He wont marry me

[Brooklyn]

Yes, this forum does lend itself to over-analysis.

The approach you take can yield different results, even when the advice being given is the same. Being harsh with people who sin, if it pushes them away or makes them shut down, is not always effective. The OP hasn’t been on here boasting about her lifestyle. That would be the only case I can think of where such a harsh approach would be appropriate.

I think people need to know you care about them if you want your advice to be go down well. The OP has given you her opinion, and fortunately she is one who can shrug off the hard hits. Not everyone can, and in that instance you would be alienating many more people than you would be helping.

The OP got upset with me, but I’d be willing to bet that my post made her think harder and do a lot more reflecting than any of the “nice, understanding” posts. Kids don’t like it when you correct them, and may get very angry and “alienated” when you tell them not to run across the street. But they eventually come to understand that it was in their best interests that you stopped them.

Our Lord doesn’t pull any punches. His mercy is always there, but he never tries to “sugar coat” sin. That is sugar coating death itself.

 

[dulcissima]

Dulcissima, I think you’re exactly right.

I’m a southern girl.

We say “Well, bless your heart” when we mean “Poor thing. You can’t help yourself that you’re a complete jerk.”

We say “You might not want to do that, Sugar.” when we mean “Stop that now. What are you? A complete moron?”

“She’s not very nice” is “She’s a b---- on wheels.”

“They ain’t purty” is “That family is ugly as sin.”

“Oh my word!” is really “Holy sh-t!”

“HE’s a little slow” is “he’s dumb as a box of rocks.”

“I don’t think so” is “H3LL NO!”

So that’s the way it is. I think the OP may be from the south, her BF being Baptist. So maybe other’s words sounded more urgent than Brooklyn realized.

When I used to work in customer service on the phone, I noticed that people from the North East didn’t take me seriously unless I was being what I considered downright rude. Only at that point would they listen. If I talked to other customers that way, I am sure I wouldn’t have lasted a day. So, what may sound like us telling someone to get out of mortal sin, might not register as being persuasive enough to someone from another part of the country.

 

[GabbieDear]

So that’s the way it is. I think the OP may be from the south, her BF being Baptist. So maybe other’s words sounded more urgent than Brooklyn realized.

No, I am not from the south.

 

[GabbieDear]

The OP got upset with me, but I’d be willing to bet that my post made her think harder and do a lot more reflecting than any of the “nice, understanding” posts. Kids don’t like it when you correct them, and may get very angry and “alienated” when you tell them not to run across the street. But they eventually come to understand that it was in their best interests that you stopped them.

Our Lord doesn’t pull any punches. His mercy is always there, but he never tries to “sugar coat” sin. That is sugar coating death itself.

Sweetheart, I am not upset with you nor did your post make me think any “harder” because you haven’t said anything that I already don’t know.

 

[Brooklyn]

Sweetheart, I am not upset with you nor did your post make me think any “harder” because you haven’t said anything that I already don’t know.

God bless you. I feel very confident that you are going to make the right decision. Don’t forget to go to our Blessed Mother - she will hold you safe in her arms.

 

[sharmin]

It may seem harsh but you are in the role of an unpaid prostitute. You are giving your body away in a sinful situation and not getting paid for it.

The term “unpaid prostitute” is an oxy-moron since the definition of prostitute is one who is paid for sex. She is merely a woman who sins. Raise your hand if you aren’t. My hand is down, I know that.

Shaming someone with exaggerated and untrue terms is not going to change hearts. And it will not help the little girl involved.

 

[sharmin]

No one is calling any one names and no one is looking down their noses at anyone else. .

What about harlot? Prostitute?

 

[whatevergirl]

*Something to note too…it’s not just the woman who loses in situations like this…the man loses, too. I wouldn’t want my son someday, to live with a woman, without being married to her–I have the same hopes for my daughter. Equally. The man stands to lose when he doesn’t put a value on marriage, and thinks that living together with no end in sight makes the most sense. His purity matters just as much. I think that there tends to be the notion that the woman is "giving herself away for free.’’ And that the man is ‘‘winning.’’ But, really, both men and women lose, when they live together. It’s a lose lose proposition.

Just wanted to state that. That could be a good way to bridge the subject, should your bf want to discuss the about face that you will be doing soon in your relationship. He might not understand your sudden change of heart. Probably wasn’t so sudden, as I said a few posts up, one year led into two…and so on…before you knew it, nine years had come to pass. So, I would point out, that out of concern and dignity for both of you, you choose to move out, have him move out, etc…however you choose to say it. I think that it’s important for men to know that living with a woman before marriage is not living out God’s best. Marriage isn’t a reward for women who who put in enough time with a guy…(finally, he’ll marry me!) it’s a Sacrament designed by God, to unite two people together into one flesh. If there isn’t mutual reciprocity (and downright enthusiasm for pete’s sakes!) involved, it would be better to not marry that person.

Good luck & may God bless you as you take your next step with this. *

 

[mrpathetic]

The tone of this thread is turning very negative and accusatory. Let’s remember that we are supposed to treat each other with Christian charity in this thread, even when we are pointing out sinful conduct to one another.

I can sumarize, with charity, the advice that has been given to the OP:

1. Stop this scandalous behavior. Do not have sex with this man again, unless you marry him. Treat yourself with dignity, even if he will not.
2. Confess your sins to a priest, immediately. Repent from your sins, and do not have sex again, unless it is within the bonds of holy matrimony.
3. Act in the best interest of your child. Yes, your boyfriend does appear extremely selfish and irresponsible. That is not good, but it should not disqualify him from being a father to your child. (Let’s keep things in perspective: he is not a murder or rapist or molestor.)

You should ask him one final time to marry you, since that would be in the best interest of your daughter; that would ensure that she has a father in her life. If not, then take advantageous of the court system, and file a paternity suit. Ask for joint custody of the child, with full child support by your ex-boyfriend. If your ex-boyfriend will not willingly commit to marriage, then perhaps a judge can force him to support you and your daughter.

In short, your situation is not good, and is an example of poor decisionmaking, which you no doubt already realize. But you can make the best of the situation, if you follow this simple advice.

I don’t have to tell you that a marriage to this man won’t be the ideal - he doesn’t exactly sound like the Ozzie and Harriet type. But sometimes a less-than-ideal father is better than no father at all. As the product of a broken home, I can speak to this directly myself, out of experience.

 

[joandarc2008]

Bad situations happen - trust me - I know. Doesn’t make yo uany of those other things. Just fix it, you’ll be fine. I think that’s what we are all trying to say.

 

[Brooklyn]

What about harlot? Prostitute?

I find it ironic that everyone here is offended by this except the OP. She seems to be able to face reality better than any of you. Is refusing to name something it is make it any less than it is?

As I’ve said, I have been guilty of being an unpaid prostitute - giving my body away and not getting paid for it. That is what it is. Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable, but then, sin tends to make us all uncomfortable. I wish it could do more than that.

 

[dulcissima]

I find it ironic that everyone here is offended by this except the OP. She seems to be able to face reality better than any of you. Is refusing to name something it is make it any less than it is?

GabbieDear, were you offended by being referred to a harlot or an unpaid prostitute?

Personally, I don’t think you are either and to say that you are being called that because that is what you are is really terribly inaccurate and unfair.

People make the choice to become a prostitue, whether paid or unpaid. I really doubt that at any point you made the choice that you wanted to have sexual relations with someone that you did not care about and did not want to commit to. Afterall, that is what would be involved if you were a prostitute. I think what happened was that you were overly generous and careless with your love and gave away that part of yourself that should only be given to the man who makes the commitment to love and honor you for life, a commitment that he makes before God and all of your family and friends. I see that as being something totally different than what the more harsh posters are saying.

Although, I will say that you got into your situation without really thinking it through. Now that you are pausing to reflect on it, you are in a position to make a choice. I know it is difficult, but it is sounding to me that you want to make the right choice.

 

[Brooklyn]

GabbieDear, were you offended by being referred to a harlot or an unpaid prostitute?

Personally, I don’t think you are either and to say that you are being called that because that is what you are is really terribly inaccurate and unfair.

People make the choice to become a prostitue, whether paid or unpaid. I really doubt that at any point you made the choice that you wanted to have sexual relations with someone that you did not care about and did not want to commit to. Afterall, that is what would be involved if you were a prostitute. I think what happened was that you were overly generous and careless with your love and gave away that part of yourself that should only be given to the man who makes the commitment to love and honor you for life, a commitment that he makes before God and all of your family and friends. I see that as being something totally different than what the more harsh posters are saying.

Although, I will say that you got into your situation without really thinking it through. Now that you are pausing to reflect on it, you are in a position to make a choice. I know it is difficult, but it is sounding to me that you want to make the right choice.

Did you see GabbieDear’s post to me? I believe it’s Post #103:

Sweetheart, I am not upset with you nor did your post make me think any “harder” because you haven’t said anything that I already don’t know.

You imputed many things to me that I never said or even implied. First of all, I never, ever said or implied that she does not love the father of her husband. She has been faithful to one man for 9 years. She has carried his baby and would be willing to have more children with him. Unfortunately, this is all without the benefit of marriage and that is where the problem comes in. She obviously wants to do the right thing, but her emotions and her own needs have gotten the best of her.

If someone drinks too much, do you not call that person an alcoholic? If someone steals something, do you not call that person a thief? Does that mean you are condemning them in any way? No, you are merely identifying the sin, and that is what I did with GabbieDear. She recognized that, and she is not offended by it.

It is all the rest of you who are offended. And I think you need to look at yourself and ask why. Do we just live in such a politically correct environment that we can’t name sin for what it is? And if we can’t name sin for what it is, how do we overcome it?

I believe that Gabbie is going to make the right decision because she is not afraid to face her situation.

Truth can sometimes be harsh, but sometimes that is what is needed to shock us into doing what needs to be done. Gabbie’s first post said that she was actually considering having another baby with this man. She was not facing reality. She needed a little bit of tough talking, and I give her all the credit in the world for not being offended by it.

I am sorry that you are.

 

[sharmin]

I find it ironic that everyone here is offended by this except the OP. She seems to be able to face reality better than any of you. Is refusing to name something it is make it any less than it is?

Name it correctly then, rather than ridiculous, made up terms like unpaid prostitute which only seek to shame and inflame.

And I am offended, as a woman who had premarital sex. Not because I think it wasn’t a sin. I realize it was. But because of the name calling that has come about. Jesus never name called …never tossed out inflamatory, untrue words to hurt someone. Why are people on this thread?

As I’ve said, I have been guilty of being an unpaid prostitute - giving my body away and not getting paid for it. That is what it is.

Every time you post this I almost want to chuckle. Before typing this again, you may want to look prostitute up in the dictionary. It is about getting paid. If someone is not getting paid, she is not a prostitute. Why not call the act what it is? Sin.

Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable, but then, sin tends to make us all uncomfortable. I wish it could do more than that.

See, if you simply called it sin, I would be fine.

 

[DerekD]

GabbieDear, were you offended by being referred to a harlot or an unpaid prostitute?

Personally, I don’t think you are either and to say that you are being called that because that is what you are is really terribly inaccurate and unfair.

People make the choice to become a prostitue, whether paid or unpaid. I really doubt that at any point you made the choice that you wanted to have sexual relations with someone that you did not care about and did not want to commit to. Afterall, that is what would be involved if you were a prostitute. I think what happened was that you were overly generous and careless with your love and gave away that part of yourself that should only be given to the man who makes the commitment to love and honor you for life, a commitment that he makes before God and all of your family and friends. I see that as being something totally different than what the more harsh posters are saying.

Although, I will say that you got into your situation without really thinking it through. Now that you are pausing to reflect on it, you are in a position to make a choice. I know it is difficult, but it is sounding to me that you want to make the right choice.

You miss the entire point; it is not about name calling, it is about calling yourself a Christian and living in total and continual disobedience. She either truly loves God above all else or she is not worthy to be His disciple. Right now and for the past several years, both of them have been disobedient and outright fornicators…the Bible say this will not enter into his kingdom, He also said some of you were once like this…therefore the choice is between proving that believe in god or showing she does not believe in god.

 

[Brooklyn]

Name it correctly then, rather than ridiculous, made up terms like unpaid prostitute which only seek to shame and inflame.

And I am offended, as a woman who had premarital sex. Not because I think it wasn’t a sin. I realize it was. But because of the name calling that has come about. Jesus never name called …never tossed out inflamatory, untrue words to hurt someone. Why are people on this thread?

Every time you post this I almost want to chuckle. Before typing this again, you may want to look prostitute up in the dictionary. It is about getting paid. If someone is not getting paid, she is not a prostitute. Why not call the act what it is? Sin.

See, if you simply called it sin, I would be fine.

Does being called a fornicator make you feel better? After all, it Is all about feelings, isn’t it. If you noticed I used the term unpaid prostitute. Okay, so we’re “just” fornicators. Ah, now I feel good about myself again. Now the sin isn’t as bad

 

[Seatuck]

GabbieDear, get a spine or get some counseling to help you grow one.

 

[sharmin]

Does being called a fornicator make you feel better? After all, it Is all about feelings, isn’t it. If you noticed I used the term unpaid prostitute. Okay, so we’re “just” fornicators. Ah, now I feel good about myself again. Now the sin isn’t as bad

It’ s not about making the sin bad or worse. Sin is what it is. It’s about trying to shame someone by making up new terminology. And, still, unpaid prostitute does not make sense. If someone is unpaid they are not a prostitute. YOu can’t make it into something it’s not because it sounds better. Yes, saying she fornicated is much more accurate. Now if you want to run around pointing your finger in someone’s face yelling, “Fornicator!” that’s fine, as long is you don’t mind someone doing that to you with any of your sins. “Cheater!” (if you’ve commited lust in your mind), “Lyer!” (if you’ve ever fibbed), “Hater!” (if you’ve ever hated someone), etc. I, myself, prefer to leave a person’s sin between he and God. (Not saying you did this on this thread, perse, but saying “She is a fornicator” kind of reminded me of that. Going to that extreme may be accurate, yes; behaving as Christ would want us to, not so much.

 

[Brooklyn]

GabbieDear, get a spine or get some counseling to help you grow one.

Everyone is going after me, but I have to say I think this is out of line. Being caught in sin is not matter of just “growing a spine.” The only way we can be freed from the prison of sin is through the Grace of God. If freeing ourselves from sin was as easy as “growing a spine” or just “pulling ourselves up by our bootstraps”, Christ wouldn’t have had to die.

GabbieDear desperately needs the Grace of God. Counseling can certainly be of help, but she will never be free without Grace, nor will any of us.

My argument was that GabbieDear needs to be honest with herself. But once she does that, then she needs to depend on the Grace of God to help her do what is right.

 

[Brooklyn]

It’ s not about making the sin bad or worse. Sin is what it is. It’s about trying to shame someone by making up new terminology. And, still, unpaid prostitute does not make sense. If someone is unpaid they are not a prostitute. YOu can’t make it into something it’s not because it sounds better. Yes, saying she fornicated is much more accurate. Now if you want to run around pointing your finger in someone’s face yelling, “Fornicator!” that’s fine, as long is you don’t mind someone doing that to you with any of your sins. “Cheater!” (if you’ve commited lust in your mind), “Lyer!” (if you’ve ever fibbed), “Hater!” (if you’ve ever hated someone), etc. I, myself, prefer to leave a person’s sin between he and God. (Not saying you did this on this thread, perse, but saying “She is a fornicator” kind of reminded me of that. Going to that extreme may be accurate, yes; behaving as Christ would want us to, not so much.

A prostitute is a person who gives away sex in exchange for something else. Yes, it is usually for money, but it can be for anything. In the OP’s case, it was for what she thought was love, as it is for most of us. Yes, you can use the word “fornicator” but the reason I used the word prostitute was to make a point, to show her that she is on the level of one who sells his or her body for sex. You may not like to look at it that way, but that doesn’t make it any less true.

I used the analogy earlier in my posts about a house being on fire. If someone is in a house that is on fire, you have to do whatever is necessary to get them out of that house, and that may mean breaking down doors and windows. And that is what I did in this case. The fact that she couldn’t clearly see that she needed to get out of this relationship and get out immediately showed that she did not understand or could not face up to the fact as to how wrong it is. So I yelled “Fire!” Yes, sometimes you do need to get in someone’s face in order to wake them up. Ever hear of tough love?

I still think you are just all about feelings and using the politically correct words. Doesn’t always work, as can be seen all around us. When someone is destroying his or her life and that of their children, it’s not time to be politically correct and try not to hurt their feelings.