Ending the Slavery Blame-Game

[MinkBDavenport]

For all the variety of answers, rebuttals, and other responses and reparteés in this heinous issue of slavery, I think it would be apropos to mention that slavery - though in the United States may most often be thought of as a Caucasian v Negro/White v Black/Light skinned v Dark skinned form of oppression -** it is not. **

Slavery comes in many forms, and has historically existed.

There is so-called "white slavery," or prostitution - the historical sexploitation of women (primarily) for the pecuniary benefit of another, most often the pimp.

There is "sexual tourism," in SouthEast Asia which frequently uses children - male and female - to pander to those whom seek perverted and selfish sexual gratification.

There is slavery/indentured servitude in** illegal immigration** - most often heard of in relation to the United States, wherein “coyotes” - human smugglers - will illegally import humans across American borders, sometimes finding them work, in “sweatshops,” which historically have ranged from textile/sewing factories, to restaurant work - essentially, any low-paying, unskilled labor.

Frequently, those in sweatshops are women, though men may also be similarly “employed” in them. They flout not only immigration laws, but public health laws, safety regulations, may often avoid taxation, and while they are a form of organized crime, they may also be fronts for syndicates of international organized crime. Because the illegal alien is present in this or other nation illegally (often seeking a better life, or improved quality of life - “the American dream”) they are fearful of Law Enforcement Officers, and often do not report crimes such as theft, assault, rape, murder or other heinous acts, merely because they are afraid to be discovered and fear deportation - (terrorism) if not retribution from the human smuggling syndicate, which may include harm to their family members abroad.

And yet, it would be remiss to avoid or neglect mentioning China, where forced abortion and a national “one-child policy” has sent untold billions of unborn children, or even neonates, to their deaths because of fertility monitoring done in sweatshops there… where those slaves, driven by ruthless corporate profiteers (Wall Street), make products for American consumption.

Yes, slavery has many faces, and it is Medusan in scale.

 

[psr13]

How is it, there were so many Africans captured into slavery across a huge ocean when there were thousands and thousands of native people within a few hundred miles who could theoretically been captured and turned into indentured servants? These are the pertinent points everyone should understand.

Natives were originally tried as slaves in one place. I forget where, though. The problem was that they died from European diseases that they didn’t have immunity to. The Africans did have immunity, so they used Africans.

 

[bbarrick8383]

Anyone notice the author of the article?

Henry Louis Gates Jr.

AKA, Skip Gates.

The beer summit guy.

Nobody should take from me today for what my ancestors did a long time ago. I inherited no scars from my Indian ancestors, nor did I inherit any slaves from my white ancestors.

 

[Dale_M]

Natives were originally tried as slaves in one place. I forget where, though.

Actually, in many places. Brazil and some of the Caribbean islands stand out in my memory, but I am pretty sure most European colonies first tried native slavery, before going to the expense of importing slaves.

 

[bbarrick8383]

Reparations today would be a punishment on someone because they are white and a benefit for someone because they are black.

Not because either of them had anything to do with slavery.

 

[psr13]

Anyone notice the author of the article?

Henry Louis Gates Jr.

AKA, Skip Gates.

The beer summit guy.

Nobody should take from me today for what my ancestors did a long time ago. I inherited no scars from my Indian ancestors, nor did I inherit any slaves from my white ancestors.

He is one of they guys they interview in the new History Channel thing about the history of America.

Seriously, my ancestors didn’t own slaves. I had ancestors who were farmers wealthy enough to own slaves who wouldn’t do it. They believed it to be wrong.

 

[Bob_Aliano]

Here we have a group of folks who were never slaves suing a group who never owned slaves over something that happend around 200 yeras ago and was actually pretty widespread at the time! My family didn’t get to America until the end of WWI, never owned a slave, and worked their tails off for what little they had. I wonder how many of these litigants can even spell work?

 

[mark_a]

Here’s what a white priest explained to me: Every white person in America benefitted from racial discrimination against blacks in the US.

Because of various types of subjugation, white folks were able to take home more money (and get better health care) and support their businesses better and educated there families better. Thus the entire white community got a benefit and the minority communities were harmed unfairly. The effects of such discrimination surely did not end in 1964, either. Bad health, bad neighborhoods near toxic wastes and bad living conditions stayed bad.

And yet the white folks with the most hatred towards blacks are the ones who have the most in common with them economically.

 

[mark_a]

Seriously, my ancestors didn’t own slaves. I had ancestors who were farmers wealthy enough to own slaves who wouldn’t do it. They believed it to be wrong.

You do know that you’re going to kill this thread, don’t you?

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

Here we have a group of folks who were never slaves suing a group who never owned slaves over something that happend around 200 yeras ago and was actually pretty widespread at the time! My family didn’t get to America until the end of WWI, never owned a slave, and worked their tails off for what little they had. I wonder how many of these litigants can even spell work?

1. What litigation? I don’t know of any going on.
2. I spoke of post-slavery persecution in which folks benefited up to this day and which harmed folks to this day.
3. Work is what the descendants of slaves have been doing – if they could get jobs and at the wages offered.

 

[stanmaxkolbe]

And let us not forget the Confederacy had the Choctaw regiment: It was just what it sounds like. It was a regiment of all Native Americans, led by a wealthy Choctaw slaveowner. (Meaning: NOT a guy who owned Choctaw slaves; he was a Choctaw Indian who owned African-American slaves).

(Anybody want to start a move to collect money from the Choctaws? Maybe it could be used to pay reparations to the Plains Indians who were slaughtered by the US Army…including some of those Buffalo Soldiers you were talking about, Stan.):hypno::hypno::hypno:

Yeah Zooey, then you would have to go back and say well; what about the European people that were slaughtered by the Indians on the East Coast? If you check out history the Indians are not the peace loving, nature loving people that are described today. They wiped out entire villages and towns slaughtered everyone that was European black, white, Hispanic, women and children so what should we do? BTW before the evil Europeans came here they were slaughtering themselves.

 

[Darryl1958]

Post racial America really was something worth hoping for, something worth voting for even.

It is not going to be part of the Obama legacy of course. Democrats need to maintain racial divisions in order to exploit them for votes.

Go back far enough and the Picts and the Celts will be asking for reparations from the Angles, and the Saxons and the Jutes. The whole thing is ludicrous. It is impossible even.

But it does maintain the resentments and racial hostilities that will perpetuate racial divisions long into the future. Ergo, ‘liberals’ will keep the idea alive. Racism and identity politics has become the lifeblood of the left.

 

[Zooey]

Yeah Zooey, then you would have to go back and say well; what about the European people that were slaughtered by the Indians on the East Coast? If you check out history the Indians are not the peace loving, nature loving people that are described today. They wiped out entire villages and towns slaughtered everyone that was European black, white, Hispanic, women and children so what should we do? BTW before the evil Europeans came here they were slaughtering themselves.

And enslaving one another, too.
Not to mention, that Indians (all over the country) captured and enslaved white people. Kill the men, take off with the women and children.

Maybe we should all go stand in a big, big circle, and pass the cash in our wallets to the person on the right, & keep going until our own money gets back to us.
Then we could all go home and think of somebody else in another country that we want money from. And start all over again.
Of course, we aren’t going to get a lot accomplished in the present, but let’s not let a little thing like*that *stop us…

I seriously need to be able to post more eye-rolling smilies.

 

[sedonaman]

The people who are responsible for the slave trade are so long dead, what does it matter?

There are huge bucks to be made in what would be the mother of all shakedowns, i.e., reparations.

 

[AHapka]

You cannot compare this issue to the reparations given to the Japanese in WWII. In that case those people were still alive, and the reparations were paid to those who were directly wronged.

I have a good friend who is black. She is one of the most liberal people I know, and is very active in the NAACP and black causes. She posted on her facebook page “I’m sick of people complaining about picking cotton who ain’t picked no cotton.”

I have no problem with reparations to any living slave.

Let’s stop living in the past, do our best as the universal Church to help ALL people in poverty and who are disenfranchised RIGHT NOW. That’s the best thing we can do in my opinion.

 

[LookAWayDixieLd]

Actually, in many places. Brazil and some of the Caribbean islands stand out in my memory, but I am pretty sure most European colonies first tried native slavery, before going to the expense of importing slaves.

• Human slavery is documented back 11,000 years.
• Slavery has been global in just about all civilizations at one time or another before the 1900’s.
• Arab slavery of Africans goes back from at least the 700’s to 1800’s
• European slavery of Africans is from the 1420’s to the 1810’s

As Gates has stated, Europeans rarely entered the interior of Africa, due to fierce African resistance. The slaves were brought to coastal outposts where they were traded for goods.

• An estimated 645,000 were brought to what is now the United States.

-The white citizens of Virginia decided to treat the first Africans in Virginia as indentured servants. The same status as over half of all European immigrants to Colonial America during the 17th and 18th centuries arrived as indentured servants.

• Approx 5% of Transatlantic African slaves landed on US shores. We all know 1 slave person is a crime against God’s natural law.
• Accounting for over 1100 years of African slavery by Arabs, the Indian Ocean - African slave routes it is projected the number of African slaves that came to what is now the US it is less than 1%. Again we all know there is no justification for even a single person being enslaved.

 

[Wolseley]

Nope. I am descended from the Black Watch, whose tartan I wear. At least, that’s my story.
http://www.albanach.org/blackwatch.jpg

Not all that different from mine, which is Macleod Harris:

http://cityofoaks2.home.netcom.com/graphics/macleod-harris.jpg

I even got a clan badge, and everything:

http://www.heraldicgifts.com.au/images/elements_mcleodbadge.gif

So, if any of you English people out there want to compensate me for taking over my family’s ancestral lands in Scotland (and Ireland, too----the Irish side of my family is Fitzgerald from County Kildare), I take cash, Visa, MasterCard, and personal check with validation.

Oh, and my mother’s family is from Alsace-Lorraine, so I’ll be expecting some recompense from you Hungarian, Mongolian, and French folks, too.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

You cannot compare this issue to the reparations given to the Japanese in WWII. In that case those people were still alive, and the reparations were paid to those who were directly wronged.

And that is exactly why there is such a strong case for discrimination reparations – the victims are alive, were directly wronged and are still suffering the effects. As I explained, including the fact that I am not a proponent of such reparations.

Or did all minorities get good jobs automatically in 1964?

 

[Phil_Stone]

With Liberty and Justice for all.

We generally require our children to learn those words as almost a civil prayer, a statement of the ambitions of the nation. That creates in us a responsibility to pursue those goals, not to merely exploit them for socialization.

Native Americans, Europeans, Africans etc, did not combine to make those promises. We do. To say that multiple parties were responsible for an act does not mean none are responsible.

To claim that Justice was uncompleted with the end of slavery was recognized at the time, when it was accompanied by the unfullfilled promise of 40 acres and a mule.

To assume that it was completed with the passage of the Voting Rights Act, or the Civil Rights Act, is just as mistaken.

Lots of people came to America, worked hard and suffered for being different. But how recently have you heard of someone being beaten because he was a Swede, or Irish, or Bohemian? When was the last time a school just “accidently” wound up 80% Polish? Or a whole school system? When was the last time you heard of a Presidential candidate supporting the honoring of the battle flag of an enemy of this country?

 

[AHapka]

But how can you say there is still discrimination and loss of opportunity when Obama was elected President. Seems it’s more of a level playing field now?