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LightBound
Guest
Just like she has placed the Duggars on one…
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Hoosier_Daddy
Guest
I must say I just find your position and vehemence on this out of character for you. I agree with most of your posts but I have never seen you so irrational on an issue. Perhaps you should reconnoiter.
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LightBound
Guest
This will be an intrusive comment, so I may remove it, but I wonder if there is something in her life that makes her defensive on this. That’s the only thing I can possibly see that’s coloring her perception of this not being a big deal.
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gracepoole
Guest
Oh, holy crikey.
New Investigation Launched Against Duggar Family — 911 Called
New Investigation Launched Against Duggar Family — 911 Called
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Memaw
Guest
Your adjectives are almost amusing. I am only stating what I think on how the Church teaches us to not judge. Who are we to judge the Duggars? We only know what the media has thrown at us and that is very likely warped. We should all know how the media works by now!! So many are so willing to trash the Duggars, don’t believe anything they say, judge their strong Christian beliefs as weird, ridicule them for having children, oh so MANY children!!! My Grandparents had 15 kids. I came from a family of 12. Big deal. Its their business not ours. We were told that we would be judged as we judge others. I walk with caution., not my job!! God Bless, Memaw
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kozlosap
Guest
LOL! In 1946 my parents lived in a small walk up apartment. The JW’s came to the door with their literature. There were two young girls and an older woman. Dad, evidently did a little flirting, and when they came back to convert that Heathen Catholic, my Mom made him sit with them on the fire escape and listen to their record player!!! Needless to say, he learned his lesson. My DD’S best friend from 12 to 18 was from a very fundamentalist LDS family. She had my permission to attend their youth groups since I knew my daughter well and was not worried about her being smitten with Mormon theology. One morning at their Young Woman’s group, she actually lasted thirty minutes before being politely asked to leave since she was espousing Catholic beliefs! This happened many times. The Mormon mom asked me why this child was so sure of her belief system and had the gall to question adults in class. I just laughed. She is an attorney now.I hear ya! Koz. You can really sense the regurgitation of stale old ideas in his theology. It would not surprise me though if he ended up being a pastor. Or a Kirk Cameron type. He is immature for sure. However, his Honeymoon to Italy was bothersome to me on a certain level. Nothing like him posting pictures of the Vatican that I am sure TLC paid for and then bashing it…
OTOH Mormonism makes an entire religion out of 19 year old kids evangelizing some pretty odd theology. I do enjoy a knock at my door every once in a while… it gives me a chance to evangelize myself. It is literally opportunity knocking.
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Hoosier_Daddy
Guest
I was an avid fan of the show. I have defended the Duggars on this Forum many times. I have seen EVERY episode and special. My wife threw a viewing party for the Weddings. And I agree that many attack these folks for promoting values that are in line with our own theology and beliefs. What you are missing is that the sexual abuse damages that message. Now, I could care less about the motives or joy of those who condemn them. I could care less about the political or theological motivations of those who exposed the molestation i our own faith. I hold the truths of the faith and the values that the duggars promoted. But my defense of those values and theology does not need to involve excusing or assuming everything is ok now. Look, the Duggars can be 100 percent right about many things that have to do with values, pro life, and faith. But we must not let the fact that we like them and dislike the opposite view cloud our judgement of certain evils.
Do you think Josh should open a daycare for a job? Would you think I should drop my kids off there? Or are we called to judge prudently?
Something is pretty evil here. And it isn’t just the wolves circling and howling because now they have something to feed on. It also involves a family that had this happen and then chose to exploit themselves for money after they knew this was an issue. There is a certain type or dishonesty and perhaps flat out denial that shows beyond a shadow of a doubt that this has not been handled correctly. And regardless of if there is still abuse or not, there is still an environment of unhealthy secrecy and control by Jim Bob and Josh. Josh is a man, an adult and a man with a family. But yet his dad is the vocal one about his state of mind…
There is an ongoing issue here. IF you don’t see that then you are missing the story and being distracted by the media that is dislikable enough.
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kozlosap
Guest
Memaw, I agree with others that your posts regarding this entire case are not indicative of your “normal” CAF views. Yes, your grandparents had fifteen kids in an age when that was not odd. Large families were needed to help run the farm and support the family. The Duggar parents are hypocritical in regards to this situation - always affirming that Josh was forgiven by at least two of his victims and God also. Meghan Kelly is a news anchor. She is also an attorney and quite obviously very, very bright. We do not know if she was quoting real statistics or just some nebulous numbers when speaking of familial abuse in large families. I don’t think anyone is implying that large families are a breeding ground for sexual predators. The problem with the Duggars is that sex is treated in a very repressed manner. The males are allowed to dress normally whole the females are taught that their bodies are the evil that tempts Holy men. They were never allowed a normal education, instead were indoctrinated by the homeschooling program developed by the leader of the Quiverfull Cult. What is the liklihood that none, absolutely none of the older kids attended any kind of college? Education, evidently is another no-no. I am of the opinion that this incident is the beginning of a waterfall of changes for the Duggar clan. Either a few kids will want an education, or one will announce that they are LGBTQ.
I don’t think that the MSM is manufacturing this story, just reporting. When you repeatedly molest young children, it is a legit story, especially when you make value judgements against others.
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Bruised_Reed
Guest
You have spend most of your posts defending Josh. Do you have anything to say in defense of his victims.
Name it then. What did Josh do that was wrong? Give it a name, something other than “mistake” or “sin” and then not minimize it immediately with a comment about him being forgiven. Can you acknowledge that what he did was a serious violation, again without claims that his victims have forgiven him and got counseling?
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LightBound
Guest
When we feel deeply about something, to the point we return to threads that discuss those things we feel so deeply over, it’s usually because we have a personal connection to that topic. Some on these Duggar threads write because they had been viewers and general supporters of what the Duggars wanted us to believe about their wholesome lifestyle on camera and now we feel we’ve been betrayed. Some write as parents or grandparents, horrified and shocked at what happened and how it wasn’t dealt with and brushed under the rug. Some write as sexual abuse or assault survivors, working through emotions, knowing some of what those girls are going through. But I must ask, when someone defends over and over, what was done, with little or no regard for the victims of molestation, I have to ask, does this person do this because they have a molester in their midst and they cannot come to terms with it? Is it in excusing and defending a stranger’s behavior that they take the focus off what is going on in their own situation?
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ComputerGeek25
Guest
Here is my take on the TV show.I was an avid fan of the show. I have defended the Duggars on this Forum many times. I have seen EVERY episode and special. My wife threw a viewing party for the Weddings. And I agree that many attack these folks for promoting values that are in line with our own theology and beliefs. What you are missing is that the sexual abuse damages that message. Now, I could care less about the motives or joy of those who condemn them. I could care less about the political or theological motivations of those who exposed the molestation i our own faith. I hold the truths of the faith and the values that the duggars promoted. But my defense of those values and theology does not need to involve excusing or assuming everything is ok now. Look, the Duggars can be 100 percent right about many things that have to do with values, pro life, and faith. But we must not let the fact that we like them and dislike the opposite view cloud our judgement of certain evils.
Do you think Josh should open a daycare for a job? Would you think I should drop my kids off there? Or are we called to judge prudently?
Something is pretty evil here. And it isn’t just the wolves circling and howling because now they have something to feed on. It also involves a family that had this happen and then chose to exploit themselves for money after they knew this was an issue. There is a certain type or dishonesty and perhaps flat out denial that shows beyond a shadow of a doubt that this has not been handled correctly. And regardless of if there is still abuse or not, there is still an environment of unhealthy secrecy and control by Jim Bob and Josh. Josh is a man, an adult and a man with a family. But yet his dad is the vocal one about his state of mind…
I have no problem with them doing a TV show if, and only if, they had handled that situation with Josh better. As in, they called the police or human services the first time it happened.
I can understand that, as Christians, they are kind of skeptical of secular counseling methods, but the law is the law and it is a just one.
Hiding it,until the statute of limitations is up and then saying you “handled it” is going to hurt your credibility to do any good work. Look at our own Church as an example.
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Memaw
Guest
Speak for yourself John! God Bless, Memawmy doorstep does not have child molestation and incest in my past. It is quite clean thank you! Too bad Josh doesn’t have the sacraments. I think it is quite prudent and logical to have concern that a former abuser has access to children. And if that former abuser abused children in his own family I think it is even more concerning. I would not and I hope you would not trust Josh with babysitting my young children.
It’s gross, it is unnatural, and it is far form being cured if you ask me.
You can take the high road all you want, but you and I know that if Josh came over to your house to play with little ones, you would call the cops!
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Memaw
Guest
Touching is NOT incest !!! God Bless, Memaw
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Memaw
Guest
Oh really, isn’t that what everyone else is doing?? They seem to believe 'everything" they read or hear from journalists. I believe Megan Kelly is also a lawyer. God Bless. Memaw
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Bruised_Reed
Guest
Minimizing again. No, touching is not incest if one is touching a hand or foot but a family member touching the breast and genitals, those areas that would be covered by a swim suit, is incest.
On a couple of other threads you have stated that nudity in and of itself is sinful; do you not see the conflict between that and avoiding and minimizing molestation by a family member?
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Xantippe
Guest
This is the family that made side-hugs famous. Touching is a very big deal in that family, and now suddenly it’s not a big deal?
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Lou2U
Guest
Actually, I think most of us are going by what’s been said in the police report, found here.
Quite frankly, it doesn’t matter what professional Megan Kelly has - does she have proof of her statistics, and if so, what conditions did these statistics involve? Professional counselling or not?
Incest is defined by the online dictionary as being:
- Sexual relations between persons who are so closely related that their marriage is illegal or forbidden by custom.
- The crime of sexual relations with a person defined by statute as too closely related.
As other posters have said, you are minimising what Josh did by saying he has “repented and should be forgiven”. You say everyone is listening too much to the media and believing what’s been said. But what has the media said that’s untrue? That Josh molested five young girls, four of them his own sisters? That Josh’s children could potentially be at risk because Josh did not receive proper counselling? That Jim Bob and Michelle were irresponsible at best to allow Josh back into their home? That continuing to bring children into an environment where the older children were expected to look after a younger sibling even though Josh had already molested his sisters was naive at the very least?
Lou
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LightBound
Guest
Memaw,
For weeks now, you’ve been grasping at straws trying to defend the Duggars and minimize the girls being sexually abused**** by their brother**** and their parents**** sweeping it under the rug.
Members have posted reply after reply trying to explain the danger in all of these and the lasting effects of sexual molestation, but you still choose to sidestep it all and come back with vague responses. Given that, I want to ask you, are you experiencing or have experienced a family member or close friend being accused of molesting someone and you can’t accept that perhaps they are guilty, so your repeated posts defending Josh and minimizing what happened to the girls is your way of dealing with an issue in your own life?
Because other than that, I cannot see how anyone, after reading what has been disclosed on multiple threads you have participated in, can continue to post what you do.
For weeks now, you’ve been grasping at straws trying to defend the Duggars and minimize the girls being sexually abused**** by their brother**** and their parents**** sweeping it under the rug.
Members have posted reply after reply trying to explain the danger in all of these and the lasting effects of sexual molestation, but you still choose to sidestep it all and come back with vague responses. Given that, I want to ask you, are you experiencing or have experienced a family member or close friend being accused of molesting someone and you can’t accept that perhaps they are guilty, so your repeated posts defending Josh and minimizing what happened to the girls is your way of dealing with an issue in your own life?
Because other than that, I cannot see how anyone, after reading what has been disclosed on multiple threads you have participated in, can continue to post what you do.
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grasscutter
Guest
Yes. Thank you. Also, it’s more than a little insulting that when one disagrees with another’s position it is assumed that one only formed their opinions based on what the “liberal media” says, instead of actual evidence, logic and common sense.
And I still think it’s dangerously naive to place anyone on a pedestal. Even if the person is not only a journalist but also a lawyer!
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Convert_in_99
Guest
You all are back to bashing Josh. I agree wholeheartedly that the parents could have handled this much better and that their putting their family on TV was a bad idea, horrible even when you consider that they knew this could come out and ruin their son’s life.
But why couldn’t Josh be a changed man? Why keep beating him down that he still has issues? Back to the “whoever among you is without sin, be the one to cast the first stone.” I know I haven’t had the best track record in my life, it ain’t going to be me!
But why couldn’t Josh be a changed man? Why keep beating him down that he still has issues? Back to the “whoever among you is without sin, be the one to cast the first stone.” I know I haven’t had the best track record in my life, it ain’t going to be me!
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