George W. Bush: "I'm worried that I might be the last Republican president."

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It is a bit of a strawman to imply that one who does believe in the punishing arm of the state to enforce family values cannot be considered to be a genuine conservative.
 
Darryl1958 said:
It is a bit of a strawman to imply that one who does believe in the punishing arm of the state to enforce family values cannot be considered to be a genuine conservative.
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I don’t believe I said that.

I said that because I do not any longer believe in the use of said punishing arm for that reason, I do not hold to social conservatism per se.

ICXC NIKA
 
GEddie said:
I don’t believe I said that.

I said that because I do not any longer believe in the use of said punishing arm for that reason, I do not hold to social conservatism per se.

ICXC NIKA
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Fine then.
Be it understood too that social conservatism is not about enforcing family values with the punishing arm of the law either.
These days in fact, it is more about ducking when the punishing arm of the law takes a swipe at social conservatives for not believing in the “family values” that the State have made the Official Values.
 
TCEL said:
People who work in defense think we had business in Iraq. They doubly think we didn’t have the stomach to see it through, and that we left when we shouldn’t have. And they aren’t necessarily conservatives. However, if I didn’t know those people, I would probably agree with the general perception that we had no business there. So, your larger point stands. Perception is that we shouldn’t have gone in, and that narrative gained traction.

I agree with you, though, that Trump has been unnecessarily antagonistic, and that demographics have changed. That’s why it kills me when conservatives, many of whom are family and friends, don’t see the Catch 22 of contraception. They complain about “all these people.”
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I don’t doubt that President Bush and those who were in favor of the Iraq war had noble intentions. There was a great deal of planning on the invasion and defeat of Saddam Hussein but it is also very clear that there was not enough planning for what would happed after Saddam Hussein was defeated. We did not have a viable “exit strategy”. The war lingered for many years and we lost many lives. Ultimately the Iraq War destabilized the Middle East and created a political environment in the U.S that would make it very difficult for a Republican to be elected POTUS.

I could not agree with you more on the Catch 22 of Contraception. Europe is a prime example of the Catch 22 of contraception in that European countries that have been Christian for centuries will become Muslim countries unless something change and changes fast.
 
wllmjoseph said:
I don’t doubt that President Bush and those who were in favor of the Iraq war had noble intentions. There was a great deal of planning on the invasion and defeat of Saddam Hussein but it is also very clear that there was not enough planning for what would happed after Saddam Hussein was defeated. We did not have a viable “exit strategy”. The war lingered for many years and we lost many lives. Ultimately the Iraq War destabilized the Middle East and created a political environment in the U.S that would make it very difficult for a Republican to be elected POTUS.

I could not agree with you more on the Catch 22 of Contraception. Europe is a prime example of the Catch 22 of contraception in that European countries that have been Christian for centuries will become Muslim countries unless something change and changes fast.
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Well, it’s nice to have a friendly disagreement. 🙂 I’m not in Defense myself. But from people I know who have been there, they think we pulled out too early. My dad was also in Defense, and the Middle East has never been truly stable. If a problem isn’t solved according to our short attention spans, people lose interest. We need to learn to be in things for the long-haul, not the short-haul.

But, it is what it is, and now we move forward best we can. Since I think most people agree we shouldn’t have been there, it doesn’t make sense to keep bringing that up. (Not you, but in general.) The consensus has been reached, rightly or wrongly. But I respect your opinion, and thanks for the civil discourse.
 
TCEL said:
Well, it’s nice to have a friendly disagreement. 🙂 I’m not in Defense myself. But from people I know who have been there, they think we pulled out too early. My dad was also in Defense, and the Middle East has never been truly stable. If a problem isn’t solved according to our short attention spans, people lose interest. We need to learn to be in things for the long-haul, not the short-haul.

But, it is what it is, and now we move forward best we can. Since I think most people agree we shouldn’t have been there, it doesn’t make sense to keep bringing that up. (Not you, but in general.) The consensus has been reached, rightly or wrongly. But I respect your opinion, and thanks for the civil discourse.
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You are so right.
The Iraq war has been over for a long time now.

What we need to learn from it is that people really do have too short of attention spans to wage the kind of war that is required when the enemy on the other side is motivated by a religious creed The attention span of religious creeds expands to even centuries.

Maybe the Obama strategy of token wars and token bombings to keep things stirred up and the region in a state of perpetual warfare and chaos is the correct one then?
Put everything on slow burn, much like pouring oil down the San Andreas fault to keep things sliding along without the status ever reaching to the magnitude of another cataclysmic event.
I don’t know if that is the most humanitarian policy to follow, but as long as the doors are kept shut to importing the ideology, much like Obama has done, and Trump has promised to do more of, then at least the precarious fate looming over Europe might be prevented.

A nightclub here or there, or a Christmas party or even the odd priest may be the price that we need to play, if the choice is between that and the Bush policy of trying to change the region from the top down.
 
ringil said:
cnn.com/2016/07/19/politics/george-w-bush-last-republican-president/

Interesting article. George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush, Jeb Bush, Mitt Romney, and John McCain all skipped out on this years GOP convention.
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I am concerned about this too but when he says that he’s worried about being the last Republican president, does he have an insight into the future? Does he know that he’ll be the last Republican president? Sooner or later, the Democrats will lose an election. Nothing lasts forever just like the Yankees of the late 90’s. In the end, they started losing World Series and losing playoff series too. The Democrats will lose another election it is going to happen. Nothing can last forever. The question is: how long will it take before a Republican wins again.
 
Robyn_p said:
No. Most aren’t. The problem is Roe v Wade sent a lot of Catholics who held the Church’s teaching on abortion into the Republican Party, but that only resulted in Republican positions being conflated with Church teaching. That’s why so many “pro-life” people are pro-torture, pro-death penalty, pro nuclear weapons etc…despite Church teaching to the contrary…

Couple that with the constant demonization of Democrats (sometimes justifiably, the Democrat Party was stupid for making pelvic issues their top priority over the environment and the poor) and use of the “lesser of two evils” excuse (which really just meant vote for anyone who gives lip service to the pro-life cause) and you end up with the political climate we have today. Where “good” Christians are out in public promoting Trump and his evils as “the most Christian candidate” simply because he’s not a Democrat.

We deserve whoever we get this election.
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Well said, but sad that it has come to this.
 
DlandFan06 said:
I am concerned about this too but when he says that he’s worried about being the last Republican president, does he have an insight into the future? Does he know that he’ll be the last Republican president? Sooner or later, the Democrats will lose an election. Nothing lasts forever just like the Yankees of the late 90’s. In the end, they started losing World Series and losing playoff series too. The Democrats will lose another election it is going to happen. Nothing can last forever. The question is: how long will it take before a Republican wins again.
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I think the point is that the Republican party may not survive this election.
 
Darryl1958 said:
You are so right.
The Iraq war has been over for a long time now.

What we need to learn from it is that people really do have too short of attention spans to wage the kind of war that is required when the enemy on the other side is motivated by a religious creed The attention span of religious creeds expands to even centuries.

Maybe the Obama strategy of token wars and token bombings to keep things stirred up and the region in a state of perpetual warfare and chaos is the correct one then?
Put everything on slow burn, much like pouring oil down the San Andreas fault to keep things sliding along without the status ever reaching to the magnitude of another cataclysmic event.
I don’t know if that is the most humanitarian policy to follow, but as long as the doors are kept shut to importing the ideology, much like Obama has done, and Trump has promised to do more of, then at least the precarious fate looming over Europe might be prevented.

A nightclub here or there, or a Christmas party or even the odd priest may be the price that we need to play, if the choice is between that and the Bush policy of trying to change the region from the top down.
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Things to ponder, for sure, but above my paygrade to make any informed opinion about.
 
gracepoole said:
I think the point is that the Republican party may not survive this election.
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They may not, and honestly, given the way they let themselves be highjacked this cycle, they arguably deserve not to.

The purpose of the parties is to control who gets onto the Presihdential ballot. The GOP failed.

And they had been an afterthought in all the major states but TX for many years.

ICXC NIKA
 
Pence barely mentioned abortion in his acceptance speech for prime-time viewing (when most people are home from work and able to watch it) and Trump didn’t mention abortion at all. The GOP basically forfeited abortion to the Dems – that’s essentially what they did – and decided to pander to the homosexual lobby, including gay Republicans who may or may not be pro-life. Very mixed message, and I wonder how long it will take before Schlafly, et al, get buyer’s remorse.
 
TCEL said:
Well, it’s nice to have a friendly disagreement. 🙂 I’m not in Defense myself. But from people I know who have been there, they think we pulled out too early. My dad was also in Defense, and the Middle East has never been truly stable. If a problem isn’t solved according to our short attention spans, people lose interest. We need to learn to be in things for the long-haul, not the short-haul.

But, it is what it is, and now we move forward best we can. Since I think most people agree we shouldn’t have been there, it doesn’t make sense to keep bringing that up. (Not you, but in general.) The consensus has been reached, rightly or wrongly. But I respect your opinion, and thanks for the civil discourse.
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It is nice to have a friendly disagreement. All to often when there is a difference of opinion the posts will become antagonistic and provocative. I do agree with you that the damage has been done and that we need to move on. That being said the Republican party needs to acknowledge it’s mistakes and make it clear that it has learned from this experience. It is not good for America if the Republican party is not a viable alternative in presidential elections. The other issue for the Republican party is that they need to be a more inclusive party. I am not saying that they need to sacrifice their conservative ideals but that they need to do a better job in reaching out to Hispanics, Asians and African Americans. God help our country if our two party system is no longer viable.
 
If the GOP goes down, a new party will move into its slot. The 2PS will remain.

ICXC NIKA
 
In some states, a driving license is all that is needed to be shown at the polls. One need not be a citizen to get that, hence the route is open to election fraud.

ICXC NIKA
 
randomuser said:
Pence barely mentioned abortion in his acceptance speech for prime-time viewing (when most people are home from work and able to watch it) and Trump didn’t mention abortion at all. The GOP basically forfeited abortion to the Dems – that’s essentially what they did – and decided to pander to the homosexual lobby, including gay Republicans who may or may not be pro-life. Very mixed message, and I wonder how long it will take before Schlafly, et al, get buyer’s remorse.
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The nomination of Trump, with the help of the Evangelicals, demonstrates that abortion is no longer a real issue in American politics. This is a real watershed election in that way.
 
Darryl1958 said:
But as a businessman he financially benefits from illegal immigration too, so it is hard to know just what he will do on the issue.
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Good point. He never said he would give up his business dealings so that his service would be completely focused on carrying out the office of President.
 
stinkcat_14 said:
Exactly. It is not like the republicans are going to become democrats.
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I think there’s great potential for whatever emerges from the GOP’s wreckage (if it indeed doesn’t survive) to be far closer to what many CAF posters hope for, providing it’s created from the ground up.
 
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