Dutch doctors can sedate ‘agitated’ patients before euthanasia

[Jen95]

I just experienced this with a friend who had a stroke. Her oldest daughter had healthcare power of attorney and brought her mother home from the hospital the day after her stroke. She told all of us that her mother was dying and hospice was assisting with home care.

I and another friend went to visit her, expecting to see a comatose person, however, she was awake, eyes open, moving in the bed and clearly aware of everything we said to her. She tried to speak and pointed toward her mouth like she wanted something to drink.

The daughter refused to give her anything to drink and only sponged her lips. According to the daughter her mother had stipulated no artificial hydration or nutrition if she was dying.

My friend was clearly NOT dying. She had many visitors and we all tried to talk with the daughter but she was too busy packing up her mother’s house to speak much with us.

It took my friend 12 days to die.

This is horrific.
@0Scarlett_nidiyilii – just so we know for the future - - wouldn’t this be a crime? We have something called a “Long-term care ombudsman” in our area - - is this something they would handle? Or some other agency - like Adult Protective Services?

 

[Anne1964]

It was our understanding that her advanced care directive and living will were clear and that her wishes were being followed. We didn’t believe this because she would never go against Church teaching. Of course, we didn’t see those documents and had no right to see them.

 

[Jen95]

I guess hospice would have stepped in if there was elder abuse or a crime happening?
Or maybe I am assuming too much about hospice?

 

[Sarcelle]

I’m sorry but this is truly disgusting.

Only a sociopath can see a person really suffer and not do anything about it, waiting for them to die. That or a vulture.

So sorry about your friend.

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

just so we know for the future - - wouldn’t this be a crime? We have something called a “Long-term care ombudsman” in our area - - is this something they would handle? Or some other agency - like Adult Protective Services?

I would personally call Adult Protective Services.

End of life issue can get really can get complicated, because a person at the end of natural life won’t have as much appetite, or necessarily feel thirst, but sometimes people rally at the end and get a burst of energy a day or two before death, or other people just sort of fade out of life, like a clock running down.

But in general, if they’re still interested in food and drink, they’re not “actively” dying.

 

[Servant31]

Anne this is a really hard story, Im so sorry your friend went through this. I’ll pray for her.

 

[Dolphin]

So much of “dying with dignity” rhetoric is glorified elder abuse

 

[Ghosty1981]

I wonder if we have any commenters here from the euthanasia countries?
Netherlands, Belgium, Colombia, Luxembourg, Canada, India, and South Korea, or the American states of NJ, Hawaii, Oregon, Washington, Colorado, California, Vermont, Montana?
I believe New Zealand just legalized it as well?
Signs of this slippery slope that any CAF-ers have seen in person?

I am in Washington. We don’t have an active euthanasia law here, but rather our law allows people with a terminal condition to request a lethal dose of medication from their provider. They must request it several times and must be of “sound mind”. They must also be able to administer the medication to themselves. Providers are not obligated to provide this service, and aren’t compelled to assist nor to refer a patient to someone who will.

Peace and God bless!

 

[Ghosty1981]

The daughter refused to give her anything to drink and only sponged her lips. According to the daughter her mother had stipulated no artificial hydration or nutrition if she was dying.

Was the woman physically capable of safely swallowing? If not then sponging the mouth would be all that is possible outside of artificial hydration or nutrition. Without knowing the medical details we can’t really know what was appropriate treatment for your poor friend, but I have certainly have seen many, many patients who have been unable to receive oral food and hydration in their final weeks. Such cases aren’t necessarily abuse or neglect, though it is easy to see how it could be perceived as such.

Prayers for your friend and her family.

 

[spoonerc]

They may sedate them, but they cannot sedate the soul. It is still screaming, a sound those doctors (if they do not repent of their evil) will hear throughout eternity in the bowels of hell.

 

[spoonerc]

Adult Protective Services may not step in to help, especially if the social worker isn’t a Catholic Christian. However, I heard of an instance where a woman needed a certain drug to live. The insurance company informed her that she would be provided with a suicide pill if she so desired but the drug she needed would not be provided.

The stroke may have prevented her from being able to intake fluids and other nutrition without medical assistance. If she had signed a document like a living will without using one provided by the Church, she may have inadvertently signed her own death certificate. The hospital may have been prevented from administering extra help and the daughter wouldn’t have had the equipment to do so from home.

Since the daughter was packing up the house while her mother was experiencing such trauma, it does sound as though she couldn’t wait for her mother to die. Thank the Lord that I am not the judge of souls as I would be judging by looks and not by true motives.

 

[Servant31]

This is honesty why I have a hard time with socialized medicine. It’s not the what is problem, it is the what I can’t think of problem. Similarly insurance can be a problem. It’s a “well because of this, crossed with that, divided by 3, then we can’t do anything… there is an exclusion but you didn’t explicitly state you wanted cheese on your pasta at 92 degrees f , or fill out a form 344 exemption beforehand…therefore we can’t help…”

 

[catholiclala]

This is disturbing.

 

[po18guy]

Since every patient could “become agitated” - this endorses automatic sedation before the homicide.

Soylent Green.

 

[jeannetherese]

A friend of mine died at a hospice near Seattle. In the last few days, water was withheld and visitors were told not to talk to him or touch him,because it was encouraging him to go on and he had been expected to die earlier.
You won’t find me signing up for hospice care.

 

[jeannetherese]

I think that you’re assuming too much about hospice.
My friend who chose hospice was initially at home supplied with morphine.
He told me that his hospice nurses told him how much it would take to kill him.
To me, they were encouraging him to take this step.
Far better to tell him his pain dosage and leave things at that.

 

[LilyM]

I think that you’re assuming too much about hospice.
My friend who chose hospice was initially at home supplied with morphine.
He told me that his hospice nurses told him how much it would take to kill him.
To me, they were encouraging him to take this step.
Far better to tell him his pain dosage and leave things at that.

Or, in charity to the workers, maybe to prevent him inadvertently taking a lethal dose?

 

[jeannetherese]

I want to be charitable as well. This was in addition to the never exceed the recommended dose and track your doses in a notebook instruction.
Perhaps he just drew a caregiver who wanted to expand the hospice agenda, just as some Catholics want to overhaul the Church to make it align with a personal philosophy.
I’ll never know.
Eternal rest grant him, O Lord,
And let perpetua light shine upon him.
May his soul and the souls of all the faithful departed
Through the mercy of God
Rest in peace.
Amen.

 

[otjm]

From the article: "“They need less fear of justice,” he said. “Or for the review committee.”

I wonder if anyone over there realizes the irony of that statement.

 

[otjm]

You won’t find me signing up for hospice care.

I think a lot of that depends on the hospice care workers, the facility, and whomever you have who may be family, etc.

My mother finally required more care - she had short term memory loss - and the retirement center was not set up for that level of care.

We chose what is called foster care, and the woman who ran it was both a gem and a saint. Ultimately my mother fractured her back and was in a great deal of pain, so she was administered a pain killer; we (her children) made it perfectly clear we understood the balancing act of pain medication and made it also clear that we did not accept euthanasia, and both the foster owner and the hospice nurses understood and operated accordingly. She finally died, with most of us there, at age 97. Long, slow process, and not a lot of fun. But everyone was cooperative as could be.