End Times: "Left Behind" and other misguided conceptions

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After the first volume, the plots cleave to an instantly predictable structure: The previous book’s culminating disaster is summarized. The main characters spend approximately four hundred pages dashing about the globe looking for each other and earnestly discussing Revelation . Another seal is broken , a new disaster vents itself, and the wheels are in motion for the next volume. No one is able to influence the course of events or do much but sit and watch those horses galloping across the sky. But it has to be that way, you see, since these characters are dwelling, not in real life, but in the fatalistic world of “Bible Prophecy.” Speaking of which, let’s move on to theology. Since the fourth century, when the expectation of Christ’s imminent return passed, the Catholic Church (and subsequently, most mainstream Protestants) has followed Jesus’ instruction that “you know not the day or the hour” and taught the fundamental truths we find in Scripture about the end of time: At some point, God will conquer evil once and for all, Jesus will return in judgement and believers, living or dead, will enter the fullness of eternal life.Following the example of St. Augustine in The City of God, the teaching Church has been cautious about interpreting the visions in Scriptural apocalyptic literature literally, and, most especially, about connecting these visions to contemporary events. Not so fundamentalists. Unpacking “Bible Prophecy” is a central occupation of Biblical literalists. And, just as any issue that comes up within the ranks of those who insist on the literal “plain meaning” of the Scriptures, they fight like banshees about just whose interpretation of the plain meaning is correct.
Dispensational Premillenarianism claims that when you do this literal interpretation, you come up with the following scenario for the endtimes: Then the Rapture will snatch up the true believers, protecting them from the wrath to come. They get that from First Thessalonians and Matthew. Seven years of really bad stuff follows. That’s the Tribulation. The general timeline comes from Daniel and the nature of the events – those wars, earthquakes, big man-faced locusts and the Antichrist – mostly from Revelation, but Ezekiel and Daniel come in handy, too. After that’s over, the Millennium will arrive, during which Jesus will physically reign over the earth. Then, after a little bit more trouble, the world will end and it’s time for everyone to go to heaven.The problems with this view, of course, are legion, beginning with the insistence that all of the apocalyptic material, including that obviously written with the travails of second-century BC Jews(Daniel) or late first-century AD Christians (Revelation) in mind, should be interpreted as a coarsely literal “prediction” of future events. Besides, it doesn’t even make sense on its own terms. In No Fear of the Storm, Tim Lahaye wrote, “The pre-Tribulation view is the most logical view of Second Coming when Scriptures are taken for their plain, literal meaning…” Really? The more you know about this view, the more absurdly strained it is in its attempts to fit wildly disparate Bible passages, all taken completely out of context, into the script. Just take the concept of the Rapture as a distinct event – such a view isn’t supported by Scripture at all, which always associates the taking up of living believers with the Second Coming of Christ. The “Pre-Trib” view, as it’s known, isn’t uncontroversial among evangelicals either, many of whom critique it for that very failure to be as “literal” as it claims. So where did this whole idea come from?The PreTribulation eschatology that’s being pushed in the Left Behind series is a recent invention. It was initially dreamed up by a 19th-century Englishman named John Nelson Darby and popularized in the United States by Cyrus Ingerson Scofield, who integrated the view into the footnotes of his immensely popular Scofield Reference Bible, first published in 1909 and still in use today.If all this isn’t enough, be warned that these books are unapologetic in their standard fundamentalist anti-Catholicism.
 
The pope is raptured, sure, but only because “He had stirred up controversy in the church with a new doctrine that seemed to coincide with the ‘heresy’ of Martin Luther than with the historic orthodox they [Catholics] were used to. “ When ace reporter Buck chats with Peter Cardinal Matthews of Cincinnati about the vanishings, the Cardinal (soon to head the Enigma Babylon One World Faith) allows as how his own sister and aunt had disappeared, but , you know, since they’d recently left the Catholic Church, he’s concluded the disappearances were punishment. We, of course, know better, since we’re informed later of the “archbishop’s attempt to explain away the doctrine of grace.” Jerry Jenkins and Tyndale Publishing claims that these books aren’t anti-Catholic, but they’re both being disingenous, if not downright dishonest. If a book works out of the assumption that following the orthodox teachings of the Catholic Church on grace and salvation leads one to eternal damnation isn’t anti-Catholic, just what is?For those doubting the strong anti-Catholic basis of these novels, just go to the bookstore and leaf through Revelation Unveiled by Tim LaHaye, published by Zondervan and marketed as the book that "lays the Scriptural foundation for Left Behind. It only takes a second to discern that LaHaye buys into and propogates every deeply anti-Catholic viewpoint ever espoused by the most virulent bigots, from Martin Luther on - yes, LaHaye explicitly identifies the Catholic Church as the Whore of Babylon. Case closed.There are, of course, Catholic apocalyptically-themed novels. Michael O’Brien’s Father Elijah and Bud McFarlane Jr.’s Pierced by the Sword feature liberal, tolerance-mongering Catholic cardinals in league with media-savvy Antichrists, as well. They share with Left Behind the insight that in the contemporary world, evil disarms good by using the power of the mass media to saturate the world with relativism. But they differ in that their vision of the future is more informed by the visions of mystics and Marian apparitions that by Revelation.This Catholic environment might make these books more interesting to Catholic readers, but since, like Left Behind, they are really focused on proselytizing (here against the missteps of the post-Vatican II Church) they suffer from the same problems - the good guys are unfailingly faith-filled fellows who dialogue in homilies, rather than conversations. They do, however, drink a whole lot, which, of course, you wouldn’t ever catch the Tribulation Force doing, even with those big locusts knocking at the screen door.So, buyer beware of Left Behind. What presents itself as an exciting, faith-based adventure through the Last Days is nothing more than a fire and brimstone sermon concealed under a flat, deeply illogical fiction, designed to move readers to accept a particularly bizarre fundamentalist Protestant theological viewpoint through that lowest of techniques: fear.
Originally published in Our Sunday Visitor: Michael O’Brien amywelborn.com/leftbehind.html
 
What I found amazing was that people were being martyred with an ancient form of death (circa France 1790’s). gullotine (sorry fo the spelling). I don’t remember that in the Book or Revelation?

I got rid of all the ‘commericalized STUFF’ that I did have. Sure it’s FICTION but i didn’t want to be ‘caught up’ in the series.

GO with GOD!
Edwin
 
It is interesting that even the angels in Heaven do not know when the Time Line of history will end.
Then why do we worry about such things?
Are we that much in a hurry to get to Heaven?
Since Christ already has the victory, the challenge for us is getting from Here to There.

Go with God!
Edwin
 
Hasn’t the Left Behind series been banned by the Catholic Bishops?

Read through the prophecies on this website: myweb.tiscali.co.uk/praeternatural/ to see what the doctors of the Church and the Saints thought about the end days and the antichrist. You will find it VERY interesting!

This is what I think: The first 3.5 years of the Seventieth Week of Daniel have been slowly played out for the past 2000 years, since the death of Christ on the Cross.

The last 3.5 years will, however, encompass a literal 3.5 human years, lest that time be shortened for the sake of the elect. This time is called the Great Tribulation, the Great Chastisement, or the Reign of Antichrist. It is a time of purification for the elect, and an time of punishment for those who refuse to repent.

The antichrist will be a Man. The Jews will declare him Messiah. He will persecute Fundamentalists, especially Traditional Catholics. He will preach from the air, appear to resurrect the dead, make the images of saints and of our Lord utter blasphemies, and perform wonders to fool us into believing that he is the Messiah. There will be some One World Religion, a faith merging all faiths, and he will be the leader. He will mark his followers with a microchip (the Verichip or Digital Angel, which has just recently passed FDA testing). He will attempt to Ascend into Heaven, but the Archangel Michael will strike him down with a thunderbolt, revealing his true identity. Satan and the false prophet will then be chained up in Hell.

Then we will have the Second Coming of Christ, but he will not walk the Earth in person, but will be more present to us through the Eucharist. (still unclear on this). The church condemns the idea that Jesus will come down and walk amongst us at the Second Coming. The Second Coming will be like like a Second Pentecost, a river of light of Super Graces via the Eucharist? There will then be an undetermined time of peace, but not a literal thousand years (Millenialism is condemned as heresy). This is called the Eucharistic Reign of the Child Jesus, or the Era of Peace.

Then, there will be a Third Coming of Christ at the Last Judgement. I’ll be dead by then, so I don’t care to try and figure it out beyond that. It hurts my brains!!! LOL!!!
 
Then, there will be a Third Coming of Christ at the Last Judgement. I’ll be dead by then, so I don’t care to try and figure it out beyond that. It hurts my brains!!! LOL!!!
The Church teaches that the Second Coming will be the final coming, so any suggestion that there is a Third Coming is heretical.

Now, your “Second Coming” simply looks to be a revival of the Church, which really wouldn’t be a Second Coming at all. The Eucharist is already here.

As to the question why we should worry about it…

We shouldn’t “worry.” And we shouldn’t get into the game of trying to predict when we think certain things will happen. And we shouldn’t let the details of what might happen preoccupy us in an unhealthy way.

But it is important to understand that there may be Tribulation, and that there will be deception, and that we have the hope of Christ’s return no matter how bad things get in the Church, our country, and our world.

Revelation was written to be of great hope and comfort to those being persecuted in the time of John’s writing. But it carries the same message for us today. Armed with a basic knowledge of the end times, we can actually expect that many in and out of the Church will be preaching heresy. We can expect that the forces of evil will find every way to work against us. And we can actually expect that a day will come where we will be persecuted (many are today, and have been already through the centuries). There may well come a day when a very public figure performs what appear to be miracles and claims to be God. If we don’t have a clue about these things, we could well be swayed into thinking it’s true.

If we simply understand that Christ will return in the sky in great Glory and Triumph, then we can always have hope, and we can be on guard against deception.

As for the details, I see nothing wrong with a little speculation, as long as we understand that nobody really knows the details, and we should always be ready.
 
AHH. Thanks, Gomer.

So … the Second Pentecost is not the Second Coming. What I described as a “Third Coming” is actually the Second Coming on the Day of Judgement, the Last Day. Forgive my error. I thank you for helping clarify this though.

I wouldn’t say the Second Pentecost is already here though. I believe in the prophecies of Garabandal, so I am thinking that the Second Pentecost will take place between The Warning and The Miracle, to fortify the faithful for the Great Chastisement ??? I am thinking that the Second Pentecost will be a great supernatural event that we will both feel with our hearts and see with our eyes. Who knows what it will entail though. This is just speculation, of course.

I think that the Second Pentecost will allow us to have closer communion with God. Perhaps we will be able to talk with Him directly??? I don’t really know. LOL!!!

Like I say … it hurts my brains to try to unravel it all.
 
The verses many Protestant’s recite to claim there interpretation is the right one is: “There will be two in the field, one will be taken, one will be left. There will be two on the roof top, one will be taken, one will be left.” (This is not totally accurate because I can’t remember exactly which book of the gosples it’s in.)
Can someone tell me how the Church interprets this??
 
I enjoy the books of Left Behind,i have study the prophecies of the end of times,good or bad they base,what they wrote on the book of Revelation,Isaiah,Daniel,Jeremiah and is a way that they are explaining the events to come,there are parts that i will agree,i don’t think that they are going to happen that way.
Some of you criticize Tim La Haye and his partner for making money with those books,with all your respect isn’t the pope sitting in richness?i don not want to attack you on this subject but let’s be fair,
nobody in this world is more rich than the pope and the vatican,just walking thru the sixteen chapel alone,plus all the gold cups and paintings they have that are worth so much money.
Once more if i offend anybody in this place forgive me,i am just pointing out something that it really was uncalled for.
If you want to critize the books i can understand that,to critizice how much money they made it’s another one.
 
gomer tree:
The Church teaches that the Second Coming will be the final coming, so any suggestion that there is a Third Coming is heretical.

Now, your “Second Coming” simply looks to be a revival of the Church, which really wouldn’t be a Second Coming at all. The Eucharist is already here.

As to the question why we should worry about it…

We shouldn’t “worry.” And we shouldn’t get into the game of trying to predict when we think certain things will happen. And we shouldn’t let the details of what might happen preoccupy us in an unhealthy way.

If we simply understand that Christ will return in the sky in great Glory and Triumph, then we can always have hope, and we can be on guard against deception.
reading the beginning of Chapter 20 in Rev:

**Revelation 20
**
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

it looks like the 2nd Coming is when the “Dead in Christ” and the one who did not fall prey to the deception of Satan will be taken up first and then a thousand years later the dead ones or “those who are not saved” will take part in the 2nd Death… when they get resurrected, join forces with Satan and are egulfed in flame. It seems the the "Encampment of the saints will be here on earth and when they are caught up, they are not taken off the planet but gather to this encampment… So there doesn’t seem to be any point there where after the saved are taken up that they actually leave, they just… “move” so the concept of a 3rd coming would appear to be false.

However, Gomer Tree, you said:

"Now, your “Second Coming” simply looks to be a revival of the Church, which really wouldn’t be a Second Coming at all. The Eucharist is already here. "

This creates a lot of issues:

If this second coming is only “symbolic”, then there should be at least a symbolic “1000 years of peace” now if we are already there… I don’t like the Peace that we are in… all the wars and slander and beheadings and everything else going on would suggest to me otherwise.

We are not to specualte or wonder about the “time” of his arrival. I’ll agree with that. Only the Father knows… but as far as “How”? It’s seems pretty specific…
 
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Edwin1961:
I had noticed that this topic has not been brought up on this Forum as of yet. Listening to Catholic Answers and other Catholic programing that this topic has been discussed before.

What is the Catholic view of the End Times?
Should a Catholic believe in the LEFT BEHIND series or just take the series as pure fiction?
How can we correct the errors that are being brought up by our 'separated brethren?

What is your perception?
Even the authors of the book note that it is fiction. Christians hold different end-time theories-- it is not black & white. Here’s an excellent article (free) explainig it all: equip.org/free/DW257.htm

…Bernie
www.FreeGoodNews.com
 
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JesustheSavior:
If you want to critize the books i can understand that,to critizice how much money they made it’s another one.
I find it difficult to say this, please bear with me… I… agree with JTS… there I said it. I read one of the books, was not impressed enough to continue the series, but, if you disagree with the books direct your comments toward that end, not at the profits of the author.
 
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Tom:
I find it difficult to say this, please bear with me… I… agree with JTS… there I said it. I read one of the books, was not impressed enough to continue the series, but, if you disagree with the books direct your comments toward that end, not at the profits of the author.
I made that comment on what Kathy Perry said on how rich they got with the books,so,i was replying to that.
Thank you
 
By the way, just to add my opinion of the original post. I feel the Left Behind series is an excellent piece of fiction… but nothing more…
 
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JesustheSavior:
I enjoy the books of Left Behind,i have study the prophecies of the end of times,good or bad they base,what they wrote on the book of Revelation,Isaiah,Daniel,Jeremiah and is a way that they are explaining the events to come,there are parts that i will agree,i don’t think that they are going to happen that way.
Some of you criticize Tim La Haye and his partner for making money with those books,with all your respect isn’t the pope sitting in richness?i don not want to attack you on this subject but let’s be fair,
nobody in this world is more rich than the pope and the vatican,just walking thru the sixteen chapel alone,plus all the gold cups and paintings they have that are worth so much money.
Once more if i offend anybody in this place forgive me,i am just pointing out something that it really was uncalled for.
If you want to critize the books i can understand that,to critizice how much money they made it’s another one.
The Pope himself is not rich. Most of those “gold cups and pictures” were gifts given to the Vatican and the prior Popes. Since the Church has been receiving gifts for the past 2,000 years it’s no surprise they have so many.
The point the others are trying to make is that LaHaye and his partner are making money by misleading those who are not educated and by bashing the Catholic Church. Although these books are fiction, they also point out to the reader that they are also fact based. These are the facts according to the writers.
 
PhilP should remember that Jesus himself said only the Father knows the date of the end of the world (Matt 24:36)
 
PhilP should remember that Jesus himself said only the Father knows the date of the end of the world (Matt 24:36)
 
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