homosexual priests and seminarians: your thoughts?

[BritishCatholic]

Hi everyone,

I was just thinking. Do you really think Pope Benedict XVI made a wise decision when he ruled that homosexual men cannot become priests? Sometimes I wonder.

I truly do believe that a homosexual man can be just as good a priest as a heterosexual; heck, perhaps even better.

Plus, we all know that the church is in a priesthood crisis. I say “priesthood” and not “vocation” crisis because we’re flourishing with permanent deacons, but not with the sacred priesthood. I don’t know… I think I’d much rather attend a Mass celebrated by a homosexual priest than a Communion Service celebrated by a deacon.

Your thoughts?

 

[St_Aloysius]

Other than a total brokenness on my part… I’m bisexual and am aspiring to the priesthood. I want to live a chaste life and believe I have a calling to the Orient, actually. (I have a thread on it: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=208806)

Can I see a copy of the document shattering my dreams and highest aspirations please? lol Well, that was a little dramatic. Hearing about it made me think that I was in a bad place…

My opinion on the matter, only knowing vaguely the details, is that the Holy Father has made a mistake and that I sincerely desire he reconsider and recant. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, I so strongly believe this to be my calling, that I would take it before the Papa himself to assert this…

It’s a sad day when the mistakes of a few make all of us culpable…

 

[turtle18]

No I don’t think homosexuals should be allowed into the priesthood. I think many homosexuals are very self-centered and focus so much on their homosexuality their agenda seeps into the church whether they do it conciously or unconciously. If you are a priest or religious, then you need to concentrate on God and what His will is first, foremost and always, not your “sexuality”.

For example if you keep saying why shouldn’t I be a priest because I am gay or bisexual, have you really thought that out? There are many people who can’t be priests for all sorts of reasons. You are focusing again on your sexuality being the first foremost and primary area of your life–I’m being discriminated again because of the way I am. But isn’t it better for the Church to have priests who will teach the Church’s TRUE teachings on SSA. Even if you had your feelings under control, would you ever speak out from the pulpit against homosexuality so your parish wouldn’t be led astray? Probably not. Do your homosexual tendenices lean toward liberal political beliefs which undermine your belief in the rest of Church teachings such as abortion?

 

[JesuitLoyola]

Hi everyone,

I was just thinking. Do you really think Pope Benedict XVI made a wise decision when he ruled that homosexual men cannot become priests? Sometimes I wonder.

I truly do believe that a homosexual man can be just as good a priest as a heterosexual; heck, perhaps even better.

Plus, we all know that the church is in a priesthood crisis. I say “priesthood” and not “vocation” crisis because we’re flourishing with permanent deacons, but not with the sacred priesthood. I don’t know… I think I’d much rather attend a Mass celebrated by a homosexual priest than a Communion Service celebrated by a deacon.

Your thoughts?

Just out of curiousity where did you get that information from, I’d like to read it. Thanks!

 

[Paladin_V]

I’m no expert on this… but I do remember watch an address given by the USCCB about a document they released called “Ministry to Persons with Homosexual Inclination: Guidelines for Pastoral Care” The link is below.

usccb.org/dpp/Ministry.pdf

It is my understanding that a person with homosexual inclinations is still eligible for priesthood. It is someone living a homosexual lifestyle who is ineligible. Granted, there will be much more scrutiny of a person who does have such tendencies, but if that person demonstrates a firm control of such tendencies, then they should be able to be a priest.

In the same line, someone who is living a sexually active life (outside of marriage) would not be eligible (I would think). The situation IS different because homosexual tendencies are inherently disordered, but if they are recognized as such, fought, and controlled through practice of the virtues, prayer, and the grace of God, then the person should be eligible for priesthood.

 

[turtle18]

The document you are citing is from the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops with their own politically correct agenda, it is not from the Vatican.

I am a female; why can’t I be a priest? Because of my sexual gender–yet we will set aside sexual orientation. Why? What is the difference?

If I am considering a call to religious life, the least appealing thing for me is to live with a group of women. However, if I went into an order that say had brothers & sisters living in close proximity, that would be a problem for me because I would frequently be tempted just being around men. So how hard is it for a celibate homosexual to enter the priesthood? At least out in secular life, he can avoid living around groups of men; the priesthood and the seminary offer no such escape. It puts gay men into too much close proximity with other men. So if you are fighting temptation, why would you put yourself in a situation where it would fester. If I am on a diet, do you think I would go eat at a buffet everyone night?

 

[ReflectHim]

No I don’t think homosexuals should be allowed into the priesthood. I think many homosexuals are very self-centered and focus so much on their homosexuality their agenda seeps into the church whether they do it conciously or unconciously. If you are a priest or religious, then you need to concentrate on God and what His will is first, foremost and always, not your “sexuality”.

For example if you keep saying why shouldn’t I be a priest because I am gay or bisexual, have you really thought that out? There are many people who can’t be priests for all sorts of reasons. You are focusing again on your sexuality being the first foremost and primary area of your life–I’m being discriminated again because of the way I am. But isn’t it better for the Church to have priests who will teach the Church’s TRUE teachings on SSA. Even if you had your feelings under control, would you ever speak out from the pulpit against homosexuality so your parish wouldn’t be led astray? Probably not. Do your homosexual tendenices lean toward liberal political beliefs which undermine your belief in the rest of Church teachings such as abortion?

such a closed mind. should u if you are male be able to be a priest? with that hateful thought I’d hate to think so.

 

[turtle18]

Yep, that’s right I get up everyday and hate, hate, hate. I get up in the morning and go to bed at night thinking “how can I make a homosexual miserable today?” Of course I am being sarcastic.

Apparently you are now the judge of what is hateful since my opinion doesn’t agree with yours. Here’s a newsflash–I am more worried about what is right and wrong in the eyes of God than some poster on a Catholic forum. Which in a weird way validates my point on homosexuality because you can’t even be open to an opposite viewpoint without considering it “hate”. You can’t even stop to think about what God wants–you just follow your own agenda because you can only identify with your sexuality first and God’s teachings are apparently second.

I don’t want to be a priest. I was just making a point. I accept the church’s teaching and my role within it. Again, I was trying to make a point. But you are not even opening to listen to it without playing the “hate” card and yes that is what it is. Because I never said anywhere in my post that I hate homosexuals. I just said that shouldn’t be priests. Gender is an exclusion to the priesthood so why should sexual orientation be any different?

 

[iviking]

NO!

Many of the Homosexual Priest in the Church have done MUCH damage. It wouldn’t be attractive for a normal heterosexual man to enter seminary where there is homosexuals. The Priesthood is for heterosexual men.

 

[Paladin_V]

The document you are citing is from the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops with their own politically correct agenda, it is not from the Vatican.

I am a female; why can’t I be a priest? Because of my sexual gender–yet we will set aside sexual orientation. Why? What is the difference?

If I am considering a call to religious life, the least appealing thing for me is to live with a group of women. However, if I went into an order that say had brothers & sisters living in close proximity, that would be a problem for me because I would frequently be tempted just being around men. So how hard is it for a celibate homosexual to enter the priesthood? At least out in secular life, he can avoid living around groups of men; the priesthood and the seminary offer no such escape. It puts gay men into too much close proximity with other men. So if you are fighting temptation, why would you put yourself in a situation where it would fester. If I am on a diet, do you think I would go eat at a buffet everyone night?

I wasn’t trying to cite an infallible document from the Vatican but to demonstrate the Church’s views on how to minister to people with homosexual inclinations. The document instructs us to treat such persons with dignity, respect, and charity while still maintaining the Church’s official position on homosexuality. It is a very informative document and describes an excellent way for all Christians to approach fellow humans who struggle with this issue with the charity they deserve.

The issue of whether or not women can be ordained is, as noted, a completely different issue. I assume that by “set aside sexual orientation” you mean “set aside gender.”

Yes, I agree, a homosexual person would be in a situtation of greater temptation as a priest. Hence, they would need to be much more closely scrutinized and evaluated, and often times they would not be allowed entrance into the seminary. But this does not mean that all homosexually inclined individuals are incapable of overcoming this tendency, and doing so completely. They must demonstrate that they have done so, as I mentioned in my previous post. It is my understanding that this is the position of the Church as well, or at least how men are generally evaluated now. It is indeed a tricky issue and one that deserves attention.

I think one of the best comments made here was that a person identifying themselves as “homosexual” has not really overcome such tendencies. It is a focus on how they are attracted to other people, not on their holiness, etc. A good indication of their progress in overcoming such tendencies (which are truly a very heavy cross).

 

[estesbob]

Hi everyone,

I was just thinking. Do you really think Pope Benedict XVI made a wise decision when he ruled that homosexual men cannot become priests? Sometimes I wonder.

Having seen the great damage done to the church in America because of the homosexual priest scandal I’m surprised anyone still believes that homosexual behavior is compatible with being a priest.

I truly do believe that a homosexual man can be just as good a priest as a heterosexual; heck, perhaps even better.

But your opinion is based on nothing more than personal prejudice. How could you possibly claim that homosexual priest would be better than a heterosexual priest?

Plus, we all know that the church is in a priesthood crisis. I say “priesthood” and not “vocation” crisis because we’re flourishing with permanent deacons, but not with the sacred priesthood. I don’t know… I think I’d much rather attend a Mass celebrated by a homosexual priest than a Communion Service celebrated by a deacon.

One of the reasons the church is in the priesthood crisis is because many many good men were driven out of seminaries for their refusal to embrace the homosexual culture that had arisen in them.

 

[Paladin_V]

such a closed mind. should u if you are male be able to be a priest? with that hateful thought I’d hate to think so.

How is this comment in any way helpful, charitable, or a “reflection of Him”? Simply calling someone a closed mind individual is no better than name calling and will never convert someone to your way of thinking. I urge you to use charity in further replies and, if you disagree, to offer reasons why.

 

[iviking]

I posted this in another thread, but I’ll post it her as well.

“Advantage to religious vows and ordination should be barred to those who are afflicted with evil tendencies to homosexuality or pederasty, since for them the common life and the priestly ministry would constitute serious dangers.”

papalencyclicals.net/John23/j23religios.htm

 

[estesbob]

such a closed mind. should u if you are male be able to be a priest? with that hateful thought I’d hate to think so.

While I would have to admit to having a closed mind on this. Homosexual behavior is sinful and is incompatible with the priesthood. It is amazing that up until 20 years ago nobody would have had a second thought about the legitimacy of this statement. We have paid a terrible price for allowing so-called tolerance to trump common sense.

 

[whatevergirl]

Not saying I do or don’t advocate men who are homosexuals being priests…but, why would someone’s sexual preference need to come up, if he is living a chaste life? If one is practicing, no, that person cannot be a priest, just like a married man cannot be a Roman Catholic priest (I don’t think?) But, let’s just say there are two single men…one thinks homosexual thoughts and the other heterosexual–all that is required is to be chaste, as a priest. To live a celibate lifestyle. If one has thoughts that are homo or heterosexual in nature…if the person is living chastely…why would this even come up? Are men asked this before becoming priests? Suppose a man is drawn to men, but has never acted upon it–would that man be disqaulified from becoming a priest?

 

[Lepanto]

Not saying I do or don’t advocate men who are homosexuals being priests…but, why would someone’s sexual preference need to come up, if he is living a chaste life?

Because all priests, like every human being, are sexual beings. Don’t confuse chastity with mere abstension from sex. A man doesn’t surrender his sexual identity upon ordination.

A priest can be perfectly chaste, yet still virile and MANLY (how’s that for an old-fashioned word?). This is part of what goes into being a “Father.”

And by the way, boys who may aspire to the priesthood will be much more likely to do so if they see their priest as a masculine man with a clear and healthy sexual identity.

 

[whatevergirl]

Because all priests, like every human being, are sexual beings. Don’t confuse chastity with mere abstension from sex. A man doesn’t surrender his sexual identity upon ordination.

A priest can be perfectly chaste, yet still virile and MANLY (how’s that for an old-fashioned word?). This is part of what goes into being a “Father.”

And by the way, boys who may aspire to the priesthood will be much more likely to do so if they see their priest as a masculine man with a clear and healthy sexual identity.

But if a man knows that being homosexual is wrong in the eyes of God–through His Sacred Word–why couldn’t he lead a chaste life as a priest? I don’t know if anyone could determine that his/her parish priest is living with homosexual thoughts? Isn’t it possible that a man, could repent of such a struggle/sin? Is it because homosexual thoughts are sinful in and of themselves that exclude such men from the priesthood, or is it because the RCC is tentative about a man perhaps acting out such thoughts? I think it’s a bit of a leap to assume that if someone suffers from homosexual thoughts–that he will appear ‘unmanly.’ Above all, we are all sinners–and one would imagine that even heterosexual priests grapple with sexual struggles to varying degrees, because they are human. Right?

All this being said…I have no problem with the Pope’s stance on not allowing men to become priests whose sexual identity is homosexual. (my questions above would have you believing otherwise lol) I am merely stating though that it begs the above questions and doesn’t make a clear enough distinction as to the why of Pope Benedict’s decision. (maybe I need to do more research–I have read a few of his books, and he doesn’t strike me as a man who leaves no stone unturned…and no question answered!)

 

[mercygate]

Other than a total brokenness on my part… I’m bisexual and am aspiring to the priesthood. I want to live a chaste life and believe I have a calling to the Orient, actually. (I have a thread on it: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=208806)

Can I see a copy of the document shattering my dreams and highest aspirations please? lol Well, that was a little dramatic. Hearing about it made me think that I was in a bad place…

My opinion on the matter, only knowing vaguely the details, is that the Holy Father has made a mistake and that I sincerely desire he reconsider and recant. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, I so strongly believe this to be my calling, that I would take it before the Papa himself to assert this…

It’s a sad day when the mistakes of a few make all of us culpable…

No. Others’ sins (not “mistakes”) have not made anybody else “culpable.” Suspect perhaps but not culpable. Careful with how you phrase things.

I have a lot of sympathy for you but in the circumstances, the prudential judgment not to continue a policy that has wrought such havoc upon innocent victims is the only responsible means of addressing the situation at least until a more effective solution has been found.

It is true that honorable men with SSA – chaste men, good men – may pay a price for this decision, and you may be among them. But overall, the price is not worse than the price being paid in the wreckage of human lives caused by your not-so-honorable and responsible brothers.

 

[mercygate]

But if a man knows that being homosexual is wrong in the eyes of God–through His Sacred Word–why couldn’t he lead a chaste life as a priest?

Many have, do, can and will. But the current moratorium is a disciplinary response to an identified problem that has 80% of its roots in same sex attraction. The math is not difficult.

 

[whatevergirl]

Other than a total brokenness on my part… I’m bisexual and am aspiring to the priesthood. I want to live a chaste life and believe I have a calling to the Orient, actually. (I have a thread on it: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=208806)

Can I see a copy of the document shattering my dreams and highest aspirations please? lol Well, that was a little dramatic. Hearing about it made me think that I was in a bad place…

My opinion on the matter, only knowing vaguely the details, is that the Holy Father has made a mistake and that I sincerely desire he reconsider and recant. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, I so strongly believe this to be my calling, that I would take it before the Papa himself to assert this…

It’s a sad day when the mistakes of a few make all of us culpable…

Your last statement is interesting…I believe I heard on Relevent Radio, when this was first brought to light (Pope Benedicts’ stance) that this is nothing new. The RCC never tolerated or advocated homosexuals in the priesthood–but rather, the stringency of following this edict, might have fallen to the wayside…call it tolerance…call it we didn’t analyze men enough who were discerning this vocation…etc…

So, really–Pope Benedict is merely enforcing something that has always been in place. I don’t think anything’s changed, rather…it’s just being enforced. Does anyone else recall hearing such a statement? I believe it was on Relevant Radio that I heard that comment, and it really made perfect sense.

Nothing’s changed…Pope Benedict has not created something ‘new,’ but my one question is…is it being enforced as a backlash reaction to the scandals? Thoughts?