Eh question

[corvidae]

I have to say this bella

Eating our young would be a far more natural act than masturbation.
At the very least, other animals in the world eat their young, as far as I know, no other animal practices masturbation. I mean, think about it, you are having sex, with yourself. There is nothing natural or harmless about that. It is a backward practice that promotes a backward ideal.

I would say look at what the Catechism says over what your priest does. He may not be lying, just misinformed. And it is not always a MORTAL sin, but it is grave matter, which means it could easily be a mortal sin. The Church tells us this.

You and your priest are in my prayers.

A lone Raven

 

[Mommyof02green]

CCC paragraph 2352:

By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. “Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action.” “The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose.” For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of “the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved.”

To form an equitable judgment about the subjects’ moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety, or other psychological or social factors that can lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.

 

[bella5110]

I doubt anyone is burning in Hell for it…that’s all.

 

[mercygate]

I doubt anyone is burning in Hell for it…that’s all.

Masturbation is not “natural” to the dignity of the human person, which is created for union with God. It is “sub-natural” because it uses our procreative faculties, which are created for self-giving for self gratification. It is a myth of our culture that it is harmless.

Your priest may be confusing the gravity of the matter, objectively taken in itself, and the subjective culpability, which may be mitigated by personal circumstances.

Check out those passages in the Catechism that others have referred you to.

 

[mercygate]

Ok just somethings here. you say this stuff doesn’t change but I seem to remember the Sabbath being changed from saturday to sunday

Others have responded well on the subject of the Sabbath. But masturbation is a “life issue” which falls under the Divine and natural moral law. The ceremonial law may change in its particulars (Sunday fs. Saturday worship in commemoration of the fulfillment of the law) though not in principle.

but one thing I wonder, why can females have orgasm, to my knowledge doesn’t it do anything?

If this is related to the original post, 1) masturbation is equally dangerous/sinful for women and 2) It DOES “do” something: aside from contributing to the subjective and objective unity of the husband and wife by the release of bonding hormones, it pulses the sperm toward the uterus to enhance the possibility of conception.

 

[Mommyof02green]

I doubt anyone is burning in Hell for it…that’s all.

I don’t know about you, but I can speak for myself.

I know that it’s wrong. I know that it’s a sin in the eyes of God. I know that sins, un-repented sins that is, can lead me to eternal punishment. Scripture is every clear that sin can = hell.

Christ told us to “sin no more” and that if we wish to enter into “life that we are to keep the commandments.”

I wish to enter into life, so I do my best to keep the commandments and sin no more. At times I fail and when I fail I seek God’s forgiveness.

I’m blessed because I’m forgiven. However, I do my best to not sin again, especially not to do the same sin again and again.

In my opinion if you are truly sorry for doing something you did wrong, then you truly do your best not to do it again.

God knows if you are truly sorry or if you are not.
God knows if you truly want to and have been trying to follow His commandments.

God is the Judge. It is His call who is in heaven and who is not in heaven.

Now, it might very well be your opinion that no one would be in hell of masturbation. However, is that the opinion of the True Judge?? Is that the opinion of God??

 

[mercygate]

I doubt anyone is burning in Hell for it…that’s all.

Would that be the judgment of your well-formed conscience, steeped in the natural law, or just an opinion drawn with very little thought from the prevailing spiritual smog of the secular culture?

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

Job 31:1
"I made a covenant with my eyes not to look lustfully at a girl.

Numbers 15:39
You will have these tassels to look at and so you will remember all the commands of the LORD, that you may obey them and** not prostitute yourselves by going after the lusts of your own hearts and eyes.**

Proverbs 6:25
Do not lust in your heart after her beauty or let her captivate you with her eyes,

1 John 2:16
For everything in the world—the cravings of sinful man, the lust of his eyes and the boasting of what he has and does—comes not from the Father but from the world.

also, look at fruit of spirit vs fruit of flesh

Galatians 5:16-26 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain

16This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

17For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

18But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

23Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

24And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

25If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

26Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Exodus 20:17
“You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”

Deuteronomy 5:21
“You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife. You shall not set your desire on your neighbor’s house or land, his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”

Philippians 4:8
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.

1 Corinthians 6:12-20 (New International Version)

12"Everything is permissible for me"—but not everything is beneficial. “Everything is permissible for me”—but I will not be mastered by anything. 13"Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"—but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body. 14By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, “The two will become one flesh.”[a] 17But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.
18Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body. 19Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

Romans 6
1What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

2God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

3Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

4Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

6Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

7For he that is dead is freed from sin.

8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:

9Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

10For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.

11Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

13Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

14For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

17But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

18Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

19I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

20For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

21What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.

22But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Timothy 5

1Do not rebuke an older man harshly, but exhort him as if he were your father. Treat younger men as brothers, 2older women as mothers, and younger women as sisters, with absolute purity. 3Give proper recognition to those widows who are really in need.

Do you really think you should masterbate while thinking of your very own sister?

Romans 12

1Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God—this is your spiritual[a] act of worship. 2Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.
3For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourself with sober judgment, in accordance with the measure of faith God has given you.

And, last

Mark 9:47
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell,

Do you think it is possible that God would remove your prostrate through cancer?

Read II Peter 1, about making your salvation sure.

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

James 4:17 (Contemporary English Version)

If you don’t do what you know is right, you have sinned.

 

[AlegreFe]

We are not talking porn, fornication, homosexuality here, stay on track…

But masterbation does fall along these lines.

1. 
   *]Porn will make someone masterbate when looking at it. Maybe not everyone but most will certainly be aroused.
   *]I would think that masterbation falls in the category of fornication because whether you’re married or not, masterbation is “sex outside of marriage” if you are alone in a room all by yourself.
   *]Homosexuality would more than likely involve masterbation along with whatever else is being done and that too is “sex outside of marriage” as defined by God.

 

[AlegreFe]

You can say whatever you want, but I don’t think you’ll go to Hell for masturbating. Lighten up. God knows men and woman are human . If it is used in a way not to hurt anyone (no porn etc…), in the privacy of your own room, to me it is not a sin. I’m not saying I practice this, it just sounds so ridiculous when it is a natural act.

There is nothing natural about masterbation. Remember God made Adam & Eve, not Adam and his hand; or Eve and her hand.

It is a selfish act that gives no life to anyone. God created the marital act to bring forth life. Not to bring forth pleasure for one person in a room all by themselves.

 

[AlegreFe]

Wrong. It is not a selfish act but a natural one. We are not perfect and God knows this. I don’t think people will be in Hell for this. If you are celibate, there is nothing wrong with it. And I love my priest and he doesn’t lie.

As I said before, nothing natural about it if you’re alone and seeking pleasure. You are right, none of us are perfect. But that does not mean that God thinks something is okay just because we are human. God is mercy, yes but he will never excuse us from our wrong doings. We all have to repent and change what we are doing if it is wrong. And this is clearly wrong.

Yes people are in hell for this. Most people who are in hell are there because of Sins of the flesh. And masturbation is definitely a sin of the flesh and has everything to do with going against chastity.

You can be married or single and it is still wrong. In both of those situations, the person performing the act of masturbation is not being in line with God’s will and that is being open to life.

I’m glad you love your priest. We all should love our priests. I know you don’t think he lies. And I’m sure your priest has no intention of lying. But that doesn’t mean that your priest isn’t misinformed. He just doesn’t know in this case.

bella5110:

Stupid thread. Just sould of called it masturbation.

You only think this is a “stupid thread” because you are being told that you and your priest are wrong. And what makes you think that changing the name of the thread would have less replies in here? Or less people telling you that you are wrong?

I’m sorry but those are the facts.

 

[repentantsinner]

Sins of the Flesh!
**
1 Peter 2:11**
11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul.

James 1:14-15
14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

2 Timothy 2:22
22 Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

Matthew 5:27-28
27 "You have heard that it was said, "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY’; 28 but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

1 Corinthians 6:13-20
13 Food is for the stomach and the stomach is for food, but God will do away with both of them. Yet the body is not for immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord is for the body. 14 Now God has not only raised the Lord, but will also raise us up through His power. 15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute? May it never be! 16 Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.” 17 But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. 18 Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own? 20 For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

2 Corinthians 12:21
21 I am afraid that when I come again my God may humiliate me before you, and I may mourn over many of those who have sinned in the past and not repented of the impurity, immorality and sensuality which they have practiced.

Galatians 5:19-21
19 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, 21 envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Ephesians 5:3-5
3 But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints; 4 and there must be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. 5 For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous man, who is an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.

Ephesians 5:3 in the New International Version says, “But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people.”

Colossians 3:5-85 Therefore consider the members of your earthly body as dead to immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and greed, which amounts to idolatry. 6 For it is because of these things that the wrath of God will come upon the sons of disobedience, 7 and in them you also once walked, when you were living in them. 8 But now you also, put them all aside: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and abusive speech from your mouth.

1 Thessalonians 4:3-53 For this is the will of God, your sanctification; that is, that you abstain from sexual immorality; 4 that each of you know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, 5 not in lustful passion, like the Gentiles who do not know God;

 

[AlegreFe]

If you are celibate, there is nothing wrong with it. And I love my priest and he doesn’t lie.

Since we are not priests and you seem to go by what a priest tells you, here are 4 different priests who all say that Masturbation is a MORTAL sin.

Mommyof02green has these links in one of her posts but I thought I would emphasis that they came from a priest since you want to go by what a priest says bella.

Thanks for those links Momof02.

Father Echert:
Objectively speaking, masturbation is a mortal sin, and must
be confessed sacramentally. Many people struggle with this
particular sin, starting at a young age and continuing for years.
However, with the grace offered in the Sacrament of Confession
and by some changes in behavior and circumstances, one may
be freed from this entanglement of sin. Find a good priest to
make a confession of this, making known to him that you have
not confessed it in the past, out of ignorance and embarrassment.

Fr. Robert J. Levis:
Dear Carol, The Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith teaches
that masturbation is intrinsically a gravely disordered act, a
mortal sin. This has always been held by the Church. Be clear
about this. While the subject matter of this sin is always grave
and serious, at times perhaps the masturbatory act may be done
without the other two perquisites for serious sin, e.g. sufficient
reflection and full consent of the will. Fr. Bob Levis

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.:
Genital pleasure was created as an expression of the union of
husband and wife where by their desire to give themselves totally
to each other, this expression of their mutual love can result in
the creation of another human being. Masturbation is not the
expression of the self-gift of oneself to another. It cannot be the
expression of love, since no one else in involved. It is not a giving,
but a taking. Maturbation takes genital activity out of its proper
context and makes it a selfish act. Yes, masturbation is a mortal
sin.

The habit of masturbatin can be a difficult one to break. But it
CAN be done by avoiding the fantasies that encourage it and with
daily prayer and reflection on the suffering of our blessed Lord on
the cross.

Fr. Matthew Habiger OSB ← His answer is long (but good) so I only put portions of it here.
…
Real love means making the total gift of yourself to another, with
no conditions or reservations. Every one of us must learn how to
love, to make the total and unconditional gift of ourselves to
others. The marital act, or the spousal act, is a couple’s way of
making the total gift of themselves to each other with their bodies.
God designed the marital act to be expressed only in marriage
between two deeply committed persons. In addition, the sexual
act is capable of bringing about a new life. Therefore, if a couple
is not open to life, and willing to accept the gift of a new life into
their family, then they are not ready for sex. The Church teaches
us that every marital act must be both love-giving and life-giving.
…
This means that we do not stimulate ourselves (masturbation) so
as to bring on sexual excitement or pleasure. It means that we
avoid situations that would be a source of temptation to us to fall
into sexual sins.
…
Yes, masturbation is a serious sin, and must be repented of and
confessed.

Cordially yours,

Fr. Matthew Habiger OSB www.nfpoutreach.org

 

[AlegreFe]

Don’t worry bella5110, I am not condemning you. I only want to inform you with the facts because I care and I do not wish for this “misinformation” that your priest gave you to be spread to anyone else. The devil is the one that is spreading this lie and the devil is getting a kick out of all of this. He loves that we are committing these sins of the flesh. Don’t let yourself be another one of his victims. I know you said that you do not do this but if you inform someone else that it is not a sin you are participating in their sin also and that is not good.

 

[LilyM]

Wrong. It is not a selfish act but a natural one. We are not perfect and God knows this. I don’t think people will be in Hell for this. If you are celibate, there is nothing wrong with it. And I love my priest and he doesn’t lie.

Stupid thread. Just sould of called it masturbation.

It may a natural act for me to punch people in the face when I’m angry with them. Anger and violence are every bit as natural as masturbation.

Does that mean it’s not sinful for me if I DO punch someone in the face in a fit of rage? After all, we’re all weak human beings and God understands that some of us need to indulge our temper sometimes. If I have a shorter and worse temper than others, there’s nothing wrong with it.

God’s law constantly calls us to rise above our human weakness, and do more and better than what is merely ‘natural’ for us.

God doesn’t change, human sexuality certainly hasn’t changed since the dawn of time - why on earth would His law about it change? Adultery was wrong from the beginning, so was homosexuality, so was fornication, SO WAS MASTURBATION. None of these moral laws are up for debate.

Your priest, I am sure, is as honest and holy as the day is long. He can still be, and is in this case, misinformed. I think the writers of the CCC knew what they were doing when they wrote the section on masturbation that makes clear that in all circumstances it is a grave sin. And all the other holy and honest priests who have been quoted for you know what they’re on about as well.

 

[AlegreFe]

It may a natural act for me to punch people in the face when I’m angry with them. Anger and violence are every bit as natural as masturbation.

But that’s just it, it’s NOT natural. Scroll up and read some of these posts and how most here will agree that masturbation is NOT natural.

 

[bella5110]

Don’t worry bella5110, I am not condemning you. I only want to inform you with the facts because I care and I do not wish for this “misinformation” that your priest gave you to be spread to anyone else. The devil is the one that is spreading this lie and the devil is getting a kick out of all of this. He loves that we are committing these sins of the flesh. Don’t let yourself be another one of his victims. I know you said that you do not do this but if you inform someone else that it is not a sin you are participating in their sin also and that is not good.

This is not something I would even are to talk about with others…

He who cast the first stone…

 

[bella5110]

But that’s just it, it’s NOT natural. Scroll up and read some of these posts and how most here will agree that masturbation is NOT natural.

Like I said, I don’t think one burns in Hell for eternity from this…the whole world is going to Hell then. I have a more real life attitude toward things in this world. No one is perfect, so stop acting as if you all lead perfect lives here.
And masturbation is NOT a mortal sin when one is celibate and in private WITHOUT porn etc…I have called three people to back me up. One wants to know if you know that MURDER is a mortal sin…hardly to compare it to masturbation. I am done with this thread…my priest told me it isn’t considered a sin anymore as have two others and one lay person, therefore I believe them. And why make a big deal out of it when it doesn’t even apply to me?
God is my judge, He is all I have to answer to. I do not think He would turn away a 14 year old boy, whom I think is natural during puberty to experiment, If this boy should die, so you all need to examine your own consciences please…