Ecumenism with Lutherans

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pacloc said:
I’m having a hard time understanding how it is you respect Holy Things. This mentality of viewing Angels and the Holy Virgin and Saints as “mere” beings compared to God is the source of blasphemy
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I’d like to say I understand you but I don’t. Not at all. You just said that and even tried to justify it.

How do you view God if you are even attempting to explain that? And then I am wrong for stating and I will say it again, no Angel or Saint or even the "ever virgin Mary " can ever be compared to God. They are all servants of God and abide by His requests for whatever and whenever by the simple fact that He is God. I am proclaiming the TOTAL supremacy of the ALL Holy here. Can’t see how that can even be attempted to be challenged. How can anything be disrespected by stating it is inferior to God. That my sir, boggles my mind.

Side note: Your post was quite interesting but it doesn’t do much justice for those ob here trying to claim you are “praying through/to Saints/Mary” and not worshipping them.

Oh and also, blasphemy was the first word coming to my mind when you started to even try and equate ANYTHING to God. But maybe that’s just me. I tend to think God is in His own catagory.
 
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All that is holy is holy because God made them holy.

He created the world and called it good.

God created and sanctified the saints – by God’s will, they are made holy.

Their holiness is from God alone.

There’s a paranoid fear of honoring creatures within the protestant circle. I should know. I was part of that circle.

(Hearing the phrase “Mother of God” was a great shock at first.)

No one is saying saints are greater than God — the implication is from the misunderstanding from the protestant side, not the belief of the Catholic and Orthodox Churches. Besides, such a claim is preposterous and not even worth refuting.
 
NuclearReceptor said:
No one is saying saints are greater than God
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Not greater, just even relatively close to equal. Maybe read that post again?

Also, claiming you know because you were Protestant makes me go … uhmmmm…

My wife was Catholic for 25 years. I’m sure her opinion won’t carry much weight for you. Get what I’m saying?
 
There’s nothing in the Catholic doctrine that says any finite creature can be close to Infinite God by nature. If God is close to us, it is through His grace.

Every Protestant fears veneration of saints because they think it’s tantamount to blasphemy. They think it will offend God or somehow detract from adoration and worship. We honor saints because through them God shows His grace and mercy — the divine works of God are made manifest and knowable to us through them. They are reflections of God and give glory to God by their exemplary lives of piety and holiness. They are friends who have gone before us.

You yourself are an example of paranoid protestant anxiety. You think veneration of saints detracts from God. Somehow.

If her reason for not venerating saints is the same as yours, then no, it won’t carry much weight for me.
 
NuclearReceptor said:
You yourself are an example of paranoid protestant anxiety. You think veneration of saints detracts from God. Somehow.

If her reason for not venerating saints is the same as yours, then no, it won’t carry much weight for me.
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You seem to know me pretty well? An analysis in 2 posts that would take a psychologist 5 sessions.

Oh and I didn’t think her opinion would. As is the exact reason I stated you should maybe choose to refrain from saying you were Protestant as if it means anything to the discussion.
 
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ComplineSanFran said:
The Lutheran Church in New York hosted the Ecumenical service of Repentance and Thanksgiving in honor of the 500th Anniversary of the Reformation.
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So do you believe in female ordination and same sex marriage?

Thank you for reading.
 
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You know that not all Lutherans and not all Anglicans ordain women. Some maintain orthodoxy in a lot of ways
 
You just wrote a lengthy paragraph on how you can’t possibly imagine considering saints as holy because only God is holy.

Your own words, not mine, show unnecessary anxiety about possibly offending God.

I grew up being taught the same line of reasoning – that since only God is holy, we can’t honor creatures. It’s a common protestant idea. I just happen to experience it first-hand.
 
Yes, they would be Protestants. (Somewhere in the above post, it was supposed to be replied/edited as “Every Protestant who rejects veneration of saints”)
 
JonNC said:
You know that not all Lutherans and not all Anglicans ordain women. Some maintain orthodoxy in a lot of ways
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But don’t you see the massive scandal and heresy this creates? I’ve come across ComplineSanFran before and they are all for same sex marriage, and in their post, they put up a picture of a joint service with those who believe in female ordination at least.

So as we can blatantly see, with such people we are not close at all, with Orthodox like yourself perhaps, but then who knows who is who?

These joint services for Luther’s 500th anniversary are just wrong on so many levels.

God Bless You

Thank you for reading
 
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@JonNC And with those orthodox like yourself, I would love for the Catholic Church to reach out and help you make that final step whatever it may be for you to come home to the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, but in order to do that, one must let Luther go because he never came home.

And I don’t want those like ComplineSanFran who believes in same sex marriage and I guess female ordination as pictured above, to be piggy backing off of this as they do with this deceptive joint services for the 500th anniversary of Martin Luther. Since we already have enough trouble with self professing ‘Catholics’ who have fallen for such heresies. For ComplineSanFran to come home, they need to not only let Luther go, but also the heresies they hold like same sex marriage and female ordination (and I really hope they do) but having not done that and claiming unity, is a total lie.

God Bless You

Thank you for reading.
 
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As in, every Lutheran Church that is not ELCA. Unfortunately, they’ve got the numbers, so they get the press. As an LCMS member, the idea of SS Marriage and female ordination is repellent. " Heretical" isn’t the word, but " apostate" probably is.
 
NuclearReceptor said:
Speaking of “hateful towards others”: the political correctness has gotten us to remain silent when the homosexual and transgender agenda are taking over civil society, and sometimes, in various Christian communities. Opposing ideas are not hateful.
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This is so very Christian! We can’t agree on the nature of salvation or the real presence, but we can all agree to hate gays!
 
Thank you for being an example of falsely using the word “hate”.
 
RandomAlias said:
Let us pray… that all Christians may be united in faith, hope, and love.
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Let us pray instead that all Christians may be united in the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church in faith, hope and love.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
 
NuclearReceptor said:
Thank you for being an example of falsely using the word “hate”.
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Oh, I’m sorry, I should have used the word salad that is “love the sinner, hate the sin!” I’m sure it makes the LGBTQ community feel so loved when someone declares that they’re souls are in mortal danger and wants to see laws re-enacted to shove them back in the closet lest they poison society.

I’ve actually been lurking on this site, even in its old version, for quite a while, and while many hear seem sincere and do try to create a partition between homosexuals and their acts, there are no lack of people here that no matter how much they try to equivocate, clearly dislike homosexuals a great deal. And yes, a few that I can only say outright hate gay people.
 
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