bubble.

If most catholics do not follow the churches teachings, thats not my fault.  Take it up with them.   Your trying to bash me because you don't want to hear the truth.  Again please check out this information available.

I am the bearer of truthful information many don’t want to believe.

I’m not trying to bash you. If all the polls were followed the Church would not be the church. It would be like splitting off to start another protestant church. If you are unhappy why not go to an anglican church or one where they allow married priests? Everyone has told you repeatedly that the Church is not a democracy. You refuse to listen and repeat polls. Polls don’t matter. Sorry.

 

[BSHoop96]

If most catholics do not follow the churches teachings, thats not my fault. Take it up with them. Your trying to bash me because you don’t want to hear the truth. Again please check out this information available.

Also please think about what your statement aboves mean. You think most Catholics aren’t following church teachings so your answer is to change the teachings??? That’s backwards.

 

[allhers]

If you don’t like my answers then why do you continue to reply? Eh!

Off topic: I was raised a catholic like you. Like most catholics we all have different views. I don’t fear what the pope says, I always use my own conscience to make logical decisions. Maybe your not a strong individual and need that crutch of the church to guide your life. I am not afraid to make negative comments about the church, nor am I afraid to criticize the government or George Bush etc. I broke away from this catholic fear/guilt syndrom the church bestowes on people, and I have been better for it. You should try it! It works.

If its working so well for you, what are you doing here?
I have no fear of the Pope either, our last one constantly repeated God’s’ words=“Be Not Afraid.” The current one says that a lot also. I use my rightly informed conscious too, that is how I know you are full of hockey pucky.
I don’t use crutches, nor am I afraid to make a negative comment, as you saw above in my last sentence. I have no Catholic fear/guilt either, I go to confession regularly. You ought to have tried that.

 

[BartBurk]

I would like to know if you think priests should be allowed to marry and still stay in the priesthood… If so, Why or why not??

Not after they’ve agreed to be celibate, but I see nothing wrong with a change in the future which would allow married men to be ordained as priests. Certainly, older men with empty nests who are married might be wonderful priests. The Eastern Rite churches have married priests and I don’t see why the Western church couldn’t change to a rule allowing married priests.

 

[impalass]

I’m sorry, but could you please state the issue correctly.

The issue is should the Church ordain married men in the Latin Church as a general rule.

There is NO POSSIBILITY of priest being able to marry and maintain their active priesthood.

Holy Orders is a permanent impediment to marriage.

The Church will NEVER allow priests to marry.

She may very well ordain more married men in the Latin Church.

God Bless

 I do believe that with so many priests   struggling with their vocation celibacy/sex abuse scandal etc  the pope should be a little more sympathetic and personal and try and find out the root cause of the discention rather then slamming his fist down and just saying "do what I say"  that only brings more discention.  All I am doing is passing on information that there are more catholic priests in the USA that want celibacy abolished then priests who don't and the numbers are rising every year.  This is not my information.   The information I state is easily attainable.    The real question on this forum should be  "why do more then half of all catholic priests in the USA want celibacy relaxed/abolished" or why are over 65% of catholic laity in favour of making celibacy optional:........they would be the better questions.

If the pope stands tuff on this issue so be it.  Devout Catholics shouldn't complain that the number of priests are diminishing quickly.  If they do then something  should  have to be done.  If you have to drive 50 miles to a church with a priest then so be it.  You can't have it both ways.

 

[Pier]

Off topic: I was raised a catholic like you. Like most catholics we all have different views. I don’t fear what the pope says, I always use my own conscience to make logical decisions. Maybe your not a strong individual and need that crutch of the church to guide your life. I am not afraid to make negative comments about the church, nor am I afraid to criticize the government or George Bush etc. I broke away from this catholic fear/guilt syndrom the church bestowes on people, and I have been better for it. You should try it! It works.

Those of us who adhere to Church teaching don’t “fear” the Pope, or consider our beliefs a crutch. Thankfully, some of us broke away from the “anything goes” syndrome our culture has dictated to people, and have been better for it.

You should try it! It works!

 

[impalass]

Those of us who adhere to Church teaching don’t “fear” the Pope, or consider our beliefs a crutch. Thankfully, some of us broke away from the “anything goes” syndrome our culture has dictated to people, and have been better for it.

You should try it! It works!

you say ........."those of us who adhere to church teaching don't fear the pope or consider our beliefs a crutch"       

your numbers are decreasing rapidly.......statistics don't lie.  More then 65% of current catholics don't adhere to the churches teachings and these numbers are growing.  Again not my opinion just factual information I thought you would like to know......its there for you to read.

“you should try it you say” Oh I tried it several years ago. About grade 6 I remember the priest & nuns screaming at us in class when someone questioned anything about the church…

         .."J U S T    B E L I E V E    I T"  !!!!!!!

they would scream back holding the wooden pointer at our faces! They scared me then but not now!

that was enough for me!