Fatima miracle of the sun?

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nobody

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Has anyone heard, or have any ideas on what the miracle meant? It just sounds so strange to me, I have to ask, “why that?”

Also, after reading about the miracle, I was reading the book of Revelation, and came to the description of the 2nd beast, Rev 13:13, “It performed great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of everyone.”

I have to say, it made me go hmmm.

The Church has “endorsed” the miracles at Fatima, right? Has the church said anything about this - the meaning of the miracle or the relation to Revelation?
 
I don’t know if they had a specific meaning, but I always thought it was just to get people to believe in Mary and what she was trying to do in Fatima, so that people may come to Christ. Maybe just to amaze the people and show them the awesomeness of God.
 
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nobody:
Has anyone heard, or have any ideas on what the miracle meant? It just sounds so strange to me, I have to ask, “why that?”

Also, after reading about the miracle, I was reading the book of Revelation, and came to the description of the 2nd beast, Rev 13:13, “It performed great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of everyone.”

I have to say, it made me go hmmm.

The Church has “endorsed” the miracles at Fatima, right? Has the church said anything about this - the meaning of the miracle or the relation to Revelation?
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Not sure what you mean. Are you suggesting that Fatima is a sign made by the Beast? I don’t think it follows that any and every great sign is necessarily from the Beast.

Scott
 
I wasn’t trying to suggest that the miracle was made by the beast, I was just describing my chain of thought, and wondering if anyone else had thought about this possibility.

I think I’m really looking for someone to assure me that it wasn’t from an evil source.
 
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nobody:
I wasn’t trying to suggest that the miracle was made by the beast, I was just describing my chain of thought, and wondering if anyone else had thought about this possibility.

I think I’m really looking for someone to assure me that it wasn’t from an evil source.
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Well, it depends if you trust and believe that the Catholic Church was indeed the Church that Christ founded and authorized to teach in His name and protected from error by the Holy Spirit. I do, so it presents no difficulty for me.

Scott
 
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nobody:
Has anyone heard, or have any ideas on what the miracle meant? It just sounds so strange to me, I have to ask, “why that?”

Also, after reading about the miracle, I was reading the book of Revelation, and came to the description of the 2nd beast, Rev 13:13, “It performed great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of everyone.”

I have to say, it made me go hmmm.

The Church has “endorsed” the miracles at Fatima, right? Has the church said anything about this - the meaning of the miracle or the relation to Revelation?
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Hi “nobody” 🙂

I’ll tell you the problem I have with this “miracle.” It involves simple logic. The earth has but “one” sun. It’s safe to say that every planet in this solar system has but “one” common sun. Every day, every living creature on God’s good earth wakes up to see this sun. What happened in Fatima makes no sense if other parts of this world didn’t experience the same. The accounts add to my skepticism: the sun was blood red, it was falling, it casted a rainbow color upon the earth, people were screaming, fainting, etc., yet, it was solely in Fatima where this “miracle” occurred. This sounds like mass hysteria to me.

Peace,
CM
 
Churchmouse,

I did read that it was witnessed by someone a few miles away, which would rule out mass hysteria, but, yes, why not the whole world if it was the sun? When I decided to find out what this miracle was, I was hoping for something beautiful, not terrifying - why would Mary do that?

Scott,

I thought (this is my humble understanding) that the miracles at Fatima were private revelation, so we are encouraged, but not required, to “believe in” them. Do you know if there is an official Church document or published statement on the miracles at Fatima, and where I could find it? Thank you for your help.
 
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Churchmouse:
What happened in Fatima makes no sense if other parts of this world didn’t experience the same. The accounts add to my skepticism: the sun was blood red, it was falling, it casted a rainbow color upon the earth, people were screaming, fainting, etc., yet, it was solely in Fatima where this “miracle” occurred. This sounds like mass hysteria to me.
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Though I consider myself a heavy skeptic as well, we also need to consider the fact that because of the curved nature of our Earth, and other physical laws- what happens to the sky and celestial bodies in one area, isn’t necessarily seen by others in other parts of the world.

For example- solar eclipses are often not seen the same by others on the “edges” of the viewing area of the eclipse as they are by people in the “center”. It may be a complete eclipse in one area- but only a partial in another. So I don’t think we can TOTALLY discount the ‘miracle’ at Fatima just because people in other areas didn’t see it- for logical reasons ;).

You might say- ‘but is it still a miracle then?’ I believe so- if there are no other explanations to completely discount it, I choose to assume it is a blessed sign.
 
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nobody:
I thought (this is my humble understanding) that the miracles at Fatima were private revelation, so we are encouraged, but not required, to “believe in” them. Do you know if there is an official Church document or published statement on the miracles at Fatima, and where I could find it? Thank you for your help.
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Well, you have pretty much my understanding of this as well. When I was Catholic, I do remember being told we could go either way, but as to official documents or other, I would assume there is, but wouldn’t know where to go to find them. Sorry…

Peace,
CM
 
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Shiann:
For example- solar eclipses are often not seen the same by others on the “edges” of the viewing area of the eclipse as they are by people in the “center”. It may be a complete eclipse in one area- but only a partial in another. So I don’t think we can TOTALLY discount the ‘miracle’ at Fatima just because people in other areas didn’t see it- for logical reasons 😉
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Personally, I don’t buy it. There are major differences between an eclipse and a dancing sun :), especially one described as falling and erratic. Add to this “miracle” that it was strictly isolated to this area, it makes it all the more unbelievable.

Peace,
CM
 
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Churchmouse:
Personally, I don’t buy it. There are major differences between an eclipse and a dancing sun :), especially one described as falling and erratic. Add to this “miracle” that it was strictly isolated to this area, it makes it all the more unbelievable.
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Yes I suppose God is not powerful enough to make some people see one thing and others to see something else.
Sorry for the sarcasm, I tried to refrain I really did! 😉
 
Anything is possible with God. I truly believe this story to the fullest. the miracle at fatima was seen be many people, odds are that not all of them “saw things” at the same time. GOD BLESS bye 🙂
 
  • Yes I suppose God is not powerful enough to make some people see one thing and others to see something else.*
I was in Finca Betania in Venezuela when the miracle of the sun occurred there. I didn’t see it, but others could, and they described to me what they were seeing. I was standing next to one man that stared directly into the sun for an hour without any damage to his eyes. I could only take a quick glance at the sun before having to avert my eyes. The man kept describing to me the different things that he was seeing, and they were all related to the Eucharist. I saw him later that day and asked him what he thought. He said that he knew that the Eucharist should be the center of his life, but that he had a hard time believing in the reality of the Church’s teachings about the Eucharist. He had traveled all the way to Venezuela from the USA, and I suppose he did that because he was in search of something. I think that God granted him a miracle to help strengthen him in his faith.

I have met many, many, people who have seen the miracle of the sun at different places across the globe.

I was in Mexico when people started seeing the miracle of the sun there too. I didn’t see it that time either. It doesn’t bother me that I never saw the miracle of the sun when others did, because it is a great blessing to be able to believe without seeing. God has given me the gift of faith, and I am very grateful for that.
 
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Churchmouse:
Personally, I don’t buy it. There are major differences between an eclipse and a dancing sun :), especially one described as falling and erratic. Add to this “miracle” that it was strictly isolated to this area, it makes it all the more unbelievable.

Peace,
CM
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The miracles performed by Jesus in the New Testament were highly localized. That fact does not have a bearing on whether or not the miracles actually occurred.

There is nothing in the way of “mass hysteria” that can explain what thousands of people saw at Fatima. You should consider questioning the source of your sckepticism. This is a miraculous event and not a natural one. Looking for a natural explanation, like an eclipse, would not increase the credibility, but would instead explain away the miracle.

Astronomy and physics don’t count when we have heavenly intervention. It either happened or it didn’t. Thousands of credible witnesses say that it did. You need to be able to refute their claims as untrustworthy. The content of the miracle itself does not, in this case, undermine the truth of the event.
 
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Poisson:
Yes I suppose God is not powerful enough to make some people see one thing and others to see something else.
Sorry for the sarcasm, I tried to refrain I really did! 😉
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Sarcasm duly noted 😃 However, when you don’t believe the miracle was from God to begin with, it’s water off a duck’s back.

Peace,
CM
 
Wow, Matt16_18, thank you for your reply! I didn’t realize that there was more than one “miracle of the sun”, and that someone saw something related to the Eucharist in it, and that not everyone sees the same thing. Yes, the gift of faith: I realize mine is puny. I pray for the gift. “Lord I believe, help my unbelief”.
 
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Pax:
The miracles performed by Jesus in the New Testament were highly localized. That fact does not have a bearing on whether or not the miracles actually occurred.
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However, the miracles of Christ didn’t involve something as universally common as the sun.
There is nothing in the way of “mass hysteria” that can explain what thousands of people saw at Fatima. You should consider questioning the source of your sckepticism. This is a miraculous event and not a natural one. Looking for a natural explanation, like an eclipse, would not increase the credibility, but would instead explain away the miracle.
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Which brings us back to square one. This miracle would have been seen on a global level if the sun was truly behaving as erratically as claimed. Mass hysteria is a logical assumption to make.
Astronomy and physics don’t count when we have heavenly intervention. It either happened or it didn’t. Thousands of credible witnesses say that it did. You need to be able to refute their claims as untrustworthy. The content of the miracle itself does not, in this case, undermine the truth of the event.
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Well, I don’t know how we can assume that these witnesses were credible. If the sun truly “danced” and “fell” I contend that it would have been seen everywhere. If not, thousands of folks who were following this apparition were so into the moment, they thought they saw the sun do what the sun really didn’t.

Peace,
CM
 
Matt16_18 said:
* Yes I suppose God is not powerful enough to make some people see one thing and others to see something else.*

I was in Finca Betania in Venezuela when the miracle of the sun occurred there. I didn’t see it, but others could, and they described to me what they were seeing. I was standing next to one man that stared directly into the sun for an hour without any damage to his eyes. I could only take a quick glance at the sun before having to avert my eyes. The man kept describing to me the different things that he was seeing, and they were all related to the Eucharist. I saw him later that day and asked him what he thought. He said that he knew that the Eucharist should be the center of his life, but that he had a hard time believing in the reality of the Church’s teachings about the Eucharist. He had traveled all the way to Venezuela from the USA, and I suppose he did that because he was in search of something. I think that God granted him a miracle to help strengthen him in his faith.

I have met many, many, people who have seen the miracle of the sun at different places across the globe.

I was in Mexico when people started seeing the miracle of the sun there too. I didn’t see it that time either. It doesn’t bother me that I never saw the miracle of the sun when others did, because it is a great blessing to be able to believe without seeing. God has given me the gift of faith, and I am very grateful for that.
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Hi Matt,

I think you forgot to include the documentation.

I don’t know how credible these instances are, given the fact that folks can say they saw something when they truly didn’t. Do you know of any credible scientific sources which claim that something strange happened that day?

Peace,
CM
 
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Churchmouse:
However, the miracles of Christ didn’t involve something as universally common as the sun.

Which brings us back to square one. This miracle would have been seen on a global level if the sun was truly behaving as erratically as claimed. Mass hysteria is a logical assumption to make.

Well, I don’t know how we can assume that these witnesses were credible. If the sun truly “danced” and “fell” I contend that it would have been seen everywhere. If not, thousands of folks who were following this apparition were so into the moment, they thought they saw the sun do what the sun really didn’t.

Peace,
CM
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#1 You are still handcuffed by demanding that a miracle follow “your” understanding of physics and astronomy. If it did it might not be a miracle.

#2 You cannot establish any basis for your statement of mass hysteria. If you think scientific criteria are somehow important, than apply the same standards to your own point on mass hysteria. It simply won’t wash.

#3 Since this is a miracle it will have its own character which might very well include a localization of the witnessed event. There is no logical reason to assume that this miracle had to be seen world wide. Remember, it’s a miracle and not a simple atronomical phenomenon that should follow your rules.
 
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Churchmouse:
Hi Matt,

I think you forgot to include the documentation.

I don’t know how credible these instances are, given the fact that folks can say they saw something when they truly didn’t. Do you know of any credible scientific sources which claim that something strange happened that day?

Peace,
CM
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You might be interested to know that it was widely reported that numerous members of the press and the scientific community as well as plenty of atheists were eye witnesses. But in your view they must have simply been part of the mass hysteria.
 
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