Food Price Riots Popping Up Around The World

[Al_Masetti]

Interesting article in the March 2008 Power Engineering magazine, page 14.

It wasn’t yet posted to their on-line edition, but I found the original by the author … David Wagman.

redorbit.com/news/business/1339027/record_performance_by_us_nuclear_power_industry/

It’s about the U.S.'s 104 operating nuclear power reactors generated / delivered a record high amount of electricity. It also talks about the cost per kwh which also was a record low. 2007 was the seventh straight year that nuclear plants have had the lowest production costs of any major source of electricity.

[Basically, only 104 nuclear plants in the U.S. are generating about 20% of U.S. electricity. Seems like we could build more nukes, use more electricity for many applications, and get away from the terrible idea of using/burning food to generate power. Yes, I know that the ethanol is being used for cars and trucks … and that electric cars and trucks have limited potential … but using electricity for more applications would free up coal, oil and natural gas to be converted/refined to motor fuels … visit www.energyvictory.net ]

Here’s the Web site for Power Engineering … for future reference:

pepei.pennnet.com/

 

[Ridgerunner]

I still hero worship him… it is perfectly normal. I do not pray to him as Catholics do to God, nor do I venerate him as with Mary. Idolizing people is perfectly normal and I am not as fervent in my “veneration” as most people.

I suspect that Soros is taking long positions on commodities now probably with leverage and worth billions. (So he is contributing to the commodities bubble.) He went out of retirement and made about 2 billion this year managing a hedge fund.

I respectfully disagree. Idolizing people is not normal, but is corrupting to the idolized and the idolatrous. A few years and he will be just as dead as a beggar.

Soros is actually persuaded that current commodity prices represent a “bubble” every bit as inflated as was the real estate bubble. More likely he is shorting commodities.

 

[Michaeljc4]

And the beat goes on…

Biofuels starving our people, leaders tell UN
Allegra Stratton and agencies
guardian.co.uk, Tuesday April 22 2008

The leaders of Bolivia and Peru have attacked the use of biofuels, saying they have made food too expensive for the poor.

Speaking at the United Nations, the Bolivian president, Evo Morales, said the increased use of farmland for fuel crops was causing a “tremendous increase” in food prices.

The Reuters news agency reported that the Peruvian president, Alan Garcia, called on developed countries to grow more food. In the last few months, food prices in Peru have run ahead of the country’s general rate of inflation.

Their attack coincided with a report published today by the environmental group Friends of the Earth warning the EU of the perils of expanding biofuel use in Latin America. Last year the EU agreed on a target of 10% biofuel use for transport by 2020.

The report says the certification schemes being set up by some South American countries to ensure sustainable production of sugar cane and soya bean crops are not enough to prevent damage to the environment and “fail to address the biggest problems” caused by the cultivation of land currently covered by forests or smaller farms.

In his UN comments, Morales criticised “some South American presidents” for pushing biofuels. The Bolivian president did not name them but his views are in sharp contrast to those of the Brazilian president, Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva, who has said developing countries have enough land to produce both food and biofuels.

Morales called on developed nations to accept that problems created by biofuels in developing countries were partly their responsibility. After his speech, he told a news conference that “it is not an internal problem, it is an external problem”.

“This is very serious,” he said. “How important is life and how important are cars? So I say life first and cars second.”

In his UN speech, Morales called for the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank to take action against the biofuel industry “in order to avoid hunger and misery among our people”.

Reuters reported Garcia as saying biofuels were “creating very serious problems for countries that have to import these (food) products. We believe there are alternative energies that do not put the world’s food in danger.”

Peru’s government has been forced to hand out food to the poorest in the country’s capital, Lima, because of the crisis caused by rising food prices. It has cut tariffs and raised interest rates to try to curb inflation, which rose 4% last year.

Both leaders are facing challenges to their authority. This month, Garcia’s approval rating sank to 26% - the lowest since he took office in 2006 - and 57% of those polled said rising prices was the main reason for their disapproval.

Morales, meanwhile, is fighting opposition leaders in four eastern provinces who want significant autonomy from the central government.

 

[Doug50]

Wall Street Journal: Suburban Farming.
youtube.com/watch?v=AJbqOqSdpx4

 

[drpmjhess]

BTW, Vern, with the US having on a few % of the worlds oil reserves do you want to exploit those now or husband them for future generations?

Doug, why would you expect Vern to care about future generations?

 

[ribozyme]

I respectfully disagree. Idolizing people is not normal, but is corrupting to the idolized and the idolatrous. A few years and he will be just as dead as a beggar.

Soros is actually persuaded that current commodity prices represent a “bubble” every bit as inflated as was the real estate bubble. More likely he is shorting commodities.

Soros said that the bubble is forming now. I do think that some of the bubble has a basis in reality, and is not driven by speculation.

 

[hasikelee]

Bamarider you crack me up and that’s a compliment. The star wars cantina comment was hilarious.

I was browsing some articles for my geology project and noticed that some geologists believe we are “returning” to our normal environment. For example, in Nebraska we have had a very fertile environment with a lot of rainfall and hence have croplands. But, evidence has shown that certain parts of Nebraska are actually desertland.

The speculation as I read it was that Nebraska, due to drought and grazing, was reducing the vegatation of certain areas to such a point that the sand dunes are starting to move again. Once that happens, it will be an unstoppable roll over millions of acres.

I didn’t dig into this to verify how true it is, but I do find it very interesting. Isn’t the sahara doing the same thing? I saw a very striking photo of huge sand dunes starting to overtake a dune orchard. It looks quite hopeless.

And if the locals can’t pull from a rechargeable aquifer, then all we can do is move.

Isn’t that why Africa is getting so heated up at the moment? With the sahara moving onwards, people are having to leave their native lands.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Soros said that the bubble is forming now. I do think that some of the bubble has a basis in reality, and is not driven by speculation.

You dispute your idol, even in part?

There is no doubt in my mind that Soros and his superwealthy cohorts likely had a hand in forming this bubble and that they’ll have a hand in “popping” it when they feel they have made all the profit there is to make on the upside. Like Rhett Butler said “one can make money both on the building up of an empire and in the tearing down thereof…” (or words to that effect. Precise quote not intended) There was a time when people like Soros were referred to as “Robber Barons” or “Malefactors of great wealth”.

For folks who have not the time nor the resources nor the desire to exploit human suffering quite as effectively as does Soros and his friends, one can measure neither the upside potential nor the down. Time, however, will tell us, as the passage of time always does.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I now hate you George Soros.

Oops! Missed this post. Sorry, Ribo, for accusing you of having him as your idol.

 

[Doug50]

Doug, why would you expect Vern to care about future generations?

Mainly because I think he has a couple of children himself. Arguing with Vern is like arguing with Al, and I’m sure they both are quite proud of that. Give them any data they don’t LIKE and they disregard it. ANWAR has a 95% chance of 4 billion bbls. and only a 5% chance of 11 billion So the USGS spits the difference to 7 billion at a 50% chance. Where else in statistics is that allowed as being relevant? (I took that wrong stat classes) But in any rate at 7 billion per year of US consumption ANWAR is only 1 years and at best under 2 years production. The Oil Drum just posted an analysis of the USGS Bakken estimates. theoildrum.com/node/3868

 

[ribozyme]

You dispute your idol, even in part?

There is no doubt in my mind that Soros and his superwealthy cohorts likely had a hand in forming this bubble and that they’ll have a hand in “popping” it when they feel they have made all the profit there is to make on the upside. Like Rhett Butler said “one can make money both on the building up of an empire and in the tearing down thereof…” (or words to that effect. Precise quote not intended) There was a time when people like Soros were referred to as “Robber Barons” or “Malefactors of great wealth”.

For folks who have not the time nor the resources nor the desire to exploit human suffering quite as effectively as does Soros and his friends, one can measure neither the upside potential nor the down. Time, however, will tell us, as the passage of time always does.

I probably have some hesitation if I make long positions on commodities. (Note: it does not follow that Soros would take short positions NOW if he thought the commodities bubble is a bubble. I doubt he thinks it will pop soon. In addition, if one correctly claimed that tech stocks were overvalued in 1999 and took short positions you would lose money by shorting it too soon. Shorting is very risking and requires the right timing too. Saying a stock is overvalued is not a enough to justify short positions.)

However, I will have no hesitation on taking short positions on mortgage back securities thus profiting of the misery of others in the way John Paulson did. If I did, I have to look at myself in the mirror and remind myself that I currently do not have the means to make a significant difference in the world in a rather depressed manner. Also I will say to myself, “if I DO profit from my bets, I could change that and help make the world a better place. I could stand up from my principles and speak up against injustice as I finally have the means do it.”

And no Soros did not cause the Asian financial crisis because he did not trade in those currencies months prior to the collapse. He might be playing a small role in this crisis though.

I think Soros is quite different than most wealthy people; I do not see ANY greed or cupidity motivating him and his conscience. That is the main reason I admire him. For Soros, money is a means, not an end in itself.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I was browsing some articles for my geology project and noticed that some geologists believe we are “returning” to our normal environment. For example, in Nebraska we have had a very fertile environment with a lot of rainfall and hence have croplands. But, evidence has shown that certain parts of Nebraska are actually desertland.

The speculation as I read it was that Nebraska, due to drought and grazing, was reducing the vegatation of certain areas to such a point that the sand dunes are starting to move again. Once that happens, it will be an unstoppable roll over millions of acres.

I was quite struck, in driving through parts of western Iowa, Nebraska & South Dakota to see the obvious “dune” formation of the land. No one seeing it could really doubt its origin.

But what is “normal”? At one (many times, actually) time my part of the country was at the bottom of the sea. It was once near, but not within the glaciated region during the glacial period. It was once massively inundated with water due to glacial melt farther north. At present, it gets almost four feet of rain/year, but is only about 200 miles from pretty dry country to the west. There are obvious encroachments of “loess” soil maybe fifty miles from here, suggesting windblown dust settlement for centuries but long ago. But there is no loess here at all. Paradoxically, the colder it gets here, the drier it gets. The warmer, the wetter. El Nino years are the best here, though not so good out west.

I suspect Nebraska has also been many things besides desert and grassland.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I probably have some hesitation if I make long positions on commodities. (Note: it does not follow that Soros would take short positions NOW if he thought the commodities bubble is a bubble. I doubt he thinks it will pop soon. In addition, if one correctly claimed that tech stocks were overvalued in 1999 and took short positions you would lose money by shorting it too soon. Shorting is very risking and requires the right timing too. Saying a stock is overvalued is not a enough to justify short positions.)

However, I will have no hesitation on taking short positions on mortgage back securities thus profiting of the misery of others in the way John Paulson did. If I did, I have to look at myself in the mirror and remind myself that I currently do not have the means to make a significant difference in the world in a rather depressed manner. Also I will say to myself, “if I DO profit from my bets, I could change that and help make the world a better place. I could stand up from my principles and speak up against injustice as I finally have the means do it.”

And no Soros did not cause the Asian financial crisis because he did not trade in those currencies months prior to the collapse. He might be playing a small role in this crisis though.

I think Soros is quite different than most wealthy people; I do not see ANY greed or cupidity motivating him and his conscience. That is the main reason I admire him. For Soros, money is a means, not an end in itself.

It is dangerous to go either short or long, but going short is more so than going long. Shorting mortgage backed securities now might not be too smart. As the extent of default becomes better and better known, the news ahead gets discounted.

Soros was not the sole cause of the Asian financial collapse, merely one of the major conspirators among the malefactors of great wealth who were.

I don’t know what his conscience tells him.

 

[ribozyme]

It is dangerous to go either short or long, but going short is more so than going long. Shorting mortgage backed securities now might not be too smart. As the extent of default becomes better and better known, the news ahead gets discounted.

Soros was not the sole cause of the Asian financial collapse, merely one of the major conspirators among the malefactors of great wealth who were.

I don’t know what his conscience tells him.

I never said that I would short mortgage backed securities now. Paulson shorted them when they were extremely overvalued. Do you think John Paulson’s actions are immoral?

Regarding Soros’ past actions such as profiting from the decline of the pound sterling, I personally, would not hesitate doing that in I were in Soros’ position. Soros needs money to be a philanthrophist and I do not see any contradiction for his deeds.

 

[Doug50]

This discussion not only talks about the daunting energy problem but they go into predicting the coming food inflationary problem.

FSN Expert Roundtable
“Energy Roundtable”
February 2, 2008
FSN Expert Roundtable
netcastdaily.com/broadcast/fsn2008-0202-2.ram
financialsense.com/Experts/roundtable/2008/0202.html

 

[ribozyme]

This discussion not only talks about the daunting energy problem but they go into predicting the coming food inflationary problem.

FSN Expert Roundtable
“Energy Roundtable”
February 2, 2008
FSN Expert Roundtable
netcastdaily.com/broadcast/fsn2008-0202-2.ram
financialsense.com/Experts/roundtable/2008/0202.html

Keep stuffing food in the feedlot Doug.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I never said that I would short mortgage backed securities now. Paulson shorted them when they were extremely overvalued. Do you think John Paulson’s actions are immoral?

Regarding Soros’ past actions such as profiting from the decline of the pound sterling, I personally, would not hesitate doing that in I were in Soros’ position. Soros needs money to be a philanthrophist and I do not see any contradiction for his deeds.

I am not knowledgeable concerning John Paulson’s activities, and if I would not presume to judge the state of George Soros’ soul, I would certainly not do so regarding Mr. Paulson. One can be a malefactor, in the case of the former, without necessarily being morally culpable, subjectively.

If you can’t see George Soros as anything but a beneficent being and one you seem to virtually worship, then you have made a life choice that, hopefully, maturity will modify.

 

[Al_Masetti]

If you want to do some interesting research, check out cyclical rainfall patterns … with a view towards seeing if there is a correlation with the 11-year solar cycle or the 22-year solar cycle.

Here in northren New Jersey, owing to the fact that we have lived in the same house since 1972, I can recall three drought periods on roughly 10-year intervals.

A friend of mine who has lived in the western Oregon/Washington State region for more than 30 years has reported a similar personal recollection on rainfall there.

I’ve gotten myself involved in “local engineering politics” * for decades, but even though the local water companies have been consistently correct for at least 50 years or more, the political operators just ignore it and just lurch from water crisis to water crisis.

My point has been that when the rainfall situation is in the drought “phase”, that is the time to enlarge existing reservoirs … when they are dry and construction is cheap and easy.

But, they don’t do any of the above. Instead they choose to do nothing until we run out of water and then they impose draconian water rationing.

Similarly with ground water recharge, which can be done modestly on a test/trial/development basis with very little money. But, even though ground water recharge is official state policy, the local officials regard it as totally radical and politically incorrect … even in terms of some low cost, modestly scaled tests [to develop various microbial and trace element testing, experiments with various filtration media, etc.]

Finally, just to beat this topic to death, consider Leptis Magna. When I was there in 1968, it was an archeological dig site … a former Roman Empire seaport city that once had a population of * 60,000 people. On the Mediterranean coast of Libya, it is about 100 or so miles east of Tripoli. During the days of the Roman Empire it exported huge quantities of grain and olive oil to Rome. So, obviously, the whole of Libya was a fertile, abundant granary.

Now, of course, the desert is right up to the Med. Leptis is abandoned. And has been for many centuries. It wasn’t global warming, man-made or natural … it was just the usual climate change.

It might be worthwhile to consider similar changes in other parts of the world.

Have you read the book, “1491”? It’s basically the economic history of “America”.

[And now I’ll go away ]

Bamarider you crack me up and that’s a compliment. The star wars cantina comment was hilarious.

I was browsing some articles for my geology project and noticed that some geologists believe we are “returning” to our normal environment. For example, in Nebraska we have had a very fertile environment with a lot of rainfall and hence have croplands. But, evidence has shown that certain parts of Nebraska are actually desertland.

The speculation as I read it was that Nebraska, due to drought and grazing, was reducing the vegatation of certain areas to such a point that the sand dunes are starting to move again. Once that happens, it will be an unstoppable roll over millions of acres.

I didn’t dig into this to verify how true it is, but I do find it very interesting. Isn’t the sahara doing the same thing? I saw a very striking photo of huge sand dunes starting to overtake a dune orchard. It looks quite hopeless.

And if the locals can’t pull from a rechargeable aquifer, then all we can do is move.

Isn’t that why Africa is getting so heated up at the moment? With the sahara moving onwards, people are having to leave their native lands.

**

 

[Al_Masetti]

I was traveling today and happened to flip through some newspapers. There were photos of people lugging huge sacks of rice at one of the “big box” stores.

It looked to me like panic buying.

Some years / decades ago, Johnny Carson (the talk show host) made a joke about a toilet paper shortage.

Well… there was a run on toilet paper. You can’t believe it.

[There WAS NO toilet paper shortage.]

After a few days everything kind of settled down; the toilet paper companies kept the shelves stocked and that was the end of it.

Anyway, I visited a friend of mine and couldn’t believe my eyes. Their entire house was a toilet paper warehouse!!! They felt foolish … and never again for the rest of their lives had to buy another roll of toilet paper.

So, to some extent, a lot of the concern is due to panic buying, in my opinion.

Prices of food are up sharply … and for that we have our Congress to thank. Libs in Congress … both Democrats voting as a block and RINOs voting with them … constitute a 60% veto-proof / filibuster-proof force that pushes these non-economic notions such as converting food to ethanol fuel.]

 

[Doug50]

Keep stuffing food in the feedlot Doug.

You like that interview? except for few things I pretty much try to stay away for sourcing sites like th oil drum. I never go to dieoff. If I source something I want to source the person based upon their background and experience.