Does the SSPX speak uncharitably of the Jews?

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st_julie

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This is a question that I have wanted to ask for a long time. My co-worker, a member of SSPX, has extremely unkind things to say when speaking of Jews. I wondered if this was a local issue or is it quite common. I am a baby boomer and I have to say that I did not know that my Father possessed the same thoughts. During my growing up years he never had a opportunity to say them. My learning was therefore formed by JPll. so I want to ask if prejidice is common?
st julie
 
Hmm…it depends what the person was saying.

What he was saying could be perfectly true, and the perfectly traditional (and correct) understanding of the Jews from a religious and political standpoint…but you have been made so sensitized to the idea of this “anti-semitism” that is apparently lurking behind every corner (thanks to a massive media propoganda campaign on their part) that you found the comments objectionable, when objectively, they’re really quite true.

At the same time, I do not like the schismatic SSPX and do believe that actual antisemitism and racism is rampant among them.
 
Hi Julie,
  1. It is difficult to give an answer to a generality.
    It would be best to give several examples of what is said, then those who care to can look at them and comment.
  2. However, as a general rule, The Catholic Church in history has always been suspicious of Jewry and its professed beliefs (the Talmud especially) and its promotion of naturalism.
  3. It sometimes is easy to subconsciously look at JPII as the only pope that ever spoke on anything, especially those who never studied an earlier time, and in fact the Catholic Church really started with the long, long reign of JPII…third longest in history I believe.
    The popes of history seem to have fallen off the catholic tree, as if what they have to say died with them and had no wisdom for the ages. Then of course, what JPII said would have to die with him as well.
  4. On the opposite side, since the SSPX are a strain of Traditionalism, and in vigorous disagreement with many preachings of JPII, they tend to drop the recent popes off the Catholic tree, and only look to the historical popes of earlier times.
    Those popes, I dare say you would consider as “unkind” toward Jewry. That is where the SSPX gets their opinions of Jewry, whereas you get yours from the most recent popes.
    In either case I don’t think it is a matter of dogma on how Jewry is treated.
    Charity demands not only the kindness to others, but also the protection of our offspring in a secular world. JPII sees the former, the SSPX & past popes in history see the latter side of charity.
    IMHO of course.
 
st_julie said:
This is a question that I have wanted to ask for a long time. My co-worker, a member of SSPX, has extremely unkind things to say when speaking of Jews. I wondered if this was a local issue or is it quite common. I am a baby boomer and I have to say that I did not know that my Father possessed the same thoughts. During my growing up years he never had a opportunity to say them. My learning was therefore formed by JPll. so I want to ask if prejidice is common?
st julie
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no they do not. i’ve been an sspx laity for over a year now, and that is simply not true. it is highly uncommon. no prejudice is not common in the sspx.
 
Marilena said:
no they do not. i’ve been an sspx laity for over a year now, and that is simply not true. it is highly uncommon. no prejudice is not common in the sspx.
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Perhaps it might be more common with the Mel/Hutton Gibson types?
 
as far as i know, mr. gibson is not an sspx laity. i believe his dad is a laityof the sspv.but correct me please if iam wrong.
still, racial discrimination of any type is not accepted at the sspx. our parish is very multicultural and it is wonderful!
👍
 
batteddy said:
At the same time, I do not like the schismatic SSPX and do believe that actual antisemitism and racism is rampant among them.
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wouldn’t “I do not like the schismatic SSPX”
Or
“believe that actual antisemitism and racism is rampant among them.”

actually be a subject to the same accusation toward you of bigotry?

Are the following quotes antisemitic or racist?
Pope Innocent IV: “And that you [King Saint Louis IX] order both the aforesaid abusive books [The Talmud] condemned by the same doctors and generally all the books with their glosses which were examined and condemned by them to be burned by fire wherever they can be found throughout your entire kingdom, strictly forbidding that Jews henceforth have Christian nurses or servants, that the sons of a free woman may not serve the sons of a bondwoman, but as slaves condemned by the Lord, whose death they wickedly plotted, they at least outwardly recognize themselves as slaves of those whom the death of Christ made free and themselves slaves. So we may commend the zeal of your sincerity in the Lord with due praises.” (The Wicked Perfidy of the Jews)
Pope Gregory IX: “They ought to know the yoke of perpetual enslavement because of their guilt. See to it that the perfidious Jews never in the future become insolent, but that they always suffer publicly the shame of their sin in servile fear.” (Epistle to the Hierarchy of Germany)

Pope Paul IV: “It is too absurd and pointless that the Jews, whom their own guilt condemns to slavery, under the pretence that Christian piety suffers and tolerates their coexistence, pay back [with wickedness] the mercy received from Christians.” (Cum Nimis Absurdum)
 
batteddy said:
Hmm…it depends what the person was saying.

What he was saying could be perfectly true, and the perfectly traditional (and correct) understanding of the Jews from a religious and political standpoint…but you have been made so sensitized to the idea of this “anti-semitism” that is apparently lurking behind every corner (thanks to a massive media propoganda campaign on their part) that you found the comments objectionable, when objectively, they’re really quite true.

At the same time, I do not like the schismatic SSPX and do believe that actual antisemitism and racism is rampant among them.
Click to expand...
that is false speculation and a false statement to make. i have never met any sspx priests or laity that are antisemitic!

i have met alot of them believe me. our parish is multicultural and everyone is treated with respect and dignity.
 
Marilena said:
as far as i know, mr. gibson is not an sspx laity. i believe his dad is a laityof the sspv.but correct me please if iam wrong.
still, racial discrimination of any type is not accepted at the sspx. our parish is very multicultural and it is wonderful!
👍
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Sorry for not being more clear. I was trying to say that the weird comments/attitude on the jews is more often found with the Gibson-types, not sspx
 
In contrast, here is B16:
Benedict XVI, General Audience, Jan. 17, 2007: “The days from 18 to 25 January… are a strong time of commitment and prayer on the part of all Christians, who can avail themselves of the booklets produced jointly by the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity and the Faith and Order Commission of the World Council of Churches… For almost 20 years now the Italian Bishops’ Conference has dedicated this Judaism Day to furthering knowledge and esteem for it and for developing the relationship of reciprocal friendship between the Christian and Jewish communities, a relationship that has developed positively since the Second Vatican Council and the historic visit of the Servant of God John Paul II to the Major Synagogue in Rome…. Today I invite you all to address an ardent prayer to the Lord that Jews and Christians may respect and esteem one another…” (L’Osservatore Romano, Jan. 24, 2007, p. 11)
 
TNT said:
InToday I invite you all to address an ardent prayer to the Lord that Jews and Christians may
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respect and esteem one another…” (L’Osservatore Romano, Jan. 24, 2007, p. 11)

that is a statement i truly believe in!! 👍
 
I was just reading Karl Keatings letter about this very subject.The influence seems to come from reading Catholic Family News and common among radical traditionalists.
 
A Monsignor in The Florida Catholic recently stated that Jews shouldn’t convert to Catholicism. That is true anti-semitism.
 
EddieArent said:
A Monsignor in The Florida Catholic recently stated that Jews shouldn’t convert to Catholicism. That is true anti-semitism.
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I agree. True love —for our fellow man–is to bring them into the light and Truth of God the Son–our Lord Jesus Christ and His Church.
 
st_julie said:
I was just reading Karl Keatings letter about this very subject.The influence seems to come from reading Catholic Family News and common among radical traditionalists.
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there is no anti semitic influence in the sspx if that is what your referrimg to?
 
st_julie said:
I was just reading Karl Keatings letter about this very subject.The influence seems to come from reading Catholic Family News and common among radical traditionalists.
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I think --you need to go back to re-read Mr. Keatings letter. He reviewed a report by the Southern Poverty Law Center on traditionalist and anti-Semitism and found the report for the most part lacking in credibility. That is why the title of Mr. Keatings letter is as follows.

A BOTCHED REPORT ON A WORTHY ISSUE
 
Your right. I did that very thing. I was glad I hadn’t made too many comments.
 
Am I missing something here? Isn’t the SSPX against the Second Vatican Council’s Nostra Aetate declaration of 1965, which removed the characterization of Jews as “Christ-killers” and opened the way for Catholic-Jewish dialogue? Don’t they maintain that current church policy towards Jews, is the product of Jewish influence in the church?
 
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