Homosexuality and God's plan for those who are gay

[at9009]

To do His will and to take up their cross and follow Jesus Christ on a daily basis.

THAT is God’s plan.

Everything else is oriented towards that.

For a non-homosexual, it might be by having a family, and the many, MANY, MANY crosses that that can involve. All of those crosses are a means of sanctification.

The problem here, is I wonder if you aren’t putting worldly standards above God’s standards. Perhaps you’re more interested in whether someone is lonely than whether or not they are truly doing God’s will.

You’ve certainly used a lot of qualifiers when discussing the immorality of homosexuality. Perhaps you see nothing wrong with it?

Well, already we aren’t focusing on God here, but on ourselves and our pleasure.

I wouldn’t say it wordly standards. However, as a celibate gay/ssa person (whatever label people prefer) I have seen that in Christian culture there is this almost idoltry level of marriage and the nuclear family (worse in some other denominational circles). So there is huge focus on ministry to marriage, dating, family life, etc with very little or no support for celibate people (single people are often treated as pre-marriage groups). Add on to this a culture to idolatrizes finding ‘the one’ to gain happiness and see how some of that has seeped into Christian culture. So, people grow up treating marriage (at least in some circles including Christian circles) almost as a check box in life. So, without good support within and outside the Church for dealing with a celibate cross (compared to the plethora of support for a married or dating person), this particular cross can feel particularly heavy.

Add onto that a not so small minority of Christians who have animosity to people who have same sex attraction and the cross becomes even harder.

 

[o_mlly]

catholic1seeks:
I think God’s plan for the gay man/woman is the same as His plan for the promiscuous man/woman: by His grace, order one’s appetites through prayer and discipline.

 

[at9009]

I think God’s plan for the gay man/woman is the same as His plan for the promiscuous man/woman: by His grace, order one’s appetites through prayer and discipline.

Side note being same sex attracted does not equal promiscuous. That comes of as kind of insulting. It’s a completely different experience and different temptation.

 

[Confiteor_Deo]

The homosexual’s vocation is the single life. That’s God’s plan for them and that is where they will be truly happy.

 

[o_mlly]

Side note being same sex attracted does not equal promiscuous. That comes of as kind of insulting. It’s a completely different experience and different temptation.

Perhaps you miss my point. If acted on, both gay and promiscuous temptations lead to a disordered life. Original sin hits us all in one way or another as does God’s grace. Make your choice.

 

[Rau]

Perhaps you miss my point. If acted on, both gay and promiscuous temptations lead to a disordered life. Original sin hits us all in one way or another as does God’s grace. Make your choice.

Gay does not imply one acts on one’s attractions, though that is sometimes assumed. Your post, drawing a kind of equivalence of mission of the gay and the promiscuous, suggested you understood the gay to act on their attractions.

 

[djames99]

Homosexuality and God’s plan for those who are gay

You cannot become a full member of the Catholic Church while determined to live in this lifestyle. No one can rewrite conditions in his baptismal promise that states that it includes a life of capital sin.

The good news.
There is no such thing has being gay. The Church encourages these people who have gone on to submit to devious temptation of the act, not to be taken in one more time to assuming the identity of the sin. One is NOT the sin.

There has been complete cures. Those who have taken on a devotion to the Holy Mother and her promises, and have availed themselves on a regular bases to the Sacrament of Reconciliation that was especially intended for them, and practice their religion devoutly, have been rewarded. They share the same attributes of persistence while increasing their charity in society. They endeavored to win back their friendship with God.

They came through a dry period of testing and resolve, but persevered and are now married and have raised upstanding God fearing children. They share a revulsion to the delectable thoughts of these practices that they saw as normal. (Mary is indeed thorough. ). They have learned to divert the trickster’s temptations to other diversions pleasing to our Lord.

Find another priest for pastoral support, and I think it would be a good idea to cut the cord entirely and start on a new ground and go to another parish. Discreetly sever your relations to like friends(?), and slowly back track from this kind of social life. Your confessor and your pastor should not be the same person, and neither should they be part of your social group. (This in the spirit of guidance of the S.V.P)

Join associations that are devoted to Mary, and stay away from the negative influences you have been exposed to so far(these are the tricksters minions who would have their charges not encouraging you to change. Always remember, that your success is an imputation of their lifestyle or teaching. (There is no honor among capital sinners, it’s everyone for themselves.)

Say the rosary once a day. This devotion is for life and motivated simply to know that it pleases Her. She will help you in this problem, and must trust that. That’s the essence of Faith. The first time that trust was required is when God stated this action offended him, and he released you has you desired to that temporary life of the decadent world. Since you are still alive, the reason is to let you stew in confusion until you come back to give him the benefit of the doubt(Faith) that you should have given him the first time around.

May Jesus and His Mother guide you on your journey to the new you.

 

[Joie_de_Vivre]

I wouldn’t say it wordly standards. However, as a celibate gay/ssa person (whatever label people prefer) I have seen that in Christian culture there is this almost idoltry level of marriage and the nuclear family (worse in some other denominational circles). So there is huge focus on ministry to marriage, dating, family life, etc with very little or no support for celibate people (single people are often treated as pre-marriage groups). Add on to this a culture to idolatrizes finding ‘the one’ to gain happiness and see how some of that has seeped into Christian culture. So, people grow up treating marriage (at least in some circles including Christian circles) almost as a check box in life. So, without good support within and outside the Church for dealing with a celibate cross (compared to the plethora of support for a married or dating person), this particular cross can feel particularly heavy.

Add onto that a not so small minority of Christians who have animosity to people who have same sex attraction and the cross becomes even harder.

You forgot to mention that even in secular society marriage is considered a “hallmark” of adulthood.

 

[Rau]

You forgot to mention that even in secular society marriage is considered a “hallmark” of adulthood.

Perhaps it is seen as “one of the hallmarks” of adulthood, but not the only one. It’s probably trues that marriage is regarded as a further stage of adulthood, (and parenthood a yet further stage) when one expands one’s sphere of responsibility from self to encompass other(s).

I agree with you that, other than priests and religious, the “single” person may be viewed as having failed to progress in their adulthood as expected, and perhaps that’s the sense in which you meant your remark?

 

[Joie_de_Vivre]

Perhaps it is seen as “one of the hallmarks” of adulthood, but not the only one. It’s probably trues that marriage is regarded as a further stage of adulthood, (and parenthood a yet further stage) when one expands one’s sphere of responsibility from self to encompass other(s).

I agree with you that, other than priests and religious, the “single” person may be viewed as having failed to progress in their adulthood as expected, and perhaps that’s the sense in which you meant your remark?

That is the sense which I meant and it is quite problematic.

 

[joseie]

Side note being same sex attracted does not equal promiscuous. That comes of as kind of insulting. It’s a completely different experience and different temptation.

It is a’ different experience’ ,ok.But regarding temptation pl.note that the intensity of temptation and urge to engage in sexual act is same both for Ssa and heterosexual.So no extra allowance or consideration need be given to Ssa in the matter.
But as I have already said the fear that they are otherwise alone and isolated and denied pleasures enjoyed by others, attract them to the company of other Ssa .Slowly they begin to feel that any thing is permissible to them as long as they don’t interfere in others matter.

 

[o_mlly]

Gay does not imply one acts on one’s attractions, though that is sometimes assumed. Your post, drawing a kind of equivalence of mission of the gay and the promiscuous, suggested you understood the gay to act on their attractions.

Suggest you re-read my post. As I stated, a temptation is not evil per se, but becomes so only if one acts on it.

I have no idea what you mean by “equivalence of mission.” Do you mean temptation to homosexuality or promiscuity acted upon leads to an equivalence in the commission of evil?

The fornicator, the unmarried heterosexual who is tempted to promiscuous behavior and acts on it, commits an evil: an ordered act in a gravely disordered manner. The acting homosexual commits a gravely disordered act against nature. The culpability of either actor depends as always on their circumstances and the mercy of a loving Creator.

 

[jjr9]

The good news.
There is no such thing has being gay.

I agree with this I believe the “homosexual person” is a myth.

What do you think of the Magisterium accepting the mythical “homosexual person” as real?

I believe the Magisterium is in error to recognize the mythical “homosexual person” I believe with this the
Magisterium has laid a stumbling block on the path to Eternal Life for those struggling with this temptation.
I am confident the Lord will have the Magisterium correct its error in His Time.

God bless

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

The Church doesn’t model the vocation of laity (other than fodder for recruitment by associations).

We ought to be concerned about lonely people.

Catholic1seeks, if you can’t handle rosaries (as I can’t), string other prayers together (you don’t need to count them), when you think of others’ needs and when you think of your own needs, alike. God likes to hear about our needs because it shows we think He can help us.

The advice regarding distancing yourself might also apply to your relationships with those family members who have a morbid view of Catholic life.

There is still hope!

Our Father said for you.

 

[Upgrade25]

My two cents. I struggle with SSA(bisexual attractions), but I am not a “gay”. I am not a creature that has no choice but to give into my impure desires. If I have to struggle with immense pain through the rest of my life for the glory of our great Lord, then let it be. I am a strong opponent of “gay rights” because it makes it seem to people struggling with this, like my self, that our only option to be happy is to live in a life of sin. Sin doesn’t work.

I get that it’s a hallmark of secular adulthood to be married, but the Church teaches differently. Chaste single life and consecrated life are also options. Are we really so into ourselves and our culture to deny Church Teaching, not to mention the BIBLE?!

I’m out, because this is ridiculous modernism. God’s plan for those who struggle with SSA is in the Gospel today, to pick up our crosses.

 

[3DOCTORS]

I don’t want to flip this around too much, but I can’t help it.

I am a straight man, and I have a desire to be in a union with someone of the opposite sex, and it sucks really hard sometimes that I have not been able to find someone who I want to be with and who also wants to be with me.

It makes me wonder what God’s plan is for me.

Do I have friendships with straight women that never have developed into something more intimate? Yes. Do I feel unfulfilled? Sometimes. Does that make me rebel against the Faith? No.

I am living my life as a chaste man. That is what I am called to right now.

I am basically your straight female counterpart. From my girlhood I had wanted to marry and have several children. But I never met the right man and now the childbearing ship has definitely sailed. I’m okay with the single life now; sometimes I think it’d still be nice to find a widower or a second time arounder (with annulment of course) and have a companion to walk with on the journey. To help one another in this life and help one another to get to Heaven. But God might have to help me move a few mountains to find that man! One thing I know for certain, though, is that I’m not going to get into any illicit relationships because I just know it is wrong, and I’d feel crummy if I settled for a counterfeit of God’s real plan of marriage.

It is not wrong for Gay people to have relationships, they can even have relationships with other Gay people , just like Men can have friendships with Women but that does not mean such relationships could or should develop sexually, or lead to marriage.

You mean a platonic relationship, i.e. a friendship, right?

 

[Rau]

My two cents. I struggle with SSA(bisexual attractions), but I am not a “gay”.

Indeed - it is only modern society that regards sexual attractions as demanding to be satisfied, and any legal and consensual means of satisfying them as acceptable.

I am not a creature that has no choice but to give into my impure desires.

Correct. And whether one describes oneself as “experiencing SSA” or “gay” or “homosexual” or “bisexual” - this remains true.

I am a strong opponent of “gay rights” because it makes it seem to people struggling with this, like my self, that our only option to be happy is to live in a life of sin.

If you have in mind things such as “gay marriage”, and the message trumpted by “gay rights parades”, that’s exactly right. But I imagine you don’t support the right of anyone to discriminate against you because of your struggles.

God’s plan for those who struggle with SSA is in the Gospel today, to pick up our crosses.

God’s plan for everyone is the same - choose the good course, whatever your cross.

CCC2358/9
*…These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.*

 

[Nixbits]

I take issue with a couple of points made.

djames99:

There is no such thing has being gay.

By the common meaning of being gay, there very definitely is such a thing as being gay.

djames99:

There has been complete cures.

Since it’s not a disease, using the word ‘cure’ is inappropriate.

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

Djames would put this point better, by saying that it doesn’t specifically exist as a spiritual category or caste in the Church, according to the faith of Jesus and the Apostles.

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

Upgrade25, our struggle is not with attractions as simple attractions, but with neurotic crushes that get out of hand as well as lust. Same as anybody.

My old pal used to have a laugh at himself when he got a touch of the DDGs (Drop Dead Gorgeous). And think that after all, it’s a good thing there are such a lot of nice people in the world!

We’ll have to make our own Gospel because no-one will make it for us (in practice).

Pair up with others to go visiting, start from a young age, lead others in doing it. And intercede lots. Then God will make good news come back to you!