Garabandal Status?

[BobCatholic]

Regarding your quote, I truly understand that you want to protect others from the* “liar in the red suit” and I applaud you for it. My concern is that, if we recognize our limitations,* we are not qualified to really determine for sure where the “guy with the red suit” is:

Well, I know one thing is that the Church has the power of the keys. The guy with the red suit will always tell people to rebel against that authority.

Padre Pio was wrongly put under an order by the Church, and he humbly obeyed. So did all the other saints who were wrongly ordered by the Church. Yes, they were vindicated in the end, but then again so is the Church.

Humble obedience to the Church is in the scriptures. The guy in the red suit will always go against obedience to the Church and encourage others to do so.

Yes, I can be wrong. But I rely on Christ who can’t be wrong. And he says about the Church: He who hears you hears me.

I’m listening.

Oh, and get me some Boston Cremes. [SIGN]Yum…Boston Creme…[/SIGN]

 

[Edward_Henry]

Well, I know one thing is that the Church has the power of the keys.

This is why I believe that the safest way not too commit and injustice towards a person like Padre Pio or a visionary, is to not anticipate but to await the final judgement of Holy Mother Church.

And we are not *telling people to rebel against the Church *by not bullying forum members into submission to our personal position towards a certain reported apparition. We cannot take away from them the very gift tha God has given them… Free Will.

Remember, the Fatima parish priest unfortunatelly was wrong when he told little Lucia that it was the devil who was appearing to her… I wouldn’t want to make that kind of mistake so I wait for Holy Mother Church’s decision.

Now you got me thinking about the Boston Cremes. There goes a trip to the donut shop. [SIGN]Yum…Boston Creme…[/SIGN]

 

[adrift]

This is why I believe that the safest way not too commit and injustice towards a person like Padre Pio or a visionary, is to not anticipate but to await the final judgement of Holy Mother Church.

Until I see a statement that is reliable from St Pio I think it is an injustice to say he approved this apparition. The truth is the claim comes from hearsay. The Church has spoken through the Bishops who say that they cannot say it is supernatural and Allow the Eucharist to be celebrated only in the Church.

And we are not *telling people to rebel against the Church *by not bullying forum members into submission to our personal position towards a certain reported apparition. We cannot take away from them the very gift tha God has given them… Free Will.

You aren’t? You try to bully people into submitting toward a personal position not what the Bishops say.

Remember, the Fatima parish priest unfortunatelly was wrong when he told little Lucia that it was the devil who was appearing to her… I wouldn’t want to make that kind of mistake so I wait for Holy Mother Church’s decision.

The parsih priest is not the one who determines worth of belief. The Bishop is and the decision has been made despite your attempt to make out to be only our personnal beliefs.

 

[brumano]

There are a number of profound approved apparitions that are credible. Like Our Lady of Good Help in Wisconsin approved in December of 2012 right here in the USA. It is worthy of devotion. Check it out.

How and where?

 

[adrift]

How and where?

How and Where

 

[brumano]

This is why I believe that the safest way not too commit and injustice towards a person like Padre Pio or a visionary, is to not anticipate but to await the final judgement of Holy Mother Church.

And we are not *telling people to rebel against the Church *by not bullying forum members into submission to our personal position towards a certain reported apparition. We cannot take away from them the very gift tha God has given them… Free Will.

Remember, the Fatima parish priest unfortunatelly was wrong when he told little Lucia that it was the devil who was appearing to her… I wouldn’t want to make that kind of mistake so I wait for Holy Mother Church’s decision.

Now you got me thinking about the Boston Cremes. There goes a trip to the donut shop. [SIGN]Yum…Boston Creme…[/SIGN]

I think yours is a fair and reasonable post; and I don’t think everyone who reports private revelation should be automatically deemed nuts or a fake, at the same time I think it is wise for the church to take a basically stringent, and protective approach towards all extraordinary claims. Have another Boston Creme.

 

[Edward_Henry]

Dear Adrift,

I am afraid that while you continuosly present your position you* not *might be taking the time to read what others post.

I clearly wrote in **post #70 **of this long and repetitive thread:

I am not speaking for nor against the events of Garabandal, I am not qualified, only against these neverending threads filled with personal accusatory opinions.

If you have read my posts, you might have observed that I have not addressed Garabandal nor a personal position about it in any of my posts. * I am not qualified *to pass a judgement on it, only Mother Church.

What I have tried to convey in this thread is that those who do not believe should not* bully *others out of their right to investigate or look into it. Let’s let their obedience to Holy Mother Church’s *final decision *take care of that.

At this point, if your are truly exercising “loving correction” towards other members:
You express your “personal opinion” once, recognizing that you do not have Church authority, and once you have expressed it, you back off, respecting the right of others to listen to your opinion or to ignore it and continue to follow their spirituality.

But what I have observed in our forum is something different. There seems to be a group of forum members who scan the list of threads continuously like a "forum police" and the moment that certain **redflag topics which they object, come up like “Third Secret”, “Garabandal”, “Medjugorge” they rush into that thread to express their “infalible opinions” in a rather forceful way.

Now, based on this past quote, please permit me to ask you a question:
** Have you already shared with the forum members your personal belief and position towards Garabandal?
Have you respectedly backed off and permitted them to make up their mind?
Or, are persistingly repeating your anti-Garabandal feelings by repeatedly presenting links and quotes?

This behavior, as I wrote before:

I just meant to give you a warning to the fact that these intellectual strategies do not usually reach hearts… they rather turn them off.

In summary, all I am trying to convey is: Let’s charitably respect others and not use this forum to unconsciously try to bully other forum members into accepting our position.

Please do not let this observation appear as a personal attack against your spirituality. We should all as Catholics agree to respect others’ free will and share some donuts!

 

[thistle]

Why are we still discussing Garabandal?
The Church has already made its decision and that decision is that there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings.

 

[adrift]

Dear Adrift,

I am afraid that while you continuously present your position you* not *might be taking the time to read what others post.

Wow! You just can’t write a post without ad hominems.

I clearly wrote in **post #70 **of this long and repetitive thread

I am not speaking for nor against the events of Garabandal, I am not qualified, only against these neverending threads filled with personal accusatory opinions.

Accusatory? The only accusation I find is the ones you make.

If you have read my posts, you might have observed that I have not addressed Garabandal nor a personal position about it in any of my posts. * I am not qualified *to pass a judgment on it, only Mother Church.

You have been presented with the judgment of the Church only to turn and attack those who do.

What I have tried to convey in this thread is that those who do not believe should not* bully *others out of their right to investigate or look into it. Let’s let their obedience to Holy Mother Church’s *final decision *take care of that.

Those who wish to comment should not be bullied into silence because another poster thinks that they have said enough. The only one who has a right to investigate is the Church. Which is what was asked

I’m having trouble determining the Church’s position on Garabandal.

to bad you have made this about the posters and not about the topic of the thread.

Now, based on this past quote, please permit me to ask you a question:
** Have you already shared with the forum members your personal belief and position towards Garabandal?**
No I have not. I have only stated the position of the Bishops who are the only ones who can make a decision.

Have you respectedly *backed off *

and permitted them to make up their mind?
Or, are persistingly repeating your anti-Garabandal feelings by repeatedly presenting links and quotes?

Have you repeatedly made ad hominen attacks? Yes. How condescending of you. Have you backed off after making your position know or do you continue to attack?

In summary, all I am trying to convey is: Let’s charitably respect others and not use this forum to unconsciously try to bully other forum members into accepting our position.

Look in the mirror and follow your own advise

Please do not let this observation appear as a personal attack against your spirituality. We should all as Catholics agree to respect others’ free will and share some donuts!

This is a personal attack. Since you can’t deny what the Bishops say, you attack the messenger.

 

[Edward_Henry]

Wow! You just can’t write a post without ad hominems.

Accusatory? The only accusation I find is the ones you make.

You have been presented with the judgment of the Church only to turn and attack those who do.

Those who wish to comment should not be bullied into silence because another poster thinks that they have said enough. The only one who has a right to investigate is the Church. Which is what was asked to bad you have made this about the posters and not about the topic of the thread.

No I have not. I have only stated the position of the Bishops who are the only ones who can make a decision.

Have you repeatedly made ad hominen attacks? Yes. How condescending of you. Have you backed off after making your position know or do you continue to attack?

Look in the mirror and follow your own advise

This is a personal attack. Since you can’t deny what the Bishops say, you attack the messenger.

Wow this is tougher than I thought. This is why I really pondered and pondered before I became involved in this thread. I have failed and I give up. I have said what I was going to say.

May God bless us and guide us all.

 

[EIRCOMNET]

I have studied Garabandal since around 1971. I lectured on it for many years. I have no interest in ramming my belief in the apparitions down people’s throats, but I do believe that if the events are true (as I believe), they should be studied carefully before being written off. I met the blind apostle Joey on more than one occasion & in my judgement he is a most sincere man and I have no doubt that his encounter with Padre Pio is a true account.
I find that many people who have not made a study of the apparitions make all kinds of half baked statements about them. I would also humbly suggest that people should approach the matter in a spiritual way, ever ready to ask Our Lady for guidance.
As for the Church’s attitude one could do worse than read the interview given by Bishop del Val who was on the original Commision which studied the on-going events. garabandal.org/vigil/interview.shtml

I do not wish to get involved in controversy but I am always happy to try and clarify any difficulties people might have when they come to study these events.

 

[jmjconder]

How and where?

Approved Marian appariation in NE WI, by Bishop David Ricken on December 8, 2011.

**Bishop David Ricken announced on Wednesday, December 8th, that he officially approves the Marian apparitions that occurred on the the site of the Shrine of Our Lady of Good Help. The announcement was made during a special Mass for the Feast of the Immaculate Conception held at the Shrine which is located at Champion, Wisconsin.

Reading from his decree, the Bishop stated, “I declare with moral certainty and in accord with the norms of the Church that the events, apparitions and locutions given to Adele Brise in October of 1859 do exhibit the substance of supernatural character, and I do hereby approve these apparitions as worthy of belief (although not obligatory) by the Christian faithful.”

This declaration makes the Shrine of Our Lady of Good Help at Champion the first and only Marian shrine in the United States that is on the site of an approved apparition of the Blessed Virgin Mary. While the Bishops of Green Bay had given full support of the Shrine throughout its history as a place of prayer and pilgrimage, the Apparitions have never received formal Church approval. Along with his decree on the apparitions, Bishop Ricken further approved the Shrine of Our Lady of Good Help as an official Diocesan Shrine of Green Bay.**

shrineofourladyofgoodhelp.com/

 

[thistle]

I have studied Garabandal since around 1971. I lectured on it for many years. I have no interest in ramming my belief in the apparitions down people’s throats, but I do believe that if the events are true (as I believe), they should be studied carefully before being written off. I met the blind apostle Joey on more than one occasion & in my judgement he is a most sincere man and I have no doubt that his encounter with Padre Pio is a true account.
I find that many people who have not made a study of the apparitions make all kinds of half baked statements about them. I would also humbly suggest that people should approach the matter in a spiritual way, ever ready to ask Our Lady for guidance.
As for the Church’s attitude one could do worse than read the interview given by Bishop del Val who was on the original Commision which studied the on-going events. garabandal.org/vigil/interview.shtml

I do not wish to get involved in controversy but I am always happy to try and clarify any difficulties people might have when they come to study these events.

Please don’t take offense but its only the Church’s position which counts and stands valid and that decision was that there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings.

 

[jmjconder]

**

Please don’t take offense but its only the Church’s position which counts and stands valid and that decision was that there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings.

**

Not sure why faithful people seem to be focused on apparitions that do not have any approval from the Catholic Church when there are so many that do.

 

[thistle]

**

Not sure why faithful people seem to be focused on apparitions that do not have any approval from the Catholic Church when there are so many that do.

**

I know. I don’t understand that either.

 

[Edward_Henry]

And… I do not know why this self-appointed *“Forum Police” *does not let others be.

As long as the Church has not officially ‘condemned’ an apparition event, they are free to continue to prudently investigate. Please put away your badges.

 

[thistle]

And… I do not know why this self-appointed *“Forum Police” *does not let others be.

As long as the Church has not officially ‘condemned’ an apparition event, they are free to continue to prudently investigate. Please put away your badges

The Church has made its decision and that is that there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings. No need to investigate further.

 

[Edward_Henry]

The Church has made its decision and that is that there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings. No need to investigate further.

The Church has not condemned it… therefore it has not forbidden anyone from looking into it… Why should you? What is this personal zeal?

 

[thistle]

The Church has not condemned it… therefore it has not forbidden anyone from looking into it… Why should you? What is this personal zeal?

Why would anyone want to follow an unapproved private revelation when the Church has officially declared there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings there.

If anyone want to follow a devotion to grow their spiritual life there are plenty of Church approved private revelations.

Remember, God unites the faithful.
Satan divides the faithful. The fruits of Garabandal are contention and division!!

 

[Edward_Henry]

Why would anyone want to follow an unapproved private revelation when the Church has officially declared there is no evidence of any supernatural happenings there.

If anyone want to follow a devotion to grow their spiritual life there are plenty of Church approved private revelations.

Remember, God unites the faithful.
Satan divides the faithful. The fruits of Garabandal are contention and division!!

Still, the Catholic Church has not condemned it! Why should forum members act as “Forum Police” over others?
Satan can use a lot of *“well intentioned” *people to “divide the faithful” in this forum