Germany: 162,000 Catholics left Church, 537 parishes closed in 2016 [CC]

[Catholic_Press]

162,093 Catholics left the Church in Germany during 2016—down from 181,925 in 2015, according to statistics released by the bishops’ conference on July 21.

More…

 

[ARSpade]

It’s good that Germany has such a prominent role in the RCC these days. Obviously the rest of the world has much to learn from their shining example.

 

[reggieM]

That was supposedly good news. “Only” 162k left the Faith, down from 181K.
Eventually, the number for parish closings will “improve” also. Next year? “Only” 400 closed, down from 537.

… side note, given other statistics I think a lot who “left” the Church were already gone years ago. I believe German Catholics pay a church tax, so a lot of people get upset about that and want to save money. But they probably held on to the Catholic label for hopes of getting a Catholic funeral in the end.
Just speculating, but I doubt that many people all of a sudden decided to leave the Church. They’re a bunch of CINO’s - like we have in America.
All said - is it better to consider oneself a Catholic and at the same time deny all the teachings and never go to Mass? Or to be honest about it and totally leave the Church?

Hard to say.

 

[reggieM]

It’s good that Germany has such a prominent role in the RCC these days. Obviously the rest of the world has much to learn from their shining example.

Yes - I hear about Catholic leaders from Germany having the best and most progressive models for Church growth and evangelization. And they’re setting the agenda for everyone else?

 

[Kaliaa]

There is a church tax which the government collects and gives to the churches according to the listed denomination. No denomination = saving on your tax bill. That is probably how they got the numbers for those who left.

 

[reggieM]

That makes sense - thanks!

 

[PluniaZ]

God come to our rescue. Lord, make haste to help us.

 

[Padres1969]

That was supposedly good news. “Only” 162k left the Faith, down from 181K.
Eventually, the number for parish closings will “improve” also. Next year? “Only” 400 closed, down from 537.

… side note, given other statistics I think a lot who “left” the Church were already gone years ago. I believe German Catholics pay a church tax, so a lot of people get upset about that and want to save money. But they probably held on to the Catholic label for hopes of getting a Catholic funeral in the end.
Just speculating, but I doubt that many people all of a sudden decided to leave the Church. They’re a bunch of CINO’s - like we have in America.
All said - is it better to consider oneself a Catholic and at the same time deny all the teachings and never go to Mass? Or to be honest about it and totally leave the Church?

Hard to say.

How many Catholics and parishes are left with numbers like that in only 2 years?

 

[7_Sorrows]

Over 300,000 in 2 years?!!! I wonder what the number will be in 2017? So many
parishes clothing? What are the reasons given for people leaving the Catholic Church in drives in Germany.

 

[reggieM]

Over 300,000 in 2 years?!!! I wonder what the number will be in 2017? So many
parishes clothing? What are the reasons given for people leaving the Catholic Church in drives in Germany.

The linked article gives a lot of ugly statistics but no reasons why.
I’ve formed my own opinions - seeing the writing on the wall from many years back.

 

[JW55]

I would say the reason for a lot of this attrition is largely the growth of secular humanism. It is the “age of me”, doing what feels good, doing what you want and making sure to be politically correct. America is well on their way for the same thing. No big mystery…

 

[StudentMI]

I would say the reason for a lot of this attrition is largely the growth of secular humanism. It is the “age of me”, doing what feels good, doing what you want and making sure to be politically correct. America is well on their way for the same thing. No big mystery…

I would say the reason is the failure of the Church. I’m tired of people blaming every other thing than the Church for losing members. If the faith meant that much to people they wouldn’t just up and leave. If the Church failed them as youngsters and failed to catechize and failed to address their lives, you can’t blame secular humanism. You have to blame the institution that failed them.

 

[twf]

Yes - I hear about Catholic leaders from Germany having the best and most progressive models for Church growth and evangelization. And they’re setting the agenda for everyone else?

Yes, I’m told those conservative African bishops, who are baptizing new Catholics left, right and centre, have a lot to learn from the progressive German bishops… they keep opening doors, and their faithful nod, smile and march right out those doors.

 

[JW55]

I would say the reason is the failure of the Church. I’m tired of people blaming every other thing than the Church for losing members. If the faith meant that much to people they wouldn’t just up and leave. If the Church failed them as youngsters and failed to catechize and failed to address their lives, you can’t blame secular humanism. You have to blame the institution that failed them.

The church isn’t blameless.Unfortunately some of our churches do play into this role as well and this extrapolates the problem. However, people are inundated 24 hrs. a day by the media, their peers, society as a whole, and dare we be politically incorrect. We are in a society of self-gratification and the mice are willing to eat the cheese because it tastes good and you don’t have to give up anything to get it.

The mind set is, why suffer? why sacrifice?, why deprive myself? when I can shape God the way I want to. Parents teach their children, our schools teach it, it is not the easiest thing to resist and its seasoned with a sense of guilt if you don’t agree with it. The beauty of it, is that is subtle and you think you are being a good spiritual, caring person.

 

[reggieM]

Yes, I’m told those conservative African bishops, who are baptizing new Catholics left, right and centre, have a lot to learn from the progressive German bishops… they keep opening doors, and their faithful nod, smile and march right out those doors.

Yes - true!

 

[reggieM]

I would say the reason is the failure of the Church. I’m tired of people blaming every other thing than the Church for losing members. If the faith meant that much to people they wouldn’t just up and leave. If the Church failed them as youngsters and failed to catechize and failed to address their lives, you can’t blame secular humanism. You have to blame the institution that failed them.

It’s a good point. Secularism actually affected many church leaders. With good intentions, they tried to show the Church friendly to everyone, but often that meant getting rid of any real evangelization. People began to see the Church as unimportant. They often were not getting the message of salvation. That is a big problem in Europe in my opinion.
That’s why I’m concerned that those same secularized-leaders have such a prominent voice lately.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

RIP Germany ( and Europe) and western Catholics.

I pray we learn from thier example before it’s too late.

 

[Athanasiy]

The Germans are a powerful EU locomotive of transformation and reconstruction of Europe.
This people has a mission.
It is very pitty that people are becoming more and more indifferent to church and spirituality.
With the faith of Christ this nation could transform the world into a thousand times more.

 

[commenter]

I don’t live in Germany, and would welcome (name removed by moderator)ut from those with direct knowledge. But given what I do know, I compare it portions of the USA and Canada, which have had similar experiences, though the US is a few years behind.

It’s not all the fault of secular humanism, though that is a big part of it. Unlike the isolated “village atheist” of yesterday, the amiable unbelieving professor here and there who just wanted to be left alone, secular humanists are organized, with the concentrated media and political arenas reinforcing each other, and both dominating education. They are not ambiguous at all, they have a plan, and any plan tends to win, if the alternative is ambiguity.

And the Church in Germany seems to be ambiguous about doctrine. Church leaders seem not to try to engage the World, but desperate to be accepted by it. In my area there are lots of Catholic and Protestant churches that are friendly, accepting, non-judgmental…and mostly empty. If nothing is absolutely true/false, or right/wrong, but everything is relative, and nothing is supernatural, why bother with Church? If the Sunday sermon repeats the secular media, and Sunday school lesson repeats what the kids learned in public school, why bother going at all?

I don’t see much hope for the Church in Germany until there is a working alliance for orthodoxy, conversion, and evangelization between the Holy See and those laity and religious orders committed to this. To some extent this is what happened in the USA in the 1980s, with partial success in some places.

 

[7_Sorrows]

The Germans are a powerful EU locomotive of transformation and reconstruction of Europe.
This people has a mission.
It is very pitty that people are becoming more and more indifferent to church and spirituality.
With the faith of Christ this nation could transform the world into a thousand times more.

Did the locomotive of transformation begin with Martin Luther? This is the 500th anniversary of the Reformation.
Hitler had his dreams for Germany and the world…