Does your faith indluence who you for vote in a secular election?

[arthra]

*“Just curious to what extent your faith influences for whom you will vote in a secular election like the upcoming US presidential election or any other election, for that matter.
For instance, do you vote for a candidate of the same faith as yours (if there is one) as the main voting qualification criteria or does faith play no role whatsoever? Perhaps somewhere in between?”

*Baha’is generally are non-partisan and do not belong to partisan political groups, parties or engage in partisanship debates, rallies etc. Baha’is are encouraged to vote as independents or non-partisans. No Baha’is run for partisan offices in elections.

*"The Bahá’í Community is a world-wide organization seeking to establish true and universal peace on earth. If a Bahá’í works for one political party to overcome another it is negation of the very spirit of the Faith. Membership in any political party, therefore, necessarily entails repudiation of some or all of the principles of peace and unity proclaimed by Bahá’u’lláh. As 'Abdu’l-Bahá stated: ‘Our Party is God’s party; we do not belong to any party.’

(Compilations, Lights of Guidance, p. 443)

*Within the Faith our elections have no nominations for offices. Our elections begin in prayerand plurality or sometimes majority vote decides the issue.Baha’is stress unity and consultation.

 

[badnewsbarrett]

From what I understand, Trump is pro-life.

I did mention one of them was lying.

Trump’s stated position used to be that he is pro-choice in every respect, and that if he were the decision-maker on partial-birth abortions, he would do nothing to prevent them.

Now he’s the Republican nominee, he’s been a conservative for the last five minutes, and he says he changed his mind. Now he’s proud to be pro-life.

He’s lying.

 

[Alex_H]

As a Catholic, are you more apt to vote for the candidate who has a Catholic VP running mate or the one who holds similar views as the Catholic Church on matters such as abortion and gay marriage but is not Catholic? Or does none of this factor in at all?

To me, the views of the VP candidates are of secondary importance.

Their views really only matter if the President dies or is incapacitated.

When I’m voting, I am looking largely at the views of the top of the ticket – that is, the Presidential nominee. In this election, that would be Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump.

Both candidates are equally scandalous, in my opinion. Donald Trump is known to say many offensive things about women, veterans, and immigrants.

Hillary, for her part, has shown incredibly bad judgment when it comes to the handling of classified information.

She has received a lot of money from the big banks. Then she goes out and rails against the big banks talking about how she is going to make sure they don’t screw over the average American. Nobody believes that. She is paid off by those banks.

Hillary says she will fight for gay rights. At the same time, she is taking money from places like Saudi Arabia, where homosexuality is punishable by death.

She and Donald both go against Catholic teaching.

Donald talks about taking out the families of terrorists, something that has been specifically denounced by the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB). He has spoken about how great waterboarding and other forms of torture are, which has also been denounced by the USCCB. He doesn’t even believe in climate change, something that the USCCB says needs to be “seriously addressed.”

Hillary, on the other hand, is pro-choice, which costs the lives of millions of babies each year.

 

[superwimp]

Hello,
I don't see why being pro-choice or pro-life would matter. During most of Bush's presidency republicans controlled both houses and seven of the nine chief justices were republican appointments. It seems like abortion is just something republicans use to rally the troops.

 

[Padres1969]

I did mention one of them was lying.

Trump’s stated position used to be that he is pro-choice in every respect, and that if he were the decision-maker on partial-birth abortions, he would do nothing to prevent them.

Now he’s the Republican nominee, he’s been a conservative for the last five minutes, and he says he changed his mind. Now he’s proud to be pro-life.

He’s lying.

Indeed even in his faux-Pro-Life for convenience guise during this election, he still supports some abortions in cases of rape, incest, mother’s health…

 

[TobyLue]

My Catholic Faith definitely plays a part for who I will vote for. Having said that, I know that there are many minuses for both candidates. One is a loud mouth who insults people, calls them names etc. with no political experience. But is political experience a plus? It can be a big minus if those political actions or inaction’s have caused considerable damage.

There is that old adage, “stick and stones can break my bones but words can never hurt me”. Well if we can apply that to the two candidates, the one who calls people names, have they cause considerable damage to the country? What damage has the other one who has failed to act caused? For one, four deaths of some brave men; has put the country at risk by sending classified material over unsecured servers; has lied about them; has looked at the mothers of the four who died straight at their eyes and lied to them.

One has selected a VP who says is a devout Catholic and is involved in parish activities but then acts like Pontius Pilate. What did Pilate do? He interrogated a man who he found was innocent but did nothing to prevent from being put to death. He was afraid that a riot would break out if he set him free. Still trying to avoid taking the blame, he then agreed for the crowd to decide when he gave them the choice to free Jesus or Barabbas a criminal. When the crowd picked Barabbas, he then washed his hands claiming innocence of Jesus’ blood.

We have many politicians who are like Pilate. They claim they are against abortion but believe it is the woman’s decision to make. Pilate knew Jesus was innocent but believed it was the crowd’s decision to make. Politicians “wash” their hands of the slaughter of the millions of babies, as they say “it’s the law” but then do NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING to try to reverse the hideous and most immoral law ever passed by the Supreme Court.

Are these “Catholic” politicians really Catholic? What does it mean when we go up to communion? It means that we are “in communion” with what the Church teaches and it teaches that abortion is an intrinsic evil.

Are we as Catholics held up to higher standards? Yes, of course. Luke 12:48 “…to whom much is given much will be demanded…” As Catholics we have been given the fullness of Truth and we are expected to live up and spread those Truths. We can’t expect those who are non-Catholics to fully understand but God is demanding Catholics to stand up and fight. How can we say we are against abortion but then just stand back and be like Pilate and cower like scared roach and look the other way and say “it’s a woman’s choice” like the coward Pilate was and washed his hands and say “It was the peoples choice to kill an innocent man.” How many innocent babies have been butchered because of cowardly inactions?

If there was an atheist running against a “pro-choice” Catholic and that atheist was against abortion, against homosexual marriages, against euthanasia, the the Catholic was wishy-washy in all those areas when then who should a Catholic vote for?

Should we vote for a Catholics whose party leader wants to force religious standards against abortion to change, whose party leaders want to force Catholic hospital to go against their teachings and perform abortions and Catholic organizations be forced to provide ABC pills, etc? Or should we vote for a candidate who wants to appoint conservative judges where we at least have some kind of hope for change or vote for a candidate who we know wants to appoint judges who will make sure Roe Vs Wade is NEVER change? (Which convention did you hear this being applauded and people jumping for joy?) Many use the excuse that if Roe vs Wade is overturned, there will be many back-alley abortions. Versus what? Millions murdered in front of our own eyes right now in so called “safe” abortions. What is a safe abortion to a child in the mothers womb?

The problem is that many Catholics forget they are Catholic when they enter the voting booth and vote for a certain party because that is the way their parents have voted for years and that one party is for the poor, and for the underprivileged and for the Hispanics or blacks.

The choice should be clear for Catholics.

 

[Padres1969]

The choice should be clear for Catholics.

Sadly it’s not always clear even if you adhere to Catholic teaching. This election is one of those instances since neither of the major candidates holds to devout Catholic teachings on a wide gamut of issues including the hot button CAF issue of abortion.

 

[TobyLue]

Re:

neither of the major candidates holds to devout Catholic teachings

I realize that because neither of them is a Catholic. However, one wants to appoint conservative judges while the other one wants to make sure to appoint judges that will never ever overturn Roe Vs Wade. One wants to defund Planned Parenthood and the other one wants to have religious beliefs change for the sake of abortion and stands with Planned Parenthood. One selected a former Catholic who is pro-life and also wants to defund Planned Parenthood. The other one selected a “devout Catholic” who has a 100% rating from Planned Parenthood and wants to repeal the Hyde Ammendment.

So who can we say is closest to Catholic teachings?

 

[Tarquin]

Baha’is generally are non-partisan and do not belong to partisan political groups, parties or engage in partisanship debates, rallies etc. Baha’is are encouraged to vote as independents or non-partisans. No Baha’is run for partisan offices in elections.

That is something I actually admired about Baha’is. It is one of the reasons, if not ‘the’ reason that Shah Muhammed Reza Pehlavi II allowed so many to work in positions in his administration. It irked me no end that anti-Baha’i anti-Pehlavi critics claimed that the Baha’is were “just a political group”, although I could understand others who said Baha’is were “apostates” from Islam. The behavior of the Baha’is themselves gave the lie to those who said the Baha’is were “political” or even “supported the Shah.” The only thing I could see them supporting was Persia and the administration of laws and justice, as well as they could given the times and the oppositions. While I greatly admire that some people can stand back from the political frays of a fallen world, I also accept the fact that some leaders (and faux leaders) are determined by voting, so I do not not-admire those who do get into the frays.

 

[superwimp]

There were some false accusations made about planned parenthood a few months ago. These were all made up by the pro life faction. After investigating it was shown
that they lied about planned parenthood. Is there some reason that your proposing that support for planned parenthood is a negative.

 

[Sy_Noe]

I am going to go by the five non-negotiables (pages 3 through 5 in the link below), since this is my first major election as a Catholic.

catholic.com/sites/default/files/voters_guide_for_serious_catholics.pdf

Groups like Catholic Answers have come up with a list of non-negotiables.

vox-nova.com/2014/03/07/no-more-non-negotiables/

Pope Francis: “I have never understood the expression non-negotiable values. Values are values, and that is it. I can’t say that, of the fingers of a hand, there is one less useful than the rest.”

catholicnewsagency.com/news/transcript-pope-francis-march-5-interview-with-corriere-della-sera/

 

[eddie_too]

it is my desire and intention that my faith inform and influence all of my decisions.

 

[badnewsbarrett]

Indeed even in his faux-Pro-Life for convenience guise during this election, he still supports some abortions in cases of rape, incest, mother’s health…

Yes yes, very accurate. He’s said exactly that several times.

If I remember correctly though, that became the more exact position of the Republican party in an official capacity during the run-up to the Romney campaign. This may not be the most Catholic position- which I won’t comment on specifically, since I am not Catholic…

And I will also say it’s well worth pointing out since this is, after all, a thread dedicated to the influence of faith on voting…but for what it’s worth, I do think Trump’s position on this is basically what Romney’s was, and it seems to have become an accepted norm. Maybe even an expected norm at this point, strictly from the standpoint of allowing a candidate to swing a little more moderate for a general election.

Again though, it’s probably not the most Catholic position, as I’m aware anyway, and there are some very good Catholic Republicans who do a better job of sticking to Catholic teaching on this matter. Trump isn’t trying to do exactly that.

Edit- I have idly wondered at times, what if Trump were asked something more specific about abortion. For example, if abortion were only allowed for reasons X Y and Z, how readily available should abortions be for those women? How would that work? If we defund Planned Parenthood, who would victims of rape and/or incest go to in order to get their abortion? Should we make a point of ensuring that a clinic is accessible in every major city, and as President, would Trump ensure that abortion clinics are available to the people who qualify for these particular exceptions? I wonder what he would say.

 

[ajcstr]

There were some false accusations made about planned parenthood a few months ago. These were all made up by the pro life faction. After investigating it was shown
that they lied about planned parenthood. Is there some reason that your proposing that support for planned parenthood is a negative.

Planned Parenthood is the #1 provider of abortion services in the country. Why would I consider support for them anything but a negative?

 

[Corki]

There were some false accusations made about planned parenthood a few months ago. These were all made up by the pro life faction. After investigating it was shown
that they lied about planned parenthood. Is there some reason that your proposing that support for planned parenthood is a negative.

Actually, none of the accusations were shown to be false. The only issue was on the legality of how they obtained the proof. And charges to that effect have been thrown out. PP is a pretty evil organization that *sometimes *does some good things but mostly does a lot of bad things. So, yes, support for Planned Parenthood is a serious negative.

 

[anon67074017]

My faith does influence who I vote for. I am conservative because I am Catholic. I would vote for an Evangelical over a liberal Catholic any day. I do not think that liberalism is compatible with Catholicism.

 

[Little_Sheep]

Yes, of course. My faith is a major reason that I will confidently join my fellows in electing Hillary Clinton as our next President.

 

[truetofaith]

Yes, of course. My faith is a major reason that I will confidently join my fellows in electing Hillary Clinton as our next President.

I guess you believe in abortion?

 

[benhur]

Hello all,
Just curious to what extent your faith influences for whom you will vote in a secular election like the upcoming US presidential election or any other election, for that matter.

For instance, do you vote for a candidate of the same faith as yours (if there is one) as the main voting qualification criteria or does faith play no role whatsoever? Perhaps somewhere in between?

Background example:
Back in 1976 and 1980, my fellow evangelicals voted for Jimmy Carter in large numbers. At my evangelical university in 1980, I was looked down upon when I was asked for whom I was going to vote and I told them, "Ronald Reagan’. After all, Ronald Reagan was a divorced movie star whereas Jimmy Carter was a faithful Christian of one wife who wore his faith on his sleeves. At my Christian school, I was considered a disloyal rebel who was out of step with what was considered right by my peer group.

I told them at the time that if I was voting for next door neighbor, I would vote for Carter but that I thought Reagan would make the better overall leader based on other traits I saw in him.

In this year’s US presidential election, one of the candidates is of the same Christian faith tradition as me. However, I do not share that political party’s views on many important issues and so I do not intend to vote for that candidate, even though the opposing candidate is not much to write home about, either.

Scenario for Catholics:
One of the vice presidential candidates is a Catholic who by all accounts attends Mass regularly and even sings in the choir. However, he is part of a ticket that opposes Catholic teaching on abortion and same sex marriage, if I understand correctly.

The opposing VP candidate is an evangelical who shares the same views on abortion and “gay marriage” that Catholicism teaches, but he is not a practicing Catholic anymore.

As a Catholic, are you more apt to vote for the candidate who has a Catholic VP running mate or the one who holds similar views as the Catholic Church on matters such as abortion and gay marriage but is not Catholic? Or does none of this factor in at all?

In case someone is interested about my own personal beliefs on this subject, my Christian faith helps form my conscience and my world view, which in turns helps me decide who to vote for – but my faith alone (no pun intended) is not the overriding factor, as illustrated above in the 1980 example I shared.

Your thoughts and (name removed by moderator)ut are welcomed.

Hi T,

Interesting. My first vote as a believer was between Carter and Ford. What I thought was a no brainer, Carter for being another born againer, was not easy. In the end I was convinced by my mentor to vote for Ford. Why ? Because of his stronger stand against communism. My mentor was involved with ministries behind the Iron Curtain of communism, and was very aware of their persecution.

Beyond that , it has been very easy due to the Democratic platform shifting so far left, and always on the wrong side of any moral choice America faces (abortion, gay marriage and adoption, prayer in schools).Enough said. Not even sure if God got kicked out of their platform this year, and He barley made it back in 4 years ago. Oh please be hot or cold.

One other thing for sure, I hate when a politician so righteously says it is proper to leave his religion at the door before entering the halls of Congress or any legislative/executive building. We used to say they sold their souls to the devil. But now Lord help them and all of us. Sheep and goats.

Blessings

 

[benhur]

Yes, of course. My faith is a major reason that I will confidently join my fellows in electing Hillary Clinton as our next President.

Hi LS,

Shall I be blunt and say your faith is not my faith ? Shall I post in rebuke or contend for a better faith between us ? We do have the same Shepherd, and are to die to our own ways and thoughts for His ?

The same thing that hardens clay melts wax. I was not above "mentoring’’ on a Godly pleasing vote once.

I know there is a right way (being "right’) but there is also wisdom, allowing for wiggle room. But I am just not enlightened as to how voting Democrat can be either for a Christian (though it is done often, as are many other wrong things under the sun). Quit understandable though heart breaking.

Blessings and enlightenment for both of us.