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kentuckyliz
Guest
Before the end comes, the gospel will be preached to every creature.
So, have a little chat with your pets. :whacky:
So, have a little chat with your pets. :whacky:
- Status
It’s not.
What you are doing is trying to fix America into the whore today. Think of the countries in this world 100 years ago and today, many are different and what would these countries be like in 100 years from now, many will be different.
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livingwordunity
Guest
But did so-called “abortion rights” and so-called same-sex “marriage” laws exist 100 years ago? Did the nuclear bomb, a weapon that can destroy the whole world, exist 100 years ago? These things are unprecedented in human history. Abortion always existed but never was it called a “right” and aggressively promoted on a global scale until just recently. The world has been advancing toward evil by great leaps and bounds recently with America leading the way. Only God knows when the final year and last days will be, but my guess is we are probably at least about 75-80% of the way there.
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livingwordunity
Guest
And oh, by the way, America and the UN are currently trying to pick a fight with Russia because Russia won’t go along with the gay agenda. This could easily escalate into a nuclear WWIII, but the ones who want to force everyone to praise sodomy at all costs don’t seem to care if the world gets destroyed by fire in the process.
O
onemangang
Guest
I find it odd that, on this very site, you have some of today’s leading scholars, and apologist, who put out teaching tracts, yet Catholics, will go out of there way to push a dispensational fundamentalist view of end times.
Why?
Here is what Catholic Answers has to say about the Whore and who she is
Hint, it’s not America!
catholic.com/tracts/hunting-the-whore-of-babylon
catholic.com/tracts/the-whore-of-babylon
Why?
Here is what Catholic Answers has to say about the Whore and who she is
Hint, it’s not America!
catholic.com/tracts/hunting-the-whore-of-babylon
catholic.com/tracts/the-whore-of-babylon
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mikekle
Guest
Show me ANY other country that fits so perfectly to these descriptions?
Another thing, I do admit that it is possible the bible is referring to a country that does not exist yet, but it is hard to imagine another country, that would be sooo close in all these details to the US, will come to fruition by the end times. Plus, if you look at the specific details laid out in these biblical ‘hints’, you will see they are referring to our modern society, like when they mention this country making many other countries rich due to its power and influence, also, it refers to a nation with many sea ports to ship and receive goods all over the world, this is something that is common in modern times, it was not common in past times though, at least not to the extent it is today, and in the far future, it may be something completely different…So, it is my opinion, these are referring to the US.
I think it would help if I posted another 50 of these biblical hints, as this would give people a chance to compare more to current nations. I will do this tomorrow, as I am getting tired tonight.
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mikekle
Guest
Not everything in the bible is a metaphor, or symbolic of something else LOL I get tired of hearing explanations for things brought up, by simply saying, ‘Oh, it wasnt meant to be taken literally, it reallly means this or that’
Im sorry, but using that kind of logic, one could interpret the bible in any way, as long as it is convenient to their particular beliefs, and sort of holds water. Using this kind of logic, how do we even know people are judged after death, how do we know people go to heaven or hell…maybe heaven and hell are symbolic of 2 states of mind? Maybe Gods judgement is a metaphor? See where Im going with this?
Another thing, those 2 articles try to explain how the catholic church is not the whore of babylon…I have never believed that and never will, the whore of babylon IS A NATION, a leading power at that…it clearly says this, so Im not sure how anyone could interpret it to mean the church?
Im going to post 50 more of the biblical hints tomorrow, I look forward to debating how these can seen as ANYTHING BESIDES the US…Some of them could even be recognized by a 5 yr old as being the US that is being talked about! LOL
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Megan7
Guest
Thanks for sharing.
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livingwordunity
Guest
The only thing I know about Protestant End Times theology is that some Christian fundamentalists say that the Whore of Babylon is the Catholic Church. And that’s all that those Catholic Answers tracts argue against. Protestants didn’t invent the concept of Jesus’ Second Coming and the events that precede it. Besides Jesus, the apostles, and the prophets of the Old Testament telling us about it in the Holy Bible, it’s actually something that we hear about at every Catholic Mass. The priest mentions it in the liturgical prayers that he offers, and we profess our belief in this in the Creed.
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mikekle
Guest
- Babylon would be the youngest and greatest of the end time nations (Jer 50:12).
- Babylon would the QUEEN AMONG THE NATIONS (Isa 47:5,7; Rev 18:7).
- Babylon would be the most powerful nation in the world (Isa 47, Jer 50, 51, Rev 18).
- Babylon would be the HAMMER OF THE WHOLE EARTH (Jer 50:23; Rev 18:23).
- Babylon is called a lady, and has the symbol of the Lady (Isa 47:7-9).
- Babylon would be the praise of the WHOLE EARTH (Jer 51:41).
- Babylon is center of world trade (Jer 51:44; Rev 17:18; 18:19).
- Babylon would grow to be the richest nation in the world (Rev 18:3, 7, 19, 23).
- All nations that traded with Babylon would grow rich (Rev 18:3).
- The merchants of Babylon were the GREAT MEN OF THE EARTH (Rev 18:23).
- Babylon is a huge nation, with lands, cities, and great wealth (implied throughout).
- Babylon is nation “peeled”, or timbered, a land of open fields (Isa 18:2).
- Babylon is land quartered by mighty rivers (Isa 18:2).
- Babylon is a land that is measured out, and populated throughout (Isa 18:2).
- Babylon destroys her own land, with pollution and waste (Isa 14:20, 18:2, 7).
- Babylon is a land rich in mineral wealth (Jer 51:13).
- Babylon is a the leading agricultural nation of the world (Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).
- Babylon is the leading exporting nation in the world (Jer 51:13; Rev 18).
- Babylon is the leading importing nation of the entire world.(Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).
- Babylon is a nation filled with warehouses and granaries (Jer 50:26).
- Babylon is the leading INDUSTRIAL NATION OF THE WORLD (Isa 13, 47, Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).
- Babylon is noted for her horses (Jer 50:37).
- Babylon is noted for her cattle, sheep and other livestock (Jer 50:26, 27; Rev 18:13).
- Babylon is noted for her fine flour and mill operations (Rev 18:13).
- Babylon is a nation of farmers and harvests huge crops (Jer 50:16, 26, 27).
- Babylon is a huge exporter of MUSIC (Rev 18:22).
- Babylon’s musicians are known around the world (Rev 18:22)
- Babylon has a huge aviation program (Isa 14:13-14; Jer 51:53; Hab 1:6-10).
- Babylon’s skies are filled with the whisper of aircraft wings (Isa 18:1; Jer 51:53).
- Babylon has a huge space industry, has “mounted up to the heavens” (Jer 51:53).
- Babylon fortifies her skies with a huge military aviation program (Jer 51:53).
- Babylon is portrayed as a leading in high tech weapons and abilities (Jer 51:53; Hab 1:6-10; implied throughout).
- Babylon is a nation filled with warm water seaports (Rev 18:17-19).
- Babylon is a coastal nation and sits upon MANY WATERS (Jer 51:13).
- Babylon trades with all who have ships in the sea year round (Rev 18:17-18).
- Babylon is nation filled with a “mingled” people (Jer 50:37).
- Babylon is a SINGULAR NATION founded upon OUT OF MANY, ONE (Isa 13, 47, Jer 50, 51, Hab 1).
- Babylon is a REPUBLIC or a DEMOCRACY, it is ruled by many counsels (Isa 47:13).
- Babylon’s governmental system breaks down (Isa 47:13).
- Babylon is bogged down with deliberations and cannot govern properly (Isa 47:13).
- Babylon’s leaders use astrology, seers and mystics for guidance (Isa 47:13; Rev 18:2).
- Babylon labored in the occult from her very inception (Isa 47:12).
- Babylon falls to the occult just before her end by nuclear fire (Rev 18:2)
- Babylon was born as a CHRISTIAN NATION (Jer 50:12).
- Babylon turns upon its heritage and destroys it all in the end (Jer 50:11).
- Babylon’s Christian leaders lead their flock astray in prophecy and salvation (Jer 50:6; implied Rev 18:2).
- Babylon’s Christian leaders are “strangers” in the Lord Houses of Worship (Jer 51:51).
- The people of Babylon are deep into astrology and spiritism (Isa 47:12; Rev 18:2).
- Babylon becomes the home of all antichrist religions in the world (Rev 18:2).
- Babylon is a nation of religious confusion (Isa 47:12-13).
- Babylon turns upon its own people and imprisons and slays them by millions (Jer 50:7,33; 51:35; 39; Dan 7:25; Rev 13:7; 17:6; 18:24).
- Babylon sets of detention centers for Jews and Christians and rounds them up for extermination (Jer 50:7, 33; 51:35, 49; Rev 17:6; 18:24).
- Babylon has a mother nation that remains in existence from her birth to death (Jer 50: 12).
- The mother of Babylon has the symbol of the LION (Dan7:4; Eze 38:13; Jer 51:38; Psalms 17:12).
- The mother of Babylon will rule over her daughter her entire life (Dan 7:4; Jer 50:12).
- The mother of Babylon will be a state of major decline as the end nears (Jer 50:12).
- Babylon is considered to be a lion’s whelp (Eze 38:13; Jer 51:38).
- Babylon will have the symbol of the EAGLE and builds her nest in the stars (Dan 7:4 EAGLE WINGS; Isa 14:13-14; Jer 51:53).
- Babylon turns totally antichrist and is the leading antichrist power at the end (Rev 18:2; Isa 14:4-6).
- THE KING OF BABYLON is called LUCIFER, the ANTICHRIST (Isa 14:4-6).
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mikekle
Guest
.
- The King of Babylon will rule from THE GREAT CITY BABYLON (Isa 14:4-6; Rev 17: 18).
- A world government entity will rise up to rule the world from BABYLON THE CITY (Isa 14; Hab 2, Rev 13, 17, 18).
- This world entity will be a diverse entity, different than all other ruling bodies of the world (Dan 7:7, 23).
- This entity will be a TREATY POWER ENTITY (Dan 7:7, 23 DIVERSE).
- This entity will rise up and use the military power of Babylon the nation to RULE THE WORLD (Isa 14:4-6; Hab 1 & 2, Rev 13, 17).
- Babylon is a huge producer and exporter of automobiles (Jer 50:37; Rev 18:13).
- Babylon is a nation of CRAFTSMEN, experts in their trade (Jer 50, 51, Rev 18:22).
- Babylon is noted for her jewelry of gold and silver (Rev 18:22).
- Babylon is a huge importer and exporter of spices (Rev 18:13).
- Babylon is a huge exporter of fine marble products (Rev 18:22).
- Babylon is noted for her iron and steel production (Rev 18:12).
- Babylon has huge corporations that have bases around the world (Rev 18:23, implied throughout)
- Babylon is a nation of higher education and learning (Isa 47:10, implied throughout).
- Babylon is a nation with a GREAT VOICE in world affairs (Jer 51:55)
- Babylon is a VIRGIN NATION, untouched by major war (Isa 47:1).
- Babylon has a vast military machine (Jer 50:36; 51:30; Hab 1 & 2, Rev 13:4).
- Babylon will be instrumental in the setting up of Israel in the Middle East, and is the home of God’s people (Jer 50:47; 51:45).
- Babylon will have a major enemy to her north (Jer 50:3, 9, 41).
- Babylon’s enemy will lie on the opposite side of the world, over the poles (Isa 13:5)
- The enemy of Babylon will be a FEDERAL OF NATIONS (Jer 50:9).
- The enemy of Babylon will be largely Moslem in make-up (Jer 50:17; Rev 17:16; Psalms 83:5-12).
- The enemy of Babylon will have nuclear missiles capable of reaching Babylon (Jer 50:9, 14,; Rev 18:8, 18).
- The enemy of Babylon will be noted for her cruelty (Isa 13, 14, Jer 50, 51, Rev 17, 18).
- The enemy of Babylon will also have a huge aviation military machine (Jer 50:9, 14, Rev 18:8, 18 implied throughout).
- The enemy of Babylon will come into Babylon unnoticed (Isa 47:11, Jer 50:24; 51:2, 14).
- Babylon will be filled with her enemies brought in under the guise of peace (Dan 11:21).
- Babylon will have all of her borders cut off, and there will be no way of
- Babylon will be destroyed by nuclear fire (Implied throughout)
- Babylon is land vast land with huge cities, towns and villages throughout (Implied throughout).
- Babylon will have been a huge missionary nation for Jesus Christ (Jer 50:11; 51:7).
- Babylon would be a home to multitudes of Jews who leave (Jer 50:4-6, 8; 51:6, 45)
- The people of Babylon would not know their true identity (Jer 50:6, implied throughout).
- The people of Babylon would think they are God’s elect and eternal (Isa 47:7-8, Rev 18:7).
- The people of Babylon would enjoy the highest standard of living in the world (Rev 18:7).
- The people of Babylon would grow mad upon their idols (Jer 50:2, 38; Hab 2:18).
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onemangang
Guest
Wow, did you read the tracts?
They were not ONLY about the Catholic Church not being the whore, the beast or the Harlot, it also points to who WAS the whore of babylon, who WAS the Harlot.
They point to ancient Pagan Rome and Apostate. Isreal?
They do not suggest that it’s COULD BE the U.S, but rather who they WERE, past tense!
I am fully aware that there will be a second coming, and I am also aware that much of the musing of the futurist, is over stuff that already has come to past!
If you are quoting Revelation about future stuff to entail, then you may want to start somewhere around Revelation Chapter 20, because before that, you will be speaking of events that already Came to pass!
I not only follow the creed, but follow that we are in the Millenial Rein of Christ, through His Church.
The Thousand Years
Revelation 20 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding in his hand the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain. 2 And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, 3 and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, that he should deceive the nations no more, **till the thousand years were ended.[a] After that he must be loosed for a little while.
Did Christ passion, death and Resurrection bind Satan?
If so, are we in the age where Satan is bound now ie: the millennium?
4 Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom judgment was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony to Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. **They came to life, and reigned with Christ a thousand years. **5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and they shall reign with him a thousand years.
Are those who have died in Christ, reigning with Christ now ie: the Saints in the Church Triumphant?
Or is that a future thing?
Do you believe that we are in the Millenial reign of Christ ( AKA The Church Age) or is that a future thing?
God bless!
O
onemangang
Guest
Why do you assume I think things are a metaphor or symbolic, I do not take that view, as a matter of fact I take the events that TOOK place in Revelation to be fulfilled Literally. I bet you take much more of Revelation to be symbolic, of metaphorical than I do, starting with Revelation Chapter one.
This is a great strawman argument you are having with yourself
You only assume to know my views, news flash, you don’t. I don’t ascribe to symbolic or metophorical but literal, and I bet if we explored Revelation, you would find that you take much less of Revelation literal than I do, starting with Chapter 1I won’t be so presumptuous to say what you believe, because I can not know, but I can gather much from your past few postings that you take much less literally in Revelation, than I do
Yes, I understand that they are combating why the Catholic Church is not the Whore of Babylon, but they also give explainations of who WAS (PAST TENSE) being referred to, and guess what, it wasn’t the U.S
I look forward to watching you posit, that you have more insight than the Scholars and Apologist, that contribute to this forum
Hey, Tim Lahaye called, and he is looking for his escatology back! High Ooooo!
Ok sorry, bad joke, anyways I’m moving and won’t be able to continue in this thread after March 19th, till Mid April. Anyways Cheers!
God bless!
O
Oska2
Guest
vague “lawless one” or “man of lawlessness,” the details of which even Paul didn’t have).
Paul in 2Thess:2:3: states very clearly that; "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
He continues and says the man of sin, 2Thess:2:4: “opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God”.
- There will be a universal falling away from the true faith
- A religious system will emerge with a worldwide leader who will exalt himself and demand to be worshiped.
- The man of sin will sit in the temple of God (or the holy place of worship)
When we see people moving away from Christ to secularism, then we know its the start of falling away.
When we see all religions in the world join hands to form a common faith, we realize, its not far from having a false Christ.
When we see the world united under one leadership, we realize that the same one world leader will demand worship at some time.
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mikekle
Guest
I was not referring to you, sorry if I gave that impression, I was mainly referring to all the posters (not sure on the exact names) that like to explain things by using the metaphor or symbolic excuse for almost anything and everything that is asked aboutWhy do you assume I think things are a metaphor or symbolic, I do not take that view, as a matter of fact I take the events that TOOK place in Revelation to be fulfilled Literally. I bet you take much more of Revelation to be symbolic, of metaphorical than I do, starting with Revelation Chapter one.
This is a great strawman argument you are having with yourself
I won’t be so presumptuous to say what you believe, because I can not know, but I can gather much from your past few postings that you take much less literally in Revelation, than I do
Yes, I understand that they are combating why the Catholic Church is not the Whore of Babylon, but they also give explainations of who WAS (PAST TENSE) being referred to, and guess what, it wasn’t the U.S
I look forward to watching you posit, that you have more insight than the Scholars and Apologist, that contribute to this forum
Hey, Tim Lahaye called, and he is looking for his escatology back! High Ooooo!
Ok sorry, bad joke, anyways I’m moving and won’t be able to continue in this thread after March 19th, till Mid April. Anyways Cheers!
God bless!
M
mikekle
Guest
How could it talking about ancient times when some of the tracts mention air travel?
I do not believe all this has already happened, I think we would have known of Jesus second coming if it had happened in the past, plus all that is said to lead up to his coming.
J
jeffrey_erwin
Guest
- De medietate lunae. John Paul I.
- De labore solis. John Paul II
- Gloria olivae. Benedict XVI
- In psecutione. extre-
ma S.R.E. sedebit. Francis I - Petrus Romanus, qui
pascet oves in mul-
tis tribulationibus:
quibus transactis ci-
vitas septicollis di-
ruetur, & Judex tre
medus judicabit po
pulum suum. Finis. Peter I
B
Brotherchuckles
Guest
If you have read the Left Behind Novels, you will really enjoy reading this from the Catholic perspective. I am still reading it and I am glued to it.
Full text of “The End Of This Present World And The Mysteries Of The Life To Come”
THE END OF THE PRESENT WORLD
AND
THE MYSTERIES OF THE FUTURE LIFE
by
FATHER C.-M.-A. ARMINJON
This book:
Charles
PS: It is free and it can be found doing a web search. Enjoy!
Full text of “The End Of This Present World And The Mysteries Of The Life To Come”
THE END OF THE PRESENT WORLD
AND
THE MYSTERIES OF THE FUTURE LIFE
by
FATHER C.-M.-A. ARMINJON
This book:
- was written over a century ago, yet was surely designed by
Divine Providence especially for our day. - was immediately and explosively influential when first
published in France in 1881. - was acknowledged by St. Theresa of Lisieux in her writings as
possibly the single most important inspiration for the
dedication of her life to the path which led to her
becoming, in the words of Pope St. Pius X, “the greatest
saint of modern times.”
Charles
PS: It is free and it can be found doing a web search. Enjoy!
H
HandyAndy
Guest
Have to agree I’m afraid.
In the writings of Catalina Riva’s she also asks that we pray for America and Brazil.
Jesus says in these writings that it is the arrogance of man that most offends him.
America lied to its allies in order to invade Iraq, without UN approval, under the lie of WMD’s. Not one found. The poor would pay the price with their lives.
Who was responsible for the lies and what of their debt?
The GFC was brought about by America’s greed. In the end, the Banks were bailed out and it was the poor who once again suffered. Where are the master minds and what of their debt?
The world used to see America as an inspiration to the free world. The great leaders of the past have lost their voice. “In God we trust”. Where?..and only when it suits.
The world just see’s arrogance, extravagance and a self serving governance. It will be her arrogance and her belief in military superiority that will see her down fall. Their pride as a nation has turned into arrogance. It is such a shame for such a great nation.
H
HandyAndy
Guest
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