Drinking alcohol and smoking pot – what are your thoughts?

[J_the_Centrist]

No such thing as pot in moderation. High is high.

Clearly, you have never smoked weed and enjoyed it. I would ask you who marijuana has ever killed, but I will ask a simpler question: who’s life has it destroyed when doing it exclusively, without doing any other drugs? Think about that and just because you feel that way, doesn’t mean that we all have to adhere to that idea. I know lawyers, as well as successful construction workers who “get high” and they are doing far better than than just fine. Oh and FYI, alcohol is far, far, far more destructive than marijuana trust me I know I lived it, been there, done that!

I never thought I would agree with Bill Maher, our faith’s bitter enemy, over fellow siblings in Christ on ANYTHING, that’s quite the quandary. I haven’t watched him since my “Agnostic years”, but the fact that I agree with him over you all is disturbing to say the least because I know that we’re right.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

Most of today’s weed is “seriously strong” and only takes a hit or two to become completely stoned. That is why moderation is not an option.

That sounds like quite an exaggeration.

 

[JHow]

Kush:

Being judgemental is a red herring. I am trying to suggest to drug users to consider the impact of their actions on others. Being considerate of the feelings if your parents is not facilitating their being judgemental, it is being loving on your part. Same for the safety issues. I know you think dope is harmless, but to me it is symptomatic of a generally careless attitude. If a person exhibits risky behavior in one area of their life, it will manifest itself in other areas as well (e.g., in high school the easy girls were the cigarette smokers n’est-ce pas?). I actually work in a railroad (not an engineer, rather commercial dept.), and I am very confident that your countrymen at CP and CN have an equally high respect for safety and correspondingly low tolerance for dope smoking. I don’t see this as a US vs. Canada cultural divide.

 

[J_the_Centrist]

I am an instructor at a University here in Canada. I am one of the best in my department. I know a lot of other profs that smoke as well.

One of the most brilliant colleges I have ever worked with is doing his post doc in mathamatics. He is designing a computer based algorythm on how the heart works - where they will be designing medical devices to stop a heart attacks by mapping out the patients arythmia.

Perhaps you just hang around stupid people? In the academic world, most of us do.

By the way, would it ever both you to hear someone say “I have never met an itellegent christian? they belive in ghosts, gods and demons and I don’t want them working in my neighbourhood”. Case thats pretty much what you said about pot smokers without any clue…

I agree completely, I also am striving for a career in academia and when I leave this job that uses random drug tests, I intend to hit the chiba again, although not in an abusive manner. We academics blow the idea of marijuana being the tool of satan right out of the water, as it does not have any impact on our intellectual competence. In my previous post, I encouraged you to continue on with your education, while it was you who should have been addressing me the whole time in that manner.

I DON’T like your last three sentences, that seems to me like a shot. If you truly believe that Christians are intellectually inferior, as is prevalent in the Atheist community, that is tantamount to neo-eugenics based ideology in my opinion, so be careful and I would be more than happy to explain this in detail, if you like. However, if you are just making a point as I instinctively believe you are, than I offer my humblest apologies.

 

[Kush]

Hi J, You know, that sounds awesome, and sound like you know where your life is heading… best wishes from me, and I know you will have an increidlbe, and spiritual journey.

My applogies about the line that may have offended you. I truly did not mean it in that sence. Please remember, I’m a christian too… just because I do not belive in the church, does not make me “non-christina” I was just making that point, as the other person was generalizing all pot smokers as “unsuccesful” - I was drawing a similarity - asking them if someone labed all Chritians that way. I do not feel that way at all… sorry if you took it the wrong way. now I feel so bad… Sometimes I just type fast then think later

Peace my friend.

I agree completely, I also am striving for a career in academia and when I leave this job that uses random drug tests, I intend to hit the chiba again, although not in an abusive manner. We academics blow the idea of marijuana being the tool of satan right out of the water, as it does not have any impact on our intellectual competence. In my previous post, I encouraged you to continue on with your education, while it was you who should have been addressing me the whole time in that manner.

I DON’T like your last three sentences, that seems to me like a shot. If you truly believe that Christians are intellectually inferior, as is prevalent in the Atheist community, that is tantamount to neo-eugenics based ideology in my opinion, so be careful and I would be more than happy to explain this in detail, if you like. However, if you are just making a point as I instinctively believe you are, than I offer my humblest apologies.

 

[Kush]

Being judgmental is so opposite of the way Christ wants you to be. I know its a part of your religon… they call it convictions, but think of it this way.

“Even when they where nailing him to the cross… he did not judge them, and offered them forgiveness and love”.

Do you really need to go to church, or even discuss the above with anyone - to know what lesson he was teaching us?

don’t ever judge, pot smokers, gay people, liberal tree hugging mushroom eaters, jews, anybody… its not his way, and you know it.

Peace

Kush:

Being judgemental is a red herring. I am trying to suggest to drug users to consider the impact of their actions on others. Being considerate of the feelings if your parents is not facilitating their being judgemental, it is being loving on your part. Same for the safety issues. I know you think dope is harmless, but to me it is symptomatic of a generally careless attitude. If a person exhibits risky behavior in one area of their life, it will manifest itself in other areas as well (e.g., in high school the easy girls were the cigarette smokers n’est-ce pas?). I actually work in a railroad (not an engineer, rather commercial dept.), and I am very confident that your countrymen at CP and CN have an equally high respect for safety and correspondingly low tolerance for dope smoking. I don’t see this as a US vs. Canada cultural divide.

 

[JHow]

I agree completely, I also am striving for a career in academia and when I leave this job that uses random drug tests, I intend to hit the chiba again, although not in an abusive manner. We academics blow the idea of marijuana being the tool of satan right out of the water, as it does not have any impact on our intellectual competence. In my previous post, I encouraged you to continue on with your education, while it was you who should have been addressing me the whole time in that manner.

I DON’T like your last three sentences, that seems to me like a shot. If you truly believe that Christians are intellectually inferior, as is prevalent in the Atheist community, that is tantamount to neo-eugenics based ideology in my opinion, so be careful and I would be more than happy to explain this in detail, if you like. However, if you are just making a point as I instinctively believe you are, than I offer my humblest apologies.

You could test this theory by writing your dissertation while smoking pot. See how well it goes.

I saw a show on TV where they gave simple tests to drug users: a cocaine user, a dope smoker, a heroin addict. The tests were things like assembling ikea furniture, and they were graded for accuracy and time. The coca one guy was hyper, spastic, fast and sloppy; the heroine chick was the most lucid, actually she did really well, but had heart disease; the dope smoker was an impossible bungler, he couldn’t follow the instructions at all.

I’m sorry, I just don’t buy the “college teachers prove the harmlessness of dope theory”. I also think you are over estimating dope use by academics.

 

[J_the_Centrist]

Hi J, You know, that sounds awesome, and sound like you know where your life is heading… best wishes from me, and I know you will have an increidlbe, and spiritual journey.

My applogies about the line that may have offended you. I truly did not mean it in that sence. Please remember, I’m a christian too… just because I do not belive in the church, does not make me “non-christina” I was just making that point, as the other person was generalizing all pot smokers as “unsuccesful” - I was drawing a similarity - asking them if someone labed all Chritians that way. I do not feel that way at all… sorry if you took it the wrong way. now I feel so bad… Sometimes I just type fast then think later

Peace my friend.

Now I feel bad because I had a strong feeling that you were just trying to exemplify the point you were making, but I wasn’t a 100% sure. There are so many trolls online these days on ALL sides and those sentiments are precisely the one’s you can find, well, on any website these days. Of course the haters, Atheist, Christian, Muslim, and so on are mostly cowards who would never say the things they say online in public. Adherence to hate in any form can have terrible consequences, particularly for the haters themselves, just look at the pictures of the leaders of any extremist groups on the right or left, they look as ugly as sin. Their hate seems to transform their physical features, is it just me or have you noticed this? Sorry, I didn’t mean to judge you falsely, I also didn’t mean meandering just now, sorry for that as well. Peace be with you.

 

[JHow]

Being judgmental is so opposite of the way Christ wants you to be. I know its a part of your religon… they call it convictions, but think of it this way.

“Even when they where nailing him to the cross… he did not judge them, and offered them forgiveness and love”.

Do you really need to go to church, or even discuss the above with anyone - to know what lesson he was teaching us?

don’t ever judge, pot smokers, gay people, liberal tree hugging mushroom eaters, jews, anybody… its not his way, and you know it.

Peace

Not being judgemental does not mean we cannot speak about right or wrong or assign things to moral categories. Christ does just that in many examples: “better for them to be thrown into the sea with a millstone…” “Easier for a camel to pass through the eye if the needle…”, cleansing the money changers.

And don’t get me started on Paul…

Besides you are deflecting, you want to maintain that dope affects no one but yourself and that is not true.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Marijuana is a controversial issue, though as I previously suggested it is not the drug it has been envisioned as being by conservatives for decades. I quit due to employment concerns and despite the fact that I cannot do it and if I could I wouldn’t allow it to control my life, who am I do deny others the right to do it? Alcohol ruined my life, not marijuana, which may have only impeded my success. Yes, marijuana can slow you down, but doing it will not make you homeless, cause you to lose your family, alter your work performance (I have friends with great jobs to verify this), turn you into a “junkie” if you do it exclusively, etc. No, I absolutely would NOT encourage anyone, especially minors, to “get high”, though if people like to do it and they enjoy it I understand completely and restricting the use of marijuana, which we both know is far less destructive than alcohol is ridiculous. I am not constantly thinking about smoking marijuana, after two years I am well beyond any physical or mental attractions, which would lead me to go back and risk losing my job. Like smoking (which I gave up for Lent and never intend to do again, EVER), if I didn’t have asthma I would probably delay my quitting, but I knew it had to be done and despite the fact that I personally detest it now, I understand why other’s enjoy it and I certainly wouldn’t attempt for the illegality of it.

I do understand about saying “I owe it to myself” very well, this struck me like a bolt of lightning when I read that. I have “celebrated” for far less important occasions than a job promotion, try passing a test, getting a good review at work (which can be very common, because my boss believes in providing feedback when necessary), completing a term paper, and on and on. An addict, alcoholic or whatever will find any excuse to “celebrate”, even for the most mundane reasons, just as I did! If I had a rough week, out comes the bottles of brandy and vodka and Quo Vadis (1953 or the more recent Polish version from 2001) goes into the DVD player.

You said you you worked at Daytop, is that the one in Manhattan? Are there others? It is near the Church of St. Francis of Assisi on 31st street where I am thinking of offering my services as a Secular Franciscan, did you ever attend services there? Thomas Merton, Dorothy Day and many other famous Catholics have. I would really love to make that church a huge part of my life, the famous breadlines for the homeless, which they have been doing since the Great Depression, as well as their theologically liberal (I am not politically liberal) approach draws me to them. I have a huge hunger to GIVE, rather than TAKE, as I have done for so long and if I could GIVE I would love to do it there. Peace be with you, brother.

Swan Lake, then Laurel Heights/Fairfield Hills in CT which was in effect was a combination of Newark and NY plus another friend who came up from Lexington KY which at the time was a Federal long term residential program. Many of the programs in the New-England area such as Elan One. Liberation and Renaissance are directed or started by guys who were employed at Daytop. Many such as CT Daytop are private now instead of non-profit, which New York I believe may still be. There is no volunteering at the (name removed by moderator)atient residential facilities, in fact even visiting is restricted, absolutely no physical contact the entire time (name removed by moderator)atient etc. Manhattan on 8th Ave is outpatient may take volunteers.

The Franciscans in the Bronx seems most impressive I hear nothing but good about them and the program is tight with a Catholic foundation and very impressive success rate. The shelters, I believe they run them also or one anyway in the Bronx. They I would imagine need volunteers, basically the same issues with substance abuse and a plus 85% population rate. Same throughout New-England. Which is why many addicts refuse to come in, they will tell you many reasons. The only I found to be true is clean urines, and including marijuana.

Its good to get involved to reinforce your own thinking. You can’t keep it till you give it away is definitely Biblical.

Right the triggers are something to watch, you know when the car is on auto-pilot heading to the package store somethings wrong. Postpone further travel

 

[J_the_Centrist]

You could test this theory by writing your dissertation while smoking pot. See how well it goes.

I saw a show on TV where they gave simple tests to drug users: a cocaine user, a dope smoker, a heroin addict. The tests were things like assembling ikea furniture, and they were graded for accuracy and time. The coca one guy was hyper, spastic, fast and sloppy; the heroine chick was the most lucid, actually she did really well, but had heart disease; the dope smoker was an impossible bungler, he couldn’t follow the instructions at all.

I’m sorry, I just don’t buy the “college teachers prove the harmlessness of dope theory”. I also think you are over estimating dope use by academics.

Whoever said anything about writing a dissertation while high? Who in their right mind would consider doing that? What drugs was the “dope smoker” doing in addition to marijuana? What was his intelligence quotient level? What was his level of education? Did he have any behavioral problems? These are some questions to consider and even if they are all answered in favor of your argument, one TV show does not provide nearly enough adequate data to prove your point. I haven’t smoked it for two years, but it didn’t ruin my life, alcohol did and I know more than enough successful professionals inside and outside academia who smoke to reject your theory.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Being judgmental is so opposite of the way Christ wants you to be. I know its a part of your religon… they call it convictions, but think of it this way.

“Even when they where nailing him to the cross… he did not judge them, and offered them forgiveness and love”.

Do you really need to go to church, or even discuss the above with anyone - to know what lesson he was teaching us?

don’t ever judge, pot smokers, gay people, liberal tree hugging mushroom eaters, jews, anybody… its not his way, and you know it.

Peace

Kush confrontation is difficult I get that. and being that I’m very direct doesn’t make it any less painless. But I still love ya. Lets not confuse one with the other, theory being I’ll be your friend but the negativity is out.

You know I have to ask, let me get this right, your teaching, and what copping weed bags on the blue side of town in-between? Never mind the confused religious aspect, you don’t see a problem here?

 

[J_the_Centrist]

Swan Lake, then Laurel Heights/Fairfield Hills in CT which was in effect was a combination of Newark and NY plus another friend who came up from Lexington KY which at the time was a Federal long term residential program. Many of the programs in the New-England area such as Elan One. Liberation and Renaissance are directed or started by guys who were employed at Daytop. Many such as CT Daytop are private now instead of non-profit, which New York I believe may still be. There is no volunteering at the (name removed by moderator)atient residential facilities, in fact even visiting is restricted, absolutely no physical contact the entire time (name removed by moderator)atient etc. Manhattan on 8th Ave is outpatient may take volunteers.

The Franciscans in the Bronx seems most impressive I hear nothing but good about them and the program is tight with a Catholic foundation and very impressive success rate. The shelters, I believe they run them also or one anyway in the Bronx. They I would imagine need volunteers, basically the same issues with substance abuse and a plus 85% population rate. Same throughout New-England. Which is why many addicts refuse to come in, they will tell you many reasons. The only I found to be true is clean urines, and including marijuana.

Its good to get involved to reinforce your own thinking. You can’t keep it till you give it away is definitely Biblical.

Right the triggers are something to watch, you know when the car is on auto-pilot heading to the package store somethings wrong. Postpone further travel

Wow!!! That’s a little harsh I think, nevertheless I know you have good intentions so I wasn’t offended. My travels will proceed, because my statements that marijuana is not the harmful drug you believe it is has nothing to do with me being a Franciscan, particularly when I am not engaging in that behavior. Even if I was, it would be on an occasional basis, not a constant occurrence. I never suggested that smoking marijuana has no consequences, it does, but it will do none of the things I suggested in my previous post and if it did those instances would be extremely rare. Brother in Christ, we shall have to agree to differ, peace be with you. Pax et Bonum

 

[J_the_Centrist]

Swan Lake, then Laurel Heights/Fairfield Hills in CT which was in effect was a combination of Newark and NY plus another friend who came up from Lexington KY which at the time was a Federal long term residential program. Many of the programs in the New-England area such as Elan One. Liberation and Renaissance are directed or started by guys who were employed at Daytop. Many such as CT Daytop are private now instead of non-profit, which New York I believe may still be. There is no volunteering at the (name removed by moderator)atient residential facilities, in fact even visiting is restricted, absolutely no physical contact the entire time (name removed by moderator)atient etc. Manhattan on 8th Ave is outpatient may take volunteers.

The Franciscans in the Bronx seems most impressive I hear nothing but good about them and the program is tight with a Catholic foundation and very impressive success rate. The shelters, I believe they run them also or one anyway in the Bronx. They I would imagine need volunteers, basically the same issues with substance abuse and a plus 85% population rate. Same throughout New-England. Which is why many addicts refuse to come in, they will tell you many reasons. The only I found to be true is clean urines, and including marijuana.

Its good to get involved to reinforce your own thinking. You can’t keep it till you give it away is definitely Biblical.

Right the triggers are something to watch, you know when the car is on auto-pilot heading to the package store somethings wrong. Postpone further travel

Also, my position on marijuana makes me no less of a Christian than you are, so I hope that is not the point you are trying to make when you say “postpone further travel.”

 

[GaryTaylor]

Also, my position on marijuana makes me no less of a Christian than you are, so I hope that is not the point you are trying to make when you say “postpone further travel.”

Christian, no, you’ve never had that thought as your driving alone to get a drink as you drive by an old frequented area? This is what I’m saying about thought by thought, as quick as one comes, so too they dissipate as you think them through. As these situations [whatever it may] occur and you reflect you begin to see the basis.

 

[Mickey]

High = good

Wrong again.

 

[Mickey]

Clearly, you have never smoked weed and enjoyed it.

I had my time. And I thank God I was delivered from it.

alcohol is far, far, far more destructive than marijuana trust me I know I lived it, been there, done that!

Alcohol can definitely be destructive. And I have seen pot destroy lives.

I never thought I would agree with Bill Maher

Big problem.

the fact that I agree with him over you all is disturbing

Very disturbing. I would say it’s time to speak to your confessor.

 

[Mickey]

That sounds like quite an exaggeration.

It’s not.

 

[Mickey]

For all you Catholics attempting to justify smoking marijuana recreationally…I refer once again to your catechism. It would also be helpful for you to speak with your confessor.

CCC 2291 The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, except on strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense.

 

[JHow]

Whoever said anything about writing a dissertation while high? Who in their right mind would consider doing that? What drugs was the “dope smoker” doing in addition to marijuana? What was his intelligence quotient level? What was his level of education? Did he have any behavioral problems? These are some questions to consider and even if they are all answered in favor of your argument, one TV show does not provide nearly enough adequate data to prove your point. I haven’t smoked it for two years, but it didn’t ruin my life, alcohol did and I know more than enough successful professionals inside and outside academia who smoke to reject your theory.

Neither of us has more than anecdote, “more than enough professionals” notwithstanding. But I have seen nothing to recommend dope smoking to me. As I mentioned earlier, why, when safety is the issue, do corporations shy away from employing users? Because the data they have likely tell a different story - that and common sense. The suggestion to write your dissertation on dope was a joke. I’m starting to think that marijuana makes people a little over serious, but that can’t be right. Maybe it’s being a marijuana crusader that makes one over serious?

Yesterday at the library, which is full of homeless, I overheard a guy skyping with his ex “woman” (ex-wife, baby-momma, who knows?). He didn’t have a job, or prospects really, he was off the drink, but he still smoked the herb - and then his daughter came on the line. That’s how you talk to your daughter when you are homeless and not drinking but still smoking the herb: Skype in the public library. Don’t want to be that guy. But I’m sure the herb had no contribution to that situation.