Found out he's not a virgin...help?

[TheRealJuliane]

Yes, this is a big factor. I would still like to meet him, as it may be a moot point - we could meet and just not be a good match despite our common life goals and faith.

There were only a few women and it was several years ago. It’s probably the best case scenario after being a virgin, if that makes sense. He regrets it and it pains him. It’s really eating me up because I know that since he has repented and confessed it, the sin is gone in God’s eyes, and I am not trying to hold the sin to him or lord it over him or anything like that. It’s just the fact that no matter what, he can’t give me that same gift…I think I am realizing how important that is to me in a person. Ultimately I guess I have to decide on this…it’s causing me a lot of pain. I was talking to my mom about it too and she said pretty much the same thing.

And it is good that you are being so honest about it, and recognizing that it DOES matter to you. It should matter to everyone, honestly. Because it is VERY important - one’s sexuality is a gift from God that is meant for the man or woman that will be your partner for life. If more people understood the importance of remaining chaste until marriage, your situation would be rare, but unfortunately it is not so rare.

The young man you are communicating with is probably a good person. The fact that he told you this so early in the relationship speaks to his regret and shame over what he has done. But that does not mean that you need to go further with the relationship. It may not be right for you. And his past does mean that there could still be consequences. Not only a possible child, but emotional consequences from the failed relationships.

 

[akela135]

It’s just the fact that no matter what, he can’t give me that same gift…I think I am realizing how important that is to me in a person.

I just wanted to make a comment on this. It sounds like what upsets you the most is that he can’t give you something you want. When I read this I feel like you are concerned with “you”, primarily. What “you sacrificed” what “you give” what “you are owed”. I just want to remind you while you do need to choose a relationship that is right for you as a person, it is important not to get involved with or throw out a relationship for selfish reasons.

From your other posts I got the feeling you were writing from the perspective that you want someone who values Catholic morality and Catholic ideals for marriage as much as you do. That way you are on the same page and can have the best future marriage and family. If this man is someone who meets those goals then perhaps you should consider forgiving his past? After all you say it pains him a great deal that he can’t give you the same gift, that if only he could he would, if he could tell his past self he’d change before it was too late. However if you feel his past will prevent him from forming a good solid Catholic marriage with strong family values then I’m all for you moving on to someone who better shares your values.

I only write this because I have done things in my past that I deeply regret myself. If I could go back and do it over I’d stop myself. Not all of these regrets are caused by sinful things, some are just exceptionally embarrassing. The point is some people have to go through mistakes to really find out why they are wrong. Like the child told “don’t touch the stove it will burn you” who touches it anyway and gets burned. Are those children worse than the ones who never touch the stove but listen and understand? Even if the one who got burned never repeats the mistake?

For the record I don’t think it is selfish to want to marry a virgin, just that it is important to make sure you did not decide that based on a selfish desire… Good luck in your discernment!

 

[JoeofCupertino]

There is no shortage of Catholic men that are virgins. There is just a shortage of Catholic women that are willing to date Catholic men that are virgins. If virginity means so much you should have no problem finding what you seek.

 

[LightBound]

There is no shortage of Catholic men that are virgins. There is just a shortage of Catholic women that are willing to date Catholic men that are virgins. If virginity means so much you should have no problem finding what you seek.

I would venture that it’s not that they are virgins that keep these men from getting dates with Catholic women.

 

[KathyA]

A chastity speaker I recently heard was talking about moving past sexual sins (losing your virginity) and committing to a life of purity. He was speaking about his wife and the mistakes she had made prior to their relationship. He said…and I’ll never forget it…“She didn’t wait for me not because she didn’t think I was worth it. She didn’t wait because she thought SHE wasn’t worth it.”

We are all broken. We make mistakes and then try to get ourselves together enough to struggle after Christ. I’d be thankful that he felt it was important to tell you this early on. Prayers and a compassionate heart are what he needs regardless of whether you end up together.

Kathy

 

[TheRealJuliane]

A chastity speaker I recently heard was talking about moving past sexual sins (losing your virginity) and committing to a life of purity. He was speaking about his wife and the mistakes she had made prior to their relationship. He said…and I’ll never forget it…**“She didn’t wait for me not because she didn’t think I was worth it. She didn’t wait because she thought SHE wasn’t worth it.” **

We are all broken. We make mistakes and then try to get ourselves together enough to struggle after Christ. I’d be thankful that he felt it was important to tell you this early on. Prayers and a compassionate heart are what he needs regardless of whether you end up together.

Kathy

Completely right.



I was never told to save myself for marriage and in fact, the only way I could gain the attention of men (or so I thought) was to have sex with them. It was perfectly normal and acceptable during the time I grew up (1970’s and 80’s) to have sex for any reason or no reason. Having sex was seen as a good thing, normal, and not related to any ongoing relationship. And getting your heart broken over and over again was also seen as normal, just a part of life. I had no idea there was any other way.

 

[Kelfa28]

Completely right.



I was never told to save myself for marriage and in fact, the only way I could gain the attention of men (or so I thought) was to have sex with them. It was perfectly normal and acceptable during the time I grew up (1970’s and 80’s) to have sex for any reason or no reason. Having sex was seen as a good thing, normal, and not related to any ongoing relationship. And getting your heart broken over and over again was also seen as normal, just a part of life. I had no idea there was any other way.

My sentiments exactly.
All of my friends were sexually active. Very sexually active at a young age. It was seen as not only “normal” but I was teased relentlessly for remaining a virgin for as long as I did (age 20).
If I wasn’t teased I had girlfriends looking for guys to hook up with me so I wouldn’t be a virgin anymore.

I wish I knew that I could wait until marriage and that this wasn’t normal or okay and it certainly wasn’t healthy.

When I did get married, the wedding night wasn’t anything special. It was nice since we had been abstinent for months after converting to the faith together but it wasn’t memorable and we weren’t doing anything we hadn’t already experienced. That is depressing.

Of course I wish I had remained a virgin until marriage. I would have felt safe and loved and not ashamed of myself.

 

[chevalier]

So I “met” a guy on a Catholic online dating website a few weeks ago. We have been talking a lot and it’s crazy how much we have in common - it seems like everything we talk about, like our hopes for our futures, how to raise a family, and so on, we always agree on. He wants to come visit and wants to have a godly relationship, and even wants to ask my dad for permission to date me (for the record, Iam in my early 20’s, he is in his mid-20’s). I was, and still am very excited about him…but recently he told me that he is not a virgin. He’s repented of it and is committed to living purely. I am trying to be okay with this, but I don’t think I am, I’ve been really sad since I found out. I’m a virgin, and I’ve always expected to marry a virgin but I thought that if something like this happened, I would be able to get around it. It makes me so sad that he wouldn’t be able to give me the same gift I would be giving him if we were to get married, and I’d have to be worried that I wasn’t measuring up to the girls he’s already been with…plus there is the practical matter of how many guys those girls had slept with previous to him and the rsk of disease.
What do you think? Should I continure to pursue this relationship? I like him in every other way, and I am afraid I won’t be able to find a man who is as great as he is, but a virgin. Male Catholic virgins are pretty rare nowadays, especially in my area where most people are not very religious…I would hate to ruin this and then never find anyone. thoughts/ what would you do/what have you done in a similar situation?

I was once in a relationship with a fallen-away Catholic agnostic girl, who was not a virgin, whereas I was the male counterpart of it (“virgin” does not apply to men, it’s a thoroughly feminine word, it kills grammar when it refers to a guy). Guess what, she was purer than I was. That much is very clear to me, even almost six years after the relationship ended. So, nowadays, if I heard that someone had sex while not calling himself a practicing Catholic, with what actions I justified while calling myself one. Doesn’t put me in a favourable light.

But whether you can pursue it or not is a question for you, not for us here.

However, maybe one thing:

Male Catholic virgins are pretty rare nowadays, especially in my area where most people are not very religious…I would hate to ruin this and then never find anyone. thoughts/ what would you do/what have you done in a similar situation?

Think about him as a person. Do you want to exchange the mutual gift of self with that person if everything works out all right? Or would you prefer to dump him the moment a guy who’d never had sex popped up and was otherwise agreeable? Would you like to be the closest person on earth to that guy and vice versa? Help each other out in all matters of life until you die and help to get in heaven? Sickness and health, good times and bad? Because this is what it is about. ‘The best of the worst,’ doesn’t seem like a good choice, regardless of what criteria are used to define better or worst candidates.

(Additional bit of advice: Don’t fall for a guilt-trip, either. By which I mean a guilt trip inflicted by your own scruples. Accepting someone as a person doesn’t necessitate selecting him as your life partner to prove it. You don’t owe a relationship. And if you can’t live with something, then it might be better to know your limitations than to turn two lives into a misery.)

plus there is the practical matter of how many guys those girls had slept with previous to him and the rsk of disease.

That could offend him but you need to protect yourself from disease, which is more important that superficial politeness.

 

[austenbosten]

I’ll speak from my experience, I threw away my gift to some woman on a one-night stand and now I’m in a great relationship with my girlfriend. She of course asked me the same question. She has forgiven me, in fact I actually made a big deal out of it more than her…why?

Because I felt guilty. I felt “Why didn’t I just have faith in God and trusted in Him that He would place this amazing woman in my way.” I still at times struggle with the guilt (not as much though because my girlfriend has been very helpful and reassuring) because I feel like in a way (even though we aren’t married yet) that I have cheated on her, or hurt her. I have however made a pact with myself that if I indeed do marry this girl, then I will give to her everything of my being. Despite going into a marriage with a “stained” body, I will do my best to make it up to her for the rest of our lives.

So don’t think that he might not have guilt for what he’s done. However like others have said, this is a question up to you if you wish to go further with this relationship. However if it’s a nagging problem; please, please, please PLEASE do not lead him on. Break it off, or just remain friends.

Only you can decide if you want a relationship, however much power to you if you can learn to forgive him and overlook his past faults. Just remember “virginity” does not define a person, you can meet a man who’s a virgin and turns out to be a jerk. One of my fears before I was in a relationship, was that my future wife would be someone who had more “relationships” than I did…however I decided to accept it, because if I truly loved her it and she was faithful and loving towards me, it wouldn’t matter. I would forgive her and love her as she would me…just as God forgives and loves us all.

Take time to think things over, decide if you can live with him not being a virgin. If you can’t that’s fine, just cut it off and move on. Don’t lead him on, don’t put any more burden on you or him.

If you think you can live with the fact, then give it a shot…who knows his love for you may overshadow any and all past faults you have with him.

Just think it over.

BTW just saw the last post, if you do continue with it, then you should ask about his sexual past and an STD screening; If it gets serious, you’re entitled to know.

 

[The_Bucket]

The thing is though, you’re not going in with a “stained” body. We need to rid the Christian community of this idea even as we stand firm in saying that premarital sex is gravely immoral.

There is no stain if you’ve gone to confession. None. The sin is gone. And if you’ve received an indulgence at some point, then even the temporal punishment for the sin is gone. The only entity that wants any of us to consider ourselves less than what we are, beloved children of God, is Satan.

We can still stand strong and say that premarital sex, contraception, homosexual acts, etc. are gravely immoral without leaving people feeling ashamed and guilty even after they repent. The guilt is a tool to prod people back to the Lord. But once they’ve repented of their evils, it’s over. Ok? It’s done. Reconciliation is a very real and very literal thing. The sins are wiped clean from your soul and it really and truly is like it never happened. God sees everything we have done, are doing and will do as the present time. So why should we languish over the past?

I’m not saying that past sins can’t come back to bite or that sexual sins carry with them certain consequences like. They can and do. So no one is saying just jump in with both feet. I’m simply saying recognize that we all have propensity to sin and probably to sin gravely.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

The thing is though, you’re not going in with a “stained” body. We need to rid the Christian community of this idea even as we stand firm in saying that premarital sex is gravely immoral.

There is no stain if you’ve gone to confession. None. The sin is gone. And if you’ve received an indulgence at some point, then even the temporal punishment for the sin is gone. The only entity that wants any of us to consider ourselves less than what we are, beloved children of God, is Satan.

We can still stand strong and say that premarital sex, contraception, homosexual acts, etc. are gravely immoral without leaving people feeling ashamed and guilty even after they repent. The guilt is a tool to prod people back to the Lord. But once they’ve repented of their evils, it’s over. Ok? It’s done. Reconciliation is a very real and very literal thing. The sins are wiped clean from your soul and it really and truly is like it never happened. God sees everything we have done, are doing and will do as the present time. So why should we languish over the past?

I’m not saying that past sins can’t come back to bite or that sexual sins carry with them certain consequences like. They can and do. So no one is saying just jump in with both feet. I’m simply saying recognize that we all have propensity to sin and probably to sin gravely.

Ok, I have a question. And this is not an argument in any way, shape, or form, but a genuine theological question. I was raised Protestant and was taught the same thing. (Only replace reconciliation and penance with praying to god saying that you’re truly sorry and asking his forgiveness.) If that’s true though, that once you’re forgiven its over, what is the purpose of Purgatory?

 

[austenbosten]

The thing is though, you’re not going in with a “stained” body. We need to rid the Christian community of this idea even as we stand firm in saying that premarital sex is gravely immoral.

There is no stain if you’ve gone to confession. None. The sin is gone. And if you’ve received an indulgence at some point, then even the temporal punishment for the sin is gone. The only entity that wants any of us to consider ourselves less than what we are, beloved children of God, is Satan.

We can still stand strong and say that premarital sex, contraception, homosexual acts, etc. are gravely immoral without leaving people feeling ashamed and guilty even after they repent. The guilt is a tool to prod people back to the Lord. But once they’ve repented of their evils, it’s over. Ok? It’s done. Reconciliation is a very real and very literal thing. The sins are wiped clean from your soul and it really and truly is like it never happened. God sees everything we have done, are doing and will do as the present time. So why should we languish over the past?

I’m not saying that past sins can’t come back to bite or that sexual sins carry with them certain consequences like. They can and do. So no one is saying just jump in with both feet. I’m simply saying recognize that we all have propensity to sin and probably to sin gravely.

Thank you my friend, for those warm words of encouragement, and you’re absolutely right!

I however am not Catholic yet but yeah that’s why I really want to be a Catholic…ironically I just want to get into that Confessional booth. haha!

Most people they want to take Communion, or have the “Catholic” label. Me? I want to be forgiven of my sins.

Once again thank you for those words. It warms my heart to know there are so many great Catholics out there like you, my girlfriend, my RCIA director, my RCIA sponsors, and my parish priest.

 

[austenbosten]

Ok, I have a question. And this is not an argument in any way, shape, or form, but a genuine theological question. I was raised Protestant and was taught the same thing. (Only replace reconciliation and penance with praying to god saying that you’re truly sorry and asking his forgiveness.) If that’s true though, that once you’re forgiven its over, what is the purpose of Purgatory?

You can still die with mortal or venial sins if you died before receiving confession. For “nothing unclean shall enter Heaven” You have your eternal punishment forgiven, but not your temporal punishment. So yes you still have to go through Purgatory even when Forgiven by the Holy Spitrit…however the caveat is. You can become pure and clean (ie go straight to Heaven) if you make up your temporal punishment with Indulgences.

CCC
1496 The spiritual effects of the sacrament of Penance are:

• reconciliation with God by which the penitent recovers grace;
• reconciliation with the Church;
• remission of the eternal punishment incurred by mortal sins;
• remission, at least in part, of temporal punishments resulting from sin;
• peace and serenity of conscience, and spiritual consolation;
• an increase of spiritual strength for the Christian battle.

Also the Council of Trent says this

As regards those who, by sin, have fallen from the received grace of Justification, they may be again justified, when, God exciting them, through the sacrament of Penance they shall have attained to the recovery, by the merit of Christ, of the grace lost: for this manner of Justification is of the fallen the reparation: which the holy Fathers have aptly called a second plank after the shipwreck of grace lost. For, on behalf of those who fall into sins after baptism, Christ Jesus instituted the sacrament of Penance, when He said, Receive ye the Holy Ghost, whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them, and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained. Whence it is to be taught, that the penitence of a Christian, after his fall, is very different from that at (his) baptism; and that therein are included not only a cessation from sins, and a detestation thereof, or, a contrite and humble heart, but also the sacramental confession of the said sins,-at least in desire, and to be made in its season,-and sacerdotal absolution; and likewise satisfaction by fasts, alms, prayers, and the other pious exercises of a spiritual life; not indeed for the eternal punishment,-which is, together with the guilt, remitted, either by the sacrament, or by the desire of the sacrament,-but for the temporal punishment, which, as the sacred writings teach, is not always wholly remitted, as is done in baptism, to those who, ungrateful to the grace of God which they have received, have grieved the Holy Spirit, and have not feared to violate the temple of God. Concerning which penitence it is written; Be mindful whence thou art fallen; do penance, and do the first works. And again; The sorrow that is according to [Page 42] God worketh penance steadfast unto salvation. And again; Do penance, and bring forth fruits worthy of penance

 

[The_Bucket]

Ok, I have a question. And this is not an argument in any way, shape, or form, but a genuine theological question. I was raised Protestant and was taught the same thing. (Only replace reconciliation and penance with praying to god saying that you’re truly sorry and asking his forgiveness.) If that’s true though, that once you’re forgiven its over, what is the purpose of Purgatory?

To continue on what austen wrote…

newadvent.org/cathen/12575a.htm

Basically, Purgatory is a state where even the propensity to sin is “burned away.” We can’t have any attachments to anything other than God. Many of us won’t die in this state. To reconcile the fact that many people die in a state that is worthy of the Beatific Vision but not perfect, the soul undergoes a time or place of purgation. What exactly Purgatory is, if it’s a spiritual realm or not, is not truly known. The Church does not take a position on what Purgatory constitutes, only that it is state in which the soul knows it will eventually reach Heaven but it must still be purified.

 

[The_Bucket]

Once again thank you for those words. It warms my heart to know there are so many great Catholics out there like you, my girlfriend, my RCIA director, my RCIA sponsors, and my parish priest.

Oh my friend, I am far from a great Catholic. My understanding of God’s forgiveness and the true nature of Reconciliation and the transformative power of His grace has come at the expense of much pain. Pain that I inflicted on myself and others.

But that experience has given me a true appreciation for His power and the real nature of the sacraments. I only hope to be a good conduit for His grace and His message.

 

[austenbosten]

Oh my friend, I am far from a great Catholic. My understanding of God’s forgiveness and the true nature of Reconciliation and the transformative power of His grace has come at the expense of much pain. Pain that I inflicted on myself and others.

But that experience has given me a true appreciation for His power and the real nature of the sacraments. I only hope to be a good conduit for His grace and His message.

Hehe in the words of Mother Teresa of Calcutta

“Saints are only sinners who keep trying”



Irregardless, thank you.

 

[SonCatcher]

Ok, I have a question. And this is not an argument in any way, shape, or form, but a genuine theological question. I was raised Protestant and was taught the same thing. (Only replace reconciliation and penance with praying to god saying that you’re truly sorry and asking his forgiveness.) If that’s true though, that once you’re forgiven its over, what is the purpose of Purgatory?

The others have addressed this theologically. Since you are an atheist, I will share a more pragmatic analogy of the purpose of Purgatory.

Say you are playing baseball with friends and the ball breaks a window. You understand, of course that you and the other players need to seek forgiveness from the window’s owner. That, however, does not end the situation. Even though forgiven, there is still broken glass to clean up and need for a new window to replace the old one. The matter is not done until everything is restored.

Purgatory is a chance for restoration even after death. The sin must be forgiven while we live but the restoration can continue for a time afterward. Then, when the soul is completely purified, the person may fully enter God’s presence in peace.

 

[bilop]

My sentiments exactly.
All of my friends were sexually active. Very sexually active at a young age. It was seen as not only “normal” but I was teased relentlessly for remaining a virgin for as long as I did (age 20).
If I wasn’t teased I had girlfriends looking for guys to hook up with me so I wouldn’t be a virgin anymore.

I wish I knew that I could wait until marriage and that this wasn’t normal or okay and it certainly wasn’t healthy.

When I did get married, the wedding night wasn’t anything special. It was nice since we had been abstinent for months after converting to the faith together but it wasn’t memorable and we weren’t doing anything we hadn’t already experienced. That is depressing.

Of course I wish I had remained a virgin until marriage. I would have felt safe and loved and not ashamed of myself.

I think we need to get rid of this expectation that the wedding night is going to be some transcendant bliss. Lot’s of virging have disappointing wedding nights too. It takes time for a couple to get to know each other and build that aspect of a relationship. People shouldn’t feel bad b/c they didn’t meet some lofty expectation.

God Bless

 

[Kelfa28]

I think we need to get rid of this expectation that the wedding night is going to be some transcendant bliss. Lot’s of virging have disappointing wedding nights too. It takes time for a couple to get to know each other and build that aspect of a relationship. People shouldn’t feel bad b/c they didn’t meet some lofty expectation.

God Bless

Physically, I can’t imagine the wedding night being anything special whether you are a virgin or not. Of course it takes time and practice.

Mentally and spiritually it has to be a huge deal. I wish I could have experienced something so deeply special, spiritual and personal with my husband…and only my husband.

 

[The_Bucket]

I think we need to get rid of this expectation that the wedding night is going to be some transcendant bliss. Lot’s of virging have disappointing wedding nights too. It takes time for a couple to get to know each other and build that aspect of a relationship. People shouldn’t feel bad b/c they didn’t meet some lofty expectation.

God Bless

People should definitely not feel bad because they didn’t meet lofty expectations. I totally agree.

That said, uh… yeah my wedding night was all kinds of awesome. That’s probably because we made the savvy and less expensive decision to have an 11am Nuptial Mass, followed by a reception from 12-3. Gave us plenty of time to get in a limo, go to the airport, fly to the Caribbean and still be awake with a decent amount of energy by the time we got to our room at like, 9:30 or 10 pm.

Oh, and having little alcohol helps TREMENDOUSLY. We each had one glass of champagne at our own wedding. That was not repeated when we went to friends and family members’ weddings…