Gay, Catholic, struggling with conversion

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Hello, I’m a gay Catholic (a term which unlike many I do not see as problematic; I think it false that ‘gay’ must always and everywhere mean that one supports a sort of licentious and illicit sexuality; gay will be used differently for different people and for some it means an attraction to the same ‘gender’ and/ or a predisposition to falling in love with the same sex).

Anyway! I’m a gay Catholic, devout and committed to Holy Mother Church. On the one hand my heart fully believes but on the other I struggle with incredible doubts and times/ periods of disbelief. I often feel a sense of God ‘not-being-there’. I pray that God would make Himself known to me, console me or otherwise give me a sense of His presence and…nothing.

In the face of the temptations that I struggle with daily (homosexual lust) how can I continue going back to Confession if my faith feels so ‘vacant’?

Sometimes it feels like I do all the religious requirements (I serve Mass; go to regular communion and confession; spend time in Adoration; say my litanies…) but that ‘God’ is somehow absent.

I struggle with this so much and I don’t want to; I would happily sacrifice everything for my faith (I think) but I just need more of a sense of God’s presence…even though I know we mustn’t allow our emotions to guide our faith.

I suppose I’m perpetually Thomas saying that I need more; that I need to feel and handle and ‘sense’ Our Lord.

Please help/ pray for me.
 
First of all, welcome to the forums! As to your struggle, the battle against sin is constant, while spiritual dryness occurs to all of us from time to time. For this reason, our Lord advised us to persevere to the end. He has given you the strength thus far and will never fail to strengthen you to carry your cross.

As to lust, any lust is sinful, no matter for what it might be. Regardless of your sexual attraction, you are called to celibacy, just as all singles are. Have you read Mother Teresa’s story? She experienced spiritual dryness for years and years, yet persevered through it all.

Our consolation is in the Lord, and our ultimate comfort is not in this world, as we are made for another. I will pray for you.
 
Student26 said:
Hello, I’m a gay Catholic (a term which unlike many I do not see as problematic; I think it false that ‘gay’ must always and everywhere mean that one supports a sort of licentious and illicit sexuality; gay will be used differently for different people and for some it means an attraction to the same ‘gender’ and/ or a predisposition to falling in love with the same sex).

Anyway! I’m a gay Catholic, devout and committed to Holy Mother Church. On the one hand my heart fully believes but on the other I struggle with incredible doubts and times/ periods of disbelief. I often feel a sense of God ‘not-being-there’. I pray that God would make Himself known to me, console me or otherwise give me a sense of His presence and…nothing.

In the face of the temptations that I struggle with daily (homosexual lust) how can I continue going back to Confession if my faith feels so ‘vacant’?

Sometimes it feels like I do all the religious requirements (I serve Mass; go to regular communion and confession; spend time in Adoration; say my litanies…) but that ‘God’ is somehow absent.

I struggle with this so much and I don’t want to; I would happily sacrifice everything for my faith (I think) but I just need more of a sense of God’s presence…even though I know we mustn’t allow our emotions to guide our faith.

I suppose I’m perpetually Thomas saying that I need more; that I need to feel and handle and ‘sense’ Our Lord.

Please help/ pray for me.
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These things take time to work out, especially if you are young. I would suggest that praying the rosary may help you, I’ve always found it a very comforting thing.

Define what you mean by lust, an example perhaps? Is it masturbation (an all to common pitfall for males)? Are you mentally stripping them? Or is it more like “Wow that guy is hot”?
po18guy said:
First of all, welcome to the forums! As to your struggle, the battle against sin is constant, while spiritual dryness occurs to all of us from time to time. For this reason, our Lord advised us to persevere to the end. He has given you the strength thus far and will never fail to strengthen you to carry your cross.

As to lust, any lust is sinful, no matter for what it might be. Regardless of your sexual attraction, you are called to celibacy, just as all singles are. Have you read Mother Teresa’s story? She experienced spiritual dryness for years and years, yet persevered through it all.

Our consolation is in the Lord, and our ultimate comfort is not in this world, as we are made for another. I will pray for you.
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Chastity, the term is chastity
 
Thank-you for all the prayers…what would a man do without prayer I do not know!
 
Student26 said:
Anyway! I’m a gay Catholic, devout and committed to Holy Mother Church.
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Why do you call yourself a gay Catholic?
Why do you put gay ahead of being a Catholic?
Why can’t you call yourself a Catholic who is gay?

The best thing you can do is pray, nothing else will help you more than this.
If you are commited to the Church than you must end these sexual feelings that you have.

Remember, most of us men have to deal with lustful thoughts all the time whether this is about men or women.
Student26 said:
I pray that God would make Himself known to me, console me or otherwise give me a sense of His presence and…nothing.
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Why do you pray for this?

Do you not believe He is there?

Would it suddenly change your feelings if He appeared in front of you?
 
Being gay is part of his identity, that’s all.

hugs

Student, I’m not gay but I understand some of what you’re dealing with. Regardless of sexual orientation, there’s too much temptation out there. The media is very sexualized and society follows the trends. The only thing you can do in this case is to get rid of anything sinful or tempting you may have. I mean porn, sexy magazines, etc. It means watching less TV and avoiding social events where you know men will flirt with you. It means listening to less sexual music.

A lot of what is out there is sexual, lust filled but not love. God’s love is perfect.

Remember even Jesus felt depressed in the garden of Gethesemene. Even Jesus said, “God, why have you forsaken me?” while he was on his cross. It is his human side that gave him those feelings, even though he is the Son of God.

Pray your rosary. You’re already doing a lot but the rosary helps me a lot. Pray to St. Michael, to put on the armor of God, to keep the devil away. The devil wants you. The devil wants a hold of us so we can all suffer in the long run, and for eternity. When you feel God isn’t there, cling to God even more. It’s so easy to just give up. I gave up years ago and it hurt me very badly. I would not want that for you.

I will keep you in mind when I pray too.
 
Dymphna82 said:
Being gay is part of his identity, that’s all.

hugs

Student, I’m not gay but I understand some of what you’re dealing with. Regardless of sexual orientation, there’s too much temptation out there. The media is very sexualized and society follows the trends. The only thing you can do in this case is to get rid of anything sinful or tempting you may have. I mean porn, sexy magazines, etc. It means watching less TV and avoiding social events where you know men will flirt with you. It means listening to less sexual music.

A lot of what is out there is sexual, lust filled but not love. God’s love is perfect.

Remember even Jesus felt depressed in the garden of Gethesemene. Even Jesus said, “God, why have you forsaken me?” while he was on his cross. It is his human side that gave him those feelings, even though he is the Son of God.

Pray your rosary. You’re already doing a lot but the rosary helps me a lot. Pray to St. Michael to keep the devil away. The devil wants you. The devil wants a hold of us so we can all suffer in the long run, and for eternity. When you feel God isn’t there, cling to God even more. It’s so easy to just give up. I gave up years ago and it hurt me very badly. I would not want that for you.

I will keep you in mind when I pray too.
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Great advice to the OP.

Also, a lot of physical activity helps keep your hormones in check if that’s a problem… particularly running, or anything that involves a lot of cardiovascular exercise. That should help with the physiological aspects of remaining chaste. Good luck and God bless.
 
Grace & Peace!

I hope you’ll forgive me for the length of this post!

It sounds like you’re going through a spiritually dry period. In my own experience, these periods come and go, but they often settle in when the vicissitudes of life seem particularly overwhelming. When these periods happen to me, my instinct is to want to do something to get God’s attention, and it’s only later that I realize that there’s nothing special I can do except for continue to pray and, if necessary, wait. God is closer to us, says a poet, than our jugular vein. It’s not that we need to do more when these periods hit us, it’s that we need to do comparatively less–to be still and know that God is God and that, in the words of Julian of Norwich, “All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well.” So often, at least in my experience, I feel most distant from God when I have begun to focus too much on the things of the passing world, where the peace which passeth understanding is actually nowhere to be found. These periods of dryness are invitations to give up whatever it is that’s concerning me or to which I’m clinging (even if it’s a good thing!) and to refocus on my walk with God.

A few things have provided me with some incredible comfort, even though thinking about them, or praying them, or reading them can feel, in the moment, like a labor:

1–St. John of the Cross’ poem about the Ascent of Mt. Carmel is a powerful and insistent injunction to give up absolutely everything for God. He writes, among other things:
To reach satisfaction in All
desire its possession in nothing.
To come to possession in All
desire the possession of nothing.
…
To come by the pleasure you have not
you must go by the way in which you enjoy not.
…
When you turn toward something
you cease to cast yourself upon the All.
For to go from all to the All
you must deny yourself of all in all.
And when you come to possession of the All
you must possess it without wanting anything."
Good stuff!

2: Do you know The Prayer of Habakkuk? It’s in the book of Habakkuk, chapter 3. In the old breviaries, it’s appointed to be read at Lauds on Friday mornings during penitential seasons, so I’ve been re-familiarizing myself with it during Advent. It is one of the most amazing passages from scripture, and the end is absolutely astounding. I’ve a feeling that if you make it your prayer, it will bear in you much fruit!

It begins:
O Lord Eternal, I have heard the report concerning thee and am afraid; * O Lord Everlasting, revive thy work in the midst of the years of our sorrow.
In the midst of the years make it known; * in wrath remember mercy.
God cometh from Teman, and the Holy One from Mount Paran: * his glory covereth the heavens, and the earth is full of his praise.
And his brightness is as the sunlight; he hath horns of glory coming out of his hands, * and there is the hiding of his power.
Before his face goeth a burning brighter than a mighty fever, * and flaming fires follow his footsteps.
He standeth still, and taketh measure of the earth; * he doth but look, and the battle-array of the nations is driven asunder.
Yea, the everlasting mountains are smitten to pieces, and the perpetual hills are made to bow down, * during the course of his going forth throughout eternity.
I see the tents of Cushan in affliction, * and the curtains of the land of Midian do tremble.
Art thou displeased with the rivers, O Lord Eternal? is thine anger against the rivers, or thy wrath against the Sea, * that thou dost ride their billows as upon thine horses and chariots of salvation?
A little further on, it continues to its extraordinary ending:
When I hear thee, my body trembleth; my lips quiver at thy voice; * my bones begin to crumble, and my steps do falter.
But I will wait quietly for the day of trouble, * which cometh up against them that oppress me.
Though the fig tree do not blossom, nor fruit be in the vines, * though the labour of the olive fail, and the fields yield no meat;
Though the flock be cut off from the fold, * and there be no herd in the stalls;
Yet even so will I rejoice in the Lord of the Covenant, * and I will joy in the God of my salvation.
For the Eternal Lord God is my strength, * and he maketh my feet as fleet as hind’s feet.
Yea, he that is the Conqueror shall make me to walk upon mine high places, * singing psalms.
It’s absolutely amazing.

[CONTINUED…]
 
…CONTINUED AND COMPLETED]

3: Speaking of breviaries, praying the psalms during the course of the office has been a source of great comfort and encouragement to me. Perhaps it may be helpful to you as well? There are lots of resources out there to help with the office. “Shorter Christian Prayer” which is a version of “Christian Prayer: The Liturgy of the Hours” is a great place to start. This site contains the text of the current Roman Liturgy of the Hours (check out the menu on the left for the day’s readings and prayers): universalis.com/. As an Anglican, I use the pattern set down in the old Books of Common Prayer (it makes sure I read through the psalms every month–assuming I stick with it every day!–and that I recite the Athanasian Creed at least 12 times a year), and I supplement it with propers drawn from the Anglican Breviary (which relies on the old Roman Breviary with additions from Dominican and Sarum rites, among others). Having mentioned the Roman Breviary, this site, though, will walk you through praying the old Roman Breviary (though it requires that you register in order to access it’s most comprehensive features): breviary.net/. The old Roman breviary is also available in hard copy. Finally, this site, while based around the Prayer Book office, has some fantastic customizable features, from contemporary language to old school thees and thous (it also includes an option to use the current Roman Catholic sanctorale): haligweorc.org/breviary/. Because it’s pretty focused on the Book of Common Prayer, however, I would suggest that you speak with your priest before incorporating it into your devotional life (should you wish to do so!).

4: I would recommend that you get your hands on a copy of the Revelations/Showings of Julian of Norwich. Few writers have such a real apprehension of the mercy, the “full homely divinity,” of God than Mother Julian. Also, the collected sayings of the 4th Century Desert Fathers are timeless treasures of the Church. They are literally manna in the spiritual desert in which we sometimes find ourselves. For that matter, the writings of the saints and the blesseds and other teachers can be very helpful. I find myself drawn to medieval German writings --there tends to be something so unpretentious, so straightforward, so “guy on the street” about their work. Check out Bd. Henry Suso’s work for some incredible stuff!

5: Sometimes, I find that meditating on the 7 Sorrows of Our Lady, followed by meditating on the 7 Joys provides a real spiritual kickstart, and a reminder that “those who sow in tears shall reap in joy.”

6: Speaking of Our Lady, you can’t go wrong with the Rosary. It’s powerful stuff!

It looks like you’re saying that some of your spiritual dryness may be coming from a struggle with lust or with being gay. And before we go any further, I want to make sure that you know this: God loves you, and so does the Church! While you’ll find on these forums a lot of different viewpoints on the gay matter, the basic point is this–you’re not condemned for being gay!

Regarding lust, I want to encourage you in your struggle. Keep in mind, though, that there’s no special homosexual lust. As far as I can tell, lust is our desire to appropriate to ourselves a particular good or set of goods. It’s always self-oriented, never other-oriented because lust tends to objectify the good which it covets, and that objectification demeans the good and prevents us from being in proper relationship to it. It’s natural for us to desire good things, to seek out beauty for instance, or to be stunned when beauty comes to us unawares. It’s natural for us to want to be in relationship with whatever is true, good, and beautiful. But it’s not natural for us to desire to possess these things as our own. They are not our own. They don’t belong to us. They are God’s good gifts. When we recognize a good, such as beauty, in a person, the “old man” in us can sometimes begin to believe that this person and their goods are directed toward satisfying our desires, solely oriented toward giving us pleasure. What an illusion! When we feel like we’re beginning to desire a person in this way–wanting to possess them and whatever goods they have been given-- maybe it’s good to step back and try to re-tune our perception of what’s going on by: acknowledging this person to be a beloved child of God; acknowledging the goods they have been given to be gifts that God has given them because God is gratuitously giving and wonderful; giving thanks to God for these gifts and for this person for their own sake; thanking God, too, for blessing us with this person in our lives; and asking how we may be a blessing to this person and to all others around us. This may help us to put lust aside and to focus on being in a right and loving relationship with the good.

I don’t know if all that helps, but…don’t despair! You’re not alone. You’ll find your way through this, by God’s grace! (You mentioned confession, but is this something you can talk about with your priest outside of confession?)

Wishing you all good things!

Under the Mercy,
Mark

All is Grace and Mercy! Deo Gratias!
 
Nelka said:
Why do you call yourself a gay Catholic?
Why do you put gay ahead of being a Catholic?
Why can’t you call yourself a Catholic who is gay?

The best thing you can do is pray, nothing else will help you more than this.
If you are committed to the Church than you must end these sexual feelings that you have.

Remember, most of us men have to deal with lustful thoughts all the time whether this is about men or women.

Why do you pray for this?

Do you not believe He is there?

Would it suddenly change your feelings if He appeared in front of you?
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The way he phrased it gay is a adjective modifying the noun which is Catholic, it does alter how one views things, one’s approach to life.
Debora123 said:
Great advice to the OP.

Also, a lot of physical activity helps keep your hormones in check if that’s a problem… particularly running, or anything that involves a lot of cardiovascular exercise. That should help with the physiological aspects of remaining chaste. Good luck and God bless.
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Yeah, do something fun like rock climbing, guns, swimming

I think of St. John of the Cross
  1. One dark night,
    fired with love’s urgent longings
  • ah, the sheer grace! -
    I went out unseen,
    my house being now all stilled.
  1. In darkness, and secure,
    by the secret ladder, disguised,
  • ah, the sheer grace! -
    in darkness and concealment,
    my house being now all stilled.
  1. On that glad night,
    in secret, for no one saw me,
    nor did I look at anything,
    with no other light or guide
    than the one that burned in my heart.
  2. This guided me
    more surely than the light of noon
    to where he was awaiting me
  • him I knew so well -
    there in a place where no one appeared.
  1. O guiding night!
    O night more lovely than the dawn!
    O night that has united
    the Lover with his beloved,
    transforming the beloved in her Lover.
  2. Upon my flowering breast
    which I kept wholly for him alone,
    there he lay sleeping,
    and I caressing him
    there in a breeze from the fanning cedars.
  3. When the breeze blew from the turret,
    as I parted his hair,
    it wounded my neck
    with its gentle hand,
    suspending all my senses.
  4. I abandoned and forgot myself,
    laying my face on my Beloved;
    all things ceased; I went out from myself,
    leaving my cares
    forgotten among the lilies.
Some serious stuff there
 
Student26 said:
Hello, I’m a gay Catholic (a term which unlike many I do not see as problematic; I think it false that ‘gay’ must always and everywhere mean that one supports a sort of licentious and illicit sexuality; gay will be used differently for different people and for some it means an attraction to the same ‘gender’ and/ or a predisposition to falling in love with the same sex).
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In the eyes of the world you are a gay. In the eyes of the world i am a bisexual.
Forget what the world thinks.

Being gay isn’t about hedonism. The idea of homosexuality is rooted in the false belief that sexual attraction is the basis of what defines your sexual identity. Its the idea that sexual identity begins with attraction. Its a philosophical belief, not an a-prior moral right.

Don’t call yourself gay unless you are willing to embrace that philosophical standard.

Personally I don’t look upon you as a gay or a homosexual. The church is not asking you to deny your gay identity, because in the first place the Church does not think of you as a gay Catholic. They think of you as a heterosexual that unfortunately has a disordered attraction towards the same sex. They are asking only that you conform to your nature as a man or a women; which is to be a heterosexual.

You are a heterosexual by default. Why? Because the heterosexual identity does not begin with attraction, and neither does it begin with the fulfillment of attraction; it begins first with the objective fact that you are a “man”. Attraction begins with the fact that you are firstly a man or a women. Your identity as a man is only meaningful in so far is there is such a thing as a women. It is only meaningful to be a man in terms of being a heterosexual. Therefore it is not a true and honest expression of your manhood to identify your self as gay or to act on SSA (same sex attractions). Your manhood is intrinsically valuable and should be guarded at all cost. Don’t let the world rob you of your true identity. It is your birthright to express yourself as a man and to fulfill your nature as a man. You are not pretending to be a man; you are a man. The gay identity cannot fulfill your nature as a man, and that is why you should reject it and refuse to be referred to as a gay. The gay identity is only possible if you don’t value your identity as a man and the intrinsic meaning that the reality of manhood expresses. You can only be gay if you don’t put your manhood first.

Be true to yourself. Being true to the fact that you are a man is apart of being true to your self. Thus if you believe in being true to yourself, how can homosexuality ever be a possibility in your life?

I have suffered from severe depression and humiliation for a long time because of my struggles, and SSA isn’t the only problem that i struggle with.

We all have a cross to bare. Our cross is greater than others, and some people have it even worse. Don’t give up your cross. Fight to the bitter end, and you will see God and you will share in the glory of heaven.
 
If he wants to call himself gay let him… We’ve already been down this road… Celibacy/chastity yes…

Ex-gay no…

That manhood stuff is a myth… You don’t have to build your masculinity up to be a good Catholic… Most gays aren’t effeminate… (Although I certainly am! :D)

The Church requires LGBT people abstain from sexual activity… It does not require you to affirm an ex-gay identity and call it SSA or to build up your so called “manhood”…

I love my designer clothes that are bright and expensive… I love my high pitch voice… I wouldn’t change it for the world it’s what God gave me…

Unlike those wack job Bible thumping Evangelicals over at Focus on the Family and Exodus International who seem to have infiltrated the Church (Cough Cough Mind Over Matter I’m watching you)…

Good luck man I’ll pray for you… 👍
 
robbie20 said:
If he wants to call himself gay let him… We’ve already been down this road… Celibacy/chastity yes…

Ex-gay no…

That manhood stuff is a myth… You don’t have to build your masculinity up to be a good Catholic… Most gays aren’t effeminate… (Although I certainly am! :D)

The Church requires LGBT people abstain from sexual activity… It does not require you to affirm an ex-gay identity and call it SSA or to build up your so called “manhood”…

I love my designer clothes that are bright and expensive… I love my high pitch voice… I wouldn’t change it for the world it’s what God gave me…

Unlike those wack job Bible thumping Evangelicals over at Focus on the Family and Exodus International who seem to have infiltrated the Church (Cough Cough Mind Over Matter I’m watching you)…

Good luck man I’ll pray for you… 👍
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Manhood has nothing to do with how you “behave” in respect of your mannerism. Its got everything to do with the intrinsic meaning self-evident in the fact that you are a man by nature.

If you want to behave like a women, that is up to you, and that is not what i was talking about. Behaving like a women has nothing to do with having same sex attractions. Some men simply like to behave like a women regardless of who they are attracted to.

Shows how much you know about being gay.:rotfl:
 
MindOverMatter2 said:
Manhood has nothing to do with how you “behave” in respect of your mannerism. Its got everything to do with the intrinsic meaning self-evident in the fact that you are a man by nature.

If you want to behave like a women, that is up to you, and that is not what i was talking about. Behaving like a women has nothing to do with having same sex attractions. Some men simply like to behave like a women regardless of who they are attracted to.

Shows how much you know about being gay.:rotfl:
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Who said I was behaving like a woman?! Based on the fact I wear clothes (made for men :mad:) and have a higher voice than average (something I couldn’t help)…

Wow your the one stereotyping me… I look and dress like a man…

Not all gay men are cross dressers dude who act like women 🤷

Just because I’m more effeminate doesn’t mean I act like a woman 🤷

And just because someone says their gay doesn’t mean their less of a man…
 
robbie20 said:
Who said I was behaving like a woman?! Based on the fact I wear clothes (made for men :mad:) and have a higher voice than average (something I couldn’t help)…

Wow your the one stereotyping me… I look and dress like a man…

Not all gay men are cross dressers dude 🤷
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I never said that you behave like a women. I said that if you want to behave like a women thats fine and is entirely up to you. But mannerisms have nothing to do with same sex attraction or being true to your manhood.
 
robbie20 said:
The Church requires LGBT people abstain from sexual activity… It does not require you to affirm an ex-gay identity and call it SSA or to build up your so called “manhood”…
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True. But it calls all of us, heteros no less than anyone else, to discard our spiritually unhealthy propensities, in our language as well as in our behavior and our friendships. For example, those turning away from the behavior of addiction (drugs, alcohol), which are different unhealthy propensities, are specifically encouraged to avoid, consciously, people they have associated with in the past, whose lifestyle remains addictive (& thus, tempting).
I love my designer clothes that are bright and expensive… I love my high pitch voice… I wouldn’t change it for the world it’s what God gave me…
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Well, whether God “gave” you that in particular is neither here nor there. You have your personal preferences which are an outgrowth of your individual personality, and that is what God gave you and loves.
👍

He did not “give” you, or me, a political identity, a social identity, or an association with people who by their own definition, claim that sexual activity is essential to that name & “identity.” None of those are things that we were born with, let alone are they things ‘determined’ at birth.
 
All gay means is that your attracted to someone of the same sex…

Those political and sexual meanings are things YOU turn it into…

The Church has assigned the word to mean those things…

It is in fact only a synonym for SSA or homosexual…
 
robbie20 said:
All gay means is that your attracted to someone of the same sex…

Those political and sexual meanings are things YOU turn it into…
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Au contraire. It’s secular gay advocacy groups who insist on gay as something not restricted to attraction, but rather including activity. In fact, if you read up on the history of the term homosexuality, through the '50’s, '60’s, and '70’s, you will find that anyone with SSA who did not act on that was considered a ‘repressed’ homosexual or a ‘latent’ homosexual, who somehow would not be able to be a full person until he started acted on his attractions.
 
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