C
Cruciferi
Guest
A No to what?
I have never said that they’re in Heaven. Nor do I believe that they’re dead.
I have never said that they’re in Heaven. Nor do I believe that they’re dead.
- Status
Perhaps you missed what I was replying to.
Here it is again.
Seems clear to me that they expect these individuals to be in heaven.
C
Cruciferi
Guest
That’s why I brought up the Traditional thoughts on the matter. I believe it’s even mentioned in one of the notes in the Douay–Rheims Bible.
My guess, people think that having them return thousands of years later is too fantastic. :man_shrugging:t2:
P
Psalms62
Guest
Are you saying that they are still here?
P
Psalms62
Guest
If not in heaven, than where?
V
Vico
Guest
Well, actually since the immediate judgment occurs at death, since the Resurrection of Christ, all the saints are in heaven meaning, from the Catechism:
P
Psalms62
Guest
Elijah the Prophet (Eliyahu HaNavi in Hebrew) did not die in the incident, but ascended to Heaven alive (see Talmud Baba Batra 121b, Mo’ed Katan 26a). He was one of very few to have perfected himself to such a degree that he was permitted to enter Heaven during his lifetime. (The other known example is Enoch, great-grandfather of Noah – see Genesis 5:4).) As a result, Elijah became part human and part angel. (See for example Talmud Brachot 4b that he flies more slowly than other angels – presumably because he is part physical (Maharsha there).) Link
The word “ascent” was used…perhaps our faith uses a different terminology but this is how the article was listed.
Last edited:
This does not sound like Catholic teaching at all.
T
TheLittleLady
Guest
It is not Catholic teaching.
This thread has me singing:
This thread has me singing:
G
GiftofMercy
Guest
That is the key, which word and in what context is it used in the Hebrew Bible.
in Hebrew the word for angel means messenger. I would question the teaching in Hebrew that a prophet is part angel, part human.
@meltzerboy2 could clear that teaching up
Last edited:
C
Cruciferi
Guest
Please refer to my post #4.
M
meltzerboy2
Guest
I’ve never heard that a prophet is part angel as well as human. Prophets are humans who are particularly holy and loving and can predict future events. They may have visions of angels and communicate with them but they are not part angels themselves, to my knowledge.
T
TARRAT
Guest
There are many places where the bible “seems” to contradict itself but in light of the “whole” bible we can figure some things out. The bible says that all have sinned but we know that through the teaching of the church that Mary did not sin. Is this a contradiction? No it is just a manner of writing in the human form and it is 99.999999999999999999999999999999999% correct.
How did Moses and Elijah appear at the Transfiguration? God’s ways are not our ways. Time does not constrain God. We need to think outside of our mere mortal minds.
How did Moses and Elijah appear at the Transfiguration? God’s ways are not our ways. Time does not constrain God. We need to think outside of our mere mortal minds.
P
Psalms62
Guest
That is a good question! Any more than asking the question of Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad” (John 8:56).
Angel’s being part human - part angel, yes- a messenger from God. We (you and I) are considered messengers from God. All us are, and Jesus said, " For whoever udoes the will of God, he is my brother and sister and mother.” and in another passage, " But he answered them, “My mother and my brothers are those twho hear the word of God and do it.”m
The question of Angels being part human came out of “The Book of Tobit”, and in this passage it was originally “thought”, Tobias asked him, “Where do you come from?” From your kindred, the Israelites,” he replied, “and I have come here to find work.”
Was the angel Raphael once human? And, then became an angel? Tobias asked this next question,"Do you know the way to Media?” Tobias asked him.
In the next response was this remark, "The man said that he knew the way to Media very well and that he would stay with their kinsmen, Gabael at Rages, which is a 2 days journey to Ecbatana. So Tobias told him to wait while he told his father.
The name given to Tobit: “I am Azariah,” he replied, “the son of the great Hananiah, one of your great relatives.”
Tobit asked “Brother, of what family are you and from what tribe? The man replied, “Why do you need to know my tribe? Tobit said, “I want to be sure, brother, whose son you are and what your name is.”
“I am Azariah,” he replied, “the son of the great Hananiah, one of your great relatives.”
Tobit replied, “Welcome Azariah! God save you, brother.
Ending
You thought you saw me eating, but that was appearance and no more. (See Genesis: Three Men Visit Abraham and, Exodus 18:12)
Do names change? Yes they do!!!
What is your name?” He replied, “Jacob.” Said he, “Your name shall no longer be Jacob but Israel, for you have striven with beings divine and human and have prevailed.” Jacob asked, “Pray tell me your name.” But he said, “You must not ask my name!” (Genesis 32:28-30)
Focal Point
God spoke to Moses and said, “I am Adonai . I appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob as El Shaddai , but I did not make Myself known to them by My name Y-H-V-H . (Exodus 6:2-3)
Last edited:
C
Cruciferi
Guest
- Angels are Pure Spirits and cannot be part Human.
- Humans cannot become Angels.
Last edited:
P
Psalms62
Guest
Angels assuming human form… not vice versa. The term angel is a messenger from God and yes, we (all) can fit the description as God can work through us to answer a prayer, to console, to bring help in need…look at all the great saints! Each saint helps us to propel our prayers to God through his son. We know that at some point we need the strength or encouragement so we call upon the saints and even when we pray to God we are encouraged to ask for a prayer partner.
Can someone be an answer to a prayer? When someone is in need to assist us in our struggles? And, sometimes in a gesture as to compare, we bless God for sending us those people in our lives! Messengers do God will, so do humans. But as King David tells God:
Bible
PSALMS 8
How Majestic Is Your Name!
O LORD, our Lord,
how majestic is Your name in all the earth!
You have set Your glory
above the heavens.
2 From the mouths of children and infants
You have ordained praise
on account of Your adversaries,
to silence the enemy and avenger.
3 When I behold Your heavens,
the work of Your fingers,
the moon and the stars,
which You have set in place—
4 what is man that You are mindful of him,
or the son of man that You care for him?
5 You made him a little lower than the angels;b
You crowned him with glory and honor.
P
Psalms62
Guest
At least, not to take the form of an angel while presently on earth anyway. Physically speaking.
C
Cruciferi
Guest
But they’re still not human.
Angels are still distinctly different from Humans regardless of your insistence.
G
GiftofMercy
Guest
This term has a distinct meaning in Biblical Hebrew. It does not mean ‘we can all , as humans beings messengers’
As a note of interest in the Psalm the word
‘adversary’ is satan in biblical Hebrew. This can be human, evil spirit , or supernatural.
Last edited:
- Status