Does it matter what denomination you are a part of?

[MichaelP3]

Someone on CAF needs to send him the memo.

And this is the central authority that is brought up so many times!.

Just to take note. I really like Pope Francis and I can just imagine how his posts would be on here. I will probably run out of LIKES very quickly!

 

[MT1926]

Someone on CAF needs to send him the memo.

And this is the central authority that is brought up so many times!.

What memo needs sent?

The only one I can think of is Good Job!

Are we not suppose to even try to work towards unity?

God Bless

 

[Wannano]

Unity is easy. They need to discard their heretical beliefs, acknowledge the Church as the one founded by Christ and led by the apostles successors and humbly submit to their authority and teaching.

They have nothing we need, we have the fullness of Christ’s truth where they have but distorted fragments.

You are saying Anglicans and Lutherans are heretics?

 

[MichaelP3]

This sums up the problem!

 

[Wannano]

What official positions would you consider to be heretical?

 

[Wannano]

So basically all non-Catholics are actually still to be considered heretics?

 

[lanman87]

I asked him for his evidence and he would sight Church Fathers on the Trinity on such and such a date and then say see this one doesn’t count because it was added on such and such a date. This led to a discussion of who gets to draw a line in the sand of the cut off date of which Church Father or which Church teaching that was finally written down was what the Apostles taught. I got no response, which tells me in the end he gets to pick and choose what interpretation of scripture is what the Apostles taught.

You do realize that there is as much disagreement about what the church fathers taught as there is on what certain scriptures mean. Calvin and Luther and many protestants sighted the church fathers in their writings as evidence that the current church doesn’t teach what the early church taught.

You asked for evidence that certain things weren’t part of the apostolic faith. I answered that you could look at history and see when the doctrines were introduced. And of course, I would say they also aren’t in the sacred scripture or the sacred scriptures is being misrepresented and taken out of context to support your position.

I ask you for evidence that the teachings were always part of apostolic teaching and your response if the church says so. The church has the authority to say what the apostles taught and what scripture means and can’t be wrong. Therefore it doesn’t matter if it was introduced at a later date or is not found in the scriptures. In your mind, if the Catholic church teaches it, it must be correct, no matter what the church teaches.

 

[lanman87]

Actually I believe Christ gave us ONE Church so that we may know the best and most accurate way. I also believe that Christ’s Church, whom Christ promised He would be with til the end of the age, knows. Sure I’ll be honest, I also believe that Church is the Catholic Church.

And Baptist think they have it right and Presbyterians believe they have it right and so on and so on.

I would say God CAN give grace. His choice not ours. He told us what things we need to do HIS WAY and how we can know what HIS WAY is in order to get grace, if some want to say he didn’t tell us this that’s their choice. All I can say is good luck with that.

And everyone will tell you they are doing it “His Way”.

 

[MichaelP3]

Calvin and Luther and many protestants sighted the church fathers in their writings as evidence that the current church doesn’t teach what the early church taught

Exactly the reason I smile when I see a post stating.

1. This is very Catholic
2. Accodring to history… (yes all have access to that)
3. This is a new invention…
4. According to the Apostles…
5. And all its derivatives…

Additionally. Many on here need to understand the difference between capital C as in the Catholic Church and small c as on what we all are! The UNIVERSAL church!

 

[MichaelP3]

You really think Pope Francis would say “good job” if he was viewing all the posts on CAF?

 

[Wannano]

Baptist’s and Presbyterians can say they’re right all they want. We at least have a 2,000 year old institution that traces its roots back to Christ himself to back up our arguments.

I think if you backed up all the way back to Christ you would discover He never intended for His followers to be interested in arguements.

 

[MichaelP3]

I am interested.

How far have you studied history?

Are you aware that no mainline Protestant would be against those councils.

And then my actual question. Do you know why? (Also many on CAF miss that.)

 

[MT1926]

I ask you for evidence that the teachings were always part of apostolic teaching and your response if the church says so.

Please quote where I said this.

My only point with you this entire time is who gets to draw the line in the sand.

See here is the issue. The Catholic Church teaches that the Church Fathers can teach authoritatively, especially when they are in agreement. However, she also teaches that they are not infallible and can err. So in the end someone, even when discussing the Fathers, has to be able to draw the line on what was taught correctly and what was off the mark. Just because Calvin and Luther can point to something that the Church has already stated for years was off the mark isn’t evidence for anything. Especially since they ignore the teachings of the Fathers they don’t agree with.

The Catholic Church has authority over what the Fathers taught and the Fathers agreed with this authority. It is only because of this agreement that what they say holds any authority. Since Calvin and Luther disagree with the authority that the Fathers agreed with and don’t believe the Father’s to be any more infallible then they are then doesn’t it seem a little ridiculous for them to try and use them as a defense of their teachings? I mean if you don’t believe the Fathers when they disagree with you why on earth would you try to use them as your defense?

God Bless

 

[Wannano]

Really? Guess all those church councils where they debated doctrine and true teachings of Christ were pointless then. Should have just let everyone have their own opinion and left it to chance rather than fighting for truth.

Domination, power and fighting was never what Jesus intended.

 

[MT1926]

And Baptist think they have it right and Presbyterians believe they have it right and so on and so on.

So they believe they are the one true Church that has existed since the time of Christ?

And everyone will tell you they are doing it “His Way”.

YEP that was the point I was making. Not claiming who has it right. Just pointing out if everyone believes they are doing it Christ’s way and Christ tells us their is only one way then common sense tells me someone has to be wrong.

God Bless

 

[MichaelP3]

I am not american to begin with.

My wife is doing her PhD in history and from experience that is a concentrated path. So unless your degree is in Bibilcal or some kind of history in that department, my question still stands.

 

[MichaelP3]

Why do you never hear a “Protestant” argue against those first councils? ( Catholics love to bring that up and I have no idea why).

 

[MT1926]

You really think Pope Francis would say “good job” if he was viewing all the posts on CAF?

Oh sorry about that. I miss understood. You seem to like to right these short little remarks that are difficult to understand.

AlNg asked why is the Pope praying with Lutherans…

You responded someone on CAF needs to send him the memo.

It sure comes across that you were saying someone needs to send a memo about what he is doing.

Not seeing how this memo was meant for him to come here and tell us how we are doing. AlNg’s original post that you quoted doesn’t even mention CAF.

I think he would tell some of the threads Good Job and some of the threads to take the log out of your own eye before you try to remove the splinter from your brothers,

God Bless

 

[MichaelP3]

I will try and write longer ones next time.

I hope to think he will be disciplining somewhat more than you are implying.

And to the memo. He probably would also correct that post!

 

[MT1926]

I will try and write longer ones next time.

No problem, I just tend to be detail oriented, kind of long winded at times also.

I hope to think he will be disciplining somewhat more than you are implying.

He is much to busy for that, that’s why he has Cardinals that help him out.

Well it’s almost ten and I’m still at work and haven’t had diner yet.

Good night all.

God Bless