Fr. Corapi Responds to Some of His Order's Charges

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dpf42, that link I posted by the JUly 5th statement of the SOLT, and my previous post are FYI to catch the late commers up. Please leave your remark to me in a pm to me if you wish to complain about it, not on a public thread. The title stated that.

As for needing clarification by the SOLT, I don’t think their statement that Corapi has engaged in corruption and bribery to key witnesses in an investigation he should have stayed out of is not necessary. That is a very to the point statement that came out by SOLT on July 5th, hence my post of the link directly to it.

They can’t proceed with the Order’s investigation as to what is going on and the accusations of misconduct due to Corapi’s lawsuit against key witnesses (s) in the secular courts. Corapi has pretty much severed all ties with the Church himself by taking the matter into his own hands. And since when is it okay for a Religious who took a vow of poverty to be able to own so much? Come on people!!! There’s no debating what’s going on here. It’s all very clear.
You have used my two words in summation of what they said concerning Corapi’s intrution into their investigation. Allow me to clarify those two words, since I think you are asking me to:

corruption:
"SOLT also recognizes that Fr. Corapi is now misleading these individuals through his false statements and characterizations. It is for these Catholics that SOLT, by means of this announcement, seeks to set the record straight…

Bribery:
As the Society was engaging this team, Fr. Corapi filed a civil lawsuit against his principal accuser. …Corapi’s lawsuit, contained a provision binding the woman to silence about him. He offered the woman $100,000 to enter this agreement…"
Again SOLT made no statement of “corruption” or “bribery” - those are your terms.

Yet if your intent is to ‘catch up’ the late-comers, it is likely far more prudent to quote the SOLT statement exactly … and then leave creative conclusions to the readers. As your initial post above stands, you seem to be saying that SOLT used the vilifying terms “corruption” and bribery" but SOLT did not do so. You have done so and yes, I’m well aware of the meaning each word; that has led to my objection. The words belong to your interpretation, not to SOLT’s words. I’m simply clarifying this for any late-comers.

I mean no personal offense to you.
 
No difference to me.

I grew up with six brothers and seven uncles.
My only sister and I do not speak like most women,
or so we have been told. If you think of my words
as more “cut to the chase” (to quote my brothers)
rather than as “aggressive or harsh,” you will have an
easier time with my speech patterns. PROBABLY.

PS -do any people say that you’re easily aggravated?
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
“Cut to the chase”, I’ll keep that in mind. I’m sure in 5 years down the road, when you’re a Forum Master/Elder and I’m a Veteran Member, we’ll be best of friends and will both have long forgotten about the challenging beginnings of our budding friendship.🙂
 
“Cut to the chase”, I’ll keep that in mind. I’m sure in 5 years down the road, when you’re a Forum Master/Elder and I’m a Veteran Member, we’ll be best of friends and will both have long forgotten about the challenging beginnings of our budding friendship.🙂
Thank you. Very sweet of you to say so.

Along with “cut to the chase” is:

“what’s the bottom line?” and
“your point is … what?” and
“so … is there a point to this?” and
“is there an end to this narrative?” and
so forth. My brothers are very funny fellows.
So was my father and so were my uncles.

Really, it was only in late-middle-age, that my sister
and I realized that we have more masculine speech
patterns/habits than feminine. Now that we know it,
we think it’s pretty funny. She’s a nun, 69 yr old;
I’m 65 yrs old. Too late for us to change?
Probably … .

It’s like we grew up swimming in a sea of testosterone …
TVs on all three floors of our home, each one tuned into
different sports event. I shudder to remember it!

(That was each and every weekend - with a Time Out for Mass.)
 
I’m speaking with rose-colored glasses, but it is quite possible that he amassed the properties for the speculative real estate value, for purposes with ultimate charitable intent. Father Corapi himself says the SOLT was aware of his holdings and never called him on it. Father Corapi himself may have struggles with gathering for self and gathering for others, and all points in between. SOLT may or may not have been OK with his holdings. The bottom line is that it is useless to speculate on his speculative(?) real estate ventures.

The stories are troublesome, but let us not paint Father Corapi the “black sheepdog” that he has adopted, as if a rogue sheepdog has to be put down. The essence of Christianity is to remember that there is a little white in all us until the day we die. ** I liked Father Corapi’s ministry because he was like a “black and white” sheepdog, who reminded us that there are boundaries and beyond those boundaries are wolves. He represented the black wolf lurking in the domesticated dog that is inclined to be loyal to the Master, but struggling with the wolf inside. He represents to all of us just how easy it is to go rogue**.

The “Call of the Wild” must be hardest for targeted sheepdogs. So pray for priests daily.
Remember, Fr. Corapi lifted this “sheepdog” imagery from a Lt. Col. in the Army, who was comparing military and police to the sheepdogs in society, keeping the more gentle citizens from being harmed. This is not the same imagery that Jesus uses, because Jesus himself is the shepherd and never did he compare even his Apostles to sheepdogs. Be careful bringing that imagery into a religious setting, it doesn’t work. (Which Fr. Corapi never seemed to realize…)
 
If we want to keep up with analogy, bad as it is. In the real world, sheepdogs work under the command of the shepherd and they are right there mixed in with the flock. A sheepdog who separates himself from the flock by living out in the middle of nowhere and who does not work under the authority of the shepherd is working towards what exactly?

Furthermore, many people attempting to discuss what this analogy actually means ought to pick up Col. Grossman’s book for themselves. It was more of a discussion on the mindset of people, some who are context to be sheep and just follow the crowd without thinking or taking any responsibility for themselves or their own safety, some who are wolves who prey on those people, and some who take the responsibility who are referred to as sheepdogs. There was nothing in there about being anti-establishment, etc.
 
I follow and somewhat agree with what you posted. However, Fr Corapi never needed to ask for faculties from the Bishop of Helena if he never administered the sacraments there.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It is very quaint that another bishop would take Father into another diocese. Ih hasn’tlisten to his superiors and if he defrocked from his ordination, I do not see how the Bishop can ordain him. The only reason I can think of his Diocese must have a shortage of priests; this is very quaint. So, I do not know if Father’s faculties would be valid.
 
Maybe I missed it, but … SOLT alleges Corapi paid ‘the lady’ 100K to sign a silence contract. Have we seen any proof of this payoff ? Checking Deposit slip, an uncashed check from Corapi to her, etc.

Corapi is too smart to pay anyone 100K to sign a contract. This charge of SOLT doesn’t seem believable, unless they have some written proof to support.
Technology companies make people sign employment agreements that assign all inventions and IP produced during the employment period to the company.

Celebrities make people sign employment agreements that involve gag clauses to not disclose anything that occurred related to the celebrity during the employment period. You are paid according to the value of the employment and what you might be losing by not disclosing the activities of the celebrity. If someone asks you to sign an additional/modified employment contract that restricts your rights after the employment starts, they generally have to compensate you for the loss.

So, retrofitting a gag clause into an employment contract would take additional compensation.

So, the question is not did it happen - SOLT has said that many witnesses are not talking due to employment contracts - the question is why would such a contract be needed.
 
Maybe I missed it, but … SOLT alleges Corapi paid ‘the lady’ 100K to sign a silence contract. Have we seen any proof of this payoff ? Checking Deposit slip, an uncashed check from Corapi to her, etc.

Corapi is too smart to pay anyone 100K to sign a contract. This charge of SOLT doesn’t seem believable, unless they have some written proof to support.
Again SOLT made no statement of “corruption” or “bribery” - those are your terms.

Yet if your intent is to ‘catch up’ the late-comers, it is likely far more prudent to quote the SOLT statement exactly … and then leave creative conclusions to the readers. As your initial post above stands, you seem to be saying that SOLT used the vilifying terms “corruption” and bribery" but SOLT did not do so. You have done so and yes, I’m well aware of the meaning each word; that has led to my objection. The words belong to your interpretation, not to SOLT’s words. I’m simply clarifying this for any late-comers.

I mean no personal offense to you.
As posted above, the SOLT never accussed anyone of curruption. Second, it is very inappropriate for anyone, including religiuos, to expect or even suggest that a superior has to produce “evidence”. This is not how religious communities operate.

The Council of Trent mae it very clear that religious are exempt from the authority of bishops and the laity. It did this to avoid this very kind of thinking, that superiors and communities wee to be accountable to the outside world for their internal affairs.

Unless a civil law has been violated and that civil law is morally justificable, religious communities are governed by superiors at their sole discretion. The only person who has the right to ask for cancelled checks and other documetns is the Holy Father or his delegate. At this point in time, neither the Holy See nor anyone appointed by the Holy See is involved in this case nor there need be anyone.

The Cathohlc Church operates on the Principle of Subsidiarity. This means that problems are resolved at the lowest level of authority. In this case, it’s the major superior. I’m stunned that no matter how many times we have stated this on this thread, people are still asking for information that none of us, including me, have a right to have and making suggestions that none of us, including me, have a right to make to a religious superior.

The law and the theology of the Church is very simple. The religious superior is the highest ranking authority in a community. Unless he violates moral law or canon law, his voice is the last word that must be accepted by the members of the community and those who are associated to it or interested in it. The superior does not have to consult anyone to make decisions. Unless the constitutioins of the institute dictate that he needs the consent of his council, he is free to discern on his own and to hand down a verdict and a mandate that must be accepted at face value.

The only person who has the right to request a hearing is the person involved, that would be Father Corapi. Unless he does so, the word of the superior stands and you are guilty as charged by your superior. The superior, in this case, called in two consultants. He did not have to do this. Moral law and canon law do not require this. I can’t speak for the constitutions of the SOLT, maybe they require this of the superior. My point . . . we must refrain from crossing a line that we may not cross…

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
As posted above, the SOLT never accussed anyone of curruption. Second, it is very inappropriate for anyone, including religiuos, to expect or even suggest that a superior has to produce “evidence”. This is not how religious communities operate.

The Council of Trent mae it very clear that religious are exempt from the authority of bishops and the laity. It did this to avoid this very kind of thinking, that superiors and communities wee to be accountable to the outside world for their internal affairs.

Unless a civil law has been violated and that civil law is morally justificable, religious communities are governed by superiors at their sole discretion. The only person who has the right to ask for cancelled checks and other documetns is the Holy Father or his delegate. At this point in time, neither the Holy See nor anyone appointed by the Holy See is involved in this case nor there need be anyone.

The Cathohlc Church operates on the Principle of Subsidiarity. This means that problems are resolved at the lowest level of authority. In this case, it’s the major superior. I’m stunned that no matter how many times we have stated this on this thread, people are still asking for information that none of us, including me, have a right to have and making suggestions that none of us, including me, have a right to make to a religious superior.

The law and the theology of the Church is very simple. The religious superior is the highest ranking authority in a community. Unless he violates moral law or canon law, his voice is the last word that must be accepted by the members of the community and those who are associated to it or interested in it. The superior does not have to consult anyone to make decisions. Unless the constitutioins of the institute dictate that he needs the consent of his council, he is free to discern on his own and to hand down a verdict and a mandate that must be accepted at face value.

The only person who has the right to request a hearing is the person involved, that would be Father Corapi. Unless he does so, the word of the superior stands and you are guilty as charged by your superior. The superior, in this case, called in two consultants. He did not have to do this. Moral law and canon law do not require this. I can’t speak for the constitutions of the SOLT, maybe they require this of the superior. My point . . . we must refrain from crossing a line that we may not cross…

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
It is always a pleasure learning from you.
 
If we want to keep up with analogy, bad as it is. In the real world, sheepdogs work under the command of the shepherd and they are right there mixed in with the flock. A sheepdog who separates himself from the flock by living out in the middle of nowhere and who does not work under the authority of the shepherd is working towards what exactly?

Furthermore, many people attempting to discuss what this analogy actually means ought to pick up Col. Grossman’s book for themselves. It was more of a discussion on the mindset of people, some who are context to be sheep and just follow the crowd without thinking or taking any responsibility for themselves or their own safety, some who are wolves who prey on those people, and some who take the responsibility who are referred to as sheepdogs. There was nothing in there about being anti-establishment, etc.
I still don’t like the inference that because I am a law-abiding citizen who has not been called to serve in the military or be a police officer (I’m a female), I am a “sheep.” The “sheepdogs” seem to be putting themselves into a special category which sets them apart in a rather conceited way, IMO. I am insulted by being called a “sheep,” and the language Col. Grossman uses to describe us “sheep” is also pretty rude.

Given how much of a “lone wolf” Fr. Corapi has shown himself to be, I guess I can’t be surprised that he would include himself in the “sheepdog” category, as well as congratulating himself on not being one of the regular sheep, but a “black sheep.” All of that amounts to “I am not like the rest of you sheep, I am in a special category.” So I don’t expect him to submit to the authority of his superior. I believe he has put the Bishops into the wolves category, which I think makes him heretical, no?

:eek:
 
I still don’t like the inference that because I am a law-abiding citizen who has not been called to serve in the military or be a police officer (I’m a female), I am a “sheep.”
That’s because you are misunderstanding it. It is not meant to be taken based on your job. It is meant to be taken based on your outlook on life.

See the PDF I have attached and you should understand perfectly.
 
Thank you, jwinch. LTC Grossman’s imagery is more like the parable of the wise and foolish virgins instead of how the Church talks about ‘sheep’ and ‘shepherds.’
 
I was on Jimmy Akins site and saw a link to the civil case of John Corapi vs his accuser… It might not be active now, because I couldn’t find it on my own, but what was somewhat odd was that he didn’t say he didn’t want the family or children in communicaton per se, but just her unless she was invited. It said her husband was an "independent contractor"for the business, so she could talk to him… Very odd you would think it would be everyone, but I suppose they didn’t talk.
Maybe he will or did drop it and that would be more “onward” than before.
 
That’s because you are misunderstanding it. It is not meant to be taken based on your job. It is meant to be taken based on your outlook on life.

See the PDF I have attached and you should understand perfectly.
I know what it says, I read the whole piece several times. I am not misunderstanding it. He is saying that some people are called to be protectors and some are just the sheep, the “pretty blue eggs” with goo inside. The messages are as clear as day. I do not begrudge warriors their calling, but I do not think that most of them think of the rest of us as sheep and I think adopting this frame of reference was one of the things that got Fr. Corapi where he is right now.

Has anyone ever heard him discuss what political ideology he resonates with? I’m thinking it’s Libertarian.
 
I do not begrudge warriors their calling, but I do not think that most of them think of the rest of us as sheep…
It is not about warriors, it is about regular folks who have that attitude and who view the world that way. That is the point.

And actually, having spent many years in that world I can soundly attest that the overwhelming majority do have that attitude. They don’t talk about in public or even with non-combat arms service members because it tends to tick off the people who work in finance and supply, etc. However, when in their own units, that is exactly the way they talk. Every police officer I know and have worked with is the same unless they are driving a desk in an office somewhere or work in a setting where they have to be politically correct.
 
It is not about warriors, it is about regular folks who have that attitude and who view the world that way. That is the point.

And actually, having spent many years in that world I can soundly attest that the overwhelming majority do have that attitude. They don’t talk about in public or even with non-combat arms service members because it tends to tick off the people who work in finance and supply, etc. However, when in their own units, that is exactly the way they talk. Every police officer I know and have worked with is the same unless they are driving a desk in an office somewhere or work in a setting where they have to be politically correct.
Nevertheless, a priest is not a policeman. I agree with Therealjuliane that while this might indeed be how police and soldiers think, it does not resonate with what you read from other priests and religious (canonized or not). We are all called to “fight the good fight” and “preserver to the end”. Yes, Jesus uses the metaphor of sheep, but that is because without Him we have lost our way. I don’t think military metaphors work well in religion.
 
Technology companies make people sign employment agreements that assign all inventions and IP produced during the employment period to the company.

Celebrities make people sign employment agreements that involve gag clauses to not disclose anything that occurred related to the celebrity during the employment period. You are paid according to the value of the employment and what you might be losing by not disclosing the activities of the celebrity. If someone asks you to sign an additional/modified employment contract that restricts your rights after the employment starts, they generally have to compensate you for the loss.

So, retrofitting a gag clause into an employment contract would take additional compensation.

So, the question is not did it happen - SOLT has said that many witnesses are not talking due to employment contracts - the question is why would such a contract be needed.
Exactly the question. Santa Cruz media is not creating new technology, it is not a defense/government contractor, and Fr. Corapi was not supposed to be a celebrity in the Hollywood sense.
 
Nevertheless, a priest is not a policeman. I agree with Therealjuliane that while this might indeed be how police and soldiers think, it does not resonate with what you read from other priests and religious (canonized or not). We are all called to “fight the good fight” and “preserver to the end”. Yes, Jesus uses the metaphor of sheep, but that is because without Him we have lost our way. I don’t think military metaphors work well in religion.
I have no plans to read the quoted military view on this.

I do remember the spiritual view though.
and I’m very fine with it.
Yes, we are sheep.
Yes, we have a shepherd, the Good Shepherd.
We even call the Good Shepherd the “Lamb of God”
as in Agnus Dei, “Lamb of God, You take away the sins
of the wordl … .”

Why would I need or want a sheepdog?

Jesus lives as our Good Shepherd.
He died for us as the Lamb of God.
Please, Lord, may I continue to be one of Your sheep!

from MATT 25:

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit upon his glorious throne,
32 and all the nations will be assembled before him. And he will separate them one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
33 **He will place the sheep on his right **and the goats on his left.
34 **Then the king will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father. Inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. **
35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, a stranger and you welcomed me,
36 naked and you clothed me, ill and you cared for me, in prison and you visited me.’
37 Then the righteous will answer him and say, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?
38 When did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?
39 When did we see you ill or in prison, and visit you?’
40 And the king will say to them in reply, ‘Amen, I say to you, whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me.’”
 
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