Easy Life of an Atheist

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Lee1 said:
Though I’ve never been a complete atheist, I have tasted the desolation of that illusion and it made every trial and tribulation far far worse and eventually led me to become Catholic.
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And this exemplifies a key difference in world views of believers and those who remain nonbelievers. IMO, many here are discussing solutions to a problem many atheists do not have/perceive. The talk of desolation or a need to reach out to an invisible (to us) being just isn’t a part of my life experience.

Based on a number of conversion stories I’d posit that those who do feel such desolation or lack of meaning do fine their way towards faith. Those that don’t don’t.
 
When you were introduced to physics or geometry etc, did the teachers expect you to believe what they said without proof, without demonstration? I’m guessing no. You probably read about the subject, were shown experimental results and even watched some live in the case of physics or chemistry and the like. They didn’t ask you to take their word for it, but they didn’t show you everything, not quarks and many other things including perhaps nuclear fusion etc.

The same is true of my religion. There are books, demonstrations of miracles attesting to the hidden power of God, and prayer which has results which are experienced subjectively. My priest directed me to read, test and experience.

I can’t tell you therefore and it wouldn’t do,any good for me to tell you that see things are so and expect you to simply believe me, you must try it yourself, in a spirit of neutrality and openness.

Belief in God is most usually built, and often slowly as is befitting such an important concept.
 
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Yes and I have experienced so I am satisfied that my belief is based on reality and truth. I understand your unbelief, really I do, I spent sixty years struggling becasue I did NOT want to believe in something which was a delusion.

I regret I can only offer you my word and ask you to suspend disbelief and try it for yourself.
 
My grandfather was agnostic/atheist, & his life was by no means easy. He’d lived a very hard life.
 
It’s true that belief can greatly ease our journey through life and it’s true that by obtaining salvation we can avoid a possibly devastating punishment but I am drawn to God for the reason that He is the ultimate good, the Truth, my creator. I see this as immense spiritual gain, not the avoidance of pain.
 
Let me say that’s a lovely coincidence.

In all honesty on occasion I doubt, but then I recall the reasons why I believe and they are such that I have no doubt that God exists.

If you need to experience life as an individual unbounded by the strictures of religion and Faith then I might ask if you can discount ALL (I have no means of highlighting, I’m not shouting) other possibly explanations for every phenomena in the universe. That cannot be done. So if the answer is you can’t then it is simply a matter of subjective preference and my preference is to stand by my experiences and embrace my Catholic religion.
 
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I did this. I was raised Catholic. Gave it all I had to give, but simply couldn’t believe it. No amount of prayer brought belief or faith. No amount of blessings, holy water, Lourdes water, oil from crying statues, personal mortfication, etc made any difference.

Eventually I moved on and lived what I experience and believe…the Universe is the Ultimate reality. I even had a near death experience…no God.
 
Some might say that you may not have been ready, some might say that your near death experience was as it was for good reason. We all have our journey to make as I believe designed by God for the greater good, as known only by the Almighty. Perhaps you’ll return to it in time only God knows.

I’m sure that we all eventually discover the Truth.
Peace.
 
Honesty is a great start! That to me is the spark lit in your being and it will lead you I’ve no doubt towards the source of all honesty. Please don’t misunderstand me, I am not saying that I understand all things or have complete knowledge, but I would say that I now know where I can find those things.
I wish you well and I regret that I can only suggest you try before you buy! Look at it again with fresh eyes and with your great experience of being a solipsist, I’m sure it’s not an accident that you were led to become one.
 
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I respect your view and I’ve no doubt that it is based on knowledge and a sound education and I acknowledge that such serious matters should be based on more than just intuition or wild fantasies…which is why my faith is rock solid.

Your belief must be based on your own experiences which it sounds has not included the Catholic religion. Mine has and I must simply tell you that I have very good reasons for continuing my spiritual development within the Catholic Church. It takes concerted effort to do this for perhaps most people but little by little your belief is justified which leads you to further your efforts. I was mistaken to say try before you buy, it doesn’t work like that, please disregard that statement.

So I’ve really enjoyed being given the opportunity to discuss this with you, I have benefited from it and I hope that you have too.
 
That’s good. You did say that your belief is that you ‘dont Know’ so I’m encouraged by that it means your open to suggestion yes?

Perhaps our experiences differ not because of the Catholic Faith but due to our physiological differences.

If you ever have any more deep questions which you don’t want answered please ask me! I mean by that I lack the knowledge to help you and that is my regret but I know others on this forum have fine minds and far greater knowledge and they may well help you. Our preferences come from our hearts, we all differ slightly but are united in a far deeper way, perhaps?

Christian love to you brother. Fair well.
 
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Bradskii said:
’m glad someone brought hell up. Can we have a show of hands of all those who have no doubt that they are going to avoid hell?
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Know I am late to the party, but, I am a Christian. I am not a believer in “once saved always saved”. While at this moment if I were to die I am in friendship with God, I do not know what will happen 10 years from now or 10 days from now or 10 minutes from now. I have free will, I may very well choose grave sin.

Will go a step further, I had a child who died without baptism. While the Church says we do not know the eternal destination of those who die without baptism, I do not believe that my child is in heaven. I believe that baptism is necessary for salvation. This does not drive me mad, in fact, it is simply a fact that I failed my duty as a parent and that my child will be denied the beatific vision because of it. There may be a place that is outside the tortures of hell (called limbo of the infants for a long time) where the unbaptized children end up. I simply trust God he is both justice and mercy and I am okay with his handling of things.

Maybe I am strange?
 
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There is no connection from the identity of “Atheist” to anything other than the question, “Are you convinced that the supernatural exists?”. That’s all the label “Atheist” refers to. Anything else is just showing that you don’t know what an Atheist is.
For example: You come and tell me that you have a new puppy. I don’t believe that to be the case. Now, as an A-puppiest, what is my political position? They don’t have anything to do with each other.

However, you are giving away one of the secrets of religion. That it is a political system for controlling the masses. One of your religion’s purpose is to use politics to force people to adhere to your religions tenants instead of just convincing people that your values are worth having. Which is why we must have separation from religion from politics since, as a democracy, we are the reference point for what is good comes from the conversation of the people instead of your dear leader that no one can talk to.
 
Atheists are not saying, “There is no god.”, they are saying, “We are not convinced there is one yet.”. Stop listening to your pulpit and talk to an atheist to understand this difference.

Is the wicket person who does not believe in god mean that they don’t believe that your god’s answers to the problems are to be taken seriously or that they don’t believe the god exists at all?

If it’s the latter, then that is a vastly ignorant statement. Beliefs are not a choice you make. They are the conclusion to the experience based on the data you took in and your understanding of reality. Example: sit in a chair and then choose to believe you are not sitting in a chair. You can’t. It’s not possible. The only way you can change your belief that you are not sitting in a chair is new evidence and new logical understanding. Such as 1+2 = 3. The 1, and 2 are just data you experience in reality. The “+” and “=” is your applied logic. You can’t help but conclude the 3 then. The only way to change the 3 is to change the data and/or change the application of your current understanding of logic.
 
There’s no such thing as atheism. There is the plural of atheist though. Atheists. More than one atheist. But there is no atheism since atheism implies dogma, tenants, philosophies, leadership, etc. None of this exists for atheists. We are individual people who are not convinced of your claim. By your reasoning here for using this word, all the jury members that found the defendant not guilty all have a world view of “Not Guilty-ism” as well.
 
TheLittleLady said:
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Bradskii:
’m glad someone brought hell up. Can we have a show of hands of all those who have no doubt that they are going to avoid hell?
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Know I am late to the party, but, I am a Christian. I am not a believer in “once saved always saved”. While at this moment if I were to die I am in friendship with God, I do not know what will happen 10 years from now or 10 days from now or 10 minutes from now. I have free will, I may very well choose grave sin.

Will go a step further, I had a child who died without baptism. While the Church says we do not know the eternal destination of those who die without baptism, I do not believe that my child is in heaven. I believe that baptism is necessary for salvation. This does not drive me mad, in fact, it is simply a fact that I failed my duty as a parent and that my child will be denied the beatific vision because of it. There may be a place that is outside the tortures of hell (called limbo of the infants for a long time) where the unbaptized children end up. I simply trust God he is both justice and mercy and I am okay with his handling of things.

Maybe I am strange?
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I am so sorry for your loss.

And yes, I do think you are strange. Well, at least your attitude to hell is strange.

Let’s say someone told you that if you did something wrong then people would appear at your home without notice, take you away and torment you continuously for a week. No let up. 24/7. And no chance for a reprieve. No matter how much you pleaded and begged it would simply go on. Friends and family would be powerless to help you.

No sane person would contemplate doing anything wrong whatsoever. You’d be living on a knife edge wondering how you’d get through the day without slipping up.

Now let’s increase the punishment to a month. You wouldn’t leave the house. Now up it to a year. You’d be in a catatonic state. The fear would be overwhelming.

Now make it eternity. You’d quite literally go mad.
 
That I believe is the problem with scrupulosity? There must be a balance, I find it hard to believe that Our Father would want us to be unhappy and unbalanced in that way. It’s a question of degree as with many things and by admitting to ourselves that we come to God as sinners we help give ourselves that balance.

Surely every Catholic must align him/herself as closely as is possible with the central tenets and the teachings of Our Lord but acknowledge that we are flawed and fallable (misspelt.) And hope in the gracious mercy of our loving Father.
 
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Lee1 said:
That I believe is the problem with scrupulosity? There must be a balance, I find it hard to believe that Our Father would want us to be unhappy and unbalanced in that way. It’s a question of degree as with many things and by admitting to ourselves that we come to God as sinners we help give ourselves that balance.

Surely every Catholic must align him/herself as closely as is possible with the central tenets and the teachings of Our Lord but acknowledge that we are flawed and fallable (misspelt.) And hope in the gracious mercy of our loving Father.
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Scrupulosity? This has nothing at all to do with it. In fact one could say it’s almost the opposite.

Scupulosity can be described as a constant worry about commiting sin whereas what you and Napp66 are exhibiting is a complete and possibly pathological disregard for the punishment. That punishment being eternal torment no less.
 
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