God cannot explain the origin of life

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  1. He is not an "Abrahamic God
Indeed not, He is “the” Abrahamic God. The God who revealed Himself to Abraham and is followed by the Jewish, Christina and Islamic religions.
  1. By what authority do you state this, or who gave you this authority?
Logic. The beginning of life cannot be ascribed to any entity that already possesses life.

rossum
 
If the tretralemma applies to Buddha, it applies to all of us.
Yes. We will all attain nirvana, eventually. That tetralemma will apply to us after our last death.
He did not bring himself into existence.
He did. We all did. Our existence now is due to our birth. Our birth is due to our failure to attain enlightenment in our previous life. The Buddhist approach to the world is very different to the Abrahamic approach; this is just one example.

rossum
 
The equivocation fallacy is when you try to use a word that has multiple meanings, and try to use a different meaning out of context.
Very well, let us avoid the fallacy by using a new word: “doshef”. I shall use “living” to describe material life and “doshef” to describe the approximate equivalent that God posesses, and which is translated in the Bible as “living”.

Now, we can say that life is caused by God, who is not “living” but is instead “doshef”. So, the title of this thread becomes: “God cannot explain the origin of doshef”.

You still have a similar problem of being unable to explain the origin of something, it is just that now you cannot explain the origin of doshef. Splitting the definition of life into two does not really help you.

We have moved to something like:

Q: How did life originate?

A: Life was created by aliens form Zargon 3.

Q: Are those aliens alive?

A: No, they are not alive, instead they have doshef.

God may explain many things, but He does not explain everything.

rossum
 
So you don’t believe on evolution?
I accept evolution because the evidence overwhelmingly supports it. Evolution is a process which explains the origin of species, not the origin of life. The science of the origin of material life is called Abiogenesis, and has non-living chemical (name removed by moderator)uts with very primitive living proto-cells as its output.

rossum
 
All of the above

A chessboard is partly black.

A chessboard is not all black.

A chessboard is both partly black and not all black.

A chessboard is neither all black nor not only black.
Yes. A chessboard is a compound entity, so its different parts may simultaneously have contradictory properties. All humans, the Buddha included, are compound entities, so they may also have contradictory properties. The tetralemma can apply to compound entities.

The assumption I referred to above was the assumption of a non-compound entity.

rossum
 
The question of the thread concerns the origin of life. Is it necessary to invoke divine intervention to explain how life originated from matter or can life arise from matter due to processes which can be explained naturally without divine intervention. Some scientists say that it is not necessary to invoke divine intervention.
How do you explain the wholeness of your being. You are one person, perceiving, thinking and feeling, planning and carrying out those actions. In a universe of chemical reactions, here we are knowing that through time we are separate and connected. This is undeniable reality, our being here, whatever this is; the rest pure conjecture, however sophisticated the relationships that reveal what is known. The numbers that amaze you that are part of that connection with the world, these very concepts, you tell me how they are merely the product of organic molecules, coming together to bring about the whole that is you-in-the-world. Some scientist “believe” is correct; and yet they have formulated no physical force to explain it. They could actually; science fiction, seeing the gaps, has done so.
 
Yes. We will all attain nirvana, eventually. That tetralemma will apply to us after our last death.
He did. We all did. Our existence now is due to our birth. Our birth is due to our failure to attain enlightenment in our previous life. The Buddhist approach to the world is very different to the Abrahamic approach; this is just one example.
rossum
It applies to us now. Well, maybe not entirely. In a way it does and more so as we grow in Christ.
Who is it that failed to attain enlightenment? You have made the claim that there is no soul.
 
How do you explain the wholeness of your being. You are one person, perceiving, thinking and feeling, planning and carrying out those actions. In a universe of chemical reactions, here we are knowing that through time we are separate and connected. This is undeniable reality, our being here, whatever this is; the rest pure conjecture, however sophisticated the relationships that reveal what is known. The numbers that amaze you that are part of that connection with the world, these very concepts, you tell me how they are merely the product of organic molecules, coming together to bring about the whole that is you-in-the-world. Some scientist “believe” is correct; and yet they have formulated no physical force to explain it. They could actually; science fiction, seeing the gaps, has done so.
So are you claiming that life cannot arise from purely natural biochemical processes and can arise only as a result of divine intervention?
 
So are you claiming that life cannot arise from purely natural biochemical processes and can arise only as a result of divine intervention?
Yes, it seems obvious actually.

Think about your own existence. Why is this not one big cosmic soup? You exist in relation to everything else. Your mind cleaves time and space and has a perspective. Everything is whole experientially because the person is a unity. Obviously, one stroke and I will be a jabbering fool, if I’m not seen as being one already. We are a spirit-body unity, eternal and in time. This being who is a person perceives, thinks, feels and acts. The spirit does not move the body and the body does not generate the soul. It is one thing that knows and acts. And, when we die, all we will be is our relational nature, related, with all else, to its Source.

There will always be those who deny the existence of God. If required to do so, they will devise some life force that would describe the easily ignored reality of personal existence. It would go something like the whole is greater than the sum of its parts because of the Gaia (earthly unification, daughter of Chaos, wife of the sky) Principle, or some such nonsense. Freud wrote about Eros and Thanatos as being universal instincts addressing this and other issues of the mind, which does obviously exist.
 
Ah, but although they did indeed pay $9 each, the actual cost was not $30, but adjusted to $25, so they overpaid $2. And this $2 was taken by the bellhop.

peace
steve
This trick question is the point in regards to things like the chessboard statement. Often even with factual math trick wording can confound most humans, therefore in regards to such things issuing a “stumper” thought process is the same as this trick question 🙂
 
The question of the thread concerns the origin of life. Is it necessary to invoke divine intervention to explain how life originated from matter or can life arise from matter due to processes which can be explained naturally without divine intervention. Some scientists say that it is not necessary to invoke divine intervention.
Yeah, but now you’re playing the bellhop trick. Where’s that matter (on which natural processes operate) come from? 😉
 
He comes from nowhere; He was always there. This is what we’ve all, very patiently, been trying to explain.

Universal, unequivocal, unlimited existence.
You didn’t get my point. Assume that there is close box on the table. We, I and you, I says there is nothing in the box and you say there is. We cannot convince each other unless we open the box. I think it is very sincere to say that we don’t know.
 
You didn’t get my point. Assume that there is close box on the table. We, I and you, I says there is nothing in the box and you say there is. We cannot convince each other unless we open the box. I think it is very sincere to say that we don’t know.
If someone we trust, who has never lied and has no reason to lie, tells us what is in the box, but that opening the box is for some reason (it doesn’t matter why) impossible…

If my trust in this person is great enough, I will say that I know what he says is true.

The box doesn’t open until we die. We can either believe or disbelieve, and that’s what we’re discussing, because no one can actually open the box.🤷
 
He comes from nowhere; He was always there. This is what we’ve all, very patiently, been trying to explain.

Universal, unequivocal, unlimited existence.
The materialist says that matter comes from nowhere and has always been there in some form or another.
 
The materialist says that matter comes from nowhere and has always been there in some form or another.
I have to laugh when I recall the learned men science who worked so hard to disprove the peasant superstition of spontaneous generation… That flies sprung from meat, or mice from rags… And now they’re falling back on exactly that. :hmmm: :whistle:
 
The materialist says that matter comes from nowhere and has always been there in some form or another.
E=MCsquared explains it all. As long as potential energy exists, there is also the potential existence of matter.
 
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