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ralphy
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Why don’t you take your “infallible” interpretations then, and line them up with scripture, and see how they turn out, such as “priests” in the new covenant. In christian love, Ralph.
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ralphy
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I can see from your reply that you are not up to the challenge of “tradition” versus “scripture”, however I can also understand your position, as the Word of God never changes, and nothing can stand against it. I believe if you did take a serious look at even one item with an open mind, that the Holy Spirit would enlighten you as to the truth of the matter, and I do say this “in Christian love”, Ralph.
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davidv
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Your challenge is the logical fallacy of the false dicotomy. It has no either or answer.
Your implication of closed mindedness of Catholics is lame and it doesn’t contain much “Christian love”.
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ralphy
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Can I assume that this answer you have given means that you are not up to the challenge. Can I also assume that probably no RC will ever venture to test what they have been taught in the RCC, and apply it to scripture to sort out the truth. In Christian love, Ralph.
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davidv
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You are certainly free to make any assumption you care to. Just be sure it doesn’t impune your credibility. I would suggest no Catholic submit themselve to a false test.
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ralphy
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It looks to me like the “false” side of this test that you are referring to is the scriptural part, as you are warning RC to stay away from it, indicating that they are right. I am not concerned about my credibility, I am just the messenger, you may shoot me down, but the message goes on. In Christian love, Ralph.
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PRmerger
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I will after you first show me that Scripture (which is a product of Catholic Tradition) says I have to do this.
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ralphy
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My friend, you do not have to do this if you do not want to, I was just asking. In Christian love, Ralph.I will after you first show me that Scripture (which is a product of Catholic Tradition) says I have to do this.
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PRmerger
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I won’t follow any command that’s not found in Scripture!
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ralphy
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I really think that you are jesting with me with this quote above, right. The RCC is full of commands that is not found in scripture. In Christian love, RalphI won’t follow any command that’s not found in Scripture!
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PRmerger
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And does your church, Ralphy. The primary one being the doctrine that says, “It has to be in the bible for me to believe it.”
Now, when you show me even one verse that says this, then I’ll show you where everything the CC teaches is in the bible.
Additionally, your church believes that Hebrews is inspired, yet no where does it say it is, so that’s another thing not found in Scripture that you believe. You can thank the CC for telling you it’s inspired.
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PRmerger
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There’s nothing in the NT that talks about a lot of things you do in your church, ralphy.
There’s not a single verse that talks about exchanging wedding rings.
There’s not a single verse that talks about getting married in a church.
There’s not a single verse that talks about Wednesday night Bible studies.
There’s not a single verse that talks about altar calls.
There’s not a single verse about an organ playing hymns.
There’s not a single verse about “let’s get out our Bibles and read what Paul has to say on this issue.”
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ralphy
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If you would look at John 17:17, you will see that the word of God is truth, so one must look to the Bible and then you know for sure that you can believe it. I say also that Hebrews is inspired because I have read 2 Tim 3:6-17, and found assurance that it is. In Christian love, Ralph.And does your church, Ralphy. The primary one being the doctrine that says, “It has to be in the bible for me to believe it.”
Now, when you show me even one verse that says this, then I’ll show you where everything the CC teaches is in the bible.
Additionally, your church believes that Hebrews is inspired, yet no where does it say it is, so that’s another thing not found in Scripture that you believe. You can thank the CC for telling you it’s inspired.
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PRmerger
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Amen! That is very Catholic of you to say that!
Ralphy, you would not know that Hebrews is inspired except that the Catholic Church told you it was.
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ralphy
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You always seem to miss one letter when you mention the CC, actually you are obviously referring to the RCC. For I belong to the “catholic” church. In Christian love, Ralph.Amen! That is very Catholic of you to say that!
Ralphy, you would not know that Hebrews is inspired except that the Catholic Church told you it was.
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ralphy
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I see a big difference between the RCC and the CC. The RCC is governed by the pope and the cardinal’s from Rome, and whatever they say is followed. The CC, (which is the Body of Christ), is under God Himself, and we follow Him by following what is said in His word. In Christian love, Ralph.
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PRmerger
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Well, since I’m on the CATHOLIC Answers forums, not the Roman CATHOLIC Answers forums, I will continue to refer to my church in the correct manner.
If you want to join a* Roman* Catholic Answers forums, ralphy, knock yourself out.
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ralphy
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Then you are indicating that you do not adhere to the teachings of the pope, the cardinals,etc, which is RC. In Christian love, Ralph.Well, since I’m on the CATHOLIC Answers forums, not the Roman CATHOLIC Answers forums, I will continue to refer to my church in the correct manner.
If you want to join a* Roman* Catholic Answers forums, ralphy, knock yourself out.
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PRmerger
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Please show me where the pope says that we are to be called the Roman Catholic Church and not the Catholic Church.
Also, why is this ministry allowed to exist and call itself Catholic Answers, ralphy?
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PRmerger
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Here’s a quote for you, ralphy, from papalencylicals.net: (bold mine)
“We define” (declare the Fathers of the Council of Florence) “that the Holy and Apostolic See and the** Roman Pontiff hold the primacy of the Church throughout the whole world: and that the same Roman Pontiff is the successor of St. Peter, the Prince of the Apostles, and the true Vicar of Christ, the head of the whole Church**, and the father and teacher of all Christians; and that full power was given to him, in Blessed Peter, by our Lord Jesus Christ to feed, to rule, and to govern the universal Church, as is also contained in the acts of ecumenical councils and in the sacred canons” (Conc. Florentinum). Similarly the Fourth Council of Lateran declares: “The Roman Church, as the mother and mistress of all the faithful, by the will of Christ obtains primacy of jurisdiction over all other Churches.” These declarations were preceded by the consent of antiquity which ever acknowledged, without the slightest doubt or hesitation, the Bishops of Rome, and revered them, as the legitimate successors of St. Peter.
Who is unaware of the many and evident testimonies of the holy Fathers which exist to this effect? Most remarkable is that of St. Irenaeus who, referring to the Roman Church, says: “With this Church, on account of its preeminent authority, it is necessary that every Church should be in concord” (Contra Haereses, lib. iii., cap. 3, n. 2); and St. Cyprian also says of the Roman Church, that “it is the root and mother of the Catholic Church, the chair of Peter, and the principal Church whence sacerdotal unity has its source” (Ep. xlviii., ad Cornelium, n. 3. and Ep. lix., ad eundem, n. 14). He calls it the chair of Peter because it is occupied by the successor of Peter: he calls it the principal Church, on account of the primacy conferred on Peter himself and his legitimate successors; and the source of unity, because the Roman Church is the efficient cause of unity in the Christian commonwealth. For this reason Jerome addresses Damasus thus: “My words are spoken to the successor of the Fisherman, to the disciple of the Cross…I communicate with none save your Blessedness, that is with the chair of Peter. For this I know is the rock on which the Church is built” (Ep. xv., ad Damasum, n. 2). **Union with the Roman See of Peter is to him always the public criterion of a Catholic. **“I acknowledge everyone who is united with the See of Peter” (Ep. xvi., ad Damasum, n. 2). And for a like reason St. Augustine publicly attests that, “the primacy of the Apostolic chair always existed in the Roman Church” (Ep. xliii., n. 7); and he denies that anyone who dissents from the Roman faith can be a Catholic. “**You are not to be looked upon as holding the true Catholic faith if you do not teach that the faith of Rome is to be held” **(Sermo cxx., n. 13). So, too, St. Cyprian: “To be in communion with Cornelius is to be in communion with the Catholic Church” (Ep. Iv., n. 1). In the same way Maximus the Abbot teaches that obedience to the Roman Pontiff is the proof of the true faith and of legitimate communion. Therefore if a man does not want to be, or to be called, a heretic, let him not strive to please this or that man…but let him hasten before all things **to be in communion with the Roman See. **If he be in communion with it, he should be acknowledged by all and everywhere as faithful and orthodox. He speaks in vain who tries to persuade me of the orthodoxy of those who, like himself, refuse obedience to his Holiness the Pope of the most holy Church of Rome: that is to the Apostolic See." The reason and motive of this he explains to be that “the Apostolic See has received and hath government, authority, and power of binding and loosing from the Incarnate Word Himself; and, according to all holy synods, sacred canons and decrees, in all things and through all things, in respect of all the holy churches of God throughout the whole world, since the Word in Heaven who rules the Heavenly powers binds and loosens there” (Defloratio ex Epistola ad Petrum illustrem).
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