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scipio337
Guest
And the SEIU in St. Louis do not have that great of a reputation.
I didn’t realize there were so many fellow St. Louisans on the boards.
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I didn’t realize there were so many fellow St. Louisans on the boards.
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jjdrury81
Guest
Employers can and do bend or break the law to keep unions out. Union busting law firms are a multi-million dollar business in the US.
amazon.com/Confessions-Union-Buster-Marty-Levitt/dp/0517583305
Did you not know this?
Suudy
Active member
You mean democracy is damaged by a secret ballot? Do you think the elections for president or governor would be more democratic if there wasn’t a secret ballot?
By the way, breaking existing labor laws to intimidate employees is already illegal. Perhaps you should look at having existing laws enforced, rather than completely revamp the entire system.
What is preventing “pathways for billions to be invested in alternative energy and green technology sources”? How would C&T do this, other than forcibly moving dollars from one company to another? Unless you think confiscating from one to give to another is noble… Ah, that’s right, you think oil evil, and green good, thus the ends are more important than the means. I see.
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jjdrury81
Guest
The argument for the Employee Free Choice Act is well laid out below. The AFL-CIO has addressed every concern brought up in this thread and then some. If you want get us out of this recession and do so in a meaningful way that will last for many years and not merely create another bubble, you should call your senator/congressman and tell them to support this legislation.
aflcio.org/joinaunion/voiceatwork/efca/qna.cfm
aflcio.org/joinaunion/voiceatwork/efca/qna.cfm
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qui_est_ce
Guest
Well, I guess since our company doesn’t engage in illegal acts, I wouldn’t know about that. And SOME companies being illegal doesn’t give the union the green light.
Have you ever been in a building when they bus in a bunch of homeless people who shout obscenities while they try to bang your door down?
That’s why we now have security doors in our lobby.
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bbarrick8383
Guest
Hey, isn’t the AFL-CIO the I guess “umbrella” union for border security?
Don’t they also promote open borders?
Ironic.
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qui_est_ce
Guest
EFCA is a misnomer. How do you address the valid issue I brought up? NO SECRET BALLOT.
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Rich_Olszewski
Guest
This is a fact. I was appalled when a high school friend of mine, a Catholic, told me at our 50th Reunion that he worked for such a union-busting law firm.
IMO, better had he said that his full time work was the defense of the worst of paedorasts.
(For the record, both paedorasts and union busters are entitled to legal counsel.)
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scipio337
Guest
Unions are a multi-Billion business in the US, and also participate in some pretty shady practices.
amazon.com/Solidarity-Sale-Corruption-Destroyed-Undermined/dp/189162072X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277399030&sr=1-2
amazon.com/Mobsters-Unions-Feds-American-Movement/dp/0814742947/ref=pd_cp_b_1
amazon.com/Power-Greed-Inside-Teamsters-Corruption/dp/0531151050/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277399030&sr=1-6
Didn’t you know this?
Suudy
Active member
Really, an AFL-CIO website to give us an impartial view on the EFCA?
And even their arguments ignore the one crucial issue that bothers most of us here: open ballots. Fine the NRLA is weak and spineless. Fine, guarantee a contract. These are things I could be persuaded to agree with. Open ballots? Heck no.
No, it hasn’t. It calls it “majority sign-up” but that is a euphemism for “open ballot”. If you think there is intimidation by companies on secret ballots, imagine what will happen by the unions if card-check passes. If the concern is that companies are managing the elections, or that the NRLA is failing to administer them fairly, perhaps that needs to change. But wiping out the secret ballot is *not *the solution.
This is the craziest thing I’ve ever heard.
More unionization is going to end the recession? What?:hypno:
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scipio337
Guest
I’ve heard that unions never rely on attorneys, but rather, the vigor and justice of their cause.
No, wait a minute…
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jjdrury81
Guest
Absolutely. Look at how strong our economy was when we had a strong and vibrant unionized workforce. Wages were up across the board - for both union and non-union member alike. This was no coincidence.
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scipio337
Guest
This thread went waaaaay off topic…
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Ridgerunner
Guest
Card check is as anti-democratic a device as could possibly be imagined. It would be like having to vote on an open table with Black Panthers like those Holder didn’t want to prosecute, standing over you telling you how to vote. But then, the left spent the 20th century proving how anti-democratic it really is, so it’s no surprise it would favor Card check.
I do not, on the other hand, doubt that Cap and Trade would, indeed, open “billions” for investment in green energy projects. The problem is, though, that it would be me and millions of other users of energy who would be handing those “billions” over to government-favored corporations to pay for devices and processes that are not, in themselves, economically viable. Fiat economies tend not to work very well, as socialism amply proved in the 20th century. That, of course, does not prevent the left from favoring them.
Suudy
Active member
I see no evidence they are linked, your assertion otherwise. I say it was the economy that brought up wages for both union and non-union members, not the unions.
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GaryTaylor
Guest
Heres the real problem as I see it. Obama has made many promise’s to remove troops from Afkan starting 2011. As wee move into next year I see no way on earth that Petraeus can do his job and do this. Either the war will be extended and Obama will have to once again shuffle to amend his words. Or there will be a conflict with Petraeus though what he advises Obama do do in war.
This war is going to excalate not decrease next year. Many senerios can be assumed from that. But I’m focusing on how this will effect Obama/Petraeus. And how Obama will react to the escalation of War. It becomes a double edged sword. You can’t talk peace and troop removal while you send a War Monger to lead the War. The assessment from Petraeus will be no different than it was from McChyrstal. Two Very very similar leaders. Educated in the same place at the same basic time by the same teachers and authoritys on War. One will not view the strategy war any different that the other.
Where the complication comes is when Obama then realizes he has to follow his advice now? Or once again look foolish. Don’t expect a different assessment of our situation in Afkan from Petraeus. His job is to win and thats what he will set out to do. Through attrition if need be.
As far as the twist this tread took. We need to get the male population of the US back to work. The areas most effected by this economy right now, is the construction and manufacturing area?
This war is going to excalate not decrease next year. Many senerios can be assumed from that. But I’m focusing on how this will effect Obama/Petraeus. And how Obama will react to the escalation of War. It becomes a double edged sword. You can’t talk peace and troop removal while you send a War Monger to lead the War. The assessment from Petraeus will be no different than it was from McChyrstal. Two Very very similar leaders. Educated in the same place at the same basic time by the same teachers and authoritys on War. One will not view the strategy war any different that the other.
Where the complication comes is when Obama then realizes he has to follow his advice now? Or once again look foolish. Don’t expect a different assessment of our situation in Afkan from Petraeus. His job is to win and thats what he will set out to do. Through attrition if need be.
As far as the twist this tread took. We need to get the male population of the US back to work. The areas most effected by this economy right now, is the construction and manufacturing area?
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7_Sorrows
Guest
yes! you are right about him getting an appointment with Obama quicker with this magazine article than he did when McChrystal wanted to meet with the president earlier to discuss the war. go figure! 
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Guyonthestreet
Guest
Joke currently doing the rounds where I am regarding the world cup:Yes-because it is staffed with foriegners!
It’s all sounding very familiar - the French give up, the Americans turn up late, and the English are left to face the Germans.
O/T sorry and if you dont follow soccer it will make no sense lol.
On Topic to the slightly off topic comments - I’m French by ‘‘spilled blood’’ and service. Although I served France for 25 years, we always consider the Legion our homeland, never France.
A lot of forces came to train with us in Africa - in Djibuti and elsewhere. The American Marines still hold the record, never beaten as far as I know, for the slowest ever completion of one of our courses.
As to IDF v. La Légion scenario - discretion is the better part of valor. The IDF would have the good sense not to even try.
Our Volunteers are feared the world over, IDF conscripts wouldnt scare Scoobydoo. 
Obama - as CIC it was the only choice he could make and retain any semblence of credibility.
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scipio337
Guest
Legionnaire, eh? Can’t admit I’ve met any, well at least not outside of prison.Joke currently doing the rounds where I am regarding the world cup:
It’s all sounding very familiar - the French give up, the Americans turn up late, and the English are left to face the Germans.
O/T sorry and if you dont follow soccer it will make no sense lol.
On Topic to the slightly off topic comments - I’m French by ‘‘spilled blood’’ and service. Although I served France for 25 years, we always consider the Legion our homeland, never France.
A lot of forces came to train with us in Africa - in Djibuti and elsewhere. The American Marines still hold the record, never beaten as far as I know, for the slowest ever completion of one of our courses.
As to IDF v. La Légion scenario - discretion is the better part of valor. The IDF would have the good sense not to even try.
Obama - as CIC it was the only choice he could make and retain any semblence of credibility.
And never send a Marine to do a 75th RR or 10th Mountain man’s job!
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EmperorNapoleon
Guest
Combined NATO, additional American, and Afghan forces already outnumber the enemy forces by a margin of three to one. If Petraeus wants more troops, and I believe he does, he’ll have to explain why we haven’t made much progress in nearly 9 years of war despite that advantage, why he thinks sending more will make a difference, and provide clear objectives. I suspect that McChrystal would have been sacked eventually anyway for his failures. Lets hope Petraeus doesn’t make the same mistakes.
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