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Annabea said:
Hello. I am an atheist. Now before you start spitting on my shoes I would like to know a little about what you believe? Belief usually varies from person to person that is why I did not post this in the admin/mod answer question thingy. I would like to know what you think about religion, how you think it is effecting the world, and why you believe what you do.
Thanks!
~Annabea

edit: sorry a little grammar check
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Annabea,

After reading all the posts to this entire thread, I realize that you have actually posted here under false pretenses. You saw a post on an atheist website somewhere and you thought it would be fun to come stir up “the christy’s” as you called us. I would guess that you were probably considered to be the smartest kid in your class and considered to be a bit of a nerd at school. You came across a group of pseudo-intellectuals who consider themselves to be super smart because they don’t believe in God. These pseudo-intellectuals were impressed by your supposed age and welcomed you into there group. You are now trying to impress your new friends by taking on all the “christy’s”. Now your friends have joined you and you feel like you have pulled one over on us.

I’ve met teen’s like you. Smart, misguided and searching for acceptance.

Even though this is a joke for you, here a few thoughts for you to take with you.

It’s much easier to not believe, than it is to believe. (You are taking the easy path in life.)

All of nature has specific laws that it adheres to.

One of these laws is that every body at rest stays at rest, every body in motion stays in motion unless it is acted upon by an external force. Ultimately, some external force set this universe in motion. At some point, going back as far as you can, some force had to exist before the universe existed.

To every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. There had to be some action that
created this universe. The action could not have just happened. There had to be some force, some momentum that caused the action. Most people call this force God.

The final thought is that chaos cannot produce order. Scientists have tried to create living things from in animate things. Only order can produce order. Our nature is based on rules. The theory is that if you understand all of these rules you can produce something animate from something that is inanimate. There is a theory that Higgs bosons exist that will explain where the mass in the universe came from. There is a multibillion dollar experiment to prove that these (God Particle’s) exist. (Large Hadron Collider.)

If they prove that these Higgs bosons exist, there is still the question where did they come from and who made the protons etc. collide.

This whole project reminds me of the tower of babel in the bible.

Whatever the case may be, some energy of force had to exist before. It had to be an ordered energy because order cannot come from chaos.

Ultimately, there is nothing in science that proves there is no God. There are a lot of things in nature that indicate there is. The ultimate belief is matter of faith and trust.

Just like believing that you are a 12 year old girl is matter of faith and trust. I have no proof you actually exist. You could be a group of 20 year olds pulling a joke. If I follow your logic, you probably don’t exist because I have seen no proof.

If you truly are a young girl, try exploring the Catholic Church. It makes a lot of sense, but ultimately you have to believe.
 
PJM said:
Evolutation as an FYI has not provided a single example of “something” turning into “something else.” By this I do not mean that they have not been able to make a fly with three eyes, rather no fly has ever become a Beetle for example, and no money a human!
Everything on the Earth today is an example of something turning into something else. How can I say this? Simple, with the possible exception of some forms of bacteria no life form that lives today existed 1,000,000,000 years ago. There are literally hundreds of examples of transitional fossils; fish with lungs and feet, dinosaurs with feathers and primates with the small brains of apes and the upright posture of a human. Evolution is a fact. It is supported by no less than six different branches of science. Even your Pope accepts it. Get over it.
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PJM said:
Evolutation as an FYI has not provided a single example of “something” turning into “something else.” By this I do not mean that they have not been able to make a fly with three eyes, rather no fly has ever become a Beetle for example, and no money a human!

I will answer you’re question why we are here and we can then work backward’s.

Question: ‘Why didn’t God just Create us in heaven and avoid earth?”

Wonderful question friend 👍

God certainly could have done this, so why didn’t He?

It has to do with What and Who “God” is.

Simply put “God is all and only everything Good – Perfectly.”

OK, and?

And this means that among the long list of “Good things” that God is and must be are the attributes of perfect Fairness and Perfect Justice.

In reviewing the wonderful story of Creation found in the Book of Genesis, Chapter One, we notice two very interesting things.

In verse 26 we are told that “God Created man in His own image and likeness” [More on this in just a bit.]

In verse 31 we are told that man was Created on the sixth and Final Day of Creation.

Before we discuss why this is, let’s go back and address in what way (or ways) humanity is Created in the very image of God. This is necessary because it supplies the basis for answering you’re question.

So we have already supplied a brief description of God, but admittedly a very brief one. So allow me to ask a question. Besides Jesus, has any human person actually seen God “face to face?” Noah, Abraham and Moses saw “manifestations” voices, fiery – bushes, clouds, and “the wind,” but I can’t recall anyone actually seeing “The Father – Yahweh God” face to face.

Peter, James and John came closest at the “Transfiguration” of Jesus.

**
The point I’m leading to is why is this? The answer is “Because God is Spirit” and thus cannot be seen except by other Spirits, such as the angels. **

God in Creating humanity has gifted each of us with “part of Himself.” We, like our God have a mind, an intellect, and a freewill. We also have a soul that animates these attributes as well as our physical bodies. That is to say, it is the human soul that gives us life.

No other creature, nothing else in the entire Created Universe, is so blessed.

So then we ask, why are we so blessed? Why are we Created in the image and likeness of God?

The answer to that question also the answer to you’re query.

It is necessary to understand both how we are “made in the image and likeness of God,” as well as why.

Let’s answer the “how first.”

Quantify for us “your mind.” No, not your “brain” which is physical, but your mind. How big, what shape, what color, what does it look like. We can’t because while we can prove that “main, intellect, and freewill” exist, they can’t be seen, measured, (physically) touched or smelled. Why is this? It is because all of these attributes are “Spiritual” just as are Gods same attributes. God’s are Perfect, while ours are very imperfect!

The reason God did not place us directly in heaven with Him relates directly as to why God Created us in the first place and why God has blessed us with these specific attributes.

The answer lies in the words found at the end of the story of Creation for each of the six days. “It was good.”

It was so GOOD in fact, that God Willed to be acknowledged and thanked for Creating “such goodness.”

**No other Created thing, no other Creature, only humanity held the possibility of doing this. **God desired this to such a degree that He wanted the thanksgiving to be sincere and from the mind, intellect and freewill that he placed in each of us. In other words, God desires that we come to this conclusion based on our ability to freely do so, or to freely choose not to do so.

“Heaven” is the reward for those who hear, know and do so; “Hell” is for those who freely choose not to do so. Not so differently than: Mk. 2: 27 “ And he said to them, ‘The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath; “ in the same way heaven is made for man, not man for heaven. Thus there is a price that has to be “paid” [no, on our own merits we CANNOT earn heaven.]

Mt. 13: 10 “Then the disciples came and said to him, “Why do you speak to them in parables?” 11 And he answered them, "To you it has been given to know the secrets of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. 12 For to him who has will more be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who has not, even what he has will be taken away. 13 This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.”

Love and prayers,

Pat
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It wasn’t me who asked that (or at least I don’t remember asking it). And we have provided everything but a video to evaluation. Think about it like this. Think of a caterpillar. It changes into a butterfly (or a moth or whatever, lets stick with the butterfly). Think of this over several million years, and instead of concealing itself and reforming it slowly changes into a butterfly. Or say, a baby. A baby grows into a toddler, a toddler grows into a child, a child to an adolescent, and adolescent to a young adult, young adult to an adult, an adult into an elder. Now think of the difference between that baby and that elder. Big difference. Now stretch that time over a million years.

Ps. We also have many skeletons to show you, if you care to google search them.
 
Annabea said:
It wasn’t me who asked that (or at least I don’t remember asking it). And we have provided everything but a video to evaluation. Think about it like this. Think of a caterpillar. It changes into a butterfly (or a moth or whatever, lets stick with the butterfly). Think of this over several million years, and instead of concealing itself and reforming it slowly changes into a butterfly. Or say, a baby. A baby grows into a toddler, a toddler grows into a child, a child to an adolescent, and adolescent to a young adult, young adult to an adult, an adult into an elder. Now think of the difference between that baby and that elder. Big difference. Now stretch that time over a million years.

Ps. We also have many skeletons to show you, if you care to google search them.
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It appears we have posted at close to the same time. Try giving my post above a read.
 
oneGODoneCHURCH said:
What caused the bang? (We don’t know. There are WAY too many possibilities right now. There are hypothesis that are so strange the human mind cannot grasp fully(Like the universe was not caused because there was no time before the big bang, therefore you cannot cause and effect if there is no time. BTW the cause and effect is a thermodynamic law) stared the cycle of the universe(A cyclic model is any of several cosmological models in which the universe follows infinite, self-sustaining cycles (for example: an eternity of Big Bang-Big crunches. Therefore it was not caused, it is eternal.), how did the first life being to so that there is evolution. (abiogenesis: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis)

I heard a sory about a scientist that met God and said we don’t need you any longer we can do and make every thing you did now. God said ok make a tree. the scientist reached down grabbed a hand full of dirt. God asked what he was doing the scientist said I’m going to make a tree. God said not with that dirt its mine make your own dirt.

All thing traced back lead to God. For he is the beginning. (not really, they don’t. There is not a single evidence of god is a very unlikely hypothesis)

Oh and one of my favorite lines from The movie “STAR WARS”

DARTH VADER " I find your lack of faith disturbing"(I find FAITH DISTURBING, people willingly to belief nonsense with no reason??
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Even if we don’t know yet how the universe started, that does not mean God exists or created him. That is just a hypothesis, which is very unlikely, because it makes MANY presumptions. And by the law of economy “Occam’s razor”( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor) it is ruled out.

As you can see science offer true answers to yours questions not just “god did it”(theist trademark), which is not even an answer. So I recommend to do some research on the awesome scientific theories of science like big bang, cyclic universe, evolution, abiogenesis and many others. You owe them much; the least you can do is research them. Science give you the live that you have now and many of the commodities you and your family enjoy. Without science the probabilities that you are alive and healthy right now would be MUCH LOWER.
 
rinnie said:
You know I gotta go. Just hearing people talk about not believing in Christ gives me the creeps. Its like when you talk to a atheist you can feel nothing but bad vibes. Nothing but hate, deep cold darkness. Gotta roll. going back to prayer. Gotta go back into the light. The darkness is not for me!
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thanks for leaving you nonsense was just wasting my internet space:D
 
Galnextdoor said:
Annabea,

After reading all the posts to this entire thread, I realize that you have actually posted here under false pretenses. You saw a post on an atheist website somewhere and you thought it would be fun to come stir up “the christy’s” as you called us. I would guess that you were probably considered to be the smartest kid in your class and considered to be a bit of a nerd at school. You came across a group of pseudo-intellectuals who consider themselves to be super smart because they don’t believe in God. These pseudo-intellectuals were impressed by your supposed age and welcomed you into there group. You are now trying to impress your new friends by taking on all the “christy’s”. Now your friends have joined you and you feel like you have pulled one over on us.

I’ve met teen’s like you. Smart, misguided and searching for acceptance.

Even though this is a joke for you, here a few thoughts for you to take with you.

It’s much easier to not believe, than it is to believe. (You are taking the easy path in life.)

All of nature has specific laws that it adheres to.

One of these laws is that every body at rest stays at rest, every body in motion stays in motion unless it is acted upon by an external force. Ultimately, some external force set this universe in motion. At some point, going back as far as you can, some force had to exist before the universe existed.

To every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. There had to be some action that
created this universe. The action could not have just happened. There had to be some force, some momentum that caused the action. Most people call this force God.

The final thought is that chaos cannot produce order. Scientists have tried to create living things from in animate things. Only order can produce order. Our nature is based on rules. The theory is that if you understand all of these rules you can produce something animate from something that is inanimate. There is a theory that Higgs bosons exist that will explain where the mass in the universe came from. There is a multibillion dollar experiment to prove that these (God Particle’s) exist. (Large Hadron Collider.)

If they prove that these Higgs bosons exist, there is still the question where did they come from and who made the protons etc. collide.

This whole project reminds me of the tower of babel in the bible.

Whatever the case may be, some energy of force had to exist before. It had to be an ordered energy because order cannot come from chaos.

Ultimately, there is nothing in science that proves there is no God. There are a lot of things in nature that indicate there is. The ultimate belief is matter of faith and trust.

Just like believing that you are a 12 year old girl is matter of faith and trust. I have no proof you actually exist. You could be a group of 20 year olds pulling a joke. If I follow your logic, you probably don’t exist because I have seen no proof.

If you truly are a young girl, try exploring the Catholic Church. It makes a lot of sense, but ultimately you have to believe.
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The wonders of hate speech. Seriously shut up, this guy should be banned.
 
Galnextdoor said:
Annabea,

After reading all the posts to this entire thread, I realize that you have actually posted here under false pretenses. You saw a post on an atheist website somewhere and you thought it would be fun to come stir up “the christy’s” as you called us. I would guess that you were probably considered to be the smartest kid in your class and considered to be a bit of a nerd at school. You came across a group of pseudo-intellectuals who consider themselves to be super smart because they don’t believe in God. These pseudo-intellectuals were impressed by your supposed age and welcomed you into there group. You are now trying to impress your new friends by taking on all the “christy’s”. Now your friends have joined you and you feel like you have pulled one over on us.

I’ve met teen’s like you. Smart, misguided and searching for acceptance.

Even though this is a joke for you, here a few thoughts for you to take with you.

It’s much easier to not believe, than it is to believe. (You are taking the easy path in life.)

All of nature has specific laws that it adheres to.

One of these laws is that every body at rest stays at rest, every body in motion stays in motion unless it is acted upon by an external force. Ultimately, some external force set this universe in motion. At some point, going back as far as you can, some force had to exist before the universe existed.

To every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. There had to be some action that
created this universe. The action could not have just happened. There had to be some force, some momentum that caused the action. Most people call this force God.

The final thought is that chaos cannot produce order. Scientists have tried to create living things from in animate things. Only order can produce order. Our nature is based on rules. The theory is that if you understand all of these rules you can produce something animate from something that is inanimate. There is a theory that Higgs bosons exist that will explain where the mass in the universe came from. There is a multibillion dollar experiment to prove that these (God Particle’s) exist. (Large Hadron Collider.)

If they prove that these Higgs bosons exist, there is still the question where did they come from and who made the protons etc. collide.

This whole project reminds me of the tower of babel in the bible.

Whatever the case may be, some energy of force had to exist before. It had to be an ordered energy because order cannot come from chaos.

Ultimately, there is nothing in science that proves there is no God. There are a lot of things in nature that indicate there is. The ultimate belief is matter of faith and trust.

Just like believing that you are a 12 year old girl is matter of faith and trust. I have no proof you actually exist. You could be a group of 20 year olds pulling a joke. If I follow your logic, you probably don’t exist because I have seen no proof.

If you truly are a young girl, try exploring the Catholic Church. It makes a lot of sense, but ultimately you have to believe.
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There are many things wrong with your statement. I am not the smartest kid in my class. I am not a nerd, I am accepted and happy.
You are right. I came here from an atheists website, and I hadn’t seen a good debate in a while. I also wanted to learn to argue. At the same time I wanted to learn how you guys think, again I belong to several forums. I want to learn to debate, I knew that me making a post on this forum would make some arguments, I wanted to see how well I would fair. And yes, I am 12. The people from the forum came over on their own choice, or they were already over. Someone else posted the link to this site.
It is not easier not to believe than to. I have to face the fact that I will die, that I am not immortal. I can die at any moment, and never see anyone ever again. I do not take comfort in knowing someone is watching me and loves me.
What if the universe has always been here? Hard to imagine nothing. Plus, we do not know everything, its kinda hard for people to accept. You might be right. But there might be some other explanation we have not thought of. It may be another religion also. Even if something did create the universe, (s)he (or genderless) would not listen to you, you are a mere organism in a vast universe.
And I am flattered that you think I might be a gang of 20 year olds. And that works both ways, I might be talking to a gang of random people. You might be a gang of atheists, pretending to be a catholic. (There is actually a forum like that I think).
You do have a good point, I respect that and thank you, I have been looking for a few of those. You have probably debated quite a few atheists and used the same tricks many times. Anywho, thanks.
 
mauricio0 said:
Even if we don’t know yet how the universe started, that does not mean God exists or created him. That is just a hypothesis, which is very unlikely, because it makes MANY presumptions. And by the law of economy “Occam’s razor”( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor) it is ruled out.

As you can see science offer true answers to yours questions not just “god did it”(theist trademark), which is not even an answer. So I recommend to do some research on the awesome scientific theories of science like big bang, cyclic universe, evolution, abiogenesis and many others. You owe them much; the least you can do is research them. Science give you the live that you have now and many of the commodities you and your family enjoy. Without science the probabilities that you are alive and healthy right now would be MUCH LOWER.
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Many scientists are Christians. and they see no conflict of interest whatsoever. As for Occam’s razor" (it was a priest who came out with that theory :D), if I’m not mistaken the whole idea behind it is to provide the simplest explanation for phenomena, as such, God being the creator of the universe is the simplest explanation. 😃 Science hasn’t even proved the origins of life. Some atheists like Richard Dawkins think it came off the backs of crystals or from some intelligent being/designer (could that be God???).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam’s_Razor

“To straightforwardly summarize the principle as it is most commonly understood, “The simplest explanation for a phenomenon is most likely the correct explanation.”
 
=Annabea;5266837]Interesting metaphor. I do, there is no reason though. I was taught in school to believe it just like you were taught to believe your faith. Our minds work on a basic do what you are told method, you are not going to believe everything but something you just throw aside. Like that I belive that george washington was the first president. I have no reason not to believe he is but I am not going to go after him and praise him as our first president. That would be going to far don’t you think? And I don’t really care. Now if I was to join a “George Washington was the first president forum” then I might want to overlook my beliefs and find if there is truth or not to the words that they say.
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Very clever response:tiphat:

Friend if you are an intellegent seeker of truth. And, and, if you believe that the bible is the unerring and inspired word of God, I think I can answer any Faith related questions you may have.

So if you wish to progress beyond exchanging cute remarks, ask what you will.

Love and prayers,
Pat
 
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