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simpleas
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The Holy Spirit is depicted as a dove, why not depict the Holy Spirit as a man also?
The spirit was given to the disciples described as tongues of fire, was it a dove that was described as the spirit of God during Jesus’ baptism?
You can’t paint something that is unseen, we can only use our imagination as to what God would look like, and I bet no one ever has painted God correctly.
The spirit was given to the disciples described as tongues of fire, was it a dove that was described as the spirit of God during Jesus’ baptism?
You can’t paint something that is unseen, we can only use our imagination as to what God would look like, and I bet no one ever has painted God correctly.
T
TheOldColonel
Guest
The Man, Jesus, was actually seen. Indeed…
“Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you for so long a time and you still do not know me, Philip? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?”
-John 14:9
“Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you for so long a time and you still do not know me, Philip? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?”
-John 14:9
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simpleas
Guest
I think this is referring to how God is, as in, a loving and forgiving entity, rather than a description of what God looks like…
I
Ima_Dufus
Guest
I am having a bit of a spiritual/psychological struggle that is detrimental to finding my vocation as Catholic woman (btw, I’m 20 years old), and I would appreciated if someone who is theologically sound can offer me some advice. I’ve never talked to anyone about these things before, because I have no one who I trust enough to confide in, and I am generally not one to vent my problems on other people, but this issue has been driving me nuts for years and I’ve realized that I need to swallow my pride and get help. I am struggling with themes related to Ephesians 5:22-24, the creation and fall of Adam and Eve, authority, and the nature of God. It’s going to take a few paragraphs to summarize my questions.
I’ll begin with Adam and Eve. After they disobeyed God, they fell from grace, and thus caused all of humanity yet to be born to have disordered passions causing them to sin and suffer the effects of sin. God said to Adam that he would have to work “by the sweat of his brow,” and to Eve: “yet your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you” (Gen 3:16b). In this fallen world, women are at a disadvantage in terms of vulnerability given their lesser physical size and strength. I thought this apparent unfairness was because of sin. But, I heard a priest explain (in accordance with the Church fathers) that in the Bible, when someone names someone or something else, it is a sign of their authority over it. God named the various components of creation, and then Adam. However, he gave Adam the authority to name the animals, and to name Eve. Therefore, a man’s authority over his wife is by God’s design. I understand that authority the way God intended is meant to protect and serve those under it. I understand that the suffering resulting from abused authority is the result of sin, not God’s plan.
That point brings us to Ephesians 5:22-24, the passage where St. Paul tells wives to be submissive to their husbands and husbands to love their wives as Christ loves his Church. I understand that he is putting a heavy demand on the man, not just the woman. The husband’s role is a role of great servitude, as Christ serves his Church.
Now I am about to explain my stumbling block. Jesus deliberately chose men to be priests, the authority figures of the Church, which makes sense given that men naturally possess the type of strength and authority that both men and women naturally respect and obey. Priests are the representatives of Christ, and they represent Him in a way that a woman cannot. They are sons of God that represent the Father in a way a daughter cannot. As a female, this concept makes me feel as though women are made in a lesser image of God with inferior attributes of God. I know that I must not be seeing this right, and that this anguished feeling of being short-changed by God must be the result of my own pride and envy and the ploys of the devil. But I can’t help but perceive being excluded and deemed inferior. I try hard to love God, but I feel bitter at Him for making women weaker on purpose, and then putting men in charge.
I have more to say, but I need to continue on another thread…
I’ll begin with Adam and Eve. After they disobeyed God, they fell from grace, and thus caused all of humanity yet to be born to have disordered passions causing them to sin and suffer the effects of sin. God said to Adam that he would have to work “by the sweat of his brow,” and to Eve: “yet your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you” (Gen 3:16b). In this fallen world, women are at a disadvantage in terms of vulnerability given their lesser physical size and strength. I thought this apparent unfairness was because of sin. But, I heard a priest explain (in accordance with the Church fathers) that in the Bible, when someone names someone or something else, it is a sign of their authority over it. God named the various components of creation, and then Adam. However, he gave Adam the authority to name the animals, and to name Eve. Therefore, a man’s authority over his wife is by God’s design. I understand that authority the way God intended is meant to protect and serve those under it. I understand that the suffering resulting from abused authority is the result of sin, not God’s plan.
That point brings us to Ephesians 5:22-24, the passage where St. Paul tells wives to be submissive to their husbands and husbands to love their wives as Christ loves his Church. I understand that he is putting a heavy demand on the man, not just the woman. The husband’s role is a role of great servitude, as Christ serves his Church.
Now I am about to explain my stumbling block. Jesus deliberately chose men to be priests, the authority figures of the Church, which makes sense given that men naturally possess the type of strength and authority that both men and women naturally respect and obey. Priests are the representatives of Christ, and they represent Him in a way that a woman cannot. They are sons of God that represent the Father in a way a daughter cannot. As a female, this concept makes me feel as though women are made in a lesser image of God with inferior attributes of God. I know that I must not be seeing this right, and that this anguished feeling of being short-changed by God must be the result of my own pride and envy and the ploys of the devil. But I can’t help but perceive being excluded and deemed inferior. I try hard to love God, but I feel bitter at Him for making women weaker on purpose, and then putting men in charge.
I have more to say, but I need to continue on another thread…
I
Ima_Dufus
Guest
I have never approved of the feminists because of their immoral stances on abortion and contraception that lead to the death of children and enable men to treat women as objects. I have also been repulsed by their whiny, irate, accusatory, and selfish attitudes. I have also never been partial to “girl-power” fiction because I find that it often does not reflect reality. I understand that the feminist ideology ultimately leads to death, and it is self-loathing in its very nature. It rejects what it means to be a woman, which leads women to act in ways that are not true to themselves, which makes them unhappy. Feminism also enables fallen men to shirk their responsibilities and act in the immoral ways that I detest. Militant feminists do not possess the admirable qualities of either gender. Feminism has also served as a gateway for a variety of absurd and profane gender identity ideologies that have caused great suffering, loss of life, and loss of souls.
Although I do not agree with the feminists, I can empathize with them. We live in a world where personal achievements bring us earthly glory. It just seems as though men are privileged with the qualities that are necessary to lead nations, fight battles, advance technology, and pioneer every field of academic study, and all sorts of cool stuff that fascinate and inspire both men and women alike. The role of the woman, the mother, although vital for the formation of every person and the preservation of every culture, seems to be held in lesser esteem. Although widely appreciated, the feminine role seems to be less revered and glorified. In the spheres of both the worldly and the spiritual, it seems as though men get to do all the spectacular stuff. I am a competitive person and have my self-worth tied up with my achievements, so it’s hard for me not to feel inadequate.
I am a devout Catholic. I want to live and die for the truth, to do the will of God, to go to Heaven and help bring as many souls with me as possible. I know these things can only be done through the grace of God, through the intercession of Mary, and through the authority of the Church. Yet I am afflicted with a temptation to be resentful of the designs of God that are ingrained in the Faith that I love. The Church is led by men, and the heroes in the Bible are overwhelming male, serving as a typological representation of God, who is understood to be masculine. Men have the same pronouns as God, and I don’t; this bothers me for some reason. But I want to be who God wants me to be.
I know that the teachings of the Church are true, and that the precepts and designs of God are perfect. They are what allow humanity to flourish. Satan hates us and wants us to reject truth, and therefore deceives us to annihilate us. We are many parts in the Mystical Body of Christ, and we must do our part. I want to do my part, to be a part of it.
But how do I overcome these feelings of resentment, this perception of unfairness, this sense of self-loathing, and my lack of understanding and trust?
Although I do not agree with the feminists, I can empathize with them. We live in a world where personal achievements bring us earthly glory. It just seems as though men are privileged with the qualities that are necessary to lead nations, fight battles, advance technology, and pioneer every field of academic study, and all sorts of cool stuff that fascinate and inspire both men and women alike. The role of the woman, the mother, although vital for the formation of every person and the preservation of every culture, seems to be held in lesser esteem. Although widely appreciated, the feminine role seems to be less revered and glorified. In the spheres of both the worldly and the spiritual, it seems as though men get to do all the spectacular stuff. I am a competitive person and have my self-worth tied up with my achievements, so it’s hard for me not to feel inadequate.
I am a devout Catholic. I want to live and die for the truth, to do the will of God, to go to Heaven and help bring as many souls with me as possible. I know these things can only be done through the grace of God, through the intercession of Mary, and through the authority of the Church. Yet I am afflicted with a temptation to be resentful of the designs of God that are ingrained in the Faith that I love. The Church is led by men, and the heroes in the Bible are overwhelming male, serving as a typological representation of God, who is understood to be masculine. Men have the same pronouns as God, and I don’t; this bothers me for some reason. But I want to be who God wants me to be.
I know that the teachings of the Church are true, and that the precepts and designs of God are perfect. They are what allow humanity to flourish. Satan hates us and wants us to reject truth, and therefore deceives us to annihilate us. We are many parts in the Mystical Body of Christ, and we must do our part. I want to do my part, to be a part of it.
But how do I overcome these feelings of resentment, this perception of unfairness, this sense of self-loathing, and my lack of understanding and trust?
I
Ima_Dufus
Guest
I remember when I was younger I thought, “I never want to get married because all men are porn-addicted losers or they’re like my dad.” Maybe I’m just hypersensitive to the disrespect and licentiousness that I perceive in my male peers, but I find that they are so derogatory that they make me feel uncomfortable and undignified in my own skin. (I was never able to understand how other women could dress immodestly and not feel wretched about it.) My dad on the other hand, although not licentious, seems to have a condescending attitude towards women. (It appears that my brothers have adopted this attitude as well, which is annoying because I think my brothers are quite spineless.) He stereotypes them as being fickle, irrational, and weak. Ironically, he is the most emotionally immature person in the house. He often rants about the women in his politically-correct work environment. Although he has many valid complaints, he speaks very disrespectfully about them while praising his male co-workers.
I guess the bottom line is, I feel like the archetype of secondary-ness. God is our “father” who is the one we worship. The Church is our “mother,” and although it is great beyond my understanding, it is still a created thing. I feel intense guilt about this sentiment, because Christ himself “did not regard equality with God as something to be grasped, but rather humbled himself.” I guess that the desire for independence from God and desire for equality with God is the crux of the human condition.
But this conflict has been bothering me for years. Why did God become a man? (I know – if he became a woman, that would be really weird.) Why did he make them physically faster, stronger, and sturdier? Why did he make their brains more adept in math and science? Why did he reserve the priesthood for them only and give them the ability to forgive sins, and cast out demons, and celebrate the Mass? I feel like women are existentially short-changed. I feel like I have nothing to offer. I feel like I am nothing of value, that I have nothing but my sins. I feel like all my struggles and sufferings are insignificant. I feel like this bitterness that I feel is disgusting in the eyes of God. I feel like I have no purpose. I feel so far away from God, and that this division is all my fault.
I have always felt like a total misfit. As a child, I didn’t really relate to the other girls – we just weren’t interested in the same things. I got along much better with the boys, until middle school. Then I really didn’t fit in with any of the kids. Although I do not question my identity as a woman, I am not stereotypical. And, as you now know, I feel discontented about being a woman. But I will keep fighting, and I have faith that God will deliver me from these problems. I won’t go into my whole life story, but life has been very hard for me. Now, I am intensely thirsting for a purpose in my life. I have prayed and prayed, but do not have any sense of what to do.
I guess the bottom line is, I feel like the archetype of secondary-ness. God is our “father” who is the one we worship. The Church is our “mother,” and although it is great beyond my understanding, it is still a created thing. I feel intense guilt about this sentiment, because Christ himself “did not regard equality with God as something to be grasped, but rather humbled himself.” I guess that the desire for independence from God and desire for equality with God is the crux of the human condition.
But this conflict has been bothering me for years. Why did God become a man? (I know – if he became a woman, that would be really weird.) Why did he make them physically faster, stronger, and sturdier? Why did he make their brains more adept in math and science? Why did he reserve the priesthood for them only and give them the ability to forgive sins, and cast out demons, and celebrate the Mass? I feel like women are existentially short-changed. I feel like I have nothing to offer. I feel like I am nothing of value, that I have nothing but my sins. I feel like all my struggles and sufferings are insignificant. I feel like this bitterness that I feel is disgusting in the eyes of God. I feel like I have no purpose. I feel so far away from God, and that this division is all my fault.
I have always felt like a total misfit. As a child, I didn’t really relate to the other girls – we just weren’t interested in the same things. I got along much better with the boys, until middle school. Then I really didn’t fit in with any of the kids. Although I do not question my identity as a woman, I am not stereotypical. And, as you now know, I feel discontented about being a woman. But I will keep fighting, and I have faith that God will deliver me from these problems. I won’t go into my whole life story, but life has been very hard for me. Now, I am intensely thirsting for a purpose in my life. I have prayed and prayed, but do not have any sense of what to do.
S
simpleas
Guest
I would say by doing what you are doing now, questioning and pondering your life, this life.But how do I overcome these feelings of resentment, this perception of unfairness, this sense of self-loathing, and my lack of understanding and trust?
Also just a suggestion, maybe shorten these well thought out posts and put it all in a new thread with a new title, you will more likely get some good responses from good posters on CAF than I can give!
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