Homosexual crushes

[NM505StKate]

I think you’re giving the benefit of the doubt when, reading between the lines, I don’t see a reason for giving the benefit of the doubt.

If I need to clear what I said that is no problem. I am happy that the friend found out he is bi and he is exploring. I hope he finds love, no matter the gender, and happiness.

 

[zamyrabyrd]

If I need to clear what I said that is no problem. I am happy that the friend found out he is bi and he is exploring. I hope he finds love, no matter the gender, and happiness.

Are you aware that this is one of the main ways HIV is spread to women, from bi-guys?

 

[NM505StKate]

Are you aware that this is one of the main ways HIV is spread to women, from bi-guys?

Are you aware that one of the main ways HIV is spread is through needles or from blood transfusions?

 

[FractalFire]

The method of the spread of HIV is irrelevant to the question at hand.

HIV is spread through many methods Christians find immoral, but also through neutral or occasionally morally beneficial processes (like births and blood transfusions) so to reason from its spread to “this is therefore immoral” is a logical fallacy. Further, both of you failed to provide sources (or any support whatsoever) for your proclamations, making them equivalent in my mind to rampant speculation.

Let’s stay on topic, shall we?

 

[on_the_hill]

If I need to clear what I said that is no problem. I am happy that the friend found out he is bi and he is exploring. I hope he finds love, no matter the gender, and happiness.

I think–and this is only my opinion–you were at least a little bit aware that your statement would raise eyebrows on a fairly conservative Catholic forum.

 

[on_the_hill]

I’ll admit to a little hero worship of John Reese, the main character on “Person of Interest.” But, like, it’s not like a gay crush or anything. It’s totes o.k. Srsly.

 

[Regina7]

I think–and this is only my opinion–you were at least a little bit aware that your statement would raise eyebrows on a fairly conservative Catholic forum.

Yes. I think Kate is only trying to get a rise out of us.

 

[lemongrass80]

There’s a very big difference between hiding something and shouting it to the world…and then getting offended when people don’t celebrate with you.

I’d like to know what you mean, specifically, by “shouting it to the world”.

Why do I feel that this is a case of if a straight couple were holding hands in public you wouldn’t bat an eye, but if it were a gay couple you would be saying that they are rubbing your face in it and “shouting it to the world”.

 

[Regina7]

I’d like to know what you mean, specifically, by “shouting it to the world”.

Why do I feel that this is a case of if a straight couple were holding hands in public you wouldn’t bat an eye, but if it were a gay couple you would be saying that they are rubbing your face in it and “shouting it to the world”.

Example of shouting it to the world:

Introducing oneself with name and sexual orientation/gender, etc. I’ve had college students introduce themselves to me or the class with, “Hi, I’m Jim. I’m gay.” This is shouting it to the world. I don’t ever introduce myself saying that I am a heterosexual. I teach English. Sexuality has absolutely no bearing on the subject matter, yet it comes up A LOT.

I’ve seen this happen several times. Twice I think the person was looking for someone to argue or bash him (this was before Supreme Court decision).

I don’t think that a couple holding hands is “shouting it to the world.” Randomly discussing sexual proclivities with strangers is.

 

[zamyrabyrd]

The method of the spread of HIV is irrelevant to the question at hand. HIV is spread through many methods Christians find immoral, but also through neutral or occasionally morally beneficial processes (like births and blood transfusions) so to reason from its spread to “this is therefore immoral” is a logical fallacy. Further, both of you failed to provide sources (or any support whatsoever) for your proclamations, making them equivalent in my mind to rampant speculation.
Let’s stay on topic, shall we?

Sure I’ll stay on topic. This was about a guy bragging that he is attracted to both women and men. As for logical fallacies, it can’t be both if we’re talking about morality, or to bring in the urban myth that all they want to do is live quietly with one partner. It can’t be monogamous is a guy is married and wants to have fun on the side.

A certain famous conductor who died almost 30 years ago paraded this publicly until is wife got fed up and divorced him. It’s no secret, happens all the time and he could have easily infected her.

This is only commonsense without statistics in a culture that is admittedly promiscuous.

But if you want statistics, you can have them too:
nypost.com/2014/01/01/women-with-bisexual-partners-account-for-new-hiv-cases-study/ “‘Men who engage in sex both with men and women can acquire HIV from a male partner and then transmit the virus to female partners,’ the Centers for Disease Control said…Men still account for eight in 10 of the new cases, mostly transmitted through unprotected gay sex."

This is the weird part:
“Many studies have gathered supporting evidence that lesbians and WSW engage in sexual activity with men. 85% of WSW reported having sex with men, according a study in American Journal of Public Health (Bailey, 2007). In general, WSW are more likely to engage in sexual activity with a bisexual or gay man (Dworkin, 2005). In LAP’s experience, some lesbians who have sex with gay or bisexual men do so, in part, because they feel safer with a man who also has same-sex attractions or behaviors.”
gmhc.org/files/editor/file/GMHC_lap_whitepaper_0609.pdf

It’s a sick culture that cannot be rationalized away or honey poured over its bitterness. I have witnessed it personally and as much as I can feel pity and compassion I do not want this lifestyle to be promoted as normal because it isn’t.

 

[NM505StKate]

Sure I’ll stay on topic. This was about a guy bragging that he is attracted to both women and men. As for logical fallacies, it can’t be both if we’re talking about morality, or to bring in the urban myth that all they want to do is live quietly with one partner. It can’t be monogamous is a guy is married and wants to have fun on the side.

A certain famous conductor who died almost 30 years ago paraded this publicly until is wife got fed up and divorced him. It’s no secret, happens all the time and he could have easily infected her.

This is only commonsense without statistics in a culture that is admittedly promiscuous.

But if you want statistics, you can have them too:
nypost.com/2014/01/01/women-with-bisexual-partners-account-for-new-hiv-cases-study/ “‘Men who engage in sex both with men and women can acquire HIV from a male partner and then transmit the virus to female partners,’ the Centers for Disease Control said…Men still account for eight in 10 of the new cases, mostly transmitted through unprotected gay sex."

This is the weird part:
“Many studies have gathered supporting evidence that lesbians and WSW engage in sexual activity with men. 85% of WSW reported having sex with men, according a study in American Journal of Public Health (Bailey, 2007). In general, WSW are more likely to engage in sexual activity with a bisexual or gay man (Dworkin, 2005). In LAP’s experience, some lesbians who have sex with gay or bisexual men do so, in part, because they feel safer with a man who also has same-sex attractions or behaviors.”
gmhc.org/files/editor/file/GMHC_lap_whitepaper_0609.pdf

It’s a sick culture that cannot be rationalized away or honey poured over its bitterness. I have witnessed it personally and as much as I can feel pity and compassion I do not want this lifestyle to be promoted as normal because it isn’t.

You do know that we as a species are more “programmed” to want multiple partners than to be with just one. The HIV thing was way off topic. Also I am not trying to get a rise out of anyone, I am trying to make points and see things from another side.

 

[zamyrabyrd]

You do know that we as a species are more “programmed” to want multiple partners than to be with just one. The HIV thing was way off topic. Also I am not trying to get a rise out of anyone, I am trying to make points and see things from another side.

First of all, don’t presume what I know. Second, this programming business to me seems specious except that our fallen natures also want things that are bad and destructive. I don’t recognize bi-sexuality as a valid anything.
I can understand that some people have exclusive attractions to the same sex for whatever reason but the admittance of dual seems to contradict even the notion of same sex orientation. If as in the study I quoted, 85% or lesbian women admitted having relations with men, it makes the whole business even more corny.

 

[NM505StKate]

First of all, don’t presume what I know. Second, this programming business to me seems specious except that our fallen natures also want things that are bad and destructive. I don’t recognize bi-sexuality as a valid anything.
I can understand that some people have exclusive attractions to the same sex for whatever reason but the admittance of dual seems to contradict even the notion of same sex orientation. If as in the study I quoted, 85% or lesbian women admitted having relations with men, it makes the whole business even more corny.

How is it corny? Again people are what they are. I’m pan and depending on the day I learn more to men or women or female to male or male to female or agender or bi-gender. Just because you don’t recognize bisexuality doesn’t mean it isn’t a thing.

 

[Regina7]

How is it corny? Again people are what they are. I’m pan and depending on the day I learn more to men or women or female to male or male to female or agender or bi-gender. Just because you don’t recognize bisexuality doesn’t mean it isn’t a thing.

We “recognize” it, but we recognize it as disordered and, if acted upon, intrinsically evil.

Just because something exists doesn’t mean we have to say it’s good.

 

[zamyrabyrd]

How is it corny? Again people are what they are. I’m pan and depending on the day I learn more to men or women or female to male or male to female or agender or bi-gender. Just because you don’t recognize bisexuality doesn’t mean it isn’t a thing.

I’ll try to be serious and not sarcastic, even though this subject rankles me to no end.
Children go through stages in which they might have a passing crush on a camp counselor, teacher, or whatever. A woman can see another beautiful figure and admire it, even catch some hormones but there is the mind that says NO.
Similarly with kids, just because boys may play with dolls or girls might be sportive to the extent of not wearing dresses, it doesn’t mean that parents and teachers have to give them the impression they might be transgender. This is bad and stupid.
The truth is we can’t change our gender, except for the minute percentages of those with genetic disorders. Our bodies were designed for a certain purpose. We could learn to walk on our hands but it is an abuse of the machine. Similarly, the practices of anything but monogamatic heterosexuality are fraught with severe health risks. I don’t need to say what. There is no candy-coating it. If abuse, neglect or molestation are causes then the problems are compounded.

 

[NM505StKate]

I’ll try to be serious and not sarcastic, even though this subject rankles me to no end.
Children go through stages in which they might have a passing crush on a camp counselor, teacher, or whatever. A woman can see another beautiful figure and admire it, even catch some hormones but there is the mind that says NO.
Similarly with kids, just because boys may play with dolls or girls might be sportive to the extent of not wearing dresses, it doesn’t mean that parents and teachers have to give them the impression they might be transgender. This is bad and stupid.
The truth is we can’t change our gender, except for the minute percentages of those with genetic disorders. Our bodies were designed for a certain purpose. We could learn to walk on our hands but it is an abuse of the machine. Similarly, the practices of anything but monogamatic heterosexuality are fraught with severe health risks. I don’t need to say what. There is no candy-coating it. If abuse, neglect or molestation are causes then the problems are compounded.

Our bodies are not “designed”. The mind won’t say “no” if it wasn’t hammered in that loving someone of your gender was wrong. Also it is way more grey than say a male liking Barbie® to say he is trans.

 

[Regina7]

Our bodies are not “designed”. The mind won’t say “no” if it wasn’t hammered in that loving someone of your gender was wrong. Also it is way more grey than say a male liking Barbie® to say he is trans.

Yes, God designed our bodies. If you don’t believe this, you are so in the wrong forum.

The human race, heck, all species, would cease to exist if we weren’t ordered towards heterosexuality.

So if a boy liking Barbies doesn’t make him, trans, what does?

 

[MaryT777]

How is it corny? Again people are what they are. I’m pan and depending on the day I learn more to men or women or female to male or male to female or agender or bi-gender. Just because you don’t recognize bisexuality doesn’t mean it isn’t a thing.

I understand your point. If one is Catholic these attractions to the opposite sex are disordered and it’s an equal opportunity celibacy teaching. No sex until marriage heterosexual and homosexuals and the Church does not recognize marriage to same sex partners.

It’s really that simple.

Mary.

 

[on_the_hill]

Yes, God designed our bodies. If you don’t believe this, you are so in the wrong forum.

No! Quite the contrary. NM505StKate is on the right forum. We’re not here to agree, we’re here to learn.

 

[on_the_hill]

No sex until marriage heterosexual and homosexuals

Up to a point. But eventually a heterosexual couple can marry, which is an option not open to homosexuals. (in the Church, I mean).

For sake of argument, one could peel back the onion and conclude that marriage exists solely for the purpose of providing socio-economic structure for human reproduction.

What if the rule became this:
We don’t want babies born out of wedlock because we want babies to grow up into productive adults and they need a solid family structure to do that. Healthy babies = healthy people = healthy civilization. Therefore, heterosexual people shall not have sex outside of marriage (their own marriage).

Everyone else can do whatever you want since you cannot reproduce and will not create orphan children, which are an economic liability to society.