Donald Trump Becomes First U.S. President to Speak at March for Life

[dvdjs]

Have you ever defended abortion as a choice? Yes or No. That’s simple to answer.

No. Although I have expressed some compassion in cases where, because of genetic anomalies, the unborn has no chance of being born alive.

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

Because no one here is president. The standard we have for the POTUS or any politician must be higher by necessity. And essentially what you’re saying is “you’re a hypocrite so your argument fails.” But this is an ad hominem attack and therefore has no merit. The argument against Trump as the spokesperson for the pro-life movement is not just built on his previous pro-choice views.

Additionally, you can go ahead and just say “you” instead of “one.” No need to hide behind that language.

No one is hiding behind any language.

I’ve explained myself otherwise and I will not repeat myself.

Well just for future reference, I’m okay being called out directly. It’s my preference, for what it’s worth.

 

[Cathoholic]

gracepoole . . . .

Well just for future reference, I’m okay being called out directly. It’s my preference, for what it’s worth.

You may well feel that way gracepoole and you are certainly entitled to that.

Never-the-less, I think generalizations are usually (not always but usually) better and more reasonable at least as far as forum members themselves are concerned.

Why? Because it is pretty tough to nail down an aspect of just about anything on anybody.

It is even more dicey to do it in a public venue where emotions or “groups” can have more influence than say, a personal discussion might have. Admittedly not always.

But even if somebody get’s all that correct,
OTHER people (especially lurkers)
may be too intimidated for them to join in the CAF discussion
(“Wow! I don’t want that happening to ME! I think I just won’t bother posting here at CAF.” they may say to themselves.).

Just my two cents though.

 

[Horton]

Well just for future reference, I’m okay being called out directly. It’s my preference, for what it’s worth.

Then why did you have my post removed when calling you out?

 

[gracepoole]

I appreciate the clarification. Thank you!

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

Well just for future reference, I’m okay being called out directly. It’s my preference, for what it’s worth.

Then why did you have my post removed when calling you out?

What post?

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Although I have expressed some compassion in cases where, because of genetic anomalies, the unborn has no chance of being born alive.

I had a friend that had an ectopic pregnancy. As such pregnancies are not viable and invariably result in the death of the fetus and sometimes the death or injury of the mother at the suggestion of her doctor she was administered an abortive injection. (She isn’t Catholic). It is one of those situations where I know there are objections that may be raised for the procedure selected, but even with objection I think there may be understanding for why she did it.

When talking about it though I think there is always the potential for misunderstanding since sometimes “understanding” or “sympathy” are conflated with cosigning and agreement.

 

[Cathoholic]

ThinkingSapien . . . .

I had a friend that had an ectopic pregnancy. As such pregnancies are not viable . . . sometimes “understanding” or “sympathy” are conflated with cosigning and agreement.

So let’s just make sure to dispel any myths of it being OK to murder any babies including ectopic pregnancy babies in case any readers “conflate” here.

An ectopic pregnancy is NOT a reason to directly kill any baby.

BOTH baby and mother will die if nothing is done.

Right now you surgically deliver the baby and at this point in time, we have nothing medically to offer most of those pre-born delivered babies. And they virtually always immediately die.

Ten or twenty or whatever years from now we MAY have more to offer and they won’t (routinely) die.

But you still do not go in there and kill the baby.

The baby dies yes.

You do everything you can so the baby does not die (right now there is nothing significant we can do), and he/she dies. (Incidentally. Our friend and neighbor had her Catholic Priest scrub in with the surgeon and baptize the baby before it died in the operating room).

While it is laying in the surgeon’s hand with a beating heart, it would not be licit to say . . . . “Well hand me the “pliers” nurse so I can smash and kill this living child. It’s now OK to murder it because it’s placenta planted was ectopically in the fallopian tube.”

No!

You still cannot KILL the baby. At least purposefully.

The fact that . . . .

She isn’t Catholic

. . is irrelevant when she is judged by Jesus (as all people will be judged by Jesus who is True God AND True Man) with regards to the action. (It MAY figure in to her culpability for that action though).

 

[dvdjs]

I had a friend that had an ectopic pregnancy.

I was thinking more of the parents who discovery late in term, their unborn child has no brain, or no lungs. The Church may ask mothers to carry these unborn to term and watch them die. If they do something else I will only pray for them.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

I was thinking more of the parents who discovery late in term, their unborn child has no brain, or no lungs.

Anencephaly and Pulmonary Hypoplasia. I can’t imagine how challenging that is.

There was a family that had a child that was missing most if his brain and skull. The child’s name was something like Jaxon Emmett Buell. I don’t know if he is still alive but he made it to at least 15 months. I’ve seen the family bith praised and condemned for deciding to keep the child alive and take care of him for as long as possible.

Someone else I know found out her daughter had trisomy 18 before she was born. The end result would be down syndrome. She was determine to see the pregnancy through though other people encouraged her to do otherwise. She ended up going into premature delivery before viable development had occurred. After birth the child lived for about 2 minutes before passing away. What kind of felt like a cruel irony is the hospital brought her a death certificate much more quickly than the birth certificate.

 

[Cathoholic]

ThinkingSapien . . . .

Someone else I know found out her daughter had trisomy 18 before she was born. The end result would be down syndrome.

Actually you are thinking of Trisomy 21 and Down’s Syndrome.

But I understand what you are trying to say.

The human baby had Trisomy 18, was deformed, and it led to a rapid fatality in this case.

Good on your friend for not killing her own baby.

 

[Horton]

I was thinking more of the parents who discovery late in term, their unborn child has no brain, or no lungs. The Church may ask mothers to carry these unborn to term and watch them die. If they do something else I will only pray for them.

This is not a reason to have an abortion and the Church has never taught it would be okay to abort the child. God formed that child and we are never to seek our will over the will of God!

Anencephaly and Pulmonary Hypoplasia. I can’t imagine how challenging that is.

The end result would be down syndrome.

Never reasons to abort.

 

[flamingpuppet]

The FACT remains: President Trump is the only president to attend and address the March for Life.
Res ipsa loquitur.

 

[dvdjs]

This is not a reason to have an abortion and the Church has never taught it would be okay to abort the child. God formed that child and we are never to seek our will over the will of God!

I have not said otherwise.

And I also think that it is fully consistent with what the Church teaches to pray for some on that who fails when faced with that challenge.

 

[PaulinVA]

Anencephaly and Pulmonary Hypoplasia. I can’t imagine how challenging that is.

Our first son was born with an Encephalocele , The brain formed outside the top of his head. We found out about it during the sonogram from hell.

He lived three years; we took care of him at home.

It was hard, but my wife is a saint. I thank God for the grace conferred in the sacrament of marriage that allowed us to remain married and have three more healthy children.

 

[TheLittleLady]

“Those other guys are doing it” is not an excuse.

 

[Jeanne_S]

Nice deflection,especially since your response makes absolutely no senseSo again I ask,whether Trumps pro life stance is one he fully embraces ,isn’t the issue.He takes action to further the prolife movement ,as opposed to Nancy Pelosi who claims in public,she is a devout Catholic,yet her actions say otherwise.Who is more pro life in this case?

 

[TheLittleLady]

As I would not vote for either Ms Pelosi or Mr Trump, I see no difference in their pro life bona fides.

I, for one, would care to have each elected person announce their stand on IVF. There are untold numbers of lab created persons sitting around in cold storage. This is a huge pro life issue that no one seems to want to talk about.

 

[Jeanne_S]

Still defecting.I didn’t ask who you would vote for.Imadked you who is more pro life,given the facts I stated.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I do not know any more than sound bytes, I cannot read hearts.

Is the person who chooses to kill people with a gun more pro life than the person who uses a knife? The question is a distinction without a difference.