Gays In The Military

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No, I am not an expat. I was born a US citizen and am currently a US citizen. I wish I was in New Zealand because the climate would be better for my health and I would be legally recognized as my true gender.
Well, Maria, I’d be lying if I said I agreed with you. I can’t say I understand your position either, because your situation seems so different from mine, and so complex. I wish you well.

But I guess we can agree on one thing. New Zealand is a beautiful country. I think it’s the best place to live in the world.

God bless
 
Assumptions

Whole lot of assumptions.

Concerning the retired gay doctor, what else where the Marines going to do?

The problem I see here is that this thread has devolved into using assumptions with absolutely no empirical proof being used nor the use of experience. Have you ever served in the military? Have you served in the combat arms? If you haven’t then everything you said on this thread is assumptions, except maybe the doctor story, and none of it can be proven. You are not the only one doing this and I don’t mean to pick on you. But you need to come with real knowledge not madeup stuff. The same goes for Larkin even though I do not expect it of him since he hasn’t supplied anything that is a real argument.
Yes, I have served 7 years active duty in the USMC, and 14 years in the reserves. My last deployment was to Iraq. Our medic was gay. This was known and accepted. Among the gay Marines whom I have known, who finally “came out”, the only negative consequences where that their brother Marines were disappointed that they waited.

I never saw it in the USMC, but it is well known that the Navy will wait until a gay sailor or officer is a year or two from retirement, and then will bring up allegations of homosexuality in order to subvert his retirement benefits.
 
Yes, I have served 7 years active duty in the USMC, and 14 years in the reserves. My last deployment was to Iraq. Our medic was gay. This was known and accepted. Among the gay Marines whom I have known, who finally “came out”, the only negative consequences where that their brother Marines were disappointed that they waited.

I never saw it in the USMC, but it is well known that the Navy will wait until a gay sailor or officer is a year or two from retirement, and then will bring up allegations of homosexuality in order to subvert his retirement benefits.
Thank you so much for posting this! I’ve been trying to get this across. My brother was a Marine and he said the same thing; everyone knew who was gay and it never mattered to them.

I am shocked to hear that about the Navy! That’s sneaky and just wrong! :mad:
 
Yes, I have served 7 years active duty in the USMC, and 14 years in the reserves. My last deployment was to Iraq. Our medic was gay. This was known and accepted. Among the gay Marines whom I have known, who finally “came out”, the only negative consequences where that their brother Marines were disappointed that they waited.

I never saw it in the USMC, but it is well known that the Navy will wait until a gay sailor or officer is a year or two from retirement, and then will bring up allegations of homosexuality in order to subvert his retirement benefits.
It’s good to hear from someone with real experience and real understanding on the matter.

If someone is willing to face the hardships of war and give that sacrifice to serve and protect their country and all of the civilians in it, then that should be accepted graciously and be honoured, be they heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, trisexual, white, black, green, purple, male, female, and everything inbetween.

And quite frankly, until there is a time when enough heterosexual men have the strength, nerve and will to enter such service until there is an over abundance of soldiers, then to put it bluntly, you’re in no position to be choosy about who to send out to war.
 
“Also, I am not an activist, I just want to be able to love a man or woman without being condemned.”
Wow. It would seem that somebody here has not read Genesis ch. 19. If you don’t want to be condemned then don’t upset God.
 
You all should read Col. John Ripley’s 1993 Testimony to the House and Senate on Homosexuals in the military. I can’t remember at the time what website it is on. His testimony was what made the government decide on the “don’t ask don’t tell” policy. The government was trying to allow Gays to be openly gay in the military and he stood up for what he believed to be right.
There is another point that I would like to make. Just about everybody here hails those that have had experience. I wish that congress would do the same. After Obama made it clear that he was going to push letting gays in the military 1150 officers signed a petition to him asking him not to do that. There were over 50 4star generals that signed it. I just wish that the government would let others do the jobs that they are supposed to do and congress stick to enforcing the law and not writing new ones.
 
You all should read Col. John Ripley’s 1993 Testimony to the House and Senate on Homosexuals in the military. I can’t remember at the time what website it is on. His testimony was what made the government decide on the “don’t ask don’t tell” policy. The government was trying to allow Gays to be openly gay in the military and he stood up for what he believed to be right.
There is another point that I would like to make. Just about everybody here hails those that have had experience. I wish that congress would do the same. After Obama made it clear that he was going to push letting gays in the military 1150 officers signed a petition to him asking him not to do that. There were over 50 4star generals that signed it. I just wish that the government would let others do the jobs that they are supposed to do and congress stick to enforcing the law and not writing new ones.
What was their reasoning?
 
You all should read Col. John Ripley’s 1993 Testimony to the House and Senate on Homosexuals in the military. I can’t remember at the time what website it is on. His testimony was what made the government decide on the “don’t ask don’t tell” policy. The government was trying to allow Gays to be openly gay in the military and he stood up for what he believed to be right.
There is another point that I would like to make. Just about everybody here hails those that have had experience. I wish that congress would do the same. After Obama made it clear that he was going to push letting gays in the military 1150 officers signed a petition to him asking him not to do that. There were over 50 4star generals that signed it. I just wish that the government would let others do the jobs that they are supposed to do and congress stick to enforcing the law and not writing new ones.
1993 was nearly 20 years ago. A lot has changed both in attitude and understanding. Further, we have been through a number of conflicts with “don’t ask, don’t tell”, and the sky did not fall in. Fighting efficiency and morale were not affected significantly.

My experience in the military has been in several capacities. The last time I was in combat in the USMC, our medic was openly gay. Frankly, he didn’t care who knew. He did not flaunt it, and he did not hide it. There were once some guys making insulting remarks and jokes about gays. He did ask them to stop making such remarks and jokes, because he found them personally offensive. The man did his job extremely well. He was respected for that, and people kept their opinions about his sexuality to themselves, as one would with any coworker who happens to do his job well. When I discussed it with a friend, we both agreed that (1) it did not matter, and that (2) if he were to be harassed or replaced in our unit, that we all might be much worse off with a less competent but heterosexual corpsman. So, professionalism won the day.

Now I am in the US Navy medical corps. I already knew that there is a high percentage of gay physicians and corpsmen. This is a non issue to providing the best medical care that we can. I have not heard of a single incident of any soldier, Marine, sailor or airman complaining about any issues with any staff with respect to this issue. There may be such issues at some time and place. But I am unaware of them. Once again, professionalism is more important than personal sex lives of individuals.

There is a generational issue, and a service branch issue. The older officers and enlisted are more likely to be opposed to full integration, than the younger officers and enlisted, in my experience. It is a non issue more often with younger men.

Peter Pace, then head of the Joint Chiefs decided to show the US Congress that integration was a bad idea. One way he tried to do so was to commission a survey across all branches. The results were that the majority Army, Navy and Air Force service members did not care. There was a slight majority of Marine Corps service members who did. The results were the opposite of what Gn. Pace was hoping for.

My take on it is, that as with any change, there is resistance. Most of what we are seeing is that, as far as negative reactions go. None of it appears to be borne out of any negative experiences in real conditions.

I have heard it said more than once in discussions on the issue, that all an individual cares about in combat is if the man next to him is doing his job well. I will take a good shooter who is gay, over a bad one who is straight any day.
 
My husband is in the military and has worked with people that are gay, lesbian, and bisexual. It never caused any problems in the work environment. I also think that people that are gay, lesbian, or bisexual have a right to be gainfully employed. So I have no problems and my husband has no problem with these people working in the military.
 
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