Help with baggage from the past

[dhgray]

YinYangMom:

Oooooh…definitely red flag there. Now I understand better.

Normally YYMom and I are on the same sheet of music. However, it’s a guy thing. Guys handle things different than women. Women want to talk out the issues, men want to fix things. Give him space. Don’t ask questions you don’t want answers to. Does he still love her? OF COURSE HE DOES. In some small way he does unless he is a complete dog. Does that dimmish his love for you? NO! He probably loves you more than you will ever know and more than he can express. I’ve been married for 16 years and there are parts of my life my wife does not know about. Why don’t I tell her? I can’t change the past, they are in the past, I can’t change the fact that I had relations be for my wife and it would serve no purpose to bring up past expierences. We look forward not back.

Of course YYMom and I do agree, “Oooooh…definitely red flag there”

 

[YinYangMom]

vluvski:

Perhaps, I hit upon the first smidgen of that in an email I sent him earlier that he presumably hasn’t read. I told him I respected that he wanted to deal with it himself but that the problem becomes my business because I suspect it is going to interfere with our relationship and particularly our sexual relationship once we’re married.

I called him to warn him about the email (because he always assumes the worst), and we talked about it then instead. Who knows if he’ll actually read the email now, sometimes he deletes the unpleasant stuff if he thinks we’ve already talked about it.

vluvski, that was a good start. I hope it leads to effective communication…but if it doesn’t I suggest you save that email to take with you to your FOCCUS sessions with your priest…that is a safe place to express your concern and willingness to help him through whatever it is he’s holding onto. I forget which segment of the inventory these type of issue are mentioned, but I suspect the way you and he answered those questions will be ‘topics to be discussed’…when the priest raises the question, you’ll recognize where this issue fits into which question and that would be your cue to bring the subject up.

Drop the issue for now but keep praying about your upcoming sessions and ask the Holy Spirit to use you as an instrument of peace for your fiance.

 

[YinYangMom]

dhgray:

Normally YYMom and I are on the same sheet of music. However, it’s a guy thing. Guys handle things different than women. Women want to talk out the issues, men want to fix things. Give him space. Don’t ask questions you don’t want answers to. Does he still love her? OF COURSE HE DOES. In some small way he does unless he is a complete dog. Does that dimmish his love for you? NO! He probably loves you more than you will ever know and more than he can express. I’ve been married for 16 years and there are parts of my life my wife does not know about. Why don’t I tell her? I can’t change the past, they are in the past, I can’t change the fact that I had relations be for my wife and it would serve no purpose to bring up past expierences. We look forward not back.

Of course YYMom and I do agree, “Oooooh…definitely red flag there”

I hear ya on the ‘guy thing’ but just because it’s a ‘guy thing’ doesn’t mean it’s the best way to resolve issues…a guy can rise above the inclination to stuff things inside and move forward, and often must, or else down the line he won’t be able to stuff it any longer and he will have to face the issue alone (since by that time to bring it up again after insisting it was a non-issue would cause stress in the marriage)…and in case you haven’t noticed, because it’s a ‘guy thing’ when it does finally hit them in the face, guys often deal with the issue the wrong way (drinking, affairs, working overtime, over eating, etc.)… am I wrong?

This is why it’s better he get over that ‘guy thing’ now, learning how to trust in his wife-to-be with anything so that down the line they will have confidence in their ability to resolve the most sensitive of issues together, with God.

 

[dhgray]

YinYangMom:

guys often deal with the issue the wrong way (drinking, affairs, working overtime, over eating, etc.)… am I wrong?

No you are not wrong, but a lot of time, I did not want to go home because she wanted to “Talk” and she would force the issue when I was not ready. The best way is for pre-marriage counseling, and I don’t mean the one weekend retreat the church makes you take either. Get involved with the Church and a young adults ministry. Have a place where He can talk to other men about this. Men need to talk to men. He needs to hear another man say (and mean) “I understand, me too.”

Just some thoughts.

 

[vluvski]

One of the questions was, “Do you think past sexual experiences may have a negative impact on your sexual relationship with your fiance?”
I put maybe, so I bet it comes up.

 

[dhgray]

vluvski:

One of the questions was, “Do you think past sexual experiences may have a negative impact on your sexual relationship with your fiance?”
I put maybe, so I bet it comes up.

Only if you let it. I use to let it bother me Before I became a Christian or Catholic I use to be very jelious. But I lifted it up to the Lord and moved on. After all, I’m the one she married. To the other guy (in my mind) I say, “I win you lose.”

 

[vluvski]

See, this is the kind of thing I’d like to avoid, and exactly why I am not going to just let it go:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=87096

 

[YinYangMom]

dhgray:

No you are not wrong, but a lot of time, I did not want to go home because she wanted to “Talk” and she would force the issue when I was not ready. The best way is for pre-marriage counseling, and I don’t mean the one weekend retreat the church makes you take either. Get involved with the Church and a young adults ministry. Have a place where He can talk to other men about this. Men need to talk to men. He needs to hear another man say (and mean) “I understand, me too.”

Just some thoughts.

Ah, so we are still on the same page.
Good advice, dhgray…another fine option for this couple.

 

[YinYangMom]

vluvski:

One of the questions was, “Do you think past sexual experiences may have a negative impact on your sexual relationship with your fiance?”
I put maybe, so I bet it comes up.

Yup. All ‘uncertain’ responses will place that question on the ‘to be discussed’ list, so relax a bit. Pray, breathe, trust…it’ll be ok. Ask the Lord and Mary for patience and understanding.

 

[YinYangMom]

vluvski:

See, this is the kind of thing I’d like to avoid, and exactly why I am not going to just let it go:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=87096

wait…which post # in that thread do you want us to read?

Also, do yourself (and me, please) a favor…replace the ‘it’ with what specifically you are holding on to…it helps.

so when you say “why I am not going to just let **it **go”…what’s the ‘it’ here?

 

[Ray_Scheel]

vluvski:

See, this is the kind of thing I’d like to avoid, and exactly why I am not going to just let it go:

I’d agree that it certainly is better to get this “tainted” water under the bridge and well downstream before marriage rather than having it “foul” the newlywed phase as it has done in the referenced thread, and I think you are already well on your way to the preferred sort of resolution, but heed the advise to not pressure your beau to talk before he is ready (but I also wouldn’t set a date until its been talked out to your satisfaction).

 

[vluvski]

IT = Let him continue to believe that he is unworthy of marrying me because he thinks he is completely to blame for what happened with his ex.

In this respect, I don’t believe my disgust with his ex is entirely misplaced because it is her denial of responsibility that has allowed and even encouraged him to adopt this attitude.

 

[LSK]

vluvski:

IT = Let him continue to believe that he is unworthy of marrying me because he thinks he is completely to blame for what happened with his ex.

In this respect, I don’t believe my disgust with his ex is entirely misplaced because it is her denial of responsibility that has allowed and even encouraged him to adopt this attitude.

I understand your feelings of disgust. I am struggling with feelings of disgust and dislike for someone myself right now. The question becomes, for me, will harboring those feelings help me or hurt me? In my 12 step program we have a saying that goes like this: “Harboring a resentment is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die”.

I know that I have to work, right now, on both forgiveness and charity. I have asked this person to no longer contact me and I plan on not contacting this person. That’s step one. However, that doesn’t stop the internal feelings, and one thing I know about myself is that I can chew something over and over again in my mind like a tough little Scottish Terrier with a ragtoy.

So, I know that part of the answer is prayer. I also know that using my Jesus Box has helped. I think you are on the right track with your FOCUS exercises because you are working hard now to lay the foundation for a good, strong Catholic marriage. I have so much admiration for that, kiddo, you have no idea.

However, you need to look at why it is so important to stay angry or even disgusted at someone simply because they will not do what you want them to do. It’s a control issue, basically, and that always comes down to trusting in God that He can do what is best if you give Him complete control.

 

[Island_Oak]

vluvski:

As long as the subject isn’t brought up, it is essentially a non-issue.

SO LEAVE IT ALONE ALREADY!! You were highly indiscreet to contact this woman and divulge that you were in any way privy to the sort of intensely personal information you suggested you knew about her past. Had the new girlfriend of a former boyfriend of mine ever done that he, too, would have justifiably earned a sizzling response. Accept the fact that none of her past conduct with your now-current fiance had anything to do with you. She owes you nothing–including conversation, apologies or explanations.

You claim you are not insecure. You then turn around and question your fiance like a 13 year old about ‘who’s the prettiest’–the old gf or you. Not exactly the sign of a mature woman ready to fully give herself to the commitment of a lifetime. Have you considered dropping back from this engagement until you have a better sense of yourself and the nature of a marital relationship?

 

[SemperJase]

vluvski:

In this respect, I don’t believe my disgust with his ex is entirely misplaced because it is her denial of responsibility that has allowed and even encouraged him to adopt this attitude.

Again, this is misplaced blame. She is not making him feel anything. She is gone. He is adopting his own attitude.

 

[vluvski]

SemperJase:

Again, this is misplaced blame. She is not making him feel anything. She is gone. He is adopting his own attitude.

If someone took a hack-saw and chopped off your arm, then left you to die because you were disfigured, how would you feel? Would you struggle with baggage because this person left you as “damaged goods?” Would your wife be justified in feeling angst toward this person? Would she be concerned that you felt less worthy of her because of this disfigurement?

This is what she did to my fiance emotionally. We may have the ability to choose our attitude, but feelings are involuntary- that’s one of the first things they taught us at the weekend for the engaged.

I realize it does no one any good to harbor hatred, and I admit that it is a problem in this situation. Maybe, just maybe, that’s why I decided to post here about my issues to get some ideas on how to cultivate a more mature, Christian attitude

 

[YinYangMom]

vluvski:

IT = Let him continue to believe that he is unworthy of marrying me because he thinks he is completely to blame for what happened with his ex.

And what evidence do you have to support your impression that he believes he is unworthy of marrying you - for whatever reason, let alone because of what happened with his ex?

What are the behaviors, the words, the expressions exhibited by him which reinforce your impression?

 

[YinYangMom]

vluvski:

If someone took a hack-saw and chopped off your arm, then left you to die because you were disfigured, how would you feel? Would you struggle with baggage because this person left you as “damaged goods?” Would your wife be justified in feeling angst toward this person? Would she be concerned that you felt less worthy of her because of this disfigurement?

Because there are issues regarding this your fiance is keeping to himself, you are not in the position to reach the conclusion that she hack-sawed his arm and left him to die.

First, you were not part of the situation so you know nothing. Reflect on that for a little bit, really. You only know bits and pieces and you also know he hasn’t told you everything which is why you are trying to get the information out of the woman involved.

This is your real issue: he is not telling you everything and that bugs the heck out of you, it makes you insecure, and hard to trust him completely. But also know that pushing him to tell you everything about this particular situation isn’t the solution to that underlying problem. As the other poster noted, he may have to do that with other Catholic men and his priest…he is not obliged to reveal all to you about his past relationship. Reflect on that for a moment as well.

That leaves you with facing your own issues knowing he is not obliged to reveal everything to you. It’s a matter of trust. Being able to trust completely that if it is an issue between the two of you he will turn to you…that is something the two of you build at the engaged encounter and reinforce at FOCCUS, but continue to work on daily in your married life.

Next, the wife would not be justified in feeling angst for that person. You, as a Catholic, are called to release any angst toward another human being to God. You’ve got to learn how to rise above that, it takes time, prayer, and patience, but you must make it a goal for yourself.

This is what she did to my fiance emotionally. We may have the ability to choose our attitude, but feelings are involuntary- that’s one of the first things they taught us at the weekend for the engaged.

Whatever emotions your fiance is carrying regarding this past relationship are his. No one makes another person feel anything, we allow ourselves to feel certain ways about others. You can’t hurt me if I don’t allow you to. My instant human reaction would be to be hurt at first, that’s normal…but allowing that hurt to last beyond a few hours, days or weeks - that’s on me, no longer on you. I’m the one who has to find a way to get past the hurt. So it is with your fiance. Stop blaming the ex for his issues. They are his and his alone at this point.

I realize it does no one any good to harbor hatred, and I admit that it is a problem in this situation. Maybe, just maybe, that’s why I decided to post here about my issues to get some ideas on how to cultivate a more mature, Christian attitude

I hope we’re helping. I’m certainly trying.

 

[vluvski]

YinYangMom:

And what evidence do you have to support your impression that he believes he is unworthy of marrying you - for whatever reason, let alone because of what happened with his ex?

What are the behaviors, the words, the expressions exhibited by him which reinforce your impression?

How does “This [the ex stuff] is why I sometimes wonder if I shouldn’t leave you for your sake. I am a worthless piece of sh*t, and I don’t want to ruin your life” sound? Granted, he was mad at me for bringing this up, but perhaps you can begin to understand my concern based on statements like this.

Or, “I don’t know what to think because in my own mind I can’t sort out how much of what she said is her mind-warping feminazi cr*p and how much is really accurate.”

How about, “When I think about bring this into our relationship I just want to die.”?

I’m not making this stuff up. Thanks for all your (name removed by moderator)ut, it really has been helpful to get me to put this stuff in perspective. Please realize, though, that I couldn’t possibly cover all the bases nor would it be appropriate for me to do so on this forum.

Also, for Island Oak, yes, in fact I have considered that I may not be ready for marriage. Those who know me outside my online persona know that most of my immaturity is intentional for comedic effect. I admit, I was being half serious when I asked my fiance, and the part that was being serious was the PMSing part. Sharing it on the forum was me laughing at myself for being an idiot.

 

[vluvski]

Perhaps a more accurate version of the hacksaw analogy would begin with someone trying to cut off their own arm, then the other joins in and says, “I’ll cut off yours and you can cut off mine” then leaves because the other person is now disfigured.