How are we saved?

[NDN]

Hi everyone.

I was wondering: How are we saved?

I mean, I consider the Catholic Church to be authoritative, but I can’t seem to get a straight answer when it comes to salvation. (In contrast, Protestants have a straight answer, “Believe in Jesus”.) I even checked the CCC and it made zero sense. Can someone please give me a short, simple answer to the question? Specifically:

i) I’ve heard it been said “Grace alone”. If so, how do we receive that grace?

ii) Where is this in the Bible?

iii) What of the verses like “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved” (Acts 16:31) and “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9)? How do they fit into the Church’s teaching?

Thanks!!!

(Oh, and by the way, I’m not trying to be pesky, I’m honestly looking for answers. Thanks!)

Remember, even the demons believe in Christ, but that is not enough to save them. We are saved by the grace of God, thru belief in Jesus Christ, and the works of Christian charity and mercy. Christ said whatever you did for the least of these, you also did for me. He expects us to follow His commands and to love one another. Pax Christi

 

[EdOsiecki]

It’s so simple to get saved, that’s why it’s so hard for some to understand. I got saved on May 4, 1974, I called out to God to save me as per Rom.10:13 “Anyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved”. also Rev 3:20. By doing that, God came into my life, I was “born again” spiritually, as required per John 3:5. and the angels rejoiced in heaven over my salvation Lk 15:10. Then two things took place, (1) I had to read the Bible inorder to grow spiritually which taught me God’s Biblical ways. (2) For months, God took me as far back into my life as I could remember. Anytime I recalled a sin, right there on the spot,I confessed it to God. I was being sanctified. In some cases, I was required to go and make an apology or a restitution. Sometime later, I was led by the spirit to go to a Catholic prayer meeting where spirit filled people laid hands and prayed for me to receive the Holy Spirit as per Acts 8:17. Later, I was water re-baptized per Mat 3:11 John states,"I baptize you with water for REPENTANCE ". (not for washing any of my sins as I was once taught). Sins can only be atoned for by the shedding of BLOOD Heb. 9:22. Jesus did that for me at the cross Rev. 1:5 “To Him (Jesus) who loves us and freed us from our sins by His BLOOD. To summarize: I got saved on these basis: (A) I believed that God would come into my life when I called on the Lord Rom.3:20 (B) I believed the gospel per Jesus in Mark 16:15-16.(The gospel is, Jesus died, was buried and was resurrected 1Cor15:2-4.) (C) I believed that salvation is by God’s grace and not by any of my works so that I could not boast, it’s a free gift from God Eph.2:8-9. (D) I was baptized to shown my out-ward sign of repentance per Mat,3:11.(E) I received the Holy Spirit per Acts 8:17. I Now do good works (not for salvation) but to show my repentance as per Mat.3:7-8 And by doing so, it now counts for my rewards in heaven Mat.16:27 (F) I now know that I’m saved because there’s been a great change in my life per 2 Cor 15:17. (G) Most importantly I now know for certain, by following God’s above plan for salvation, that I’m assured of going to heaven per 1 John 5:13. " I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may KNOW that you have eternal life”. We are said by faith in Jesus alone

 

[paul_c]

It’s so simple to get saved, that’s why it’s so hard for some to understand. I got saved on May 4, 1974, I called out to God to save me as per Rom.10:13 “Anyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved”. also Rev 3:20. By doing that, God came into my life, I was “born again” spiritually, as required per John 3:5. and the angels rejoiced in heaven over my salvation Lk 15:10. Then two things took place, (1) I had to read the Bible inorder to grow spiritually which taught me God’s Biblical ways. (2) For months, God took me as far back into my life as I could remember. Anytime I recalled a sin, right there on the spot,I confessed it to God. I was being sanctified. In some cases, I was required to go and make an apology or a restitution. Sometime later, I was led by the spirit to go to a Catholic prayer meeting where spirit filled people laid hands and prayed for me to receive the Holy Spirit as per Acts 8:17. Later, I was water re-baptized per Mat 3:11 John states,"I baptize you with water for REPENTANCE ". (not for washing any of my sins as I was once taught). Sins can only be atoned for by the shedding of BLOOD Heb. 9:22. Jesus did that for me at the cross Rev. 1:5 “To Him (Jesus) who loves us and freed us from our sins by His BLOOD. To summarize: I got saved on these basis: (A) I believed that God would come into my life when I called on the Lord Rom.3:20 (B) I believed the gospel per Jesus in Mark 16:15-16.(The gospel is, Jesus died, was buried and was resurrected 1Cor15:2-4.) (C) I believed that salvation is by God’s grace and not by any of my works so that I could not boast, it’s a free gift from God Eph.2:8-9. (D) I was baptized to shown my out-ward sign of repentance per Mat,3:11.(E) I received the Holy Spirit per Acts 8:17. I Now do good works (not for salvation) but to show my repentance as per Mat.3:7-8 And by doing so, it now counts for my rewards in heaven Mat.16:27 (F) I now know that I’m saved because there’s been a great change in my life per 2 Cor 15:17. (G) Most importantly I now know for certain, by following God’s above plan for salvation, that I’m assured of going to heaven per 1 John 5:13. " I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may KNOW that you have eternal life”. We are said by faith in Jesus alone

Be careful. You will be saved only if you persevere and stay in the state of Grace. Should you apostacize, you would be condemned. You know you have eternal life, only if you die in the state of Grace.

And remember, St; James 2:24. “Faith without works is Dead”. And Paul in 1corinthians 13 " If I have faith enough to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.".

 

[Jim_Baur]

We are saved as taught in this Sunday’s Reading II of I John 4: 7-10.

…everyone who loves is BEGOTTEN by God and knows God.

 

[Philthy]

(G) Most importantly I now know for certain, by following God’s above plan for salvation, that I’m assured of going to heaven per 1 John 5:13. " I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may KNOW that you have eternal life"…

Hi Ed! :tiphat:

Thank you for sharing your testimony and your thoughts - its always great to hear how God has worked/is working in someone’s life. And even though we don’t agree on some details of the Christian faith, He that unites us is greater that that which divides us. That much being said, I’d like to comment on the above quote. I wish to do so because I think this is one big area of confusion between non-Catholics and Catholics. You - and many others - equate “going to Heaven” with salvation and/or eternal life. I say this because you made comment about your certainty of “going to heaven” on the basis of knowing that you have eternal life. **I dont believe eternal life or salvation are treated quite the same as “going to Heaven” in Holy Scripture. If you think otherwise I’d be interested to hear where you think Scripture tells us once your saved you irrevocably “go to Heaven”. **
It’s not really a big deal except for one little issue - the ability of sin to separate us from God in eternity. If Catholics are correct and post-regeneration, post-born again sin (if it is of the most serious nature) can result in us not going to Heaven, then I think the notion of “Im saved and therefore Im going to Heaven when I die no matter what” is dangerous. Given our fallen nature and propensity to sin, it simply does us no good to have a little voice in the back of our heads saying - its ok if I sin, I’m saved no matter what! That is not the kind of response that any of the NT authors desired from the early churches (cf 1Pet 2:11, 1Cor 6:9, Rom6:1 and others…)
Now you have stated that you believe good works have nothing to do with our salvation but only with our heavenly rewards. I will not dwell on the disconnect such a claim has with James 2 “…a man is justified by works and not by faith alone” as well as with Paul: If I have all faith such as to move mountains but have not love…I am nothing. I will instead ask you what a salvation devoid of heavenly rewards is? Is it good? You seem to casually dismiss the degree of importance of heavenly rewards with a disproportionate emphasis on the status of being saved. I dont think the NT authors would have written so much about our behavior and good works if they werent important to our eternal destiny.

Again, thanks for sharing your testimony…

 

[ralphy]

You forgot verse 10.

It is just as important as 8 and 9. We must walk in them (good works) in order to continue to be saved.

Ephesians 2:10 “For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.”

Pax,
SHW

Good works comes after salvation as the sequence shows. Verses 8&9 indicates “not by works”, if you work for it, then it is NOT a gift. To me it is quite clear and simple. Ralph

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Good works comes after salvation as the sequence shows. Verses 8&9 indicates “not by works”, if you work for it, then it is NOT a gift. To me it is quite clear and simple. Ralph

I think what SHW said agrees with what you just said. Some Protestants have a misconception that Catholics work their way into heaven, that’s just not possible. Faith and works go together, one without the other is dead.

**Jas 2:26 For even as the body without the spirit is dead: so also faith without works is dead.

Gal 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing nor uncircumcision: but faith that worketh by Charity.

1Co 13:2 And if I should have prophecy and should know all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I should have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

Joh 14:15 If you love me, keep my commandments.

Mat 19:16 And behold one came and said to him: Good master, what good shall I do that I may have life everlasting?
Mat 19:17 Who said to him: Why askest thou me concerning good? One is good, God. But if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.**

To me it is quite clear and simple.

 

[SHW]

Good works comes after salvation as the sequence shows. Verses 8&9 indicates “not by works”, if you work for it, then it is NOT a gift. To me it is quite clear and simple. Ralph

We receive justification as a free gift of grace. But, according to Scripture, we can lose this gift through our own sinful actions.

1 John 2:4 “He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.”

When we sin intentionally, we throw God’s free gift of grace back into His face and we lose our justification. We insult the Spirit of grace when we sin intentionally after our justification and unless we repent before death, we will receive God’s vengeance after we die. We will not inherit eternal life if we break God’s commandments and do not repent before death. (Matthew 19:16-19) These are Jesus’ own Words.

Hebrews 10:26-27 "For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people.”

This Scripture passage is just as important as Ephesians 2:8-9

Faith without good works will not save anyone. Faith with evil works is not faith at all but is instead a lie. Belief is obedience. Unbelief is disobedience. (Hebrews 3:8-19)

James 2:24 “You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.”

Pax,
shw

 

[ralphy]

We receive justification as a free gift of grace. But, according to Scripture, we can lose this gift through our own sinful actions.

1 John 2:4 “He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.”

When we sin intentionally, we throw God’s free gift of grace back into His face and we lose our justification. We insult the Spirit of grace when we sin intentionally after our justification and unless we repent before death, we will receive God’s vengeance after we die. We will not inherit eternal life if we break God’s commandments and do not repent before death. (Matthew 19:16-19) These are Jesus’ own Words.

Hebrews 10:26-27 "For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people.”

This Scripture passage is just as important as Ephesians 2:8-9

Faith without good works will not save anyone. Faith with evil works is not faith at all but is instead a lie. Belief is obedience. Unbelief is disobedience. (Hebrews 3:8-19)

James 2:24 “You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.”

Pax,
shw

Faith (of course), comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God, the Bible. Ralph

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Faith (of course), comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God, the Bible. Ralph

You realize that when St. Paul wrote that verse, there was no New Testament?

2Th 2:15 (2:14) Therefore, brethren, stand fast: and hold the traditions, which you have learned, whether by word or by our epistle.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

When Christ spoke of the chair of Moses, He did not explain what the chair was. It’s apparent the crowd knew what He was speaking about as the Chair of Moses is not mentioned anywhere else in scriptures.

Mat 23:1 Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to his disciples,
Mat 23:2 Saying: The scribes and the Pharisees have sitten on the chair of Moses.
Mat 23:3 All things therefore whatsoever they shall say to you, observe and do: but according to their works do ye not. For they say, and do not.

Another example of oral tradition is found in Acts. Remember, even though he wrote a Gospel St. Luke was not an eye witness of Christ, yet he wrote words Christ spoke, that were not written anywhere else in scriptures.

Act 20:35 I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring you ought to support the weak and to remember the word of the Lord Jesus, how he said: It is a more blessed thing to give, rather than to receive.

St. Paul also wrote about Jannes and Mambres, the two magicians for Pharoah. Remember, Moses’ staff, turned into a snake, ate their staffs turned into snakes. Jannes and Mambres are not written about anywhere in scriptures. The only way St. Paul could have known their names, was through oral tradition.

2Ti 3:8 Now as Jannes and Mambres resisted Moses, so these also resist the truth, men corrupted in mind, reprobate concerning the faith.

St. Paul also wrote about the rock that followed the Israelites, during the Exodus led by Moses. The rock that followed them, is not written about anywhere else in scriptures.

1Co 10:4 And all drank the same spiritual drink: (And they drank of the spiritual rock that followed them: and the rock was Christ.)

As I mentioned St. Luke was not an eye-witness to Christ, I’d like to add that neither was St. Mark. Everything they recorded in the Gospels, they learned from through the spoken word.

These are examples that there was an oral tradition, in addition to scriptures.

 

[SteveGC]

Hi Ed! :tiphat:

I will instead ask you what a salvation devoid of heavenly rewards is? Is it good? You seem to casually dismiss the degree of importance of heavenly rewards with a disproportionate emphasis on the status of being saved. I dont think the NT authors would have written so much about our behavior and good works if they werent important to our eternal destiny.

Hi Phil…

This is precisely my question as well for the “rewards” vs “salvation” camp. I’ve asked this numerous times to these folks on here (you remember Jerry, no doubt?). Anyway, I’ve yet to get an answer at all from them. I’m anxious to see if Ed gives it a go. Thanks for asking this highly critical, and pivotal, question.

 

[SteveGC]

Good works comes after salvation as the sequence shows. Verses 8&9 indicates “not by works”, if you work for it, then it is NOT a gift. To me it is quite clear and simple. Ralph

Well, hello again Ralphy. I see you’re still at it

Wanted to say this…

The “Gift” that you believe is eternal heavenly life, is not exactly what the “gift” is. The Gift, rather, is the newly opened entrance to heaven for all of mankind. An entrance which was previously closed shut for us Gentiles.

Salvation is not manifested by an entrance to the Kingdom. It is made manifest by our walking through it, which requires effort, namely cooperation with Grace, (belief, baptism, obedience, repentance). Once we walk through it, we are on the other side, in the Kingdom…hence it (salvation) does not “occur” on this earth…It doesn’t “occur” until we transition out from this earthly life…hence, our cooperation with Grace is a lifelong process, not a one-time event.

None of this, if you read carefully, negates or even remotely diminishes the very true statement that it’s ALL a Gift from God, through Christ. All of it is…the doorway Christ opened, and the possibility of our entering it, through our cooperation powered by grace.

God Bless

 

[ralphy]

You realize that when St. Paul wrote that verse, there was no New Testament?

2Th 2:15 (2:14) Therefore, brethren, stand fast: and hold the traditions, which you have learned, whether by word or by our epistle./QUOTE) What St Paul wrote “is” the New Testament and that is the word of God, which I follow. Ralph

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Prodigal Son1;5217579:

You realize that when St. Paul wrote that verse, there was no New Testament?

2Th 2:15 (2:14) Therefore, brethren, stand fast: and hold the traditions, which you have learned, whether by word or by our epistle.

What St Paul wrote “is” the New Testament and that is the word of God, which I follow. Ralph

Ok, care to show us where scriptures state that the Bible is the sole authority?

Why does the inspired word of God tell us the Church of the living God is the pillar and ground of truth, instead of scriptures?

1Ti 3:15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Also, why does the inspired word of God tell us that the manifold wisdom of God may be made known through the Church, instead of scriptures?

Eph 3:10 That the manifold wisdom of God may be made known to the principalities and powers in heavenly places through the church

Please make no mistake about it, the Catholic Church follows the sacred scriptures.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

What St Paul wrote “is” the New Testament and that is the word of God, which I follow. Ralph

2Pe 3:15 And account the longsuffering of our Lord, salvation: as also our most dear brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, hath written to you:
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction.

 

[SHW]

Faith (of course), comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God, the Bible. Ralph

Faith is also obedience.

Romans 1:5 “Through Him we have received grace and apostleship for obedience to the faith among all nations for His name,”

No obedience to the gospel of Christ, then no real faith. No real faith, then no salvation.

1 Corinthians 14:37 “If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things which I write to you are the commandments of the Lord.”

2 Peter 2:20-21 “For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,** they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.** 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.”

We can turn away from the way of righteousness any time we want to, and if we do, then we are no longer saved.

shw

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Mat 24:13 But he that shall persevere to the end, he shall be saved.

**Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once illuminated, have tasted also the heavenly gift and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 Have moreover tasted the good word of God and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 And are fallen away: to be renewed again to penance, crucifying again to themselves the Son of God and making him a mockery.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after having the knowledge of the truth, there is now left no sacrifice for sins:
Heb 10:27 But a certain dreadful expectation of judgment, and the rage of a fire which shall consume the adversaries.**

 

[Philthy]

Hi Phil…

This is precisely my question as well for the “rewards” vs “salvation” camp. I’ve asked this numerous times to these folks on here (you remember Jerry, no doubt?). Anyway, I’ve yet to get an answer at all from them. I’m anxious to see if Ed gives it a go. Thanks for asking this highly critical, and pivotal, question.

Hi Ed -

Thank you for your kind words. If you have an interest in this particular topic - and some time! - you will wish to check out this thread from a few months ago. It was a glorious thread with all the heavy hitters in play. Our old nemesis Moondweller took the reigns and did not hold back any punches…

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=4392870&postcount=19

 

[mdcpensive1]

It’s so simple to get saved, that’s why it’s so hard for some to understand. I got saved on May 4, 1974, I called out to God to save me as per Rom.10:13 “Anyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved”. also Rev 3:20. By doing that, God came into my life, I was “born again” spiritually, as required per John 3:5. and the angels rejoiced in heaven over my salvation Lk 15:10. Then two things took place, (1) I had to read the Bible inorder to grow spiritually which taught me God’s Biblical ways. (2) For months, God took me as far back into my life as I could remember. Anytime I recalled a sin, right there on the spot,I confessed it to God. I was being sanctified. In some cases, I was required to go and make an apology or a restitution. Sometime later, I was led by the spirit to go to a Catholic prayer meeting where spirit filled people laid hands and prayed for me to receive the Holy Spirit as per Acts 8:17. Later, I was water re-baptized per Mat 3:11 John states,"I baptize you with water for REPENTANCE ". (not for washing any of my sins as I was once taught). Sins can only be atoned for by the shedding of BLOOD Heb. 9:22. Jesus did that for me at the cross Rev. 1:5 “To Him (Jesus) who loves us and freed us from our sins by His BLOOD. To summarize: I got saved on these basis: (A) I believed that God would come into my life when I called on the Lord Rom.3:20 (B) I believed the gospel per Jesus in Mark 16:15-16.(The gospel is, Jesus died, was buried and was resurrected 1Cor15:2-4.) (C) I believed that salvation is by God’s grace and not by any of my works so that I could not boast, it’s a free gift from God Eph.2:8-9. (D) I was baptized to shown my out-ward sign of repentance per Mat,3:11.(E) I received the Holy Spirit per Acts 8:17. I Now do good works (not for salvation) but to show my repentance as per Mat.3:7-8 And by doing so, it now counts for my rewards in heaven Mat.16:27 (F) I now know that I’m saved because there’s been a great change in my life per 2 Cor 15:17. (G) Most importantly I now know for certain, by following God’s above plan for salvation, that I’m assured of going to heaven per 1 John 5:13. " I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may KNOW that you have eternal life”. We are said by faith in Jesus alone

You have written quite a bit Ed, but could you explain two things for me that I got from your writing?? If you say you were saved by calling on the name of the Lord then do all the children who die before learning to talk go to hell since they cannot call on the Lord. And second, if you are saved then why do you read the bible anymore? Are you saying you will be saved BETTER if you do??

mdcpensive1