Ecemunical Council

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Starwarsfan2 said:
Well they certainly can’t contradict the scriptures and be authoritative, which is why agreement with the scriptures is the qualification for ecemunical status.
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You noted female bishops as one such topic for this ecumenical council. The problem is what will happen when various Churches disagree with each other based on the Scripture?

I see this now in the Lutheran Church where conservative Lutherans LCMS WELS do not ordain women nor have Bishops and the ELCA have female clergy as I understand it. (I stand corrected if wrong, let me know) There decisions from the conservative side are based on scripture and I assume the ELCA as well.

So already that is an area of disagreement. If this went to an ecumenical council how would this be resolved by vote? Or some other way?

Mary.
 
MaryT777 said:
You noted female bishops as one such topic for this ecumenical council. The problem is what will happen when various Churches disagree with each other based on the Scripture?

I see this now in the Lutheran Church where conservative Lutherans LCMS WELS do not ordain women nor have Bishops and the ELCA have female clergy as I understand it. (I stand corrected if wrong, let me know) There decisions from the conservative side are based on scripture and I assume the ELCA as well.

So already that is an area of disagreement. If this went to an ecumenical council how would this be resolved by vote? Or some other way?

Mary.
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I assume there would be a vote , because there would be at least five churches in attendance ( Roman Catholic, Orthodox Catholic , Lutheran , Anglican , Reformed ) with the potential for the rest ( oriental orthodox , Anabaptist , Westlyan, Adventist ) . Maybe like 50 delegates each?

Not all conservative Lutherans oppose women priests, The North American Lutheran , and Lutheran congregations in mission for Christ , and the Norwegian Lutheran mission support it , ( I’m a confessional / conservative Lutheran that supports women priests btw) on this issue it comes down to the egalitarian view in which both genders have equal rights and responsibilities ( my view) or the complamentarian view with. Strict gender roles.
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
Well they certainly can’t contradict the scriptures and be authoritative, which is why agreement with the scriptures is the qualification for ecemunical status.
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Well…who would decide what is the correct interpretation first? Should this not be settled first?
 
pablope said:
Well…who would decide what is the correct interpretation first? Should this not be settled first?
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We agree that the first four are ecemunical, so we call another one , but disagree on the numbering.
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
We agree that the first four are ecemunical, so we call another one , but disagree on the numbering.
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But you did not answer the question. You said the EC should be be in agreement with Scriptures…so the question of what is the correct interpretation and where to find that should be settled first.

How do you propose about doing that? And whose interpretation should be followed if there is disagreement?
 
pablope said:
But you did not answer the question. You said the EC should be be in agreement with Scriptures…so the question of what is the correct interpretation and where to find that should be settled first.

How do you propose about doing that? And whose interpretation should be followed if there is disagreement?
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Of what?. I don’t quite get the question .
 
Anyway , how’s this for an outline:
Pre council

1.Intra church councils dealing with internal problems
Then 2. Selecting delegates( maybe 50 each ) times and places for the ecemunical council
and 3. churches selecting the topics to discuss.

Ecemunical council itself
  1. Discussing the topics and decide on them .
Post council
  1. The churches vote on accepting the council as ecemunical.
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
I assume there would be a vote , because there would be at least five churches in attendance ( Roman Catholic, Orthodox Catholic , Lutheran , Anglican , Reformed ) with the potential for the rest ( oriental orthodox , Anabaptist , Westlyan, Adventist ) . Maybe like 50 delegates each?

Not all conservative Lutherans oppose women priests, The North American Lutheran , and Lutheran congregations in mission for Christ , and the Norwegian Lutheran mission support it , ( I’m a confessional / conservative Lutheran that supports women priests btw) on this issue it comes down to the egalitarian view in which both genders have equal rights and responsibilities ( my view) or the complamentarian view with. Strict gender roles.
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Wouldn’t it make more sense for the Lutheran Church to first hold an Ecumenical Council among themselves and agree on the issue of women ordination by vote as you suggest and then present a unified front to the " ecumenical council" you are speaking about?

You also noted issues of the Pope. Again it would make more sense to iron out the AntiChrist doctrine among the Lutherans that do and those that don’t hold to the
Smalcald article and provide a unified front?

How could we possibly hold an ecumenical council with all these various teachings and beliefs among the non Catholic religions? Each sect and synod often already disagree with each other based on scripture, high , low, liberal, conservative, etc .

I believe of course the Pope should have the final decision for he alone has the charism of infallibility regarding the issues of Faith and Morals.

Plus didn’t Luther say Councils can err? So as a Lutheran it’s interesting to see you’d like thoughts on it.

It does seem intriguing.

The peace of Christ that transcends all understanding to you,

Mary.
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
Anyway , how’s this for an outline:
Pre council

1.Intra church councils dealing with internal problems
Then 2. Selecting delegates( maybe 50 each ) times and places for the ecemunical council
and 3. churches selecting the topics to discuss.

Ecemunical council itself
  1. Discussing the topics and decide on them .
Post council
  1. The churches vote on accepting the council as ecemunical.
Click to expand...
Seems to me the first order of business is for the EO and CC to have a truly ecumenical council, and solve the issues that have divided the Church for a thousand years.
I think many of the issues we Lutherans (well, confessional Lutherans at least) have become easier to solve once that’s in place.

Jon
 
MaryT777 said:
Wouldn’t it make more sense for the Lutheran Church to first hold an Ecumenical Council among themselves and agree on the issue of women ordination by vote as you suggest and then present a unified front to the " ecumenical council" you are speaking about?

You also noted issues of the Pope. Again it would make more sense to iron out the AntiChrist doctrine among the Lutherans that do and those that don’t hold to the
Smalcald article and provide a unified front?

How could we possibly hold an ecumenical council with all these various teachings and beliefs among the non Catholic religions? Each sect and synod often already disagree with each other based on scripture, high , low, liberal, conservative, etc .

I believe of course the Pope should have the final decision for he alone has the charism of infallibility regarding the issues of Faith and Morals.

Plus didn’t Luther say Councils can err? So as a Lutheran it’s interesting to see you’d like thoughts on it.

It does seem intriguing.

The peace of Christ that transcends all understanding to you,

Mary.
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You make a good case for a unified front among Lutherans , and Luther accepted four councils as ecemunical because they taught the truth , councils can err but that’s why we call false councils robber ones , the bishop of Rome hopefully may be a delegate.
I’m going to suggest a council to a Lutheran bishop and see where it leads, cus someone s got to ask 🙂

Keep the faith , Starwarsfan .
 
JonNC said:
Seems to me the first order of business is for the EO and CC to have a truly ecumenical council, and solve the issues that have divided the Church for a thousand years.
I think many of the issues we Lutherans (well, confessional Lutherans at least) have become easier to solve once that’s in place.

Jon
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I think that’s a cop out. Have a Lutheran “truly” ecumenical council first.

Mary.
 
MaryT777 said:
I think that’s a cop out. Have a Lutheran “truly” ecumenical council first.

Mary.
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Are you making excuses for your thousand year schism from the Eastern Orthodox? 😃

Come on , Mary, we’re a mere 80 million. The CC and EO combined are what? 1.5 billion or more?
But maybe we could meet in a smaller conference room at the same time. 👍

Jon
 
JonNC said:
Are you making excuses for your thousand year schism from the Eastern Orthodox? 😃

Come on , Mary, we’re a mere 80 million. The CC and EO combined are what? 1.5 billion or more?
But maybe we could meet in a smaller conference room at the same time. 👍

Jon
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Well , to be fair there are more subdivisions of the Lutheran church , than of the roman and orthodox Catholics
 
JonNC said:
Are you making excuses for your thousand year schism from the Eastern Orthodox? 😃

Come on , Mary, we’re a mere 80 million. The CC and EO combined are what? 1.5 billion or more?
But maybe we could meet in a smaller conference room at the same time. 👍

Jon
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:rotfl:

I tell you what, we’ll let you use the smaller conference room for free, it comes with the “big” room.

Mary.
 
JonNC said:
Are you making excuses for your thousand year schism from the Eastern Orthodox? 😃

Come on , Mary, we’re a mere 80 million. The CC and EO combined are what? 1.5 billion or more?
But maybe we could meet in a smaller conference room at the same time. 👍

Jon
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I wish there could be some movement towards unity with the EO but alas it seems far away to me.

However, if it is ever arranged you can use the smaller conference room of course, for it comes for free when you rent the big one~👍

Mary.
 
MaryT777 said:
I wish there could be some movement towards unity with the EO but alas it seems far away to me.

However, if it is ever arranged you can use the smaller conference room of course, for it comes for free when you rent the big one~👍

Mary.
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Texting the primate of Russia , and Constantinople tight now:D
 
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