Gay Uncle's "marriage"

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sbcoral:
I don’t think that being self-righteous is going to change her 78 year-old uncle’s behavior. He will continue to be gay. She can continue to accept him for who he is (as she has done for 30+ years it seems) or, now, reject him and call him a sinner and possibly forever lose ties to a father figure. Call me a moral relativist all you want, but I think love and acceptance trump self-righteous indignance all of the time.
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BYZ cath never said anything about God being the cause of his sexual orientation. God isn’t the cause of evil. Perhaps reading St. Thomas could help you understand this better. She shouldn’t attent the service but at the same time she should let God work. Her not attenting the service is God’s way of waking him up and smelling the coffee. Will there be hurt? Yes. God allows these things to happen, because the Lord can use pain to draw us closer to him. He should remain celebate, cause I truly believe that is a homosexual’s calling to serve God. Would that be a trail? Yes. But we must pick up our cross and follow Jesus. Jesus didn’t ask us to understand! But to have faith.

Padre Pio “Don’t worry, work and pray.”
 
Perhaps you can decline, without giving him an explanation? This way you will not feel like you are approving of his marriage, and in all honesty giving him an explanation probably will not do either of you any good at this point. I assume he knows your position on gay marriage if he knows you’re a practicing Catholic anyway. This must be a tough situation to be in!
 
I think Jesus addressed this specific dilemma in his ministry…

Matt 10:34-39: "Do not think that I have come to bring peace upon the earth. I have come to bring not peace but the sword. For I have come to set a man ‘against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and one’s enemies will be those of his household.’ “Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; and whoever does not take up his cross and follow after me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.”

God bless! :gopray2: I will pray for strength for you, Sandy. :gopray2: If you do not go, you will lose relationships, you will be viewed as intolerant and bigoted, among other things. But you will gain Christ. It’s so unfortunate that you are forced into such a decision. But the path of the righteous is laden with snares.

Psalm 142:
A maskil of David, when he was in the cave. A prayer. With full voice I cry to the LORD; with full voice I beseech the LORD. Before God I pour out my complaint, lay bare my distress. My spirit is faint within me, but you know my path. Along the way I walk they have hidden a trap for me. I look to my right hand, but no friend is there. There is no escape for me; no one cares for me. I cry out to you, LORD, I say, You are my refuge, my portion in the land of the living. Listen to my cry for help, for I am brought very low. Rescue me from my pursuers, for they are too strong for me. Lead me out of my prison, that I may give thanks to your name. Then the just shall gather around me because you have been good to me.
 
Don’t listen to these people, Sandy. With your uncle’s age, he may not be around much longer. You need to savor the time you have left with him. You should be there to show your love and support on what will be a very special day for him. It would mean a lot to him, I suspect.
 
That’s the problem … by being their to show your love, it may appear that you are their to show your support for such a scandalous ceremony and sinful lifestyle.

I say stay away, and send him a nice card telling him how much you love him and wish him all the happiness in the world. If he presses you for more, then catechize him in Catholic beliefs by sending him the following article by an ex-gay activist convert to Catholicism:

Out of the Closet and Into Chastity by David Morrison
catholiceducation.org/articles/homosexuality/ho0001.html
 
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sbcoral:
Don’t listen to these people, Sandy. With your uncle’s age, he may not be around much longer. You need to savor the time you have left with him. You should be there to show your love and support on what will be a very special day for him. It would mean a lot to him, I suspect.
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All the more reason to be especially blunt with him.

After all, if someone dies with unrepented mortal sin on their souls… well we know where they are bound…
 
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ByzCath:
All the more reason to be especially blunt with him.

After all, if someone dies with unrepented mortal sin on their souls… well we know where they are bound…
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The man is 78. I don’t think he’s going to convert to heterosexuality anytime soon. He will be judged by God, not by us.
Souring her relationship with her uncle by being sanctimonious isn’t going to accomplish anything other than grief.
 
He will be judged by God, not by us.
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I’ll give you a hypothetical …

I’m an officer in the USAF. If my uncle were to invite me to a ceremony in his Communist Party Headquarters where he was to receive a “Top Commie of the Year” award, it would be improper for me to attend, as my convictions and my oath to God and country prohibit me from participation in such activities.

It’s not that I don’t love my hypothetical commie unlce, but it’s that I am against everything he stands for with respect to Communism. I love my uncle but cannot give my support to such anti-American, anti-God gatherings.

It’s about the public scandal and occasion or near occasion of sin for lovesfall’s soul, not about the gay uncle’s soul.
 
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sbcoral:
The man is 78. I don’t think he’s going to convert to heterosexuality anytime soon. He will be judged by God, not by us.
Souring her relationship with her uncle by being sanctimonious isn’t going to accomplish anything other than grief.
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Just because he is old is no excuse not to evangelize. All I’ve heard from you is excuses and not one good reason to attent the ceremony. You will have to provide good documentation sir/maddam. You say that he won’t convert any time soon? YOU DO NOT KNOW THE POWER OF GOD NOR DO YOU KNOW THE SCRIPTURES.
 
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sbcoral:
The man is 78. I don’t think he’s going to convert to heterosexuality anytime soon. He will be judged by God, not by us.
Souring her relationship with her uncle by being sanctimonious isn’t going to accomplish anything other than grief.
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Your profile states that you are a Catholic so you must understand what the Catholic Church teaches here.

Does not matter if this man became a heterosexual or not.

It is not a sin to have homosexual tendencies, it is a sin to act on those tendencies.

A heterosexual single man who has sex with a female is commiting a mortal sin, just as a homosexual man does when he has sex with a man.
 
“Evangelize always. When necessary, use words.”
– St. Francis of Assisi
 
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sbcoral:
The man is 78. I don’t think he’s going to convert to heterosexuality anytime soon. He will be judged by God, not by us.
Souring her relationship with her uncle by being sanctimonious isn’t going to accomplish anything other than grief.
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I agree with this. I generally think boycotting weddings does not help evangelization. People only end up thinking that religious people are intolerant. I’m talking about practicality here. It will only serve to alienate her from an otherwise dear, kind man.

We all have our weaknesses and blindspots. In her uncle’s case, his homosexual sexual lifestyle is his. In his worldview this is not a sin. And, anyone who hasn’t struggles with these type of compelling desires really doesn’t have much insight into them.

I say, go to this function, be respectful of different points of view, and be loving to your uncle who was so good to you.
 
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WhiteDove:
I agree with this. I generally think boycotting weddings does not help evangelization. People only end up thinking that religious people are intolerant. I’m talking about practicality here. It will only serve to alienate her from an otherwise dear, kind man.
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I disagree with this most strongly.

If you do not live your faith then what kind of example do you show?

Let me bring up something in my past. This has to do with me accepting Christ in the Assemblies of God denomination, which was the start of my journey home to the Catholic Church.

At the time I was searching I was in the party mode. I had a lot of friends who I partied with. One of them was a christian. I would talk with him about this. Well it hit him one day and he reordered his life and stopped partying with us. Now most of my friends thought as you state, but it made an impact in my life. That this person believed so much that he would do this, it lead me into this life.

Its all about the witness. We can not water down our Gaith, we can not act like it doesn’t matter. We must live our Faith. If we don’t then we are just as wrong as that which we claim is wrong.
 
:confused:

I am even more confused now! :crying:

I appreciate everyone’s very intelligent and compelling replies though, it means a lot to me.
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sbcoral:
Don’t listen to these people, Sandy. With your uncle’s age, he may not be around much longer.
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I am glad your brought this up as I do feel I need to add a few things.

The family and I really do feel my uncle has “lost it” for want of a more appropriate term. He is an extremely intelligent man, is a retired psychiatrist and CEO of a huge hospital. But…this man he is marrying not only is HIV positive, but has full blown AIDS! We are all in shock that my uncle would choose to be with someone that inevitably will have to be taken care of. The problem with that (besides the obvious) is that my uncle is not in the best of health either. I am in the health field and I seriously do feel he is showing signs of either senility or dementia.

I do want to say that I am a Cradle Catholic and my faith has helped me through some extremely difficult times during my life. I do not want to do anything that goes against the teachings of the Church nor do I want to commit sin.

I suppose some of the reason behind my confusion has a lot to do with being a woman. I am not saying that men are not capable of being empathetic or nurturing, but I do feel most women possess these traits.

Anyway, I am praying that God is able to help me with this dilemma. I am leaning towards either not attending the “ceremony” and going to the reception or just sending a card. My uncle’s birthday is on the same day so I may just send a birthday card and letter letting me know I love him and that I am praying for him.

Still uncertain but your replies have given me a lot to think and pray about.

God Bless,
Sandy
 
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ByzCath:
I disagree with this most strongly.

If you do not live your faith then what kind of example do you show?

Let me bring up something in my past. This has to do with me accepting Christ in the Assemblies of God denomination, which was the start of my journey home to the Catholic Church.

At the time I was searching I was in the party mode. I had a lot of friends who I partied with. One of them was a christian. I would talk with him about this. Well it hit him one day and he reordered his life and stopped partying with us. Now most of my friends thought as you state, but it made an impact in my life. That this person believed so much that he would do this, it lead me into this life.

Its all about the witness. We can not water down our Gaith, we can not act like it doesn’t matter. We must live our Faith. If we don’t then we are just as wrong as that which we claim is wrong.
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What you said is an excellent testimony!

Padre Pio “Don’t worry, work and pray.”
 
I can’t think of any legitimate reason anyone should attend a “gay wedding”. No matter one’s relationship. It could be one’s mother or father, to attend such an enterprise is a scandal. It only would show one supports such a disastrous lifestyle CHOICE. As informed Catholics how can we not know we must practice authentic love. Tough love is needed many times. That does not mean we write off the sinner, but it certainly does not mean we accept their sins and act as if we are accepting of one endangering their soul. One poster mentioned that the “gay” uncle was 78 and so his advanced years meant the niece should go to the wedding. It is precisely because this man may be facing death soon that one must share the faith with them in a charitable way. Glossing over such a terrible sin as faux marriage is not sharing the faith. God can convert hearts. Pray for the uncle, but stay away from that scandal.
 
What is wrong with you people? I absolutely understand being devoted to your faith, but I cannot fathom how one could denounce a person based on their sexual orientation. You are born gay or straight, end of story, and every reputable study done in the past 25 years has come to that conclusion. Why would anyone decide to be a homosexual when so many people hate them for it? Why would one choose to be hated?

The Bible tells us not to judge our fellow man, and if you condemn someone for being a homosexual, you are failing God. No one is perfect. Everyday we commit sins. Did anyone eat shellfish today? Did any of you men cut the hair on your temples at any point in your lives? If so, I recommend you hurry to confession. However, feel free to own slaves or sell your daughter into slavery when she is of birthing age.

The fact of the matter is that we pick and choose what to believe, sometimes based on our own fallibility and sometimes based on relevance. Personally, I choose not to hate or judge. It is my duty, and yours, to love others. If you make a conscious effort to despise others because of who they are, then I would not expect to be walking hand in hand with our lord in the afterlife.

To whomever started this post: If you do not go to your uncle’s wedding, shame on you. This man offerred his guidance, support, and a roof over your head at one of the most difficult times of your life. If that isn’t a Christian act, then I don’t know what is.
 
The Reason:
What is wrong with you people? I absolutely understand being devoted to your faith, but I cannot fathom how one could denounce a person based on their sexual orientation. You are born gay or straight, end of story, and every reputable study done in the past 25 years has come to that conclusion. Why would anyone decide to be a homosexual when so many people hate them for it? Why would one choose to be hated?

The Bible tells us not to judge our fellow man, and if you condemn someone for being a homosexual, you are failing God. No one is perfect. Everyday we commit sins. Did anyone eat shellfish today? Did any of you men cut the hair on your temples at any point in your lives? If so, I recommend you hurry to confession. However, feel free to own slaves or sell your daughter into slavery when she is of birthing age.

The fact of the matter is that we pick and choose what to believe, sometimes based on our own fallibility and sometimes based on relevance. Personally, I choose not to hate or judge. It is my duty, and yours, to love others. If you make a conscious effort to despise others because of who they are, then I would not expect to be walking hand in hand with our lord in the afterlife.

To whomever started this post: If you do not go to your uncle’s wedding, shame on you. This man offerred his guidance, support, and a roof over your head at one of the most difficult times of your life. If that isn’t a Christian act, then I don’t know what is.
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Just because one is homosexual doesn’t automatically make homosexuality right. Just because a study or an idea is popular doesn’t mean its always right. The fact that he practiced homosexuality, doesn’t automatically validate the good dead. You can’t be in a state of mortal sin and expect a good deed to be a christian act. Two wrongs don’t make a right. We can’t pick and choose to what to believe, there’s only one true faith and that’s the Catholic church. Just because we are against the act of homosexuality doesn’t mean that we condemn the homosexual. God did not cause this becuase God is not the cause of evil. But the act of homosexuality in of itself is mortally sinful. With God anythings possible. Even if the Church were to reverse this teaching it wouldn’t be licit. And whether you like it or not the church condemns the act of homosexuality. Read the catechism of the catholic church my friend your ignorance is showing.
 
You are born gay or straight, end of story …
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This has as much supporting evidence as the claim that “you are born an alcoholic.” Even if true, (and studies indicate that homosexuality is a psychological disorder which can and has been cured), then just as “drunkeness” is not a morally licit alternative lifestyle, neither is homosexual sexual acts. They are both sins, even if the sinner is afflicted by a psychological disorder.

I doubt necrophilia or pedophilia are something you are “born with”, although these too are sexual psycological disorders that are not to be condoned as morally licit alternative lifestyles. Sexual disorders are most likely heavily influenced by dysfunctional relationships during the formative early childhood years.

For example, my mom worked with a gay man whose father abandoned him as an infant and was raised by his grandmother. His grandmother wanted a girl, not a boy. So she dressed him since the age of two as a girl. Never in his entire life did he have a healthy relationship with a male role model while growing up. This according to his own testimony. Hmmmm… I wonder why he’s gay?

Can’t anybody, necophiliac, pedopheliac, homosexual or heterosexual, choose not to have sex? I’m choosing not to have sex right now, so it seems that it is possible. There have been many who have lived celibate lives, never choosing to have sex despite a natural urge to do so. So I don’t see that homosexual sex is any more an inevitability than alcoholism or necrophilia or pedophilia, etc. is an inevitability.

We all have our crosses to bear. We are called to bear it faithfully, in accordance with the Father’s will, not our own, as did our Savior Jesus Christ.
 
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lovesfall:
The family and I really do feel my uncle has “lost it” for want of a more appropriate term. He is an extremely intelligent man, is a retired psychiatrist and CEO of a huge hospital. But…this man he is marrying not only is HIV positive, but has full blown AIDS! We are all in shock that my uncle would choose to be with someone that inevitably will have to be taken care of. The problem with that (besides the obvious) is that my uncle is not in the best of health either. I am in the health field and I seriously do feel he is showing signs of either senility or dementia.
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He took care of you when you needed him. That wasn’t dementia. He sounds like a very caring, selfless, compassionate person to me. Now you know him and know what other signs of dementia he may be showing. But if taking in a man with a terminal disease and not being ashamed of it is the only sign, I don’t think you’ll make much of a case. In fact, I daresay that their “marriage” may not be about disordered sex, but about legally putting themselves in the position to take care of each other. Unless his very “out” friend has been sharing some very intimate details with you, for all you know they are from their point of view starting a monastery of two. At any rate, you don’t have to agree with gay marriage to see something worthy of deep respect there. You are lucky to have such a man in your family. A complicated sort of lucky is lucky nonetheless.
 
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