Does 8am Saturday TLM fulfill Sunday obligation?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jenny35
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
J

Jenny35

Guest
It seems like it would be too early in the day, but there is no TLM on Sunday in my area. Does anyone know for sure?
 
Jenny35 said:
It seems like it would be too early in the day, but there is no TLM on Sunday in my area. Does anyone know for sure?
Click to expand...
No, this would not fulfill the Sunday obligation. Even a noon Mass (TLM or NO) on Saturday would not qualify, as it is not the Sunday anticipatory Mass. I believe it is up to the bishop of a diocese to decide the earliest that an anticipatory Mass can be said, and it is generally no earlier than 4:00-5:00 p.m.

Even a Saturday evening wedding is generally not considered fulfilling the Sunday obligation, but I believe one can get a dispensation from a priest regarding this (not 100% sure about that, though).
 
larsont7 said:
Even a Saturday evening wedding is generally not considered fulfilling the Sunday obligation, but I believe one can get a dispensation from a priest regarding this (not 100% sure about that, though).
Click to expand...
A Saturday evening wedding Mass would indeed fulfill the Sunday obligation.
 
Jenny35 said:
It seems like it would be too early in the day, but there is no TLM on Sunday in my area. Does anyone know for sure?
Click to expand...
No.Your obligation to attend Mass on Sunday is not fulfilled by a Saturday morning Mass. You will have to attend another Mass.
 
Jenny35 said:
It seems like it would be too early in the day, but there is no TLM on Sunday in my area. Does anyone know for sure?
Click to expand...
No it would not. It’s has to take place in the evening but it’s not just about the time of day, to fulfil the Sunday mass obligation the Vigil Mass has to include the relevant readings and lectionary proper to the following day’s Sunday celebration of the Mass.

That is why when a feast day falls on a Saturday, it is celebrated at the earlier mass, and the evening mass will be the proper vigil for Sunday with the same readings as you would find if you went to mass on the Sunday.
 
I just posted this canon yesterday. 😛

Can. 1248 §1. A person who assists at a Mass celebrated anywhere in a Catholic rite either on the feast day itself or in the evening of the preceding day satisfies the obligation of participating in the Mass.

Notice that no stipulation is made about the readings needing to be for the Sunday in order to fulfill the obligation. Naturally, that will be the case 99 times out of 100. But it is not strictly necessary.
 
1ke said:
This is not true.
Click to expand...
Yes it is. The Saturday evening mass is, in effect, the Sunday Mass which is why it fulfills the obligation. You cannot attend a mass which has Saturday’s readings and fulfil your obligation.
 
liturgyluver said:
Yes it is. The Saturday evening mass is, in effect, the Sunday Mass which is why it fulfills the obligation. You cannot attend a mass which has Saturday’s readings and fulfil your obligation.
Click to expand...
Yes you can. Would you contend that a nuptial Mass on a Saturday at 6PM does not fulfill the obligation? The Mass itself does not matter; it is when it is celebrated that counts.
 
liturgyluver said:
Yes it is. The Saturday evening mass is, in effect, the Sunday Mass which is why it fulfills the obligation. You cannot attend a mass which has Saturday’s readings and fulfil your obligation.
Click to expand...
Very common misconception, and it has been covered here literally hundreds of time before. The relevant canon has already been posted. As one may see from the canon, the Church makes NO DISTINCTION about which Mass is celebrated or which readings are used. One may go to a wedding Mass, a funeral Mass, a Byzantine Divine Liturgy or an Extraordinary Form Mass (the latter two use different readings). As the canon clearly states, a Mass on Sunday or Saturday evening fulfills the Sunday or holy day obligation. Anything else is something that individuals have somehow gotten into their minds and convinced themselves are Church requirements, but they cannot support this with any documentation, because the Church does not have such requirements.

A few months ago my mother attended a wedding Mass celebrated on a Sunday in the chapel of Fordham University. Present were the president and officers of this well-known Jesuit institution. Even at that Mass, the priest (an eminent canon lawyer) explained that the nuptial Mass fulfilled the Sunday obligation because it was a Mass on Sunday, in accordance with canon law, and NOT because of the readings used.
 
I lean towards to side of ‘yes, it is’.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_05071998_dies-domini_en.html
  1. Because the faithful are obliged to attend Mass unless there is a grave impediment, Pastors have the corresponding duty to offer to everyone the real possibility of fulfilling the precept. The provisions of Church law move in this direction, as for example in the faculty granted to priests, with the prior authorization of the diocesan Bishop, to celebrate more than one Mass on Sundays and holy days,(85) the institution of evening Masses(86) and the provision which allows the obligation to be fulfilled from Saturday evening onwards, starting at the time of First Vespers of Sunday.(87) From a liturgical point of view, in fact, holy days begin with First Vespers.(88) Consequently, the liturgy of what is sometimes called the “Vigil Mass” is in effect the “festive” Mass of Sunday, at which the celebrant is required to preach the homily and recite the Prayer of the Faithful.
Click to expand...
 
Joe_5859 said:
Yes, a Mass needs to have the readings for that day to be the Mass for that day. But that speaks nothing of fulfilling one’s obligation for Mass attendance.
Click to expand...
On the contrary, Masses before the First Vespers of Sunday would not fulfill the Sunday obligation and to use Saturday readings on Sunday would appear to me to be liturgical abuse. That is, of course, only my opinion.
 
liturgyluver said:
Yes it is. The Saturday evening mass is, in effect, the Sunday Mass which is why it fulfills the obligation. You cannot attend a mass which has Saturday’s readings and fulfil your obligation.
Click to expand...
There was some kerfluffle about this on Fr. Z’s blog recently and Ed Peters, a canonist of note, weighed in. Evening Masses always fulfill the following day’s obligation regardless of choice of readings.

It is not a Sunday Mass unless it has readings for Sunday Mass, but we are not obliged to attend a Sunday Mass, just a Mass on Sunday. Follow?
 
JM3 said:
On the contrary, Masses before the First Vespers of Sunday would not fulfill the Sunday obligation and to use Saturday readings on Sunday would appear to me to be liturgical abuse. That is, of course, only my opinion.
Click to expand...
We need to be careful not to conflate two separate issues.

Yes, ordinarily a Saturday evening Mass will use the Sunday readings. But there are exceptions: weddings, funerals, etc. This is where it comes into play.

The Canon says only “A person who assists at a Mass celebrated anywhere in a Catholic rite either on the feast day itself or in the evening of the preceding day satisfies the obligation of participating in the Mass.” It doesn’t say anything about having to be after First Vespers or using the readings for the day.

Jimmy Akin backs me up. 😛
 
sw85 said:
It is not a Sunday Mass unless it has readings for Sunday Mass, but we are not obliged to attend a Sunday Mass, just a Mass on Sunday. Follow?
Click to expand...
Thank you for very concisely saying what I have been trying to say.
 
For example, when Christmas falls on a Saturday, one can attend the Saturday morning Mass for Christmas Day to fulfill the Christmas obligation, and then attend the Saturday evening Mass, which will also be the Mass for Christmas Day, in fulfillment of the Sunday obligation.
 
I pray I never attend Mass out of obligation, but only out of the ardent desire to worship The Lord!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top