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MartinJordan
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They know what they know means what?
The same principle applying to Christians is not about rejecting Jewish belief. They are and always will be The Chosen People.
MJ
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The same principle applying to Christians is not about rejecting Jewish belief. They are and always will be The Chosen People.
MJ
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MartinJordan
Guest
John 1 already delineates any other manifestion to come. Any other manifestion is misnomer.
This concept of manifestation of God is a 19th century creation.MJ
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JimmyDFG
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Wasn’t mirza husayn-ali nuri the only one to cook up that concept?John 1 already delineates any other manifestion to come. Any other manifestion is misnomer.
MJ
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Servant19
Guest
They know what they know in that they have found redemption in Prophet Muhammad, directly with Allah Himself. There is no THE redeemer. He was a Redeemer.
You can call the Jews the Chosen People but it’s not quite the same as stating that Moses was the greatest Prophet that ever lived which you would never state…
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TonyBS
Guest
It was no given to them in plain language as they were not ready for this principle and the world was not able to give it on the scale needed for mass transformation. It is still apparent it will take a little time to break down all The barriers raised by man.
The barriers are falling rapidly now.
Regards Tony
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worldcitizen
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Dear Tony,
Last night I broke the fast with 2 slices of toast and a can of baked beans in honour of you!!!
I thought ’ how can I consume a feast when dear Tony is eating so frugally’? But it was the best and most delicious meal I had in a long time even if you didn’t have it I thank you for the idea.
But my wife’s apple cake I couldn’t resist so I’m sorry there but I had both you and Kam’s fill in honour of you both.
Tonight it’s rockmelon juice! Love and greetings to EVERYONE HERE!! - David
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worldcitizen
Guest
“The basis of the teaching of Bahá’u’lláh is the Unity of Mankind, and his greatest desire was that love and goodwill should live in the heart of men.”
(Abdul-Baha Paris Talks)
(Abdul-Baha Paris Talks)
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TonyBS
Guest
Ha ha ha David ROFLOL - Just remember it is self afflicted as I was too Lazy to go to The market to get something to cook.
I will do the same tonight as poured some concrete and to lazy to cook again. I might have brought a can of Chicken curry and will cook a little rice!
Tonight Fresh Coconut water right out of the coconut, a fresh bush lime drink made from local limes with a bit of raw sugar.
So feast David, Feast dear friend!
Love you cobber! Your heart sings to all.Regards Tony
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MartinJordan
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Exactly then why they reject Jesus death and resurrection. No way can they reconcile with Christianity unless they realize what Jesus said and did.
430 Jesus means in Hebrew: “God saves.” At the annunciation, the angel Gabriel gave him the name Jesus as his proper name, which expresses both his identity and his mission.18 Since God alone can forgive sins, it is God who, in Jesus his eternal Son made man, “will save his people from their sins”.19 in Jesus, God recapitulates all of his history of salvation on behalf of men.
431 In the history of salvation God was not content to deliver Israel "out of the house of bondage"20 by bringing them out of Egypt. He also saves them from their sin. Because sin is always an offence against God, only he can forgive it.21 For this reason Israel, becoming more and more aware of the universality of sin, will no longer be able to seek salvation except by invoking the name of the Redeemer God.22
432 The name “Jesus” signifies that the very name of God is present in the person of his Son, made man for the universal and definitive redemption from sins. It is the divine name that alone brings salvation, and henceforth all can invoke his name, for Jesus united himself to all men through his Incarnation,23 so that "there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."24
433 The name of the Savior God was invoked only once in the year by the high priest in atonement for the sins of Israel, after he had sprinkled the mercy seat in the Holy of Holies with the sacrificial blood. The mercy seat was the place of God’s presence.25 When St. Paul speaks of Jesus whom “God put forward as an expiation by his blood”, he means that in Christ’s humanity "God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself."26
434 Jesus’ Resurrection glorifies the name of the Savior God, for from that time on it is the name of Jesus that fully manifests the supreme power of the “name which is above every name”.27 The evil spirits fear his name; in his name his disciples perform miracles, for the Father grants all they ask in this name.28
435 The name of Jesus is at the heart of Christian prayer. All liturgical prayers conclude with the words “through our Lord Jesus Christ”. The Hail Mary reaches its high point in the words “blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.” The Eastern prayer of the heart, the Jesus Prayer, says: “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Many Christians, such as St. Joan of Arc, have died with the one word “Jesus” on their lips.
You can call the Jews the Chosen People but it’s not quite the same as stating that Moses was the greatest Prophet that ever lived which you would never state…
The Greatest Prophet isn’t God. Jesus is God.
John 5 : 36 “I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the works that the Father has given me to finish—the very works that I am doing—testify that the Father has sent me. 37 And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, 38 nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. 39 You study[c] the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, 40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
41 “I do not accept glory from human beings, 42 but I know you. I know that you do not have the love of God in your hearts. 43 I have come in my Father’s name, and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him. 44 How can you believe since you accept glory from one another but do not seek the glory that comes from the only God[d]?
45 “But do not think I will accuse you before the Father. Your accuser is Moses, on whom your hopes are set. 46 If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. 47 But since you do not believe what he wrote, how are you going to believe what I say
MJ
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Techno2000
Guest
So why God didnt foresee all the problems that would happen by not revealing to them and us what a manifestation is ? So now somebody has to go and try to explain to all these Religions that Bahaism is the fulfillment, God could have at least given these Religions a clue.
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hasantas
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Paul was enemy of Jesus and His followers. The conflicts between Islam and Christianity were established by Paul. Paul got down to rock bottom of doctrines such Original Sin, Jesus to be Son of God literally, all foods permissible(pork), revoke of circumcision, advise to revoke marriage. These are not exist in previous scriptures(Jews) and next scripture(Qur’an). Now scriptures are valid or doctrines of Paul?
If there had been such principles in revelation of Jesus(Bible) then those should be very clearly in Gospels. There is no but in epistles of Paul!
Paul was a Jewish scholar so he could know such doctrines conflict with OT. Then why did he ignore? Was previous revelation totaly false?
Is English translation of Bible equal Greek text exactly? There may be many different meaning in interpretations.
Ofcourse Paul and other saints would preach with languages of people but the original text of revelation should be saved.
If someone is not verified by God as prophet by miracles clearly then the faith and religion could not be established by any one. But Paul did. He added extra principles over faith and religion which was taught by Jesus.
Life is an exam. The circumstances of that exam progressively changed. Until last prophet the scriptures were corrupted partly. God could prevent that. One of reason why God allowed such thing should be that: God revealed the most advanced(according to life of human which is perpetually in improvement and changing) revelation which will progress until last day of world(Islam).
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worldcitizen
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This is one of the signs that oppression will envelop the people. Spiritual oppression not knowing who to turn to or where to turn to for truth.
The ways to find God have become so confused and multiplied that many just give in.
“What “oppression” is greater than that which hath been recounted? What “oppression” is more grievous than that a soul seeking the truth, and wishing to attain unto the knowledge of God, should know not where to go for it and from whom to seek it? For opinions have sorely differed, and the ways unto the attainment of God have multiplied. This “oppression” is the essential feature of every Revelation”
Excerpt From: Bahá’u’lláh. “The Kitáb-i-Íqán.” Bahá’í eBooks
This oppression has enveloped the earth. People are lost and confused. At this time those who are spiritually awake can see clearly the second coming. But most are stuck in confusion. Every religion says it is true and the other false so which way? Just choose and hope?
Baha’u’llah’s Teachings are the only ones relevant and that make sense for today. People will just have to remain in confusion and disunity until we are much larger and they can see more clearly then. For now people write us off as they did the early Christians.
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Techno2000
Guest
That’s the point, they don’t make sense.
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Servant19
Guest
You are welcome to believe what you believe dear Martin, but 1.6 billion people have seen something from Muhammad that is worthy of worship and more believable and more embracing than the “only Jesus” approach of Christianity.
And personally, I can’t believe in a God that would allow 1.6 billion people to collectively worship and collectively do good for humanity through Muhammad, and all of it to be a lie.
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Servant19
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What is so non-sensual Techno?
God prepared the way by guiding humanity to the Messiah, and now He has prepared the way by guiding humanity towards the Promised One Of all religions.
It’s very simple.
If you don’t buy it, move on. God loves you, but you reap what you sow. If you want to make more sense of it, go to your local Baha’i Centre in New Orleans and enroll in a Ruhi Book 1 course and it starts very very simple and gets more complex from there and you’ll be able to make sense of all of it…
I think we should seriously get back on topic here!
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worldcitizen
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Even though Christianity had for centuries been divided, when Baha’u’llah came as Christ returned He still offered them one last chance to be God’s Chosen Ones but they refused.
“O CONCOURSE of monks! If ye choose to follow Me, I will make you heirs of My Kingdom; and if ye transgress against Me, I will, in My long-suffering, endure it patiently, and I, verily, am the Ever-Forgiving, the All-Merciful”
Excerpt From: Bahá’u’lláh. “Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh.”
It’s Christians who have been praying the Lord’s Prayer day and night asking for the Kingdom but when offered it preferred their earthly kingdoms instead so now the blessing of uniting the world and forming the one fold and one shepherd has been taken away and given to those who brought enough spiritual oil in their lamps to see Christ’s coming and now have the blueprint for the Kingdom of God on earth.
Christians can still build it when they realise that it IS the Kingdom that has come and accept Baha’u’llah but they were offered the Kingdom of God first and refused it.
Had the church accepted Baha’u’llah the Pope may well have been the head of the Bahai Faith alongside the House of Justice as He was offered to be the heir of the Kingdom but refused. The world would have been united before WW1 and WW2.
“O CONCOURSE of monks! If ye choose to follow Me, I will make you heirs of My Kingdom; and if ye transgress against Me, I will, in My long-suffering, endure it patiently, and I, verily, am the Ever-Forgiving, the All-Merciful”
Excerpt From: Bahá’u’lláh. “Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh.”
It’s Christians who have been praying the Lord’s Prayer day and night asking for the Kingdom but when offered it preferred their earthly kingdoms instead so now the blessing of uniting the world and forming the one fold and one shepherd has been taken away and given to those who brought enough spiritual oil in their lamps to see Christ’s coming and now have the blueprint for the Kingdom of God on earth.
Christians can still build it when they realise that it IS the Kingdom that has come and accept Baha’u’llah but they were offered the Kingdom of God first and refused it.
Had the church accepted Baha’u’llah the Pope may well have been the head of the Bahai Faith alongside the House of Justice as He was offered to be the heir of the Kingdom but refused. The world would have been united before WW1 and WW2.
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MartinJordan
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Strange you admitted going for Mass and this is what you learned. Where is this Jesus only you’re talking about?
I think you’re confused who Jesus is despite claiming you listen to him.
MJ
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MartinJordan
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IgnatianPhilo
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I read that and think that if Paul was so crafty as to destroy Christian faith all by himself it must have been God’s will that this man be accepted into the Church and deliberately corrupt it. Is God so impotent as to not give the apostles revelation concerning this Man Paul and warn about him? How was one man able to destroy the Church set up by God? I think you give Paul too much credit and you also show a lack of belief in God’s power to redeem sinners if you think God cannot redeem a man who persecuted Christians at first. Why can’t God do this? Must one be utterly pure? Are you utterly pure?
Also I don’t think it follows that because Paul speaks about circumstances that Jesus did not, that therefore they are inauthentic or somehow mistaken. Saint Peter and Saint John in their epistles speak about things Jesus didn’t directly mention either, yet it is accepted because we know the Spirit was among the apostles guiding them into all truth, the same as Paul. The doctrines you mention like Original sin are present in the Genesis account or do you deny that God cursed humanity in that account, man to work all his life and die and woman to give birth in pain? The entire story of the Bible is about how God’s creation by its own will went entirely wrong, how we were corrupted from the beginning and the rescue operation mounted by God in Abraham then through Israel leading up to Jesus Christ. Also Paul was not the first to call Jesus the Son of God, it is present in Gospels and Jesus it affirms it. Part of Mark’s gospel is to establish that exact point that Jesus is the Son of God.
As for English translations being exact, of course their not exact translations, no translation is exact but if the Gospels were written in Greek by the apostles and those who knew apostles then we can say for sure that the Apostles knew how to preach the Gospel in Greek as well as in Aramaic. They were inspired after all, they were given the spirit to speak in many tongues to preach to Nations. Why should it be beyond the Church as a whole to speak of the Gospel in any language? Is it impossible for me to understand the basics of Islamic Tauwhid without Arabic? That you clearly reject multiple persons in God is obvious and you don’t need me to learn Arabic in order to conceive of the concept.
Also you keep expecting the original text to be saved. Why do we need the originals? Do we have the very first manuscripts of the Quran? I don’t think we do, yet you would trust teh transmission of it. Tell me why we need the original script of the New testament and not the Quran’s. As for Paul adding extra principles, he only taught the Gospel. Why was he wrong to encourage celibacy? Jesus was celibate. Why was he wrong to not demand circumcision when the apostles didn’t demand circumcision? Why was he wrong to accept eating all foods when Jesus himself declared all foods clean? We don’t have all the words of Jesus contained in the Gospel and we trust the apostles who trusted Paul to teach correctly concerning the things they brought up. If the Apostles can’t be trusted then I would grant your point, but they can since Christ appointed them.
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TonyBS
Guest
The Word contains all the Clues…ALL!
Free Will is a gift when used in the knowledge that God Doeth as He Willeth.
The Key - One God and His Purpose is One. Our next goal is the Unity of Mankind as its peace and security is unattainable until Unity is firmly established.
Regards Tony
Regards Tony
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