Full Text of Obama's Speech

[JimG]

How are we supposed to encourage others to become pro-life if we can’t even try to understand the “other side’s” reasons for their convictions?

Actually, Obama never gave any reasons for his convictions. He main point seemed to be that we should disagree with kindness.

In fact I very seldom hear pro-choice advocates give reasons for their convictions. Mainly they seem to reiterate that it must be a woman’s choice. But they seldom engage the fact of why it should be a women’s choice for a baby to die. It’s not something we normally allow people to choose in other situations.

 

[JimG]

When the left begins looking for “common ground” that’s Alinsky-speak for get 'em off our agenda by attacking their compassion.

I guess I’m going to have to read Alinsky’s book (Rules for Radicals) in order to understand Obama.

 

[rlg94086]

Don’t worry LoveJesus, I go into forums with a totally different view than the majority and get the same treatment. We don’t hate you, **we are just expressing ourselves in the only way we think that will get the other person thinking. **And don’t forget, we are all passionate about certain things and sometimes our posts reflect that in ways we probably shouldn’t have expressed.

The problem Snerticus, is that our expressions often don’t get through to new posters who come in with a holier-than-thou attitude and immediately demean “us guys” as a group.

Jesus loves us all and is patient with our squabbles. I am thankful for that, since I fall short of the perfection we are called to.

 

[rlg94086]

Actually, Obama never gave any reasons for his convictions. He main point seemed to be that we should disagree with kindness.

In fact I very seldom hear pro-choice advocates give reasons for their convictions. Mainly they seem to reiterate that it must be a woman’s choice. But they seldom engage the fact of why it should be a women’s choice for a baby to die. It’s not something we normally allow people to choose in other situations.

As LoveJesus points out, most pro-choicers don’t consider the unborn child “a baby.” Why? I don’t know. It defies logic and science. The DNA shows a distinct living organism (i.e. not just a tissue sample of another being) and it is definitely human.

 

[7_Sorrows]

i feel sorry for the students who spent hours, months and years studying hard and working towards their degree and i feel sorry for the parents who struggled to raise their children in the Catholic faith and provide for them financially and send them off for a good Catholic education at Notre Dame and 4 years or more later they are asked to sit and listen to this president, who has been very up front about his views on abortion, as they prepare to go out into the world.

someday, some of these students may look back and might wonder about the wisdom of the decision to invite obama to speak.

he is a very insincere person to me and not worthy of addressing a graduating class of graduates from a supposed Catholic university.

 

[redrosetea]

The Nazis used to say shut up and stay in your churches…If that line of reasoning would have been followed we would still have segregation in the south

It was the churches that spearhead the civil rights protests, and they did so with peaceful assembly…It was the govt that used fire hoses and dogs on them

I will not roll over and play dead just because some people think I should…My son served 9 years aboard a submarine for my right to free speech and the right to assemble peacefully

 

[JReducation]

If he hadn’t mentioned abortion and ESCR during his speech, what would people think? That he’s too scared to address the issues? He’s damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t. If these issues are so important to the Catholics at ND I don’t see a problem with him mentioning it. Weren’t people speaking out about these issues just weeks before the Commencement? I don’t think he swayed his audience with his speech. I would hope that they are intelligent enough to hear a different side of an argument without jumping to conclusions.

From his speech:
*Understand - I do not suggest that the debate surrounding abortion can or should go away. No matter how much we may want to fudge it - indeed, while we know that the views of most Americans on the subject are complex and even contradictory - the fact is that at some level, the views of the two camps are irreconcilable. Each side will continue to make its case to the public with passion and conviction. But surely we can do so without reducing those with differing views to caricature.

Open hearts. Open minds. Fair-minded words. *
…

*The soldier and the lawyer may both love this country with equal passion, and yet reach very different conclusions on the specific steps needed to protect us from harm. The gay activist and the evangelical pastor may both deplore the ravages of HIV/AIDS, but find themselves unable to bridge the cultural divide that might unite their efforts. Those who speak out against stem cell research may be rooted in admirable conviction about the sacredness of life, but so are the parents of a child with juvenile diabetes who are convinced that their son’s or daughter’s hardships can be relieved.

The question, then, is how do we work through these conflicts? Is it possible for us to join hands in common effort? As citizens of a vibrant and varied democracy, how do we engage in vigorous debate? How does each of us remain firm in our principles, and fight for what we consider right, without demonizing those with just as strongly held convictions on the other side*?

How are we supposed to encourage others to become pro-life if we can’t even try to understand the “other side’s” reasons for their convictions?

There are two points here.

1. This is a Catholic school. The President knows as well as anyone that this subject is not negotiable with Catholics. To bring them up as something that can be debated to find some common ground, was inappropriate for the setting. It was also misleading to a younger audience who may not really understand that these issues are not negotiable. He did try to back peddle by saying that the pro-life and pro-choice positions were irreconcileable, but he managed to deliver his message. Even the Holy Father did not mention Jesus when he prayed at the mosque and the synagogue during his trip to the Middle East. You can respect your audience without selling yourself short on your beliefs.
2. Mr. Obama was invited to speak at a graduation. The president of IBM does not speak at a commencement to recruit. He speaks to inspire the young adults transitioning from one developmental stage to another. Mr. Obama spent more time recruiting for his political vision than he did inspiring these young men and women to take their place in society.

Fraternally,

JR

 

[cathgal]

Thank you for your kind, fair-minded words, sister cathgal.

I mentioned in one of my previous posts that I myself used to think on the “other side.”

Tell me what you think are the reasons for the “other side’s” convictions?

I’m not sure if they have any conviction, but only denial.

The problem of the matter is, the unborn is not a human person in their view.

Now, are they convinced of this view?

I believe there are 4 groups of pro-abort people:

1. the ignorant – their only source of education is from the leftist; as long as they’re ignorant, they’re convinced
2. the fearful – it’s easier to rid the helpless human being than suffer the consequence
3. the denial – know that the unborn is truly a human person just like themselves but denying it in order to live the life they want without feeling any guilt and the agendas driven; they’re convinced as long as they avoid the ‘issue’

Take Obama for example. When asked when human life begins, he said it is above his pay grade to answer it.

1. the know-but-don’t-care – no conviction for abortion

The ignorant may be the only one who is sincerely convinced.

 

[JReducation]

I’m not sure if they have any conviction, but only denial.

The problem of the matter is, the unborn is not a human person in their view.

Now, are they convinced of this view?

I believe there are 4 groups of pro-abort people:

1. the ignorant – their only source of education is from the leftist; as long as they’re ignorant, they’re convinced
2. the fearful – it’s easier to rid the helpless human being than suffer the consequence
3. the denial – know that the unborn is truly a human person just like themselves but denying it in order to live the life they want without feeling any guilt and the agendas driven; they’re convinced as long as they avoid the ‘issue’

Take Obama for example. When asked when human life begins, he said it is above his pay grade to answer it.

1. the know-but-don’t-care – no conviction for abortion

The ignorant may be the only one who is sincerely convinced.

The truly ignorant and the gravely fearful are probably the only two people in this group for whom the culpability is mitigated. Ignorance and fear can distort perceptions and cripple subjective judgment.

Fraternally,

JR

 

[redrosetea]

I found nothing fair minded in Obamas speech at all…Since when it is fair to save someones life by murdering an innocent victim?

Why should he push his views in a commencement speech? This was not supposed to be a bully pulpit …

He used his bully pulpit to further his own agenda, which was the actions of a dictator, and not a statesman

 

[JReducation]

I found nothing fair minded in Obamas speech at all…Since when it is fair to save someones life by murdering an innocent victim?

Why should he push his views in a commencement speech? This was not supposed to be a bully pulpit …

He used his bully pulpit to further his own agenda, which was the actions of a dictator, and not a statesman

From my position, as the son of a former diplomat, this presentation lacked diplomacy at many levels. My father always said, “Never tell the other side, ‘We need to find common ground,’ show them the common ground.” Mr. Obama did not do that.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[redrosetea]

I found his references to God very disingenuous…What God does he serve?

Abortion was forbidden in the OT and the NT and the Didache…so I was very unimpressed with his mentioning of God…It made him look worse than it would if he said nothing

He should have just spoken about things that would inspire the graduates, and left the rest out

I think he came to ND with his own agenda and he used it

 

[MarcoPolo]

Thank you for taking my first quote out of context to try and paint me as someone who likes the fact that babies are being killed. Please read what I wrote after it.

There’s passion, and then there’s fanaticism. I feel like some people are using this forum as an outlet to express their anger at the going ons of the world and that’s just fine, but what is it doing for those (on earth and not) who are suffering right now? Or is this a place for people to brag that they’re better Christians than others?

I don’t think I took your post out of context. Perhaps it would be helpful to get to know some of the posters here before making accusations. People have every right to state what they think about the event. Come to the Prayer Intentions forum and see what we’re “doing for those suffering.” Or visit the Family Life forum and see those who are active at their churches. Many of them are probably the same people you are accusing of thinking they are better than others.

 

[CatholicBoy1957]

The subject is Obama’s speech at ND. I hope I digress not far at all if I mention this article

politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/05/18/cnn-poll-abortion-not-hurting-obama/

May 18, 2009
CNN Poll: Abortion not hurting Obama
Posted: 05:09 PM ET

A new CNN poll gives President Obama a 62 percent approval rating.
WASHINGTON (CNN) – Six in ten Americans continue to approve of how Barack Obama is handling his job as president — and despite the controversy over Obama’s appearance at Notre Dame on Sunday, Catholics have a high opinion of him, according to a new CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll.

How did CNN finagle the poll to show no difference between Catholics that do attend mass, and those that don’t?

 

[LoveJesus]

I don’t think I took your post out of context. Perhaps it would be helpful to get to know some of the posters here before making accusations. People have every right to state what they think about the event. Come to the Prayer Intentions forum and see what we’re “doing for those suffering.” Or visit the Family Life forum and see those who are active at their churches. Many of them are probably the same people you are accusing of thinking they are better than others.

out of context: without the surrounding words or circumstances and so not fully understandable I looked up the phrase in the dictionary because I wanted to make sure that I knew what I was referring to.

Since I’ve started posting here I’ve already been accused of being a baiter and gasp! voting for Obama (perhaps because I haven’t called him the Antichrist yet?). Perhaps if you got to know me, those accusation wouldn’t be made.

As I’ve mentioned before I’ve spent about four months lurking here…reading through the forum, so I am familiar with those areas that you mentioned, thanks. I’ve even grown to admire some certain posters’ calm and thoughtful comments (such as JReducation) and always look forward to reading them. But I can’t help noticing the difference in posters’ attitudes between the different subforums. I notice a lot more hostility on this subforum and the Liturgy & Sacraments forum than on the Prayer Intentions and Spirituality forums, for example. I’m just confused as to why there’s a difference? Why can’t the latter attitudes be brought here as well?

But I’m just new here. So what do I know?

No harm. I don’t seem to feel welcome on this thread so I’ll just leave here and explore other places. If it makes you happy… So much the welcome message…

 

[Tsuwano]

I thought the President’s speech at Notre Dame was somewhat bland and mediocre, as most commencement speeches tend to be, but I thought it was generally fair and courteous toward his Catholic hosts. (Yes, I know that many will say that Notre Dame is no longer a Catholic institution, but I’m not going to get in that argument.) I think it would have been disingenious if Obama had ignored the controversy surrounding his views on abortion and stem cell research and I think it was good for him to mention the differences of opinions in his speech. I don’t think anyone is ignorant of either Obama’s views on the subject or the Church’s position. I think it is notable that Obama called for continued dialogue and seemed to recognize a place for the Church in this continuing discussion. He also seemed to repudiate the view that would label those who support the right to life as ideologues or even “terrorists” and this, considering the language the Obama Administration has used in the past, seems to be a positive advance in my opinion. He recognized the importance of Christian action in the life of the nation, which to me seems to support, if back - handedly, continued pro life efforts to pursuade the nation to reject the evil of abortion. Obama certainly wasn’t going to change his personal views on the subject of abortion in this speech, but I think he has been surprised and perhaps even influenced by the vibrant energy and intensity of the pro life position. Again, I don’t think this was a great speech, and certainly not as eloquent as some of his past speeches have been, but to me it seemed apprehensive, perhaps a bit doubtful, about the one sided approach his Administration has taken on some of these issues. Perhaps he has been influenced (politically speaking) by the recent poll showing that a majority of Americans now support limits on abortion and is putting his finger to the wind. I don’t know, but I certainly don’t think the pro abortion people will be satisfied or pleased with this speech and will soon begin demanding that Obama reiterate his support for abortion. I think he will give it to them, but like Bill Clinton during his first administration, he will begin looking over his shoulder to see exactly how much political damage he will have to suffer due to this support. I think now is a good time for pro life activists to begin letting the Administration know they are alive and present in the public arena, not by constantly condemning Obama for his support of abortion, but by taking the fight to the people and drumming up grass roots support that will win elections on local levels.

 

[St_Francis]

out of context: without the surrounding words or circumstances and so not fully understandable I looked up the phrase in the dictionary because I wanted to make sure that I knew what I was referring to.

Since I’ve started posting here I’ve already been accused of being a baiter and gasp! voting for Obama (perhaps because I haven’t called him the Antichrist yet?). Perhaps if you got to know me, those accusation wouldn’t be made.

As I’ve mentioned before I’ve spent about four months lurking here…reading through the forum, so I am familiar with those areas that you mentioned, thanks. I’ve even grown to admire some certain posters’ calm and thoughtful comments (such as JReducation) and always look forward to reading them. But I can’t help noticing the difference in posters’ attitudes between the different subforums. I notice a lot more hostility on this subforum and the Liturgy & Sacraments forum than on the Prayer Intentions and Spirituality forums, for example. I’m just confused as to why there’s a difference? Why can’t the latter attitudes be brought here as well?

But I’m just new here. So what do I know?

No harm. I don’t seem to feel welcome on this thread so I’ll just leave here and explore other places. If it makes you happy… So much the welcome message…

I thought you made a lot of good points but you started with, “Y’all aren’t showing a lot of love here…” which is all too often the way a liberal starts or ends his series of comments. It’s a liberal tactic to run down the other person (argumentum ad hominem) in an effort to get him to listen to liberal baloney.

Reading your following comments, I thought you made some good points, and I think that they would make for some good discussion.

One of your questions was whether we had considered the point of view of the other side. I certainly have. I was very uninvolved in politics for many years but started getting interested again because of the differences. I wanted to understand the point of view of the other side. It has taken me several years to get to this point, and I have a ways to go, but it has taken so long mostly because I find it difficult to believe that people could be so very insincere and untruthful. I don’t see how there could be a conspiracy, but I certainly understand why people think there is!

What you see as lack of charity is simply our being here among fellow Catholics. If I feel outraged by Obama’s speech, I can’t discuss that with my mother or my siblings. My family is not set up for debate, but this place is. So yeah, it gets rough and tumble, but stays within reasonable bounds.

 

[crazyage3]

You’re right. Of course the Catholic Church speaks out on these problems. But I’m referring to the Catholic Church in America. There is a difference in the way the Church in America teaches (or doesn’t teach) its principles to the laity. Most priests here (of course, there are some good ones) are afraid to tell it like it is for fear of “scaring” people away. And it’s not working anyway. People who just go to Mass out of habit…or force themselves to just sit there and endure that hour will look for the most frivolous excuse not to go to Mass.

You have put words in my mouth. I have never said that we shouldn’t speak out over abortion. Of course we should, but I think we should speak out even more about the underlying factors that lead to abortion.

I hope that you will continue to grow in your understanding of Church teaching. It is a long path for all of us. I said in my post (and by your reply I think that you’ve misunderstood me) that abortion is a result of disobedience. The sin of abortion is committed when one wants to hide their disobedience to the sexual teachings of God.

When the general Catholic population in America can’t even bring themselves to attend Mass every week (and when they do, they run out right after Communion or during the recessional hymn), or avoid Confession but still take Communion, I see a problem with the with the Church’s approach to educating their laity. How many times has anyone here heard the priest say before Communion that only those who are baptized, in full communion with the Church, and in a state of grace through Confession are allowed to receive the Body and Blood of Christ?

I honestly don’t think ND was praising Obama for his stance on abortion. I think it was for the fact that he is the first African-American President of the US.

Of course I think abortion should be illegal, but it’s not going to stop abortions for good in a society that views children as commodities instead of gifts from God.

WHOA!!! the Roman Catholic Church should be the same all across the world! If someone here in the states is preaching different then what the Church teaches , then it is possible heresy! ONE HOLY ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH…not the US Catholic or Rome Catholic CHurch! WE ARE ONE!!!
And despite how babies are concieved through sin (invitro, rape, unmarried sex, artifiical insemination etc) or not , they are still a gift and blessing and shouldnt be considered a product of sin.

 

[cathgal]

From my position, as the son of a former diplomat, this presentation lacked diplomacy at many levels. My father always said, “Never tell the other side, ‘We need to find common ground,’ show them the common ground.” Mr. Obama did not do that.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Common ground my !

After re-instating the Mexico Policy, he dares to call for common ground??

He should save his saliva for his secular speech

 

[LoveJesus]

I thought you made a lot of good points but you started with, “Y’all aren’t showing a lot of love here…” which is all too often the way a liberal starts or ends his series of comments. It’s a liberal tactic to run down the other person (argumentum ad hominem) in an effort to get him to listen to liberal baloney.

Reading your following comments, I thought you made some good points, and I think that they would make for some good discussion.

One of your questions was whether we had considered the point of view of the other side. I certainly have. I was very uninvolved in politics for many years but started getting interested again because of the differences. I wanted to understand the point of view of the other side. It has taken me several years to get to this point, and I have a ways to go, but it has taken so long mostly because I find it difficult to believe that people could be so very insincere and untruthful. I don’t see how there could be a conspiracy, but I certainly understand why people think there is!

What you see as lack of charity is simply our being here among fellow Catholics. If I feel outraged by Obama’s speech, I can’t discuss that with my mother or my siblings. My family is not set up for debate, but this place is. So yeah, it gets rough and tumble, but stays within reasonable bounds.

Thanks for explaining that to me. I made that “not showing a lot of love here comment” because that’s what I perceived as I was reading this forum (particularly this section).

WHOA!!! the Roman Catholic Church should be the same all across the world! If someone here in the states is preaching different then what the Church teaches , then it is possible heresy! ONE HOLY ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH…not the US Catholic or Rome Catholic CHurch! WE ARE ONE!!!
And despite how babies are concieved through sin (invitro, rape, unmarried sex, artifiical insemination etc) or not , they are still a gift and blessing and shouldnt be considered a product of sin.

Why are you yelling? Of course the Catholic Church is universal, but there are cultural differences in the way the members of the Church teach and conduct themselves. That is what I am referring to. Ask any Catholic who’s ever emigrated from another part of the world (i.e. Latin America, Africa) to this country and they will tell you that there is a difference. For example, I once learned from a Puerto Rican Catholic tht when girls celebrate their quinceanera, there is a Mass celebrated for them (and they participate in it more). To her dismay, she can’t find a church here that will do that for her daughter’s upcoming quinceanera. I will also tell you that in Puerto Rico there is a much bigger emphasis on the celebration of Good Friday…probably on par with or even more than Easter.

And I never said that a child is a product of sin. I said that the sin of abortion is a product of the sin of disobedience.