Gays May Be Prosecuted at 2014 Olympics

[holyrood]

I complain about our support of those countries routinely, but they weren’t the topic of this thread. I abhor the idea of Sharia law… In fact I abhor the idea of any religiously based laws.

Are you on another forum, another thread somewhere, devoting as much time to speaking out against these countries–who are actually killing people–as you’re devoting here to demanding the rights of homosexuals to propagandize other people’s kids? If so, kudos to you.

While I agree that most people who disagree with us aren’t phobic, I think there are definitely some out there. When I hear things about how the nation is going to be destroyed because of gay marriage, or when I hear natural disasters being blamed on the gays, or when i hear people say that one day they will be stripped of all religious liberties, or churches will be forced to marry gay people in the US… I sense at least a hint of irrational fear.

So in effect, you’ve agreed that disagreement is not ‘phobic’ but then gone on to say that those who believe differently from you have ‘irrational fear.’ In the next post, I’ll be including a link to a movie that discusses some of the ways in which our culture’s ideas about sex are harming us. This includes homosexuality. There’s already evidence of what ‘gay marriage’ is doing to our country. There are already pastors around the world being charged with crimes for stating what the Bible says about homosexuality.

There are already people talking about removing the church’s tax exempt status if it dares to teach what our faith tells us is true. There’s already been some sort of law suit against a church for refusing to marry two men–‘ruining my big day.’ There are already people raised by homosexual couples speaking out about what it is to grow up deliberately deprived of a parent of the other gender. There are already people who are afraid to decline to participate in ‘gay weddings,’ despite it going against their religious principles. There are already large portions of society not raising children in part because of things like homosexuality (obviously not entirely) and this is having a demographic impact, which also impacts our economy.

This entire thread is about the Russian government’s attempt to stop children being propagandized. This should have been MY religious freedom and liberty, to teach my children as I see fit, and instead, that right has been taken from me by people putting this stuff out there in every sitcom and movie, all over the internet, etc., telling MY children things against MY religious beliefs. Things I believe may harm their soul, their eternal future, their health here on this earth if they choose to get involved in this stuff.

These things are already happening, and it’s just the start. How is it an ‘irrational fear’ to believe that what we already see happening…is in fact happening? This is not ‘irrational fear,’ but intelligent discernment. An ability to look at facts and see where we’re heading.

Natural disasters–honestly, did God send you an e-mail telling you what He does or doesn’t do? Maybe they’re just natural disasters or maybe it is warnings before the real Sodom and Gomorrah, before God finally becomes fed up and unwilling to wait any longer.

First, if I’m not mistaken, the homosexuals in Nazi held territories were thrown in the same ovens as the Jewish victims. I’m not saying its a perfect analogy, I’m saying that there are situational similarities.

Just because they were different groups being attacked, doesn’t mean that it’s out of the realm of possibilities for history to repeat itself, and for the antagonist’s target to be a different group.

constitutionalistnc.tripod.com/hitler-leftist/id12.html

“Documents the homosexual and occultic roots of the Nazi movement in Germany. Much has been written about Nazi persecution of homosexuals. Yet, many Nazis were homosexuals themselves, and the so-called persecution was merely one faction using the state to suppress the other faction or was unrelated to their being homosexual.”

modernhistoryproject.org/mhp?Article=PinkSwastika

Did you mean two men having sex have complementary anatomy? There is no way the bodies of two men or two women can achieve complementarity in the sex act. Whatever supposed sexual act between two of the same gender is performed, it can only be an approximation or simulation of intercourse between a man and a woman.
.
.
I can tell you that my two brothers and sister-in-law who are physicians will laugh at your assertion that “the anatomy is perfectly complementary” with two men (or two women) engaging in sex,

Well said. This is simply a ridiculous assertion, that men’s bodies are somehow designed to have sex with one another. The physical damage alone would suggest otherwise. “By their fruits you shall know them,” and the number of diseases, drug and alcohol issues, and so on, among homosexuals would suggest that this is not a healthy way to live.

 

[holyrood]

Demographic Winter

One thing that we haven’t talked about much in this thread is the reason Russia passed this bill. They have seen the results, in their demographics, of the last 40-50 years of people throwing away traditional values. It could be pointed out that this is hardly concern for morality on their part, but more a practical concern for the survival of their country.

I think this highlights what those of faith have known all along: these ‘rules’ and restrictions God (and by proxy all those evil hateful religious types out there) foist on the world are not about ‘controlling people’ as we so often (ridiculously) hear, but about the fact that God Who designed and created us actually KNOWS something about what is best for us, what will ultimately bring us the greatest happiness.

This video is not about homosexuality, but about the many reasons why we’re heading to a demographic winter, how it’s affecting our economy already, and more.

There is, however, an interesting comment made probably more than 2/3 of the way through, where one of the many professors/demographers represented says that among the world’s top demographers, there is agreement based on the data that we need to get back to more traditional values because the numbers they work with show that our current lifestyle is having an overall negative impact on our society. This includes the things we’re talking about in this thread.

 

[InSearchofGrace]

I complain about our support of those countries routinely, but they weren’t the topic of this thread. I abhor the idea of Sharia law… In fact I abhor the idea of any religiously based laws.

… so much so that you go to any Muslim site (as you do here) to engage its Muslim membership that their Quranic surahs and sharia law preaching death to homosexuals is an abhorrent religiously based law? And that they need to step into this pluralistic world / society that permits freedom for gays to be open about their homosexuality and marry, that for equality sake, provide financial benefits to married gay couples?

Should not homosexual activists focus on targeting the sources and places of actual horrific practices against homosexuals, instead of picking on anti-gay Christians like Scott Lively, or take offense that they would be disallowed to wear rainbow T-shirts, wave a rainbow flag, hold hands in public in Sochi, Russia, etc?
,

 

[Darryl1958]

First, if I’m not mistaken, the homosexuals in Nazi held territories were thrown in the same ovens as the Jewish victims. I’m not saying its a perfect analogy, I’m saying that there are situational similarities.

Just because they were different groups being attacked, doesn’t mean that it’s out of the realm of possibilities for history to repeat itself, and for the antagonist’s target to be a different group.

Goodwins law.

 

[JRJOHNSON]

I have not been to Russia (though would like), but we have no business to be telling Russia or Uganda what laws they can have against gay propaganda. buchanan.org/blog/post-v-puti…re-you-on-5760 President Barack H. Obama has no business to be lecturing Russia on what their laws should be. I don’t watch Olympics anyhow, but Russians have these laws to protect children from filthy propaganda.

Also with gay bashings which are happening in Russia, media version can’t be trusted. Though what the Russian men did was assault and battery, the circumstances possibly call for less punishment. The media gave 1/2 truths by saying the Russian men (calling them neo-Nazis with no proof) bashed gays and put the images on Internet, but here’s what most media omitted though some have now raised it. The Russian men who were bashing gays had pretended to be 15 year old boys on Internet by going on gay websites. Gays looking for teenage boys on Internet replied and set up places to meet them, but instead the gays got bashed by men pretending to be 15 year old boys. Yes, what the Russian men did is vigilanteism for which they should do jail time because right thing to do is to report this to cops and let the cops arrest the gays for soliciting minors and then hopefully the legal system will convict the gays and send them to prison.

But these gays who were bashed did commit a crime by looking for teenage boys on Internet and instead got bashed by men who pretended to be the teenage boys, so I have no sympathy for the gays bashed here. If a man were looking for teenage girls on Internet but instead got bashed by a mob, many would say the man was a disgusting pig looking for underage girls. Gays often harass teenage boys. Those gay bashing victims deserve no sympathy because there is something wrong with an adult looking for teenagers. The gay bashers put the images on Internet after they bashed the gays with slogan ‘occupy pedophilia’ because they aren’t going to tolerate gays harassing teenage boys. Yes, it’s the job of police to do this, but again, no sympathy for these gay bashing victims.

 

[SeannyM]

Goodwins law.

I was responding to a question about how I could dare to make the comparison and that it was insulting to jewish people… I was only pointing out that gay people were also persecuted.

Your use of “goodwins law” seems to be excessive. Unless you actually believe that the historical events surrounding the holocaust are off limits for the purpose of learning from history. There are clear similarities between today’s events and the events leading up to the holocaust, and so there is actually a legitimate reason to make the comparison. This is not the same as calling a political figure a nazi or a communist because you don’t like them.

 

[SeannyM]

… so much so that you go to any Muslim site (as you do here) to engage its Muslim membership that their Quranic surahs and sharia law preaching death to homosexuals is an abhorrent religiously based law? And that they need to step into this pluralistic world / society that permits freedom for gays to be open about their homosexuality and marry, that for equality sake, provide financial benefits to married gay couples?

Should not homosexual activists focus on targeting the sources and places of actual horrific practices against homosexuals, instead of picking on anti-gay Christians like Scott Lively, or take offense that they would be disallowed to wear rainbow T-shirts, wave a rainbow flag, hold hands in public in Sochi, Russia, etc?
,

I’m mostly concerned with achieving equality in the country in which I reside. But yes, I do in fact engage Muslims on these issues as well.

 

[holyrood]

Goodwins law.

I had to look up Godwin’s law. For those who also haven’t heard of it:

Godwin’s law (also known as Godwin’s Rule of Nazi Analogies or Godwin’s Law of Nazi Analogies[1][2]) is an assertion made by Mike Godwin in 1990[2] that has become an Internet adage. It states: “As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1.”[2][3] In other words, Godwin said that, given enough time, in any online discussion—regardless of topic or scope—someone inevitably makes a comparison to Hitler or the Nazis.

Although in one of its early forms Godwin’s law referred specifically to Usenet newsgroup discussions,[4] the law is now often applied to any threaded online discussion, such as forums, chat rooms and blog comment threads, and has been invoked for the inappropriate use of Nazi analogies in articles or speeches.[5] The law is sometimes invoked prescriptively to mark the end of a discussion when a Nazi analogy is made, with the writer who made the analogy being considered to have lost the argument.

I was responding to a question about how I could dare to make the comparison and that it was insulting to jewish people… I was only pointing out that gay people were also persecuted.

The fact is, after thousands of years of history, everyone has been persecuted: the Irish, the Chinese, Indians, blacks, gays, Christians, Jews…everyone. The fact that the Nazis threw people into concentration camps, some of whom were gay, proves…?

There are clear similarities between today’s events and the events leading up to the holocaust, and so there is actually a legitimate reason to make the comparison. This is not the same as calling a political figure a nazi or a communist because you don’t like them.

I don’t see any similarity between putting someone in an oven because they happen to be born into a particular religion over which they had no control, and putting someone in jail for actually deliberately, knowing, intentionally *breaking the law *with actual, deliberate actions, actions, moreover, that have been deemed by billions of people throughout history, and by every major world religion, to actually be harmful to children and society.

I’m mostly concerned with achieving equality in the country in which I reside. But yes, I do in fact engage Muslims on these issues as well.

Which forums? Forums with radical Muslims who support sharia law? Are you arguing with such people that gays should not be killed? Can you provide a link?

…we have no business to be telling Russia or Uganda what laws they can have against gay propaganda. …Russians have these laws to protect children from filthy propaganda.

Exactly.

Also with gay bashings which are happening in Russia, **media version can’t be trusted. ** …The Russian men who were bashing gays had pretended to be 15 year old boys on Internet by going on gay websites. Gays looking for teenage boys on Internet replied and set up places to meet them, but instead the gays got bashed by men pretending to be 15 year old boys.

This is the sad truth: the media is so determined to change society, no matter how many lies they have to tell, rather than report the news, that they have themselves irrelevant. They can’t be trusted.

I fully agree that nobody should have been beaten up. Notice: nobody. But if they were preying on boys, it’s kind of hard to feel like they’re sweet innocent little victims, either.

 

[SeannyM]

I had to look up Godwin’s law. For those who also haven’t heard of it:


holyrood;11127639:

IThe fact is, after thousands of years of history, everyone

has been persecuted: the Irish, the Chinese, Indians, blacks, gays, Christians, Jews…everyone. The fact that the Nazis threw people into concentration camps, some of whom were gay, proves…?

I don’t see any similarity between putting someone in an oven because they happen to be born into a particular religion over which they had no control, and putting someone in jail for actually deliberately, knowing, intentionally *breaking the law *with actual, deliberate actions, actions, moreover, that have been deemed by billions of people throughout history, and by every major world religion, to actually be harmful to children and society.

Which forums? Forums with radical Muslims who support sharia law? Are you arguing with such people that gays should not be killed? Can you provide a link?

Exactly.

This is the sad truth: the media is so determined to change society, no matter how many lies they have to tell, rather than report the news, that they have themselves irrelevant. They can’t be trusted.

I fully agree that nobody should have been beaten up. Notice: nobody. But if they were preying on boys, it’s kind of hard to feel like they’re sweet innocent little victims, either.

I’m not saying Russia is putting anyone in ovens… I’m saying that there are events occurring now that are similar to events that occurred prior to the 1936 olympics. If you can’t understand the similarities, then I guess you will just continue to disagree, because I don’t think I’d have the time to explain them. But basically if you want to give it a try, take any narrative of the events leading up to the 1936 olympics, and replace the word Jewish with the word gay, and many of those events will fit right into today’s news coverage on the current situation. Except, you wouldn’t have to add the word gay, because it was happening to them back then as well.

 

[gam197]

… so much so that you go to any Muslim site (as you do here) to engage its Muslim membership that their Quranic surahs and sharia law preaching death to homosexuals is an abhorrent religiously based law? And that they need to step into this pluralistic world / society that permits freedom for gays to be open about their homosexuality and marry, that for equality sake, provide financial benefits to married gay couples?

Should not homosexual activists focus on targeting the sources and places of actual horrific practices against homosexuals, instead of picking on anti-gay Christians like Scott Lively, or take offense that they would be disallowed to wear rainbow T-shirts, wave a rainbow flag, hold hands in public in Sochi, Russia, etc?
,

Not only in Russia but any Russian who is in American in under attack.
We saw that with the article on Red Wind hockey player Pavel Datsyuk.

Pavel Datsyuk on Russian anti-gay law: “I’m orthodox and that says it all.”

nhl.si.com/2013/08/22/pavel-datsyuk-on-russian-anti-gay-law-im-orthodox-and-that-says-it-all/

And now the gay community wants the Met Opera house to host a LGBT Gala.

Two Russian stars, soprano Anna Netrebko and conductor Valery Gergiev, publicly supported Vladimir Putin in his reelection to the presidency in 2012. …

While there’s been no statement on the issue from Gergiev, Netrebko, to her credit, has posted a tempered statement on her Facebook page, with no mention of Russia.

“As an artist, it is my great joy to collaborate with all of my wonderful colleagues – regardless of their race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or sexual orientation. I have never and will never discriminate against anyone”.

Attack! Attack! Attack!

 

[Darryl1958]

I was responding to a question about how I could dare to make the comparison and that it was insulting to jewish people… I was only pointing out that gay people were also persecuted.

Your use of “goodwins law” seems to be excessive. Unless you actually believe that the historical events surrounding the holocaust are off limits for the purpose of learning from history. There are clear similarities between today’s events and the events leading up to the holocaust, and so there is actually a legitimate reason to make the comparison. This is not the same as calling a political figure a nazi or a communist because you don’t like them.

Goodwin’s Law applies to the deliberate overkill being used in the argument. It cheapens any point you try to make when you have to bring ovens and Nazis into the discussion.

 

[SeannyM]

It’s cool, I’m not welcome there anyway, so I’m not particularly concerned. I’m not saying anything in an attempt to be ofensive or demeaning. I’m just recognizing the similarities in some of the events.

 

[SeannyM]

Well since those who frequent this forum are so concerned with offending others’ sensibilities, I apologize. Except wait, did you just criticize me for not being concerned about offending other’s sensibilities in the same post you tell me that I’m not equal to heterosexuals, then insinuate that I have some sort of disease or something? Because it offends my sensibilities.

 

[Jeffrey_David]

:clapping:

 

[gnosisofthomas]

I love offending the sensibilities of people who have the audacity to say I’m suffering from being gay and that my love isn’t equal to heterosexuals. The only suffering I experience is from people like you. If me holding hands with my husband offends your sensibilities, then you’re the one with the problem, not me!

 

[SeannyM]

I’m obliged to respect the followers of RCC teaching, but I’m not required to respect the teaching itself. Would you respect a teaching that taught that you were a “spiritual murderer?” I respect that you have the right to believe that, but I will not ever respect that teaching. I also do not have any desire to attempt to change your belief in that teaching. I’m only here to engage in spirited debate, and offer another point of view about the social implications of current events, and to attempt to understand how Roman Catholics view the events of the times.

 

[estesbob]

I love offending the sensibilities of people who have the audacity to say I’m suffering from being gay and that my love isn’t equal to heterosexuals. The only suffering I experience is from people like you. If me holding hands with my husband offends your sensibilities, then you’re the one with the problem, not me!

You definitely came to the wrong place if you expected to find people affirming homosexual behavior.

BTW,-love never expresses itself through sin.

 

[holyrood]

did you just criticize me for not being concerned about offending other’s sensibilities in the same post you tell me that I’m not equal to heterosexuals.

Just a little compare and contrast below.

From the person who wants tolerance:

**I love offending the sensibilities of people **who…[have a different opinion than me.]

From the person speaking the views routinely called ‘intolerant’ and hateful:

I know in which of those sentence I am seeing true love and respect for others as human beings. I know in which I see true dignity and compassion given to others, even those who disagree with him.

 

[gnosisofthomas]

BTW,-love never expresses itself through sin.

I agree.

 

[gnosisofthomas]

I’m not a woman.

There is an evil in Russia, but it’s not because of the homosexuals.

I get sad over how far people have strayed from the apostolic churches too… it’s been a problem since about the 4th century.