Hey Im a Muslim contemplating Christianity but need a few things cleared up. Thanks.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Matt10281986
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
This guy knows what he is talking about. 100% correct. the Holy Quran is only in arabic… anything else is a translation of the meaning of the Quran. Is not Holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it.
So… in a closing conclusion:
  • allah only speaks/transmits his message in Arabic.
  • all non-Arabic versions/translations/printined books of the koran are "not holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it"
  • Therefore, one concludes that islam, the koran & mohamad was not sent to **ALL **mankind
 
~ BTW ~

I have a gut feeling that the OP “Matt” is not returning back to his thread -

I see this “muslim” poster as another drop thread & run poster ~

🤷

I could be wrong - but we have seen “posters” like him/her many times on here…
 
So… in a closing conclusion:
  • allah only speaks/transmits his message in Arabic.
  • all non-Arabic versions/translations/printined books of the koran are **“not **holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it”
  • Therefore, one concludes that islam, the koran & mohamad was not sent to **ALL **mankind
One does NOT follow from the other.

It is perfectly consistent for Muslims to think that the Qur’an (i.e., recitation) which Muhammad is alleged to receive from God must be recited in that same language as which it was received for it to actually be the recitation. But that doesn’t mean that message contained in it is only for those who can read Arabic. Islam has no problem translating the message of the Qur’an into other languages, so that more people can become followers of Islam and live lives of submission (as Islam understands it) to Allah.

But the translation is just that, a translation; it is not the actual recitation that was received by Muhammad. The recitation, that is the Qur’an, can only be preserved in the original language in which it was first given if it is to be the Holy Qur’an.

To not get that is simply choosing to be dense or contentious, or both. It is on par with the denseness of some Muslims I know who argue that because we don’t have the original autographs of our own Holy Scriptures, that we don’t have the genuine Bible, and therefore can’t claim it to be the revealed Word of God.
~ BTW ~

I have a gut feeling that the OP “Matt” is not returning back to his thread -

I see this “muslim” poster as another drop thread & run poster ~

🤷

I could be wrong - but we have seen “posters” like him/her many times on here…
Maybe. But I have no reason to doubt the sincerity of his original post. After all he did follow up on it the next day. However, there has been a lot of attention given to this thread the last couple of days, and not all of the more recent posts of the last few days are as welcoming as the intial posts were. Matt may be reading but see no read to respond, except perhaps privately.
 
One does NOT follow from the other.

It is perfectly consistent for Muslims to think that the Qur’an (i.e., recitation) which Muhammad is alleged to receive from God must be recited in that same language as which it was received for it to actually be the recitation. But that doesn’t mean that message contained in it is only for those who can read Arabic. Islam has no problem translating the message of the Qur’an into other languages, so that more people can become followers of Islam and live lives of submission (as Islam understands it) to Allah.

But the translation is just that, a translation; it is not the actual recitation that was received by Muhammad. The recitation, that is the Qur’an, can only be preserved in the original language in which it was first given if it is to be the Holy Qur’an.

To not get that is simply choosing to be dense or contentious, or both. It is on par with the denseness of some Muslims I know who argue that because we don’t have the original autographs of our own Holy Scriptures, that we don’t have the genuine Bible, and therefore can’t claim it to be the revealed Word of God.

Maybe. But I have no reason to doubt the sincerity of his original post. After all he did follow up on it the next day. However, there has been a lot of attention given to this thread the last couple of days, and not all of the more recent posts of the last few days are as welcoming as the intial posts were. Matt may be reading but see no read to respond, except perhaps privately.
Originally Posted by meedo
This guy knows what he is talking about. 100% correct. the Holy Quran is only in arabic… anything else is a translation of the meaning of the Quran. Is not Holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it.
The muslim poster Meedo wrote **that the holy koran is only in arabic and that anything else, meaning any other translation of their koran is not holy no is it considered the word of … as he spoke it. **

So my point is that if the koran is read in English or any other language it is not holy & it is not the word of allah

Did you not read Meedo’s reply in the same manner…???
 
The muslim poster Meedo wrote **that the holy koran is only in arabic and that anything else, meaning any other translation of their koran is not holy no is it considered the word of … as he spoke it. **

So my point is that if the koran is read in English or any other language it is not holy & it is not the word of allah

Did you not read Meedo’s reply in the same manner…???
Yes, I do. But that is all that it means. It doesn’t mean that the message of the Qur’an or the faith of Islam is only for those who speak Arabic, which is what I understood you to also be saying.
 
So… in a closing conclusion:
  • allah only speaks/transmits his message in Arabic.
  • all non-Arabic versions/translations/printined books of the koran are **“not **holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it”
  • Therefore, one concludes that islam, the koran & mohamad was not sent to **ALL **mankind
I remember that one post where the debate was whether or not Islam was an Arab-centralized religion. Muslims would say that the Quran was better read in Arabic, that mosque services had to be performed in Arabic, admit that most practices and traditions in Islam came strictly from Arabic customs…then claim Islam wasn’t Arab-centralized. 🤷

In fact I still have the image I made for that discussion, showing the difference between Christianity and Islam in that regard.

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/2424/religionandcultures.jpg
 
I apologize for offending or going against any policy. I promise not to participate in this discussion anymore. God bless you.
Please stay! It is precisely your voice that needs to be heard. What many forget is that Christianity is a huge step for anyone from another faith. They especially need the help and advice of someone else who has made the same journey. Your (name removed by moderator)ut might make the difference with the OP, or someone who is lurking, but not posting.
 
Hi, Matt1028,

Welcome to CAF! 🙂 I think you will find this to be an excellent site for learning about the Catholic Faith and the wisdom from those who post.

I think yo have received some excellent response to your first question - and, I do not know enough to evaluate anything about your second question… 😃 But, concerning that second question - I do have one of my own for you… 😉
  1. I have been told by Imams and Scholars at meetings and conferences etc that not a Single Word has been altered in our Holy Quran throughout 1400 years. Is this fact? I have been on Christian sites where they say this is not true though some of these sites seem a little suspect. I have been lurking here for a while and can tell that for the most part this is one of the most honest forums on the net!
Assuming that, as was previously pointed out, there are variations in the translation - so much so as to actually shift the meaning from from source to another, it looks like there is also a fluidity when it comes to interpretation. As a practical matter, there was a time when innocent non-combatants were actually not made targets for death. Those who have declared that their own interpretation allows this indiscriminate mass murder seem to have drowned out those who favor life for innocent civilians. This seems to be to have recently taken hold - so, my question is: when an interpretation can be radically changed so that mass murder and suicide are encouraged, who has the authority to decide which is valid?

God bless
 
Please stay! It is precisely your voice that needs to be heard. What many forget is that Christianity is a huge step for anyone from another faith. They especially need the help and advice of someone else who has made the same journey. Your (name removed by moderator)ut might make the difference with the OP, or someone who is lurking, but not posting.
I second that motion! Limette come back, please. You’ve said nothing wrong really. I just have personal issues with that “non-Catholic” site. Im sorry. 😊

MJ
 
Limette.

I do hope you continue here on CAF…I do not know how to believe among the Muslims. I get very annoyed when they try to teach us Christianity.
 
Limette.

I do hope you continue here on CAF…I do not know how to believe among the Muslims. I get very annoyed when they try to teach us Christianity and the Bible.

I remember reading about the PLO leader, Arafat, nephew of Hussein who headed the Waqf and was in collusion with the Naziis during the 1920’s, and committed pogroms against the Jews during that time in the world.

Arafat would speak to the media in English, such benevolent words, and then when he began to speak Arabic, he gave a very different and contradictory message. Oh, the media.
 
Hello everyone my names Matt im a 23 year old Muslim. I have been a Muslim my whole life (though not always truly practicing my faith) and have very little knowledge about Christianity and other Faiths. I would truly like to learn more about Catholicism especially.

Questions:
  1. How come there are many versions of the bible? Who altered them? Did they speak to God too? Im confused because there are so many versions how do I know which one is correct? Thanks.
  2. I have been told by Imams and Scholars at meetings and conferences etc that not a Single Word has been altered in our Holy Quran throughout 1400 years. Is this fact? I have been on Christian sites where they say this is not true though some of these sites seem a little suspect. I have been lurking here for a while and can tell that for the most part this is one of the most honest forums on the net!
Welcome friend, and God bless you abundantly on your spiritual journey.

I would definitely suggest the Apologetics section on this Forum.

God is Love, and He loves you.
 
So… in a closing conclusion:

- allah only speaks/transmits his message in Arabic.
  • all non-Arabic versions/translations/printined books of the koran are **“not **holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it”
  • Therefore, one concludes that islam, the koran & mohamad was not sent to **ALL **mankind
I think you’ve missed a few links in the chain between allah the koran. First allah told jibril and then jibril told muhammed, and in turn muhammed in turn told other people. It wasn’t written down immediately in the cave by muhammed, word for word in an exact order of the messages that were received from jibril. What muhammed was told was memorized by him, then he taught other people memorized it. The messages started out short and became lengthier as time progressed but the suras are arranged somewhat from the longest to shortest. One might come to the conclusion that the suras are arranged haphazardly and somewhat backwards - thanks to the recession of uthman ibn affan.

I think you are oversimplifying it too by saying *"…his message in Arabic" *(not to open up another can of worms) some contend (well actually Christoph Luxenberg) that the koran contain some words of Syro-aramaic origin that change the meaning of some passages, maybe it would had been better if you has said: *"…his message in arabic with syro-aramic loan words."
*
 
I think you are oversimplifying it too by saying *"…his message in Arabic" *(not to open up another can of worms) some contend (well actually Christoph Luxenberg) that the koran contain some words of Syro-aramaic origin that change the meaning of some passages, maybe it would had been better if you has said: *"…his message in arabic with syro-aramic loan words."
*
That’s like getting mad at someone for saying the New Testament was written in Greek and suggesting they instead say, “The New Testament was written in Greek with Semitic loan words.”
 
Nevertheless, as Sam_777 says, Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega. Scripture says that false prophets will come after Him. Scripture pre-dates the Quran by from 600-2,000 years and predicts that false prophets, false teachers and even false christs will appear. The true prophets wrote of One who was to come. Were Jesus not the Messiah, how on earth could He have arranged His life to match Isaiah? Not even by magic could He have manipulated His fate, or performed the miracles which He did. I notice that the twelve, whom Jesus named as Apostles, and not prophets, performed well attested to miracles exactly as Jesus did. Even Saint Paul - not one of the twelve, accomplished the same works. Additionally, I note that Muhammad and Joseph Smith both claimed to have been contacted directly by an angel who taught them of a god who has a different nature from the God of Abraham (as revealed by scripture). As well, I note the other similarities between Islam and Mormonism. To me, this points to a common origin of concept between Islam and Mormonism - and it does not have the same origin as was revealed by God through His many prophets.
 
Nevertheless, as Sam_777 says,
:confused:
  • all non-Arabic versions/translations/printined books of the koran are **“not **holy nor is considered the word of God as he spoke it”
  • Therefore, one concludes that islam, the koran & mohamad was not sent to **ALL **mankind
And therefore there should be no issue by burring the Quran in English translation by Rev. Terry Jones. 😉
👍
 
:confused:

And therefore there should be no issue by burring the Quran in English translation by Rev. Terry Jones. 😉

👍
What would be your reason for burning an English version of the Quran? How does this conform to the image of Christ and his call to love our enemies, pray for those who use us badly, turn the other cheek?

What of Paul’s call to “Be at peace with all men as far as it is up If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.” Or the writer of Hebrews…“Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord: Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;”

Is burning Quran’s to make some “point” to Muslims worthy of one who claims to follow Christ?

We are supposed to have a better way to deal with issues between us and perceived “enemies”…just some thoughts.🤷

I wonder if “burning a Quran” to somehow make a point to Muslims is done so in the Peace of Christ?
 
:confused:

And therefore there should be no issue by burring the Quran in English translation by Rev. Terry Jones. 😉

👍
As a matter of fact, once I pointed out to my Muslim friends that the particular Qur’an shown in the TV news footage that Jones was threatening to burn was written in English on the front cover, they went from indignation over it to laughing and decided that there was nothing to be upset about.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top