Eh question

[AlegreFe]

Yes corvidae, I believe this is what you´re trying to do here. And I´m very grateful to you and the others on this thread who are also doing a great job on this :yup: .Obviously is not working too well for everyone on this thread, but I for one have learned tremendously here and thank you all very much for spreading the TEACHINGS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH.
I will keep everyone on this thread on my prayers tonight. God Bless

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i85/Alegre-Fe/Emoticons/CryHappytear.gif Aw, thanks for having us in your prayers. I will pray for you too. http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i85/Alegre-Fe/Emoticons/Pray.gif

And you’re right, that is all we’re trying to do here. But that is about the only thing we can do. We can’t change anyone’s heart. Only God can do that. We can pray for those whose hearts we cannot change. http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i85/Alegre-Fe/Emoticons/Pray.gif

 

[bella5110]

Bella what does it mean when the CCC states:MORAL Cupability? What does it mean to make equitable judgement about ones MORAL responibility?

Bella what does it mean to be intrinsically
and gravely disordered action??

I have one last question for you: I know that this thread has nothing to do with what I’m going to ask you. However, I just wondering, because I believe it would help prove a point.

So with that being said: Do you believe that homosexual acts are a mortal sin???

Like I said, worry about your own kids and their hang-ups and their fear they will burn in hell. I will not comment about homosexuality and what I meant. It;s like an apple and a bananna, Oh most Holier than thou.:bowdown:

 

[mercygate]

Masturbation is not a Mortal sin. what is it you don’t understand?? I am bored with this thread goodbye…

Masturbation, taken in itself IS objectively grave matter.

It becomes less than mortal sin only when certain mitigations are in place, such as ignorance of the fact (which Paul tells us is inexcusable because the created world certainly shows even to barbarians what is good and what is not), mental frailty or strength of habit.

 

[bella5110]

:nope:

Masturbation, taken in itself IS objectively grave matter.

It becomes less than mortal sin only when certain mitigations are in place, such as ignorance of the fact (which Paul tells us is inexcusable because the created world certainly shows even to barbarians what is good and what is not), mental frailty or strength of habit.

:nope:

 

[fix]

Corvidae, I really don’t think people are condemning me for what my thoughts are. I don’t take things personal. It’s ok.
Think about it. Perhaps you are right and I have a liberal priest whom I adore. What I think my priest meant was that to seperate a man who remained celibate for awhile, had an urge and masturbated, vs.Hitler who we know was a madman, will Our Lord have time for pettiness? Or have time to cast out evil as it is. They are not the same sin. Masturbation must then be a venial sin. It is not mortal. Make sense? Because I’d hate to see all teenagers going to Hell…

The problem is the measure of holiness is not simply to be better than Hitler. That is not the standard. In fact, that reasoning is partly why so many of us fail to properly form our consciences.

 

[mercygate]

. . . **the measure of holiness is not simply to be better than Hitler. **

 

[bella5110]

The problem is the measure of holiness is not simply to be better than Hitler. That is not the standard. In fact, that reasoning is partly why so many of us fail to properly form our consciences.

Not better than Hitler? Are you saying it is ok to be equal and still remain Holy??

 

[blessedtoo]

bella5110,
Either this is an absolute refusal to see and accept the truth or you are purposely trying to provoke the very sincere posters here. Either way, your concerns have been more than addressed. The sin of masturbation is not your issue anymore: perhaps the bigger issue is pride and the refusal to accept and share the truth with your children.

 

[corvidae]

Not better than Hitler? Are you saying it is ok to be equal and still remain Holy??

I am pretty sure that he or she is saying that Hitler is too low of a standard to apply. I am pretty sure he or she is saying that we not only need to be better than Hitler, but much better than Hitler.

Also, the only reason we can possibly be Holy is because God is Holy.

If it were not for the grace of God, I would undoubtedly be worse than Hitler. In the old saying, “There but for the grace of God go I.”

A lone Raven

 

[fix]

Not better than Hitler? Are you saying it is ok to be equal and still remain Holy??

Nope. I am saying our obligation is to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect. Also, if a priest gave me advice that contradicted a higher authority I would seek clarification from the proper authority. IOW, if a priest told me it was morally acceptable to cheat on my wife I would ignore him and seek out the truth from his superior.

As has been pointed out to me our obligation is to our pastor, bishop, and pope. If a lower authority contradicts a higher authority we must obey the higher authority.

Self abuse is objectively a grave sin. How culpable one is before God is another matter, but I have seen no proof that it should be viewed a mostly venial.

 

[Mommyof02green]

Like I said, worry about your own kids and their hang-ups and their fear they will burn in hell.

My kids do NOT fear or think they will burn in hell. They are 4 and 5 year-old.
Right now my kids are working on these following commandments:

1st Commandment: I am the Lord your God, you shall not have strange God’s before me.
We work on this commandment, by praying to God for the things we are thankful for, by praying to God for the things we are in need of, by praying to God because we are scared, happy, sad, angry, etc.

A few months ago, there was a bad thunderstorm here. My kids were scared as any 4 and 5 year-old would be. So I lead them into prayer. I started to the pray by saying “God we are scared right now and we know that you are here with us to keep us safe. We ask that you do keep us safe, and please keep the follow people that we love safe: (Then told my kids to say the names of the people they wanted to keep safe from the storm.) My son, then said: God, keep Jesus safe from the storm. My daughter said: Don’t forget Jesus’ Mommy Mary, God keep Mary safe too.

They then looked at me and said, “Is that okay Mommy? Are we doing it right?” I said “yep that just right! Is there anybody else that you want God to keep safe from the storm? They went on listing, aunts, uncles, grandparents, daddy, me, the dog, etc.

What struck me was the first name out of my children’s mouth was Jesus. That to me meant that my children do put God first in their lives. After we said our prayer the storm immediately passed. I of course was in aw and was reminded of the fact that I don’t always put God first like I should.

3rd Commandment: Remember to keep holy the Lord’s Day.
We go to Mass every Sunday and holy day of obligation. My Children know that we go to Mass because that is what God wants us to do. God wants us to “worship” HIM. My 4 and 5 year-old know that when the bells ring during Mass the bread and wine become the body and blood of Jesus Christ.

My 4 year-old ask, “Why do we eat Jesus body and blood?” I told her “because the in the Bible that is what Jesus told us to do, and I read the Bible passage to her.” She then asked “But why did he say it?” I at that time couldn’t think of an answer, so I sent her across the room to go ask Father. (We happen to be at church). I watch my daughter walked up to Father and ask Father the same questions she asked me. I saw Fr. Face have a puzzling look, however he did talk to her. What he exactly told her, I don’t know.

However, I can tell you my daughter has never question “why” since then. She still knows that the host is Jesus’ body and the wine is His blood. She from time to time will lean over and whisper in my ear “Mom, that’s Jesus body pointing to the host, or Mom, that’s Jesus’ blood pointing to the chalices”
more next post

 

[Mommyof02green]

continue from last post
4th Commandment: Honor our father and mother.
My kids are learning what that means.

8th Commandment: You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
My kids are learning that you should always tell the truth….no matter what.

They know also that stealing (7th commandment) is wrong. They know also that killing (5th commandment) is wrong. They know that using the name of God in a bad way (2nd commandment) is wrong. They are learning to be thankful for what they have (10th commandment).

As for the 6th and 9th commandments: Well, the only thing they know is that a man and women are get married FIRST before they have children. They know that for a man and women to share a bedroom and a bed they have to be married. They know that men can only marry women. They know that women can only marry men. They also know that they cannot marry any of their relatives…and they know that NO ONE can TOUCH their private parts and they know what are private parts on a girl and what are private parts on a boy.

They do not know what masturbation is. They do not know what sex is. They are 4 and 5 year-old. However, when the time comes (9 year-old and up). We will have those talks with them.

My children know that people make mistakes and sometimes do things they aren’t suppose too. They know that when you do something wrong to God you go to confession. They come to confession with hubby and I. They sit in the pew while we wait in line. After we come out we sit with them. They will ask what prayers do we have to say. My hubby and I tell them and they sometimes ask if they can pray with us. We of course tell them yes.

A few weeks ago when we went to confession there were other children there. (They were in line to receive the sacrament). My son watched them stand in line and watch them go into the confessional. He then turned to me and said “Mom, I didn’t know that kids could go to confession too”. I then told him “yes, kids can go to confession, they can go to tell God they are sorry for the things they do wrong.” He then turn to me and said, “Can I go today too?” I told him that he would have to wait a few more years until he was 7. He said, “Well I’m 5” then counting with his fingers he said “6…7… That’s 2 more years: YEAH to more years then I can go to confession too.” He was grinning ear to ear, about the idea of going to confession. I just hope that his eagerness to go to confession will be there when he is 7.

Oh most Holier than thou.:bowdown:

If this is to suggest that I believe that I’m holier then you then you are WRONG. I already told you that I am not a holy woman. I already told you that I’m a sinner and that I am not perfect. There are many things that I do wrong daily. I don’t pretend to be more then what I am. This thread is about masturbation and masturbation only.

My children know that if they love JESUS and follow HIS commandment they will be heaven with JESUS. They know that people sometimes don’t follow the HIS commandments like they should. However, because of JESUS love, they know they can go to God and tell God they are sorry, and that God will forgive them. They know that after telling God they are sorry they have to do their very best NOT to the SAME bad thing again. If they do the SAME bad thing again, they know to go back to God and tell Him “I’ve done my very best not to this bad thing, but it happen again God. I’m sorry.” After that they are to try and try and try again. They know that as long as they do their very best to always do Good and are truly sorry for the bad things they do, and tell God they are sorry, God will forgive them and they will get to be in Heaven with HIM.

I know that most of this response is not related to the thread. However, I will not just sit by and listen to people make clams about my children fears when they do not know me and certainly do not know my children. I’m PROUD of my children faith and love for God. Maybe a little to proud of my children… After all pride is one of the DEADLY SINS: Something I’m working on

 

[MilesXpisti]

The Church does not expect blind, servile obedience. She offers us every opportunity to form our consciences according to her wisdom. It is not a matter of bashing a herd of truculent malcontents into submission.

Apologies…I’ve been away for a while and felt compelled to reply. In the climate of the Church as it is today, when heterodoxy and open assent to heresy so often go unchallenged, we’re to rely on members of the Church to form their consciences based on the teaching of the Church and not the secular humanist agenda? I’m sorry, but when the moneychangers turned the Temple in a den of thieves, was Christ’s reaction to wring his hands and politely ask them to amend their ways?

 

[bella5110]

continue from last post
4th Commandment: Honor our father and mother.
My kids are learning what that means.

8th Commandment: You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
My kids are learning that you should always tell the truth….no matter what.

They know also that stealing (7th commandment) is wrong. They know also that killing (5th commandment) is wrong. They know that using the name of God in a bad way (2nd commandment) is wrong. They are learning to be thankful for what they have (10th commandment).

As for the 6th and 9th commandments: Well, the only thing they know is that a man and women are get married FIRST before they have children. They know that for a man and women to share a bedroom and a bed they have to be married. They know that men can only marry women. They know that women can only marry men. They also know that they cannot marry any of their relatives…and they know that NO ONE can TOUCH their private parts and they know what are private parts on a girl and what are private parts on a boy.

They do not know what masturbation is. They do not know what sex is. They are 4 and 5 year-old. However, when the time comes (9 year-old and up). We will have those talks with them.

My children know that people make mistakes and sometimes do things they aren’t suppose too. They know that when you do something wrong to God you go to confession. They come to confession with hubby and I. They sit in the pew while we wait in line. After we come out we sit with them. They will ask what prayers do we have to say. My hubby and I tell them and they sometimes ask if they can pray with us. We of course tell them yes.

A few weeks ago when we went to confession there were other children there. (They were in line to receive the sacrament). My son watched them stand in line and watch them go into the confessional. He then turned to me and said “Mom, I didn’t know that kids could go to confession too”. I then told him “yes, kids can go to confession, they can go to tell God they are sorry for the things they do wrong.” He then turn to me and said, “Can I go today too?” I told him that he would have to wait a few more years until he was 7. He said, “Well I’m 5” then counting with his fingers he said “6…7… That’s 2 more years: YEAH to more years then I can go to confession too.” He was grinning ear to ear, about the idea of going to confession. I just hope that his eagerness to go to confession will be there when he is 7. If this is to suggest that I believe that I’m holier then you then you are WRONG. I already told you that I am not a holy woman. I already told you that I’m a sinner and that I am not perfect. There are many things that I do wrong daily. I don’t pretend to be more then what I am. This thread is about masturbation and masturbation only.

My children know that if they love JESUS and follow HIS commandment they will be heaven with JESUS. They know that people sometimes don’t follow the HIS commandments like they should. However, because of JESUS love, they know they can go to God and tell God they are sorry, and that God will forgive them. They know that after telling God they are sorry they have to do their very best NOT to the SAME bad thing again. If they do the SAME bad thing again, they know to go back to God and tell Him “I’ve done my very best not to this bad thing, but it happen again God. I’m sorry.” After that they are to try and try and try again. They know that as long as they do their very best to always do Good and are truly sorry for the bad things they do, and tell God they are sorry, God will forgive them and they will get to be in Heaven with HIM.

I know that most of this response is not related to the thread. However, I will not just sit by and listen to people make clams about my children fears when they do not know me and certainly do not know my children. I’m PROUD of my children faith and love for God. Maybe a little to proud of my children… After all pride is one of the DEADLY SINS: Something I’m working on

Oh please…

 

[Mommyof02green]

Oh please…

:yup: What I wrote is the truth, that is what has happen.

Of course, I didn’t write or post ALL the things that have gone wrong.

I don’t need to post my sins here on the forum and I don’t need to post my children’s sins here on the forum. Those are between God and us.

My children know that to get to heaven they have to LOVE God and follow HIS commandments.:bible1:

My children know that time-to-time they will fail. We all fail to keep the commandments. However with True repentance, and True will and desire to Sin NO more, God will forgive us and we can still get to Heaven. :bible1:

Does that mean we are perfect? NO of course not.

However, every day I do try to do what is right and try to live by God commandments. Some days I try harder then others. Some days I really truly care, other days I don’t. I know my shortcomings. I just don’t ways post them or share with others.

However, everyday, I examine my conscience and ask God to forgive me for what I have done and what I have failed to do. I do my best to make amends to the people I have hurt. I take it all a day at a time.

 

[corvidae]

It is ok Mommy of 2

I think you had a great witness and a great testimony.
It was not a look at me, look how holy I am kind of one.

The fact that some will disregard it out of hand is fine, it is expected, but do not worry, not all of us will do that.

I personally think it was a good response to someone who said that your children are probably living in extreme fear of hell.

It doesn’t sound like fear at all.

I will pray for you and your children.

A lone Raven

 

[BlestOne]

My boys do follow the proper teachings of the church. Because you didn’ like what my priest said, you are very defensive…maybe you really don’t know the answer and assume everything is a sin. I can tell just the type of religious fanatic you are, and those are the worse kinds. I’d not want you near my boys, the’yd be scared to death of burning in hell. good luck.

Bella…

I never said your boys don’t follow the proper teachings…what I said was

BlestOne:

I am glad your boys have an “amazing” life…just think how much more amazing it could be if they knew and followed the proper teachings of the Church!

which is a direct reflection on what you believe, and as the primary teacher, have passed on to your sons.

You are taking many things out of context, which would lead one to believe that you are being defensive. No, I do not like what your priests have said, because I know it to be wrong. I am very sorry that they have taught incorrectly! That doesn’t mean that I think everything is a sin, or that I am a religious “fanatic” it means that I have taken the time to look up the official teachings and found them in direct conflict with what you were told.

It is fine that you would not want your boys around me, that is the right of a parent, but if your reasoning is that I would scare them about going to hell…I must remind you that fear is not always a bad thing. Fear is what keeps us from walking out into traffic, fear of punishment kept me from alot of sin when I was a teen… these are not bad things. Before I understood the why’s of sin, the fear keeping me from committing them was a good thing.

You know Bella, you are coming off sounding rather prideful. Whether you are or not, is a matter between you and God, but that does not stop me from telling you as a Christian, that you may want to examine this. After all, God does commission us to point these things out in love to our fellow brethern. Many of us here have tried to point out different things to you, not out of hatred or spite, but out of genuine Christian love. Please accept them in the light they were given. Replying with comments like not to talk to you because you go to confession more often, or calling people fanatics or ignorant, is not showing that you understand that we are only trying to help you and point out that you were given incorrect information.

Mommy of 2…That was beautiful!

 

[Mommyof02green]

Corvidae-
It’s okay really. I’m just a proud Mom! I’m proud of my children and the faith and love that they have for God. I’m proud of the understanding they have at such a young age. I’m proud, because I know they learned it from me. Of course, I admit that at times I may be a little too proud and my pride does cross over to that Deadly Sin of Pride. Like, I said it’s something I’m working on.

However, I can rest assure that I’m not the only proud Mom on this thread.

My boys confess their sins they go to church. They have an amazing life.

My boys do follow the proper teachings of the church.

 

[Mommyof02green]

Mommy of 2…That was beautiful!

Thanks.
God Bless,

M2G

 

[Missa_Solemnis]

Why doesnt bella just go to the ask an apologist forum right now and find out.

I mean she might be able to refuse us humble posters…but maybe the great and mighty Fr. Vincet Serpa crusher of heretics extraordinarre can help us out here