Hooting, hollering, and whistling in church

[TheRealJuliane]

Tonight, the 2nd reader did her reading, then added something that sounded a lot like the lyrics to a John Michael Talbot song. I was shocked. At first I wondered if she thought we hadn’t already done the Psalm and was going to ask us to speak the refrain, but she just plowed on through it, said, “Allelujah” and “Amen” at the end. I did not reply, but I heard some “Amens” in the audience.

Then after the homily, people clapped. For a while, some people clapped after every homily our Pastor did. I think the crusty looks they got for starting it may have inhibited them, they rarely do it now, even though the Pastor always says, “Thanks for listening and God bless” at the end of his homily, which gives me the feeling he is searching for applause.

again.

I’m about fed up with this church.

 

[Timothysis]

I imagine this does not happen at traditional Masses. Never been to one.

When Louis XVI was crowned King of France, the doors of the cathedral were thrown open, the crowds poured in shouting “vivat Rex” while doves were released* inside the cathedral.*

 

[Stylites]

Are they really applauding God’s grace in the accomplishments of others? In an indirect way, perhaps. But even if it is done with full and sole focus on God’s sovereignty and glory, it seems inappropriate to clap about it. If people must do this during Mass, can they not come up with some other less-disruptive way to acknowledge God’s grace in others? Why the ruckus? Why the noise? If we’re applauding God, does he need to have us make physical noise to realize we are doing so?

No, God doesn’t need anything.

People in the West applaud to show they are appreciative of something. Other cultures drum the table, or stomp their feet, or snap their fingers, or pat their leg.

Seems you have two choices in regards to applause after Mass: Get everyone to stop it, or learn to live with it.

 

[Stylites]

No, it was the Ordination to the Priesthood. C’mon! We don’t start hooting and hollering during the PGA tournament. We give a lame “golf clap”. There’s no excuse to hoot, holler, and whistle at such a solemn event.

Priestly ordination is such a wonderful event which proclaims that the gates of hell shall not prevail against the Church, and we like to complain about the resulting “hooting, hollering, and whistling”?

 

[Stylites]

From a blog:

Priestly Ordination at Hartford, Connecticut

published 18 May 2011 by Dr. Ronda Chervin

I have mentioned before that I have trouble with ceremonies, especially longer ones, but Ordinations are different. The first one I saw was in 1960. I was on a tour in Switzerland and going to daily Mass as usual came upon an ordination. Being a convert made it even more stunning.

After teaching at the seminary in Los Angeles, it was different. I actually knew these men. Some of these heroes I had helped pray through their worst moments of doubt about their vocations. The first time it was my late vocation seminarians being ordained I stood in the parking lot tears in my eyes pledging that because these wonderful holy men had gotten through the gauntlet of seminary I would never complain again in my whole life. Well, of course, I didn’t live up to my pledge but, to my joy, coming back to Los Angeles years later, I found those heroes were now the priestly pillars of the archdiocese. They kept their pledge.

Now, when I go to an ordination of seminarians from Holy Apostles, where I teach, I always murmur the same words as I see the throngs of lay people taking their seats and the long procession of bishops, priests, about to be ordained, and seminarians coming up the aisle to the loud organ music and choir. The words I murmur as, 'AND THE GATES OF HELL SHALL NOT PREVAIL.’

The seminarian who invited me was a medical researcher born in South Africa, a huge black man, who migrated to the US and then to our seminary, primarily, for late vocations. The choir learned a song in African for part of the ceremony. There were also 2 songs in Spanish for the hispanic ordinand. Most of the music, however, was traditional chant, some in Latin.

The traditional ceremonial of such extraordinary supernatural meaning, reminded me, however, of something else I love: surprise. I recalled a Mass in Corpus Christi, Texas, for the ordination of Society of Our Lady of the Trinity priests. The vocations director, Fr. Tony Anderson, a thin man in his 40’s, was in the customary line up of all the priests who greet each newly ordained with a hug of peace. One of those just ordained was a large, large, man about 6’4” weighing no one could imagine how much. When Fr. Tony was in High School he was a wrestling champ. But, of course, this was the last thing on anyone’s mind until suddenly at the hug of peace we saw the huge newly ordained priest lifted up into the air into a horizontal position by our thin priest. It was too quick for anyone to clap, but I clapped in my heart because

reverential tradition is magnificent
but
the freedom of the Spirit in surprise is also…delightful!

ccwatershed.org/blog/2011/may/18/priestly-ordination-hartford-connecticut/]

 

[Stylites]

If I were there, I would instantly drop to my knees in reparation.

Why see sin where there is no sin?

 

[Davina100]

Tonight, the 2nd reader did her reading, then added something that sounded a lot like the lyrics to a John Michael Talbot song. I was shocked. At first I wondered if she thought we hadn’t already done the Psalm and was going to ask us to speak the refrain, but she just plowed on through it, said, “Allelujah” and “Amen” at the end. I did not reply, but I heard some “Amens” in the audience.

Then after the homily, people clapped. For a while, some people clapped after every homily our Pastor did. I think the crusty looks they got for starting it may have inhibited them, they rarely do it now, even though the Pastor always says, “Thanks for listening and God bless” at the end of his homily, which gives me the feeling he is searching for applause.

again.

I’m about fed up with this church.

I am a proclaimer in my parish. We are specifically instructed not to change, add, or remove any of the words of the reading. We are proclaiming the word of God there is nothing that we need or can add to it to “improve” it. I hope someone spoke to her about how inappropriate that was.

After one homily the congregation appluaded, it was spontaneous and in agreement with what he was saying. I’m not saying it was appropriate. Our priest turned to us and told us “your not suppose to applaud the homily.”

 

[Stylites]

At an Ordination, clapping is the liturgically correct way (mentioned in the Rite itself) for the congregation to express it’s assent to the Bishop’s decision to call a man to Sacred Orders.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I am a proclaimer in my parish. We are specifically instructed not to change, add, or remove any of the words of the reading. We are proclaiming the word of God there is nothing that we need or can add to it to “improve” it. I hope someone spoke to her about how inappropriate that was.

After one homily the congregation appluaded, it was spontaneous and in agreement with what he was saying. I’m not saying it was appropriate. Our priest turned to us and told us “your not suppose to applaud the homily.”

I saw this reader (Proclaimer?) take the book up to the lectern minutes before the Mass and thought “That’s a bit odd, it’s usually already up there by now.” I wonder if she put her text in it at that point rather than walk up with a piece of paper in her hand. I thought about saying something after the Mass but I decided to leave it to the people in charge of the Liturgy - I think they can handle it. It was a person I had never seen before, and probably won’t again.

As for the applause, I think our Pastor enjoys it. He’s a bit of a showboater and likes to go on and on, sometimes up to 45 minutes and no, I am NOT kidding!

 

[PattiDay]

There was great applause today in church following the Baptism of a baby girl. I believe the people experienced a great uplifting of their hearts and souls, especially because we’ve had more funerals than Baptisms in the last year or more. A new blessed soul added to the parish roll.

If we were to celebrate the ordination of a new priest, I think we would blow the roof off the church with our applause.

 

[TheMc]

I saw this reader (Proclaimer?) take the book up to the lectern minutes before the Mass and thought “That’s a bit odd, it’s usually already up there by now.” I wonder if she put her text in it at that point rather than walk up with a piece of paper in her hand. I thought about saying something after the Mass but I decided to leave it to the people in charge of the Liturgy - I think they can handle it. It was a person I had never seen before, and probably won’t again.

As for the applause, I think our Pastor enjoys it. He’s a bit of a showboater and likes to go on and on, sometimes up to 45 minutes and no, I am NOT kidding!

Wow. How terrible.

 

[BlackCatholics]

sometimes up to 45 minutes and no

Smile come to St. Theresa of Avila (Baltimore/Washington), or St. Brigid, Los Angeles,45 minutes? Ta’nt nuthin’! How’s 1/2 - 2 hours. But then we are there to worship, not to watch the clock eh?
While I weren’t there, don’t recall hearing anyone walk outta Yeshua when He gave the sermon on the Mount, or preached on the Temple steps, or on the boat, or in the synagogue, eh? (But in reality, each to his/her own liturgy. Some folks even go to the local Catholic hosptials’ chapels, where the liturgy is almost a guaranteed 1/2 hour, since the docs and nurses gotta get back.
Pax Christi!

 

[BlackCatholics]

I became Catholic in 1999. Wonderful… but never could find the Church I had been longing for my whole life until 2010 when I attended the Traditional Latin Mass. I have never been happier!

Do you remember if it was a High Mass (all the altar candles lit) or low mass (just a few). Tridentine? ,Latin masses are glorious, especially if there is choir that can sing either Gregorian Chant, or regular Catholic hymns. And a mass where a bishop celebrates or several con-celebrants, Oh, my God!
Ex-altar boy here at Cincinnati’s 150 years+ old St. Joseph Church. I don’t think I’ve seen such a mass for nigh on 59 years or so. They don’t do 'em like they used to.
But then Ysehua didn’t stay with the apostles past 3 years or so, neither. But I hear some parishes around the US are beginning to have 'em. Check out Mass Times web site online. You might find one or several in your neck of the woods.
Pax Christi!

 

[hazcompat]

Why do we judge our neighbors? Because we are not trying to get to know ourselves. Someone busy trying to understand himself has no time to notice the shortcomings of others. Judge yourself — and you will stop judging others. Judge a poor deed, but do not judge the doer. It is necessary to consider yourself the most sinful of all, and to forgive your neighbor every poor deed. One must hate only the devil, who tempted him. It can happen that someone might appear to be doing something bad to us, but in reality, because of the doer’s good intentions, it is a good deed. Besides, the door of penitence is always open, and it is not known who will enter it sooner — you, “the judge,” or the one judged by you.

fatheralexander.org/booklets/english/seraphim_e.htm

 

[BlackCatholics]

The worship you speak of in your proceeding post is admirable. I am happy to what you have to say. Still this worship is giving glory to God. If I understand the opening post (and it isn’t perfectly clear what the applause etc was for), I think the opening poster spoke of giving glory to men during the mass, and in fact making this an important part of what is going on.

Grace,peace, and mercy to you. Is it okay to post links? …so folks can see a Papua New Guinea , or Zambia, or Ghana, or Nigerian celebration? Methinks it is giving Glory period and recognizing the glory of Almighty God through Yeshua in such celebrations.
But I fully understand the “culture of quiet”).
(I’ve been to mass in London, and at St. Pat’s in New York… Quite a difference in celebrating God (I don’t see the celebration–but one can see the “reflections”).
Please let me know about the links.(or one can go to youtube, and punch in e.g. Zambia and Catholic Church, or Kenya and Catholic church and see for themselves.
To the poster re: Chrism mass:
Here in Los Angeles and around the US and other parts of the Black Diaspora, no banners usually–but have seen them in Mexican and Spanish masses), but in ours,
a procession of “speaking drums” and percussion instruments starts our Eucharistic celebration followed by the altar servers, the Crucifix, the WORD, the lectors, the celebrant (and sometimes liturgical dancers)…
So a little bit different at Society of Divine Word, Josephite, and other parishes serving the African Diaspora, as opposed to European heritaged churches, I suppose.
Still, one holy catholic(universal) and apostolic church. As St. Thomas Didymus (Doubting Thomas) evangelized aprt of India, I can’t wait to see what the St. Thomas Catholics’ liturgy resembles.
Pax Christi

 

[TheMc]

Why do we judge our neighbors? Because we are not trying to get to know ourselves. Someone busy trying to understand himself has no time to notice the shortcomings of others. Judge yourself — and you will stop judging others. Judge a poor deed, but do not judge the doer. It is necessary to consider yourself the most sinful of all, and to forgive your neighbor every poor deed. One must hate only the devil, who tempted him. It can happen that someone might appear to be doing something bad to us, but in reality, because of the doer’s good intentions, it is a good deed. Besides, the door of penitence is always open, and it is not known who will enter it sooner — you, “the judge,” or the one judged by you.

fatheralexander.org/booklets/english/seraphim_e.htm

No one is judging these people. If we were judging them, we’d be saying "You’re going to hell for shouting in church!

We are judging their actions, and their actions were completely unacceptable. Hooting, hollering, and whistling is completely unfitting for the reverence that should be kept in church.

 

[Cecilianus]

Grace,peace, and mercy to you. Is it okay to post links? …so folks can see a Papua New Guinea , or Zambia, or Ghana, or Nigerian celebration? Methinks it is giving Glory period and recognizing the glory of Almighty God through Yeshua in such celebrations.
But I fully understand the “culture of quiet”).
(I’ve been to mass in London, and at St. Pat’s in New York… Quite a difference in celebrating God (I don’t see the celebration–but one can see the “reflections”).
Please let me know about the links.(or one can go to youtube, and punch in e.g. Zambia and Catholic Church, or Kenya and Catholic church and see for themselves.
To the poster re: Chrism mass:
Here in Los Angeles and around the US and other parts of the Black Diaspora, no banners usually–but have seen them in Mexican and Spanish masses), but in ours,
a procession of “speaking drums” and percussion instruments starts our Eucharistic celebration followed by the altar servers, the Crucifix, the WORD, the lectors, the celebrant (and sometimes liturgical dancers)…
So a little bit different at Society of Divine Word, Josephite, and other parishes serving the African Diaspora, as opposed to European heritaged churches, I suppose.
Still, one holy catholic(universal) and apostolic church. As St. Thomas Didymus (Doubting Thomas) evangelized aprt of India, I can’t wait to see what the St. Thomas Catholics’ liturgy resembles.
Pax Christi

It’s different in cultures where that is actually used to praise God. The Ethiopians even have liturgical dance. I’ve never been to an Ethiopian liturgy, but the Melkites have a much more upbeat and joyful-style worship - and yet I have never felt like I was not praising God in the purest and most noble way. I personally encounter God best through silence and contemplation, due to cultural, tempermental, and personal reasons - I was received into the Catholic Church in a very conservative parish, began going to a Tridentine Latin Mass where the entire hour and half-long Mass is celebrated in complete silence (an incredibly beautiful experience), and wound up a Carpatho-Rusyn Greek Catholic in the most grand, most formal, most aesthetically rich expression of the Catholic faith. But I don’t have any problem with the Melkite and Ethiopian way of worship - to each his own.

But in America those sort of antics - clapping, dancing, enjoying the rock band, etc. - don’t serve to worship God. They’re a distraction. They developed inorganically from the liturgical context, and they “horizontalize” the Mass by turning the emphasis back on each other, by making the Mass look like a presentation or a show that is given to the audience/congregation, rather than directly praising God (as the Ethiopians do with their dance - a natural and almost spontaneous expression of the joy of the Resurrection) or even rather than praising God by praising men in a manner that elevates one’s attention upwards (as when the doves were released on the coronation of St. Louis, an occasion of great joy in which thanksgiving was given, or when an Orthodox congregation gives its approval a bishop by proclaiming “Axios!” - “Worthy!” - or even in a typical Byzantine Catholic liturgy when someone like a guest or a visiting priest or somebody’s birthday is honored by singing the “God grant them many years”).

 

[Corki]

Grace,peace, and mercy to you. I am new to Catholic Answes, but lifelong Catholic. Might I share. “Blatant, disrespectful” is a cultural determinative.
Might I guide you to Youtube–Gambia and the Catholic Church (Or any African country and the Catholic Church, or Pacific rim and the Catholic church, and you will see our masses (those in the African diaspora) are filled with a joyful noise, and powerful emotional worship of God.
Howsoever, the quietude appears to be a function of the European heritaged, and by all means worship Father God and Son, Yeshua in the manner that befits you and your culture. You can do nothing more. But if you celebrate outside the United States (or that idiom) get ready for a powerful extension of the Holy Spirit in worship. (It is said that St. Augustine the African bishop of Hippo Regus danced down the aisle (as did David) in worship.(Excuse any arthritic) typos. Humbly submitted…
Pax Christi

I don’t think the OP is in Africa so those enculturation elements are not applicable.

 

[Stylites]

No one is judging these people. If we were judging them, we’d be saying "You’re going to hell for shouting in church!

We are judging their actions, and their actions were completely unacceptable. Hooting, hollering, and whistling is completely unfitting for the reverence that should be kept in church.

Rather, it seems very appropriate for the moment - family and friends reacting to the ordination of priests. Those who suffer from the sin of scruple might struggle to contain their happy emotions lest their joyfulness offend, in their minds, a cold and dour God.

 

[jkarp]

Tonight, the 2nd reader did her reading, then added something that sounded a lot like the lyrics to a John Michael Talbot song. I was shocked. At first I wondered if she thought we hadn’t already done the Psalm and was going to ask us to speak the refrain, but she just plowed on through it, said, “Allelujah” and “Amen” at the end. I did not reply, but I heard some “Amens” in the audience.

This was probably the Sequence - a required part of the liturgy on Pentecost. Did it start with something like: “Come, O Holy Spirit, Come?” You should be hearing this every year on Pentecost so you shouldn’t be too shocked by hearing it this past weekend . . .

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veni_Sancte_Spiritus?