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Sister_Amy
Guest
I feel like I need to emphasize this point so often mostly because my sheikh brings it up so often, and that is the absolute right of human beings, according to Islam, to freely choose their religion. It’s not a personal philosophy, but a fundamental part of my study of Islam, from my sheikh. And he typically describes his own situation–he is from Syria–and how Muslim scholars in so-called Muslim countries are prevented from freely teaching and worshiping.
Mind you, Christians face lockdowns too although it’s not just Christians. So people aren’t being taught faith and religiously mandated justice in the first place–not by Muslims, not by Christians. That is turning now, somewhat, with a surge of interest in Islamic scholarship, and the knowledge becoming more widespread and easily available worldwide. But see that religious values over all were squeezed out of the society. And for the most part Christian and Muslim values towards societies are the same–providing help for the poor and needy, dealing honestly in transactions and not trying to cheat or take advantage, consideration for family and neighbors.
So I think as you see a revival of Islam, and Islamic values, you’ll see less fear of Christians, and perhaps more cooperation, but certainly more freedom.
Doesn’t EVERYONE do that?
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Sister_Amy
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ralphinal
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First part, good information. I hope that you are right. I tend ot think that it is not going to make it better, as there is no unified authority in Islam.
Last line, yes, everyone does that. The only issue is, and you know what I am about to say, some of the “holier than thou” Muslims blow up innocent people.
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inJESUS
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Sister_Amy
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There’s a story in Islam (a hadith) of two men who were in a fight, trying to kill each other. Muhammad said that both men would be in the hellfire. And the people asked why–as it was clear the man who killed the other one would be punished for killing. But what about the other one? He would be punished because he intended to kill the other, and if he hadn’t been killed first he would have been successful.
I don’t know why exactly that came to my mind just now, except to say that Muslims believe that God is Just, and that He will judge between us on the Day of Judgment… and that those who have done evil will be punished for it.
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AgnosTheist
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those are just examples of social rights.
the problem in islam is that the social rights of females are inferior to that of males.
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morning_star777
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sister amy look,domestic violence is every where in my country.muslim males r always abusive.i often read a news about it.husband beat his wife for money.son teach mother about cover system.&specially every mullah have more than 1 wife.many men drink alcohol in their house when their wife locked in other room.some ppl also like that,if mistakenly their wife face other man then their husband beat them cuz their wife avoid covering system!so?
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Sister_Amy
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I think sex is a good reason to get married. Don’t you? Especially since the alternative might be sex outside of marriage… so marriage is a protection from that sin.
If a woman is doing something wrong (“whatever reason”), and her husband beats her, that’s not much to make her change her behavior. How does she know what she did was wrong? Does she know why? Maybe she had a good reason? So the husband just beating her is stupid–and that’s what we call domestic abuse. If he just gets angry and hits her, that will NOT solve the problem, and that is NOT allowed in Islam.
It’s not just a matter of her dignity, here. But her husband is supposed to explain how it was wrong, and discuss it with her. Don’t gloss over that because it’s VERY important. If she keeps doing it, KNOWING that it’s wrong, he still can’t get angry and beat her. He is supposed to leave her bed, to notify her of the seriousness of the matter–that it is serious to him. This is a step towards divorce. If she keeps doing it, and knows it’s wrong, and knows that it will lead to a divorce, he can hit her gently, but that’s it. If she keeps on, the only remaining solution is divorce. He is not supposed to “punish” her–a wife is not a child, and is not to be treated like one. But if she persists in that behavior which is against Islam, and detrimental to the family (i.e., him and her children) then divorce is the final option.
Now, let’s suppose that a woman has a husband who is doing something against Islam. Would hitting him solve the problem? No. She should talk with him. The Qur’an is clear about consultation between spouses. So if she explains and he doesn’t agree or keeps on doing wrong, should she hit him? No, it wouldn’t solve the problem. What she should do is find an authority–like an imam, police officer, ruler, elder in the community, etc–to talk to her husband. That would be someone he should respect. And if that doesn’t work, she can try to reach an agreement by appointing someone from her family to talk to someone from his family, and she can go back to the authority to ask for a divorce.
I don’t see how hitting her husband would solve the problem at all–in fact, it would probably just exacerbate it. But if a man marries such a fiery woman with a temper who hits him and it doesn’t bother him… that’s their own business.
I’ve asked before if you were a woman, not sure if you ever responded. So let me just assume that you are…
If a woman is doing something wrong (“whatever reason”), and her husband beats her, that’s not much to make her change her behavior. How does she know what she did was wrong? Does she know why? Maybe she had a good reason? So the husband just beating her is stupid–and that’s what we call domestic abuse. If he just gets angry and hits her, that will NOT solve the problem, and that is NOT allowed in Islam.
It’s not just a matter of her dignity, here. But her husband is supposed to explain how it was wrong, and discuss it with her. Don’t gloss over that because it’s VERY important. If she keeps doing it, KNOWING that it’s wrong, he still can’t get angry and beat her. He is supposed to leave her bed, to notify her of the seriousness of the matter–that it is serious to him. This is a step towards divorce. If she keeps doing it, and knows it’s wrong, and knows that it will lead to a divorce, he can hit her gently, but that’s it. If she keeps on, the only remaining solution is divorce. He is not supposed to “punish” her–a wife is not a child, and is not to be treated like one. But if she persists in that behavior which is against Islam, and detrimental to the family (i.e., him and her children) then divorce is the final option.
Now, let’s suppose that a woman has a husband who is doing something against Islam. Would hitting him solve the problem? No. She should talk with him. The Qur’an is clear about consultation between spouses. So if she explains and he doesn’t agree or keeps on doing wrong, should she hit him? No, it wouldn’t solve the problem. What she should do is find an authority–like an imam, police officer, ruler, elder in the community, etc–to talk to her husband. That would be someone he should respect. And if that doesn’t work, she can try to reach an agreement by appointing someone from her family to talk to someone from his family, and she can go back to the authority to ask for a divorce.
I don’t see how hitting her husband would solve the problem at all–in fact, it would probably just exacerbate it. But if a man marries such a fiery woman with a temper who hits him and it doesn’t bother him… that’s their own business.
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Sister_Amy
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Inferior how?
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Sister_Amy
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Domestic violence is everywhere in my country too, and it happens in every race, culture, religion, and class of the society. But if the men in your country are too stupid to learn their religion on their own, perhaps you should try to teach it to them?
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morning_star777
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i am asking you sister amy,if islam really gave women the special honor then why male allowed to take 4 wives?and hadith told(i can’t remember where is it.but hope you know)oh men you can only enjoy sex with your wives and slave girls!so wife and slave girls are same?so wife=slave right?its a big honor?actually you all muslims are un logical.you just can shout.ya except shout you can’t do anything
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morning_star777
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sister amy if all ppl of my country is stupid its ok.but tell me why the mullahs or imams r stupid?they know everything about islam
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Sister_Amy
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That doesn’t make any sense to me. I don’t even know what you’re talking about. Sorry.
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Sister_Amy
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Well I didn’t say all people, I said the men. Because according to you they are the problem, right–with the boozing, irresponsible marriages, and keeping their wives locked up? None of that is allowed in Islam so if they do it clearly they either don’t know or don’t care about Islam. That’s why I called them stupid.
Moreover, “mullahs” (whatever a mullah is–do you know?) and “imams” (do you even know what an imam is?) don’t know “everything about islam.” It’s possible they don’t know much at all, but who am I to say? Then again, who are you to say?
Frankly I don’t know much about your country, even what country it is, but the fact that it is inhabited by Muslims does not mean that every Joe on the corner understands Islam.
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inJESUS
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morning_star777
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“that doesn’t make any senses to me.i don’t even know what are you talking about”.sister amy actually what things you know?i was talking about the honor of women in your great(!?)islam.and ur next reply u asked me about mullah or imam.ya i know very very well that wat is an imam or a mullah.but i guess you don’t know anything.you just can give un logical reply.oh ya also can shout.&when u lost then u can tell “i am not going to explain anything”
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Verisimilitude
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The 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UDHR) as adopted by the UN:
Article 2.
Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.
Article 18.
Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.
The 1981 Universal Islamic Declaration of Human Rights (UIDHR):
The Universal Islamic Declaration of Human Rights is based on the Qur’an and the Sunnah and has been compiled by eminent Muslim scholars, jurists and representatives of Islamic movements and thought. May God reward them all for their efforts and guide us along the right path.
Therefore we, as Muslims, who believe
e) in inviting all mankind to the message of Islam;
f) that by the terms of our primeval covenant with God our duties and obligations have priority over our rights, and that each one of us is under a bounden duty to spread the teachings of Islam by word, deed, and indeed in all gentle ways, and to make them effective not only in our individual lives but also in the society around us;
g) in our obligation to establish an Islamic order:
i) wherein all human beings shall be equal and none shall enjoy a privilege or suffer a disadvantage or discrimination by reason of race, colour, sex, origin or language; (Religion is not mentioned)
ix) wherein all public affairs shall be determined and conducted, and the authority to administer them shall be exercised after mutual consultation (Shura) between the believers qualified to contribute to a decision which would accord well with the Law and the public good; (limited to believers- i.e. Muslims only)
I Right to Life
a) Human life is sacred and inviolable and every effort shall be made to protect it. In particular no one shall be exposed to injury or death, except under the authority of the Law. (Islamic law)
II Right to Freedom
b) Every individual and every people has the inalienable right to freedom in all its forms¾ physical, cultural, economic and political — and shall be entitled to struggle by all available means against any infringement or abrogation of this right; and every oppressed individual or people has a legitimate claim to the support of other individuals and/or peoples in such a struggle.
(Religion is not mentioned)
XIII Right to Freedom of Religion
Every person has the right to freedom of conscience and worship in accordance with his religious beliefs.
(Freedom in accordance with Islamic Law- the Qur’an which wants non-Muslims to feel the submission of Islam)
XX Rights of Married Women
d) inherit from her husband, her parents, her children and other relatives according to the Law;(1/8 share)
XXIII Right to Freedom of Movement and Residence
a) In view of the fact that the World of Islam is veritably Ummah Islamia, every Muslim shall have the right to freely move in and out of any Muslim country.(What about the non-Muslim?)
Explanatory Notes:
1 In the above formulation of Human Rights, unless the context provides otherwise:
b) the term ‘Law’ denotes the Shari’ah, i.e. the totality of ordinances derived from the Qur’an and the Sunnah and any other laws that are deduced from these two sources by methods considered valid in Islamic jurisprudence.
The CUIDHR is another qualified document that puts the non-Muslim and women in a less than equal status.
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inJESUS
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I don’t about others but if i were a woman and i knew that my husband can beat me (righteously or not), divorce me (righteously or not), marry someone else (righteously or not), lock me in a low-standard house to humiliate me if i don’t comply to his wish( beit al-taa), carry me along with his other hareem in the street as if i were of his flock… i wouldn’t see an honour at all…i see it as a 7th century sahara male mentality and not a universal law of God…none of which was uttered by Jesus anyway, for obvious reasons.
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AgnosTheist
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all this time and you are still clueless? oh my goodness.
Doctrines:
- islamic wife beating (as a last resort)
- inheritance fLaw
- dumbed down female commercial contracts
- polygamy
- women not allowed to drive
- women not allowed to go out without company
- women not allowed education
- women forced to wear veils
Are you still going to give a blind eye on these facts?
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