Former Catholics victims of Separation Anxiety?

[ThereseMarie]

so what does this mean about Catholics who take up every opportunity to “bash” former Catholics? Does it mean they have some inner turmoil, that perhaps the former Catholics are actually right, and the only way to deal with that is for them to loudly, angrily and repeatedly knock everything former Catholics do, and to create theories and stories about why they REALLY left, etc?

Probably lots of inner tumoil, yes. Why do people feel the need to bash anyone? Why go at it that way? Why scream at me in the middle of a bookstore if one is so happy to have moved on from Catholicism? Why not just…move on? Why should any Catholic revile you if you are happy where you are, and they are happy in their world? It doesn’t make sense. But we forgive over and over, and then we forgive some more. Obviously you have been hurt by Catholics. I have been hurt by ex-Catholics. Yes, it does work both ways. So what is the answer for you?

This thread was not meant (I think) to include ALL ex-Catholics’ reasons for leaving. The handful of ex-Catholics I know (out of the 1,000’s out there) are filled with something that is anything but peace, and it shows. The Catholics here who feel the need to bash non and ex-Catholics are also, IMO, filled with something that is not peace.

Does it mean that the only way they can justify staying is to revile those who left?.

Maybe so, who knows? Maybe some are just egomaniacs who have to be right at all costs.

I’ve met so many people that I’ve known for years before I ever found out they were once Catholics. It isn’t a huge issue for many.
It is usually an issue when something happened that made it one.
Most just leave because they don’t believe the faith. End of story. No big drama, no hate letters, etc. And, no separation anxiety.

Sounds like they have moved on.

Blessings to you, Calliope,

 

[peary]

Calliope wrote: If people continue to scream about how perfect the Church is, because it has been entrusted with the truth, it makes it very hard to deal with the problems (and yes, every human institution has them). And THAT is one of the big reasons people leave, is that there often is no good way to get legitimate issues addressed.

You have it totally mixed up. No one is saying that the earthly church is perfect, and it isn’t because it has always been led by imperfect human beings. What is amazing is that in 2000 years, it has survived. Why? Because Christ said that He would be with His Church until the end of time, and that the gates of Hell would never prevail over it. It is an imperfect earthly institution but it has been entrusted with the Truth. And Jesus also said that He would send the Holy Spirit to guide and protect it. And you have also forgotten the Church Suffering (those in a state of purgatory) and the Church Triumphant (the saints in heaven). We are the Church Militant, and we are the soldiers for Christ. But all three are not separated but function as ONE.

I take Christ at His word. To believe otherwise, or to leave the Church because one doesn’t agree with what it teaches shows not only spiritual arrogance but to call Christ a liar.

 

[qui_est_ce]

If people continue to scream about how perfect the Church is, because it has been entrusted with the truth, it makes it very hard to deal with the problems (and yes, every human institution has them). And THAT is one of the big reasons people leave, is that there often is no good way to get legitimate issues addressed.

The CC does not approve of Catholics screaming it’s perfection.

I think sometimes it is because to admit to any imperfection may feel like opening a can of worms that the Church doesn’t have the authority it claims. But some serious housekeeping is in order.

All houses need to kept up on a regular basis.

Blaming those who see legitimate issues and protecting those who perpetuate them doesn’t seem to be a wise way to protect the Truth with which the Church has been entrusted.

Which legitmate issues are being perpetuated? Who is being blamed for seeing legitimate issues. Actually, I can’t tell what you are trying to see here.

Instead of boasting about how you have the REAL presence of Christ locked in a can behind the altar,

??Jesus is present in red flame at the alter. He is not locked in a can. His precious body is protected in the Tabernacle. Jesus is very precious to us. We put the host in the Monstrance for Eucharistc Adoration, we received him in daily communion.

why not use the Real Presence to cleanse the temple?

Exactly what do you mean by this?

 

[mercygate]

so what does this mean about Catholics who take up every opportunity to “bash” former Catholics? Does it mean they have some inner turmoil, that perhaps the former Catholics are actually right, and the only way to deal with that is for them to loudly, angrily and repeatedly knock everything former Catholics do, and to create theories and stories about why they REALLY left, etc?

Does it mean that the only way they can justify staying is to revile those who left?

I don’t think so, just applying a similar line of reasoning in the opposite direction.

I think that there are many (at least I know many) former Catholics who really don’t have much to say about their former faith. But of course, you don’t hear from them, because they aren’t making an issue of it. They don’t start anti-catholic web sites, come here and start fights, etc. So they go under the radar.

It only comes out when someone mentions “I was raised Catholic” and then others say “Oh, yeah, me too”

I’ve met so many people that I’ve known for years before I ever found out they were once Catholics. It isn’t a huge issue for many.
It is usually an issue when something happened that made it one.
Most just leave because they don’t believe the faith. End of story. No big drama, no hate letters, etc. And, no separation anxiety.

You are definitely right that many just slide away without much noise.

But I have never known still-in-the-house Catholics who make a career out of bashing those who leave. Mostly we ache for them because so many leave embittered, hostile, hurt (often with cause, if a Priest or Sister offended or harmed them). And it is undeniable that many leave because the Church just cannot let them have their own way.

I always say: Door’s open. Lights are on. We’ll be here when you’re ready.

 

[hasikelee]

I have noticed that while Protestant converts to the Catholic faith are grateful to their Protestant backgrounds in their faith journey, Catholics who leave the Church seem to be filled with hate for their former Church.

Is this a failure on the part of the Catholic Church’s catechesis or is it lies about the teachings of the Catholic Church to those who have been poorly catechized in their Catholic faith?

Please tell your story.

I think you’re referring to the “bubble” a person creates to protect themselves from the truth that niggles at them.

I see this all the time with women who have chosen abortion. They become militant, even enraged and violent over the issue because they are defending a very delicate bubble. To accept what their choice is, even if they are satisfied with the consequences of that choice, is too much to bear.

Except for someone seriously not in touch with their faith, most Catholics were at some point in their life made aware that Catholicism teaches a one-true-only mantra, so denying that takes a wall of emotion.

 

[Calliope]

Calliope wrote: If people continue to scream about how perfect the Church is, because it has been entrusted with the truth, it makes it very hard to deal with the problems (and yes, every human institution has them). And THAT is one of the big reasons people leave, is that there often is no good way to get legitimate issues addressed.

You have it totally mixed up. No one is saying that the earthly church is perfect, and it isn’t because it has always been led by imperfect human beings. What is amazing is that in 2000 years, it has survived. Why? Because Christ said that He would be with His Church until the end of time, and that the gates of Hell would never prevail over it. It is an imperfect earthly institution but it has been entrusted with the Truth. And Jesus also said that He would send the Holy Spirit to guide and protect it. And you have also forgotten the Church Suffering (those in a state of purgatory) and the Church Triumphant (the saints in heaven). We are the Church Militant, and we are the soldiers for Christ. But all three are not separated but function as ONE.

I take Christ at His word. To believe otherwise, or to leave the Church because one doesn’t agree with what it teaches shows not only spiritual arrogance but to call Christ a liar.

Your post helps me see some things, the Church Militant, soldiers for Christ, and that those who left suffer from spiritual arrogance and are calling Christ a liar.

These help me understand many things I have read and many responses I have gotten much better.

Thank you, and best to you.

 

[Calliope]

The CC does not approve of Catholics screaming it’s perfection.
All houses need to kept up on a regular basis.Which legitmate issues are being perpetuated? Who is being blamed for seeing legitimate issues. Actually, I can’t tell what you are trying to see here.
??Jesus is present in red flame at the alter. He is not locked in a can. His precious body is protected in the Tabernacle. Jesus is very precious to us. We put the host in the Monstrance for Eucharistc Adoration, we received him in daily communion.
Exactly what do you mean by this?

I know it is rude to begin a discussion and not finish it, but I have come to understand some things better, and I don’t think it is worthwhile for me to continue here.

I am sorry for any offense. I really had no right to come in here and question the Church, or any practices therein.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

Holy MofG! I had no idea they were such a cult. Now I wish some would come to my door. I’ll shake them silly. I will get some tracts, etc. What do you suggest would be the best approach?

Prayer.

They won’t read your tracts.

I tried. The response I got was ***“There is so much bad stuff out there, we avoid it by only reading reliable (read JW) lit.” ***
It stopped an email exchange I was having with a fellow cold - he refused to read any patristics articles I sent to him that came from Catholic Answers, but insisted I was free to write my arguments down “in my own words.” We tried that for a little bit, but invariably citations I used were linked to scholarly resources and he would refuse.

So we could look at his lit, but not at mine. Its a cult, they need prayers.

 

[BrewMax]

I have noticed that while Protestant converts to the Catholic faith are grateful to their Protestant backgrounds in their faith journey, Catholics who leave the Church seem to be filled with hate for their former Church.

Is this a failure on the part of the Catholic Church’s catechesis or is it lies about the teachings of the Catholic Church to those who have been poorly catechized in their Catholic faith?

Please tell your story.

This is an awful generalization! It is the failure on the part of Catholics like yourself to understand that others have good reasons not to believe or (buy into) the same things that you have. Many ex-Catholics including myself (most recently ex-Catholic) have left because of what they have come to know or their growing knowledge of the truth is leading them out. As I see it, there are many that stay because of their ignorance of their faith. I don’t mean that as an insult.

 

[mercygate]

This is an awful generalization! It is the failure on the part of Catholics like yourself to understand that others have good reasons not to believe or (buy into) the same things that you have. Many ex-Catholics including myself (most recently ex-Catholic) have left because of what they have come to know or their growing knowledge of the truth is leading them out. As I see it, there are many that stay because of their ignorance of their faith. I don’t mean that as an insult.

Did the new truth you have found relate to actual teachings of the Church or to practices/politics/structure and disagreeable people?

 

[Roy5]

I can only speak about why various family members and others said they had become Protestants or totally unchurched. The reasons varied. In one case they became convinced that the Catholic Church had departed from the simplicity of the early church, borrowing too much from Greek and other alien cultures. In another, the issue of married clergy was major. Why forbid men the natural, God-given desire for life mates and children? For in a couple instances, it was a parochial school experience that was alienating - especially memories of ‘mean nuns’.

There was the encyclical against birth control even within marriage after four children already; rejection of confession to a priest; subordinate role of women in the church; clergy sex scandal, especially preying on boys; boredom with mass (compared to what was seen as more spontaneity in some Protestant churches); made to feel like a leper after a divorce - and other reasons.

  Some simply lost their faith in Christ and drifted into agnosticism, atheism, and one toward Buddhism. 

  What has surprised me most is the number who went from Catholicism to the pentecostal style of Protestantism with its strict Biblical literalism and heavy emotionalism. I'm not sure what motivated them. Any ideas?

 

[BrewMax]

Did the new truth you have found relate to actual teachings of the Church or to practices/politics/structure and disagreeable people?

Not really new truth. It’s more like truth revealed with an unblocked and clear relationship with God. It’s about what God wants to do in our lives, not what the church wants.

 

[po18guy]

You are definitely right that many just slide away without much noise.

But I have never known still-in-the-house Catholics who make a career out of bashing those who leave. Mostly we ache for them because so many leave embittered, hostile, hurt (often with cause, if a Priest or Sister offended or harmed them). And it is undeniable that many leave because the Church just cannot let them have their own way.

I always say: Door’s open. Lights are on. We’ll be here when you’re ready.

Amen. Well said.

 

[po18guy]

I can only speak about why various family members and others said they had become Protestants or totally unchurched. The reasons varied. In one case they became convinced that the Catholic Church had departed from the simplicity of the early church, borrowing too much from Greek and other alien cultures. In another, the issue of married clergy was major. Why forbid men the natural, God-given desire for life mates and children? For in a couple instances, it was a parochial school experience that was alienating - especially memories of ‘mean nuns’.

There was the encyclical against birth control even within marriage after four children already; rejection of confession to a priest; subordinate role of women in the church; clergy sex scandal, especially preying on boys; boredom with mass (compared to what was seen as more spontaneity in some Protestant churches); made to feel like a leper after a divorce - and other reasons.

  Some simply lost their faith in Christ and drifted into agnosticism, atheism, and one toward Buddhism. 

  What has surprised me most is the number who went from Catholicism to the pentecostal style of Protestantism with its strict Biblical literalism and heavy emotionalism. I'm not sure what motivated them. Any ideas?

The parable of the sower. Some of these seeds were sown on the path, on rocky soil, or among thorns. Prayer is the only thing that will unfaillingly work on them.

Christ’s peace.

 

[mercygate]

Not really new truth. It’s more like truth revealed with an unblocked and clear relationship with God. It’s about what God wants to do in our lives, not what the church wants.

Ah. thank you. NOMB, of course. No comment.

 

[qui_est_ce]

This is an awful generalization! It is the failure on the part of Catholics like yourself to understand that others have good reasons not to believe

this would have sufficed, but you continue:

or (buy into) the same things that you have.

This is a prime example of what motivated my OP

Many ex-Catholics including myself (most recently ex-Catholic) have left because of what they have come to know or their growing knowledge of the truth is leading them out. As I see it, there are many that stay because of their ignorance of their faith. I don’t mean that as an insult.

You tell well-educated Catholics they are ignorant in their faith. How is this not an insult?

What if I told you that you left the CC because you are ignorant of her teachings? Would that be charitable?

 

[BrewMax]

What if I told you that you left the CC because you are ignorant of her teachings? Would that be charitable?

So many have already alleged this and heck no it isn’t charitable. I’m surprised that you haven’t as well.

 

[Delraek]

Not really new truth. It’s more like truth revealed with an unblocked and clear relationship with God. It’s about what God wants to do in our lives, not what the church wants.

You sure seem to have a strong resentment toward the Church, just like the OP was referring to. At least that’s how it comes across in your posts!

 

[steve_b]

To answer the OP ( I haven’t finished reading this thread, but just had to interrupt), my husband thinks you are right. Some people who leave the Church have such deep turmoil (after all they are leaving what they thought was the key to their salvation) that it is so hard not to be bitter, or angry or broken-hearted about it.

Here’s my mother-in-law’s story. She was raised Italian-American in a very Catholic family. After she married and had a few kids, she wanted to get her tubes tied. She said her priest told her she would “go to hell.” So she left the church 30 something years ago and never looked back. She hates the Church and doesn’t miss a chance to bash it when she can (just shows me the inner turmoil inside.) She is very liberal and very pro-abortion now. Her husband goes to Mass without her (he’s not really devout, but he does still go to Mass). My poor husband is so worried for her salvation. He wanted me to ask you guys, what can he do, if anything, besides pray for her. Any books to recommend? She is a voratious reader.

One thing he said to her which was awesome, I thought, was “Mom, I realize that priest hurt you. He shouldn’t have. But you cannot throw out the Church because of one bad or even 100 bad priests. If someone lies to me, should I now not believe in the truth? If someone cheats me, do I now disregard honesty?”

There are a lot of ex-Catholics here who I think want a reason to come back, or else need to justify to themselves that they were right to leave. I ran into an ex-Catholic in a bookstore one evening, and she literally screamed at me ( ) for 40 minutes about how terrible the Church is, how the Pope isn’t infallble, about how dumb my Miraculous Medal is, how I shouldn’t depend on Mary for graces, how the Bible is the only teaching I need to follow. My husband was so embarrassed for her, he wouldn’t come to bail me out. I really was just jaw-dropped, standing there getting pummeled. When she finally paused in her tirade, I suggested to her that she read some Church history, and told her that I definitely sensed the inner turmoil in her. I told her I would pray for that anguish to leave her; curiously, she said nothing. I felt I had hit the nail on the head.

Please pray for the fallen away who have bitterness or sadness. They need so much healing ! And pray for those who do not do such a great job for Holy Mother Church.

Blessings,

I ran into someone I hadn’t seen in years. In catching up, she told me she wasn’t a Catholic any longer. And all this rage came out. Bottomline, her husband of many years cheated on her and they got a divorce over it. She ultimately met what she called a great guy, and when she couldn’t get an annulment from her marriage she threw the Church under the bus too.

These folks need prayer above all, but they also need a support group to help with the biggest day to day challenges if they are to keep their faith alive. Otherwise, when a person feels at their weakest, there’s just too much nonesense out there competing with truth.

 

[Mannyfit75]

You sure seem to have a strong resentment toward the Church, just like the OP was referring to. At least that’s how it comes across in your posts!

I noticed that as well. This has always been a common view of Ex-Catholics. The anger of the Catholic Church is there. Why else would they come here? To convert us and hope to make us Protestants…

I don’t that will happen. I think half of the members here are Ex-Protestants.