Hail Mary- Biblical support?

[Sr_Lorraine]

In the original Greek of Luke’s Gospel, the angel’s greeting to Mary is:
“Kaire, kecharitomene”
The word “kaire” means “rejoice.” The proper translation is really “rejoice, Mary,” although some people seem to think it’s just a type of greeting. But it expresses the joy so evident in Luke’s Gospel, the joy over the coming of the Good News of salvation.
“kecharitomene” is a difficult word to translate, but it’s very rich in meaning. It comes from the verb “charitoo” which expresses the idea of a change brought about by grace. It means that the grace of God has totally transformed Mary.

 

[katgee]

Very good responses…

So what the original post has the Protestants implying is that they can only pray Bible verses, no extemporaneous prayers either from the heart?

So each time they need to pray, they have to use a Bible quote?

So you can’t say thank you to Jesus for your mother or His mother for saying yes, for allowing either you or Him to be born?

 

[Bob4BVM]

Many GREAT responses here. I can only add this:
God sent His angel to visit Mary. The Angel’s greeting to Mary was “Hail, full of Grace”… !!!
If the angel was in error at that moment, I’m sure God would have corrected him !

What I find interesting is not the verses some people pick and choose, but the verses they choose to ignore !

I would challenge ANYONE of any religion to say a rosary every day, from the heart, for any need or intention. See how long it is before your prayer is answered !

+Peace,
Bob

---

“No woman is like unto thee, thou art more than an empress or a queen. Blessed above all nobility, wisdom, or saintliness.”
…Martin Luther on the Blessed Virgin Mary. …shortly before his death in 1546

---

 

[holy_moly]

That’s funny. When I was going to an Evangelical church, every sermon was a series of cut and pasted verses from all over the bible designed to fit the point that the pastor wanted to make. Protestants are really good at this. Roman’s Road, anyone?

I was thinking the same thing- pot calling the kettle black!

 

[holy_moly]

In the original Greek of Luke’s Gospel, the angel’s greeting to Mary is:
“Kaire, kecharitomene”
The word “kaire” means “rejoice.” The proper translation is really “rejoice, Mary,” although some people seem to think it’s just a type of greeting. But it expresses the joy so evident in Luke’s Gospel, the joy over the coming of the Good News of salvation.
“kecharitomene” is a difficult word to translate, but it’s very rich in meaning. It comes from the verb “charitoo” which expresses the idea of a change brought about by grace. It means that the grace of God has totally transformed Mary.

Great info!
:tiphat:

 

[incense]

She doesn’t think other people’s prayers do anything? Does she really believe that or is she just stumped at your reply and trying to win the argument? Anyway, here’s some Bible verses for her:

James 5:16 Confess therefore your sins one to another: and pray one for another, that you may be saved. For the continual prayer of a just man availeth much.

Judith 8:29 Now therefore pray for us, for thou art a holy woman, and one fearing God.

Perhaps she doesn’t think any of her friends are holy?

 

[awantz]

We were talking about the Hail Mary, and the Protestants objected to this prayer for a number of reasons: firstly, because it’s supposedly ‘cut-and-pasted’ from different passages in the Bible (they accused Catholics of picking and choosing verses that fit, unlike the Lord’s Prayer, which is all in one passage); secondly, because they just have problems with the whole praying-to-Mary thing. Here’s what one of my friends said:

quote:maybe what i don’t like about it is the name–“Hail Mary” sounds like worshiping someone besides the true God (and i think all of us would agree that according to the Bible that is forbidden). According to the dictionary, hail means a salutation or acclamation. so its like saying “Hello Mary”? ok, so you think Mary’s awesome. why not just pray to God/Jesus and say “thanks for Mary, she was an awesome person.” instead of devoting a prayer to her—why pray to a dead person when Jesus is readily available?

it seems like playing in a mud puddle when you could be swimming in the ocean. :quote

It sounds like your friend doesn’t fully understand/ know the Hail Mary or the BIBLE. They don’t like the line Hail Mary. Well, it’s in the BIBLE. So, do they have a problem with the BIBLE too? Did you tell your friend that you are just asking Mary for her prayers like you would ask your friend? As far as the cutting and pasting, I know many pastors in protestant churches who do the same thing with their messages on Sunday morning. As long as they are all conveying the same message, there shouldn’t be a problem. As far as their issue with praying to Mary, Do they have family that past away? If so, you could compare your praying to Mary to with their talking to their deceased family member, if they do that.

 

[musicgal4jesus]

She doesn’t think other people’s prayers do anything? Does she really believe that or is she just stumped at your reply and trying to win the argument? Anyway, here’s some Bible verses for her:

James 5:16 Confess therefore your sins one to another: and pray one for another, that you may be saved. For the continual prayer of a just man availeth much.

Yeah, I think she was just frustrated by my arguments. (Or maybe you’re right, and she doesn’t think she has any holy friends!)

 

[PJM]

I’ve recently been discussing the issue of Marian devotion with some Protestant friends. We were talking about the Hail Mary, and the Protestants objected to this prayer for a number of reasons: firstly, because it’s supposedly ‘cut-and-pasted’ from different passages in the Bible (they accused Catholics of picking and choosing verses that fit, unlike the Lord’s Prayer, which is all in one passage); secondly, because they just have problems with the whole praying-to-Mary thing. Here’s what one of my friends said:

The “Hail Mary Prayer and the Bible”

James 5: “The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects”

2 Thess. 2: 1 “To this end we always pray for you, that our God may make you worthy of his call, and may fulfill every good resolve and work of faith by his power, 12 so that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ. “

2 Cor. 9: 14 “while they long for you and pray for you, because of the surpassing grace of God in you.

“Hail Mary Full of grace”

Luke 22: [Jesus speaking] 39 “And he came out, and went, as was his custom, to the Mount of Olives; and the disciples followed him. 40 And when he came to the place he said to them, “Pray that you may not enter into temptation.”

**Luke 1: 26 “In the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin’s name was Mary. 28 And he came to her and said, “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!”/**COLOR]“The LORD is with thee”

Luke 1: 34 *“And Mary said to the angel, “How shall this be, since I have no husband?” 35 And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God. *

“Blessed are you among [all] women”

**Luke 1: 39 **“In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a city of Judah, 40 and she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. 41 And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit 42 and she exclaimed with a loud cry, "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!

“And Blessed be the fruit of YOUR womb…. JESUS!”

Luke 1:43 *"Blessed are you among women, **and blessed is the fruit of your womb! ***43 And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? 44 For behold, when the voice of your greeting came to my ears, the babe in my womb leaped for joy.

“Holy Mary”

Luke 1: 28 “And he came to her and said, "Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!"

Luke 1: 46 “And Mary said, “My soul magnifies the Lord, 47 and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior, 48 for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden. For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed”

“Mother of God”

Luke1: 35 “And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.

“Pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death.” AMEN!

This is biblically founded in 2 Mac. Chapter 12: 39 “On the next day, as by that time it had become necessary, Judas and his men went to take up the bodies of the fallen and to bring them back to lie with their kinsmen in the sepulchres of their fathers. 40 Then under the tunic of every one of the dead they found sacred tokens of the idols of Jamnia, which the law forbids the Jews to wear. And it became clear to all that this was why these men had fallen. 41 So they all blessed the ways of the Lord, the righteous Judge, who reveals the things that are hidden; 42 and they turned to prayer, beseeching that the sin which had been committed might be wholly blotted out. And the noble Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves free from sin, for they had seen with their own eyes what had happened because of the sin of those who had fallen. 43 He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the resurrection. 44 For if he were not expecting that those who had fallen would rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead. ******Now you too are able to see that prayers, including 45 But if he was looking to the splendid reward that is laid up for those who fall asleep in godliness, it was a holy and pious thought. Therefore he made atonement for the dead, that they might be delivered from their sin.”

The “Hail Mary” is solidly founded on the bible. What else would you have us prove?

Hail Mary full of grace, pray for us sinners NOW!

 

[Erich]

Mary herself said, “from now on will all ages call me blessed” (Luke 1:48).

Well, all except for Protestants who don’t like asking Mary to pray for us, I suppose

 

[YourAverageJoe]

I find it astonishing that the word “Hail” is only used twice in the entire NT. First, when the Angel greets Mary, second when the roman soldiers put the crown of thorns on Jesus and mock him by “hail, king of the Jews”. For me, this isa very powerful representation for understanding Mary’s motherly role in God’s salvation plan. The word “Hail,” is just more than "hello, " it was used historically to greet earthly kings and queens and people of high stature. When the angel said “Hail Mary full of grace”, the word “Hail” alone, put Mary on the highest human pedestal, second to Christ. At that moment, Mary did not know she was a Queen, but the Angel surprised her and she was. As only a Queen can give birth to a King. Recall that Mary was troubled at the greeting. Who wouldn’t ???

In Christ.

 

[YourAverageJoe]

I find it astonishing that the word “Hail” is only used twice in the entire NT. First, when the Angel greets Mary, second when the roman soldiers put the crown of thorns on Jesus and mock him by “hail, king of the Jews”. For me, this is a very powerful representation for understanding Mary’s motherly role in God’s salvation plan. The word “Hail,” is just more than "hello, " it was used historically to greet earthly kings and queens and people of high stature. When the angel said “Hail Mary full of grace”, the word “Hail” alone, put Mary on the highest human pedestal, second to Christ. At that moment, Mary did not know she was a Queen, but the Angel surprised her and she was. As only a Queen can give birth to a King. Recall that Mary was troubled at the greeting. Who wouldn’t ???

In Christ.

 

[holy_moly]

I find it astonishing that the word “Hail” is only used twice in the entire NT. First, when the Angel greets Mary, second when the roman soldiers put the crown of thorns on Jesus and mock him by “hail, king of the Jews”. For me, this isa very powerful representation for understanding Mary’s motherly role in God’s salvation plan. The word “Hail,” is just more than "hello, " it was used historically to greet earthly kings and queens and people of high stature. When the angel said “Hail Mary full of grace”, the word “Hail” alone, put Mary on the highest human pedestal, second to Christ. At that moment, Mary did not know she was a Queen, but the Angel surprised her and she was. As only a Queen can give birth to a King. Recall that Mary was troubled at the greeting. Who wouldn’t ???

In Christ.

This is interesting to know, thanks!

 

[patrick457]

I find it astonishing that the word “Hail” is only used twice in the entire NT. First, when the Angel greets Mary, second when the roman soldiers put the crown of thorns on Jesus and mock him by “hail, king of the Jews”. For me, this isa very powerful representation for understanding Mary’s motherly role in God’s salvation plan. The word “Hail,” is just more than "hello, " it was used historically to greet earthly kings and queens and people of high stature. When the angel said “Hail Mary full of grace”, the word “Hail” alone, put Mary on the highest human pedestal, second to Christ. At that moment, Mary did not know she was a Queen, but the Angel surprised her and she was. As only a Queen can give birth to a King. Recall that Mary was troubled at the greeting. Who wouldn’t ???

In Christ.

Actually, besides that, there are a few other instances where the Greek chaire (from chairo, “to rejoice”) is used in the context of a greeting; even so, many Bible translations render these as “greetings” or something of the sort so the confusion is understandable:

Matthew 26:49 - When Judas greets Jesus (“Chaire, Rabbi!”)
Matthew 28:9 - When Jesus greets the women (in the plural, “chairete”)

Acts 15:23 - When the apostles and elders greet “the brothers who are from the nations in Antioch, and Syria, and Cilicia” in their letter (in the more formal infinitive form commonly used in letters, “Chairein”)
Acts 23:26 - Where Claudius Lysias greets Felix in his letter (again, “Chairein”)
James 1:1 - When James greets “the twelve tribes in the Diaspora” in his letter (once more, “Chairein”).
2 John 1:10 - “If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house nor say “greetings” * (Chairein) * to him…”

Interestingly, some note that the early Christians did not greet each other with chaire, but with the almost phonetically-similar charis (“grace”), which can already by seen in the epistles of St. Paul (1 Corinthians 1:3; 2 Corinthians 13:13; Colossians 4:18; 1 Timothy 6:21; 2 Timothy 4:22). Early Christians may have noted that the angel oddly greets her with chaire, but with a good reason: because Gabriel also uses the word kecharitōmenē (full of grace). Saying “Grace, full of grace” would have been rather redundant.

Others point out that for this, chaire was used because of its other meaning, “to rejoice”. As such, the greeting “Rejoice, full of grace!” would then be a prophetic invitation to messianic joy, as in Zephaniah 3:14, Joel 2:21 and Zechariah 9:9:

Rejoice greatly (Chaire sphodra), O daughter Sion!
Proclaim, O daughter Jerusalem!
Rejoice, and be delighted with your heart, O daughter Jerusalem!
The Lord has taken away your iniquities;
He has redeemed you from the hand of your enemies.
The King of Israel, the Lord, is in your midst;
You shall see evil no more.

-Zephaniah 3:14-15, Septuagint

 

[patrick457]

This is strikingly similar to part of the Divine Mercy Chaplet a.k.a. the 3 o’clock Prayer:

“Holy God, Holy Mighty One, Holy Immortal One, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”

For a good reason: Poland is in eastern Europe, and is home to both Catholics and Orthodox. Apparently the Lord thought it fitting to combine “the best of both worlds” in the Chaplet; the Rosary famous and beloved in the West, and the Trisagion venerable and ubiqitous in the East (and to a lesser extent, in the West as well).

According to Byzantine tradition, a child in 5th century Constantinople was lifted up to heaven during an earthquake, and coming down back to earth, exhorted the people to pray those words, which they did; the earthquake stopped as a result, but the child died.

The Copts, meanwhile, say that Nicodemus exclaimed when He took Jesus off the cross, “Holy God, Holy Mighty, Holy Immortal!” A variation on this is that he heard the angels singing it.

 

[Duc_in_Altum]

That’s funny. When I was going to an Evangelical church, every sermon was a series of cut and pasted verses from all over the bible designed to fit the point that the pastor wanted to make. Protestants are really good at this. Roman’s Road, anyone?

Soooo true!!!

 

[scottywolf777]

You might want to remind your protestant friends that the Protestant poet Ralph Waldo Emerson once described our Lady as “our fallen race’s highest boast.” Also remind them that Luke 1:28 says all generations will call me blessed for the Mighty God has done great things for me and his mercy extends from age to age and Holy is His Name."
Even the reformers described Mary as the first, finest and best of all Christians. And do they like to forget that business in Cana where Jesus turned water into wine at MARY’S insistence? Do whatever He tells you to do. BTW if you need a favor from a Jewish man, get in good with his mother.

 

[Victorious]

Sigh. This is all of a piece with the general objection to praying to saints. Here is an excerpt from St. Thomas More’s Dialogue Concerning Heresies. I think what the saint says here goes double for the Blessed Mother (and I broke up one huge long paragraph for easier readibility):

“Yet I see,” said he [the Messenger, with whom the saint is carrying on the dialogue] “no reason or need for us to pray to them [the saints], since God can as well both hear us and can help us as can any saint in heaven, and will as gladly.”

“What need do you have,” said I, “to pray to any physician to cure your fever, or to pray and pay any surgeon to heal your sore leg, since God can both hear you and heal you as well as the best, and loves you more and can do it sooner, and can supply His salves more cheaply, and give you more for your words than they for your money?”

“But this is His pleasure,” said he, “that I shall be healed by the means of them as His instruments, although actually He does it all Himself, since the things they do it with are given their healing properties by Him.”

“So has it,” said I, "likewise pleased God that we shall ask help of His holy saints, and pray to them for healing. And this is not a making them equal to God Himself, even if they do it by His will and power, or He does it at their intercession. Though God will (as stands to reason) be chief and have no match, He yet does not forbid that one human being pray another for help. And though the Father has given all judgment to His Son [John 5:22], the Son yet does delight to have His holy saints be sharers in that honor, and on Judgment Day to have them sit with Him [Matthew 19:28]. Was Elisha made equal t God because the widow prayed him to revive her dead son? See 2 Kings 4:28-35.] Were the apostles equal to Christ because they were prayed to for help after His death, and even during His life? See Matthew 10:1 and Acts 5:12-16.] And may things did they do at folks’ prayer. And sometimes they were prayed to for something and they tried to do it,but could not, and the parties in question had to go from them to their Master for it [Mark 9:14-29]. And yet it was all right with Him that they were prayed to. And for proof of this, He allowed them at people’s devout urging and prayer to do many miracles. And sometimes they were prayed to be intercessors to their Master. Such as when they came to Christ and said [Latin quote omitted], ‘Get this woman taken care of, for she keeps calling out after us’ [Matthew 15:23].

And do you then think that, He being all right with this and giving people occasion to pray to them while they were with Him on earth, He will be angry if we do them as much homage when they are with Him in heaven? No; I think, on the contrary, that since it is His pleasure to have His saints held in honor and prayed to so that they can be for us intercessors to His high majesty, whereto, before we presume to approach, it becomes us and well behooves us to make friends of such as He has in favor, He will disdain ever to look on us if we are such presumptuous and impudent boors that upon boldness of familiarity with Him, we disdain to make His especially beloved friends our intercessors. And when St. Paul exhorts us to pray for one another see 1 Timothy 2:1 and James 5:16], and we are glad to think it a right thing to do to pray every poor man to pray for us, should we think it a bad thing to do to pray holy saints in heaven to do the same?

 

[holy_moly]

You might want to remind your protestant friends that the Protestant poet Ralph Waldo Emerson once described our Lady as “our fallen race’s highest boast.” Also remind them that Luke 1:28 says all generations will call me blessed for the Mighty God has done great things for me and his mercy extends from age to age and Holy is His Name."
Even the reformers described Mary as the first, finest and best of all Christians. And do they like to forget that business in Cana where Jesus turned water into wine at MARY’S insistence? Do whatever He tells you to do. BTW if you need a favor from a Jewish man, get in good with his mother.

Even Muslims give respect to Mary!

 

[scottywolf777]

Even Muslims give respect to Mary!

Yes, they do! The Quran has a whole book, I believe it’s Sutra 8 dedicated to her. The question then becomes why Protestants don’t love her and respect her. And worse yet, think they’re honoring Jesus by insulting her and downplaying her role in salvation history. The only time she comes up in most protestant churches is at Christmas time. I guess it’s a little hard to have an incarnated God without a mother to give Him flesh and blood. At Christmas she’s nice and silent and doesn’t have a rosary or scapular with her so she isn’t threatening to them.
[SIGN]When I think of Jesus I usually picture Him as a baby looking up at His mother for the first time or at the cross looking down at her for the last time- Kahlil Gibran, The Prophet,Maronite Christian[/SIGN]