Frozen Thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter anon67074017
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
A

anon67074017

Guest
This thread is to discuss the Disney movie Frozen and its connection with Christianity. I myself am quite interested in Frozen. When I first saw it, I was pleasantly surprised because of the film’s European history themes. I am a big history buff. Frozen also has very mild religious themes in it. This is evident when the Duke of Weselton condemns Elsa for sorcery. The magic in the film poses a problem for me as a Christian though. The film teaches that witchcraft is okay. We Catholics know this is not true. The film also promotes a left-wing political agenda based on secular humanism. These reasons are why I am not fully a part of the Frozen fandom. What do you people think of the film?
 
Last time i checked, there is no one that has ice powers…and its loosely based on the fairy tale by hans christian andersen called The Snow Queen.
 
One point that the film makes is that Elsa was born with the powers (it states so explicitly in the beginning). This makes it very different than the promotion of witchcraft which is about invoking the help of demons and the occult. It’s fantasy - nobody is born with magic abilities.

I also have heard accusations of the promotion of secular humanism but frankly, I don’t see it. I think the film is awkwardly constructed (Elsa was originally a villain, and “Let it Go,” which does have some problematic lines, was a villain song), but the overall message is one of sacrificial love. I do think “Let it Go” overshadows the rest of the movie, though, and think it wasn’t a good move (from a thematic standpoint) to have that be the ending credit song, even though it’s the radio version and not the film version.

I have heard parents of children with disabilities (especially autism) praise the film because Elsa reminds them of their children, and how family and society can react in a way that is harmful (which is why Elsa runs away to begin with), but how she integrates at the end and uses her powers for good (and learns to control them better, because she isn’t afraid).
 
This thread is to discuss the Disney movie Frozen and its connection with Christianity. I myself am quite interested in Frozen. When I first saw it, I was pleasantly surprised because of the film’s European history themes. I am a big history buff. Frozen also has very mild religious themes in it. This is evident when the Duke of Weselton condemns Elsa for sorcery. The magic in the film poses a problem for me as a Christian though. The film teaches that witchcraft is okay. We Catholics know this is not true. The film also promotes a left-wing political agenda based on secular humanism. These reasons are why I am not fully a part of the Frozen fandom. What do you people think of the film?
When I saw it I was trying to work out the historical setting for a good part of the film. It seemed like 1800s or early 1900s to me. It appeared to be a Catholic priest who crowned Elsa rather than an Orthodox one, based on the appearance of his vestments. Joan of Arc is name-dropped too during the song “Do you want to build a snowman,” and her picture is shown. She is not venerated in Russian Orthodoxy as far as I know, which is further evidence that the family was Catholic. Perhaps the setting is therefore Poland rather than Russia?

Oh, I just looked it up and the set is apparently based in Norway, which is Lutheran. That explains it. Lutherans might not Venerate Joan of Arc, but they could easily have a picture of her. And the “priest” who crowned Elsa is probably therefore Lutheran. I don’t know why I thought it was Russian.

Some of the technology they had reminded me of the 1800s or early 1900s, but I forget why.
 
This thread is to discuss the Disney movie Frozen and its connection with Christianity. I myself am quite interested in Frozen. When I first saw it, I was pleasantly surprised because of the film’s European history themes. I am a big history buff. Frozen also has very mild religious themes in it. This is evident when the Duke of Weselton condemns Elsa for sorcery. The magic in the film poses a problem for me as a Christian though. The film teaches that witchcraft is okay. We Catholics know this is not true. The film also promotes a left-wing political agenda based on secular humanism. These reasons are why I am not fully a part of the Frozen fandom. What do you people think of the film?
Did Elsa get her powers from bargaining with the devil? This is the technical definition of witchcraft.

As for being a fan of Frozen? I couldn’t be less interested. I’m more of a Harry Potter fan and an even bigger Tolkien fan.
 
Haven’t seen the film and don’t care to, but magical powers by birth are of course the premise of Harry Potter, as well, which is why it’s ironic that that series drew so much fire while the atheistic, anticlerical Golden Compass sailed in undetected.

ICXC NIKA
 
One point that the film makes is that Elsa was born with the powers (it states so explicitly in the beginning). This makes it very different than the promotion of witchcraft which is about invoking the help of demons and the occult. It’s fantasy - nobody is born with magic abilities.

I also have heard accusations of the promotion of secular humanism but frankly, I don’t see it. I think the film is awkwardly constructed (Elsa was originally a villain, and “Let it Go,” which does have some problematic lines, was a villain song), but the overall message is one of sacrificial love. I do think “Let it Go” overshadows the rest of the movie, though, and think it wasn’t a good move (from a thematic standpoint) to have that be the ending credit song, even though it’s the radio version and not the film version.

I have heard parents of children with disabilities (especially autism) praise the film because Elsa reminds them of their children, and how family and society can react in a way that is harmful (which is why Elsa runs away to begin with), but how she integrates at the end and uses her powers for good (and learns to control them better, because she isn’t afraid).
I myself have autism. I relate more with Hans than I do with Elsa. I think Hans may have Asperger’s.
When I saw it I was trying to work out the historical setting for a good part of the film. It seemed like 1800s or early 1900s to me. It appeared to be a Catholic priest who crowned Elsa rather than an Orthodox one, based on the appearance of his vestments. Joan of Arc is name-dropped too during the song “Do you want to build a snowman,” and her picture is shown. She is not venerated in Russian Orthodoxy as far as I know, which is further evidence that the family was Catholic. Perhaps the setting is therefore Poland rather than Russia?

Oh, I just looked it up and the set is apparently based in Norway, which is Lutheran. That explains it. Lutherans might not Venerate Joan of Arc, but they could easily have a picture of her. And the “priest” who crowned Elsa is probably therefore Lutheran. I don’t know why I thought it was Russian.

Some of the technology they had reminded me of the 1800s or early 1900s, but I forget why.
I also thought the film took place in Russia from the previews. I quickly figured out it was Scandinavia. I never thought it took place in Poland. The year it takes place is 1839.
Did Elsa get her powers from bargaining with the devil? This is the technical definition of witchcraft.

As for being a fan of Frozen? I couldn’t be less interested. I’m more of a Harry Potter fan and an even bigger Tolkien fan.
Elsa did not make a deal with the devil herself. I believe her powers come from demonic sources though.
 
The film is fantasy. :confused:

It is not set in a specific time or place; rather, it borrows. The architecture and clothing can be approximately dated, sure, but it’s not meant at all to be historical. Just to have a certain “feel.”

OP, I’m surprised that you would say you relate to Hans (the villain). He’s poorly handled in the film as well (he was originally not supposed to be the villain, but Anna’s actual love interest, and the “twist” is actually too good because nothing in the beginning indicates that he will end up being the bad guy). But once he is shown to be the villain, it’s obvious that his treatment of the characters is absolutely horrendous (and nonsensical - he could have played a “good guy” forever and gotten what he wanted - even if he never killed Elsa as he planned, it was incredibly unlikely she was going to get married, and Anna would have never been the wiser.) I see nothing that says “Asperger’s” about him - he actually preys socially on people very well. That’s more in line with a narcissist or sociopath. :confused:

I also don’t know how you could say that Elsa’s powers have a demonic source. In the real world, yes. But this isn’t real, and the film specifically addresses the question - “born or cursed?” “Born, and getting stronger.” That’s not demonic in origin. 🤷
 
The film is fantasy. :confused:

It is not set in a specific time or place; rather, it borrows. The architecture and clothing can be approximately dated, sure, but it’s not meant at all to be historical. Just to have a certain “feel.”

OP, I’m surprised that you would say you relate to Hans (the villain). He’s poorly handled in the film as well (he was originally not supposed to be the villain, but Anna’s actual love interest, and the “twist” is actually too good because nothing in the beginning indicates that he will end up being the bad guy). But once he is shown to be the villain, it’s obvious that his treatment of the characters is absolutely horrendous (and nonsensical - he could have played a “good guy” forever and gotten what he wanted - even if he never killed Elsa as he planned, it was incredibly unlikely she was going to get married, and Anna would have never been the wiser.) I see nothing that says “Asperger’s” about him - he actually preys socially on people very well. That’s more in line with a narcissist or sociopath. :confused:
Hans is like Napoleon Bonaparte. He was rumored to have Asperger’s.
 
she was BORN with the powers…I very much doubt her parents made some sort of demonic exchange while the mother was pregnant with her. But this is different than say, Harry Potter, who sort of inherited the same sort of abilities from his parents. But in that world, even a child with non magical, normal parents (Hermoine) can have special abilities and those with magical parents can be born without the abilities (Mr Filtch, Mrs Figg)

I am guessing you also consider Narnia to be witchcraft? Because we all know that Narnia is a way of teaching Christianity to young children. Aslan the Lion is Jesus who sacrifices himself in place of Edmund and of course, Rises from the Dead like Jesus did.
The White Witch is like the Devil. Actually, read The Magicians Nephew, the book that actually shows the beginnings of Narnia. Good read.

As for the setting, I would say probably 1700s…and two of my nieces thought it was France because of the Joan of Arc reference. I would say its probably Norway. And it was probably more like a Bishop that was present at the Coronation.
 
Personally I think it is a terrible, half-baked, overly annoying movie that is popular because of one good song. (Of course, this is just my opinion) as far as Christian themes; maybe, but I don’t see them.
 
Hans is like Napoleon Bonaparte. He was rumored to have Asperger’s.
“Is like” does not mean “complete stand-in for.” Can you explain what they have in common? Hans aspired to political power, sure, but lots of people do that. He uses social power to almost get it, too, which is very not-Aspie like.
 
she was BORN with the powers…I very much doubt her parents made some sort of demonic exchange while the mother was pregnant with her. But this is different than say, Harry Potter, who sort of inherited the same sort of abilities from his parents. But in that world, even a child with non magical, normal parents (Hermoine) can have special abilities and those with magical parents can be born without the abilities (Mr Filtch, Mrs Figg)

I am guessing you also consider Narnia to be witchcraft? Because we all know that Narnia is a way of teaching Christianity to young children. Aslan the Lion is Jesus who sacrifices himself in place of Edmund and of course, Rises from the Dead like Jesus did.
The White Witch is like the Devil. Actually, read The Magicians Nephew, the book that actually shows the beginnings of Narnia. Good read.

As for the setting, I would say probably 1700s…and two of my nieces thought it was France because of the Joan of Arc reference. I would say its probably Norway. And it was probably more like a Bishop that was present at the Coronation.
I do not consider Narnia a promoter of witchcraft. It is clearly a Christian allegory. Frozen was made by those who do not know God.
“Is like” does not mean “complete stand-in for.” Can you explain what they have in common? Hans aspired to political power, sure, but lots of people do that. He uses social power to almost get it, too, which is very not-Aspie like.
Hans and Napoleon both desire the best for the citizens. They also both use cunning methods to try to get power.
 
OP, if you’re worried about Frozen being made by people who “do not know God” then you might as well stop watching any movies at all other than obviously “Christian” ones.

Frozen has had an interesting reception in Christian circles. I don’t think it was meant to be a Christian work, but that doesn’t mean it’s not relevant to Christians at all. Some critics were very impressed by the idea that it is Anna’s self-sacrificial love for her sister that saves her, and how Elsa realizes at the end that the key to controlling her powers is love, as opposed to fear. The first is very Christ-like, and the second brings to mind 1 John 4:18, “perfect love casts out fear”.

However, I think those who reject the film simply based on *Let It Go *are oversimplifying the overall message. As pensmama87 notes, Elsa was initially meant to be an outright evil character, and apparently the song was written as a “villain song”. And it’s pretty obvious that evil characters will say evil things, that doesn’t mean the reader or watcher is meant to take them seriously, or agree.

Now, Elsa is not actually evil, just tired of hiding away her powers and being isolated for years. But she develops beyond her “let it go” moment. Elsa quickly finds out that her understandable but selfish desire to “let it go” and let her powers run wild have caused much destruction in her kingdom. When Elsa realizes this, she is remorseful, but doesn’t know what she can do beyond continue to hide, because she does not know how to control her powers. The film wraps up with a rather balanced message, it does not validate the fear-based “conceal, don’t feel” approach, she ends the film using her powers publicly, in a controlled way. But I did not get the message that Elsa was justified in just “letting it go” with no care for the consequences.

As for the fantasy magic aspect of it. I have no problem with it, because I did not get the sense that Elsa’s powers are at all demonic. Her abilities seemed to be closer to ones a mutant in the Marvel*** X-men*** universe would have, somewhat of a combination of Storm and Iceman. Or Frozone in the Incredibles franchise. They simply “are”. Elsa is never portrayed as a witch the way, say, Mother Goethel is in Tangled, though both are likely set in the same quasi-European universe (there’s even a cameo shot of Rapunzel attending Elsa’s coronation).

Note that if fantasy magic were an issue, most Renaissance era Disney movies would be automatically verboten, the only 2 major ones I recall without magic are ***The Incredibles ***and The Lion King, and even that film has Rafiki the pagan shaman, though he doesn’t really do any feats of magic that I can recall.

And even the Classic Disney Cinderella would be off the list because of the “fairy godmother”. I guess ***Snow White ***and ***Sleeping Beauty ***might make the cut because they feature witches who are obviously evil, and defeated at the end.

Little Mermaid, the first of the Rensaissance era movies, also has an obviously evil witch, but King Triton also performs magic and that’s not shown as bad at all.

Anyway, back to Frozen. Another “controversy” was whether the movie sent a pro-LGBT message. But I don’t think that was the main point, much as I don’t think the X-men were originally meant to be, either, the comic was started in the 1960s and meant to parallel the Civil Rights struggle, with Professor X representing MLK and other civil rights activists who were “mainstream”, while Magneto represented the violent radicals – I wasn’t around back then, but apparently Magneto being a Holocaust survivor was NOT part of his original backstory.

Also, if we really think Frozen is an LGBT analogy, it really isn’t that pro-LGBT. The movie never minimizes the dangers that Elsa’s power pose to both her immediate family and her kingdom. I really don’t think it validates the “just be yourself and don’t worry about right or wrong” message in the end.

As noted before, Elsa actually decides to use her powers judiciously to help others, not just frolic in a frozen wasteland while everyone else freezes to death. I’m really not sure exactly what LGBT analogy this would be, unless it’s for the Pope Francis approach to those with SSA, treating them with respect and even acknowledging some same-sex relationships may have merits, but without saying they are equivalent to marriage. This message might mollify some in the LGBT community, but it’s not what the leadership would find acceptable as a final solution.

Though I guess the Duke of Weselton getting his trading rights cut off at the end is actually similar to what many in the LGBT community would like to do to business owners who don’t want to participate in same-sex weddings. But the Duke actually got off easy considering he tried to have Elsa killed.

I also never saw Oaken the store/sauna keeper as homosexual, either. His “family” does include a broad-shouldered adult male, but the man seemed much too young to be a “partner” to a guy with graying hair who’s probably in his 40s-50s. (Unless we want to indulge in the worst sorts of stereotypes about the practices of male homosexuals.) I assumed he was either his oldest son, or a younger brother.
 
It is quite possible that Frozen promotes the LGBT agenda. A significant portion of the fandom wants Elsa to be recognized as a lesbian in the sequel. Another part of the fandom wants Anna and Elsa to be in a romantic relationship. Disney gives possible hints of Anna and Elsa being in a romantic relationship in their printed materials and merchandise. Anna and Elsa even hold hands in the non-canon TV series Once Upon a Time. Olaf the snowman also holds traits common with homosexual men.
 
I myself have autism. I relate more with Hans than I do with Elsa. I think Hans may have Asperger’s.

I also thought the film took place in Russia from the previews. I quickly figured out it was Scandinavia. I never thought it took place in Poland. The year it takes place is 1839.

Elsa did not make a deal with the devil herself. I believe her powers come from demonic sources though.
The devil does not have the ability to grant powers on an individual without their knowledge or consent.
 
It is quite possible that Frozen promotes the LGBT agenda. A significant portion of the fandom wants Elsa to be recognized as a lesbian in the sequel. Another part of the fandom wants Anna and Elsa to be in a romantic relationship. Disney gives possible hints of Anna and Elsa being in a romantic relationship in their printed materials and merchandise. Anna and Elsa even hold hands in the non-canon TV series Once Upon a Time. Olaf the snowman also holds traits common with homosexual men.
You are seeing too much into a children’s film.

It seems to be more of a reflection of your mindset than what is really there.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top